Porsche - the world's best car company.

nvbanker · June 2007

Yes, it was an 06 - but my review stands - it's among the worst rides of my life. I've driven an MDX - and it's far superior in the transmission department that the Porsche I drove.

british_rover · June 2007

Yeah the Cayenne has TOO much engine braking. You let off the gas in second gear and it yanks you to a halt.

nvbanker · June 2007

EXACTLY!!! That is largely it, from the driver's experience.

british_rover · June 2007

I know people that like that. Engine braking is fine and all but it shouldn't do it that much just from letting off the gas. You should have to downshift one gear. Also the ride in the Cayenne is ridiculously hard. I drove a MINI Cooper S for two years and it was more comfortable to drive on uneven surface streets.

nvbanker · June 2007

You are brilliant, BR - I completely agree.

habitat1 · June 2007

You guys have me wondering if the new base Cayenne, with a 6-speed manual and PASM option would solve most of your complaints. The manual transmission takes care of the automatic's gear searching and engine braking, the PASM should make for a more comfortable ride when set to "normal" rather than "sport", and the new 2008 model's 290 horsepower should provide ample acceleration for an SUV, especially with a stick.

What do you think?

P.S. For what it's worth, I have a 2005 911S Cab with 19" wheels and 35/30 series tires and, with the standard PASM set on normal, it's no more jarring over bumpy roads than my Acura TL. I drove a 2001 996 Turbo with 18" wheels and it was severely painful by comparison, with no ability to adjust the suspension. Also, nvbanker, if you find the MDX auto transmission acceptable, you have more tolerance than I do for a slushy slushbox.

british_rover · June 2007

I haven't been in a 2008 Cayenne yet, although I did see one today on the highway man I didn't think they could make it uglier, but perhaps you are right that might make things better.

habitat1 · June 2007

That's a pretty strong statement from someone who, I assume, is a fan of the ultimate "box on wheels" SUV. I'm not sure who wins the beauty or beast contest here, but if you don't think the LR3 and Range Rovers are at least as "ugly" as the Cayenne, then I should have sold you my old Isuzu Trooper.

british_rover · June 2007

If someone sat you down and explained why the LR3 is designed the way it is you would understand it better. The LR3 is the definition of minimalist design with a form follows function element.

Dude the original Range Rover was showcased in the Louvre you can't get a much better endorsement for beauty then that.

In 1970, the first Range Rover was displayed in the Louvre Museum in Paris, and a British army general made headlines with his six-month trek from Alaska to Argentina in his Range Rover. Range Rovers first came to North America in 1987.

Source

spiritinthesky · June 2007

Before this gets ugly, I'd like to throw in a few perspectives from both sides. My qualifications are that my garage currently contains a 2004 Range Rover HSE and a 2007 911 Turbo. Also, when my 911 was in for service recently, I was given a 2008 Cayenne S to try out for a day.

Ugly is a highly subjective characteristic. Personally, I don't think the Range Rover can be claimed to be "beautiful" because it found its way into a French museum. The Range Rovers best attributes (and inner beauty) are its off roading ability and durability which, unfortunately, in the United States, are actually tested by about 3% of the buyers. We have a ski/lake house and a boat, so we fall into that 3%, at least some of the time.

I was reasonably impressed with the 2008 Cayenne. But it's a totally different vehicle than the Range Rover. It can take turns at 70 mph that would have my Range Rover on its roof at 40 mph. And is far quiter and comfortable to drive on the highway. But, in spite of Porsches acclaimed off-roading ability, I have to believe those 20" sport wheels and 40 series tires wouldn't last more than a minute or two on some of the roads we've taken the Range Rover on.

If I were looking for a primarily urban/suburban/light recreational SUV, the Cayenne would be my choice. If you want anything that could hadle serious off roading, the Range Rover woud be my choice.

And, in terms of quality of materials, fit and finish, etc., they are comparable. (With the exception of the LR3, which I find a cut below what it should be. The paint job on the one my niece was considering was deplorable, with excessive orange peeling and swirl marks).

Also, one would be a fool to buy a Range Rover new at anywhere near MSRP, unless the intent was to keep it forever. The depreciation on a Range Rover in the first 12-18 months is horrific. It is the only vehicle in 30 years that I purchased used (executive demo at $18k off) and that is the only way I would purchase one in the future.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2007

To its credit, a RAnge Rover would probably kick a Cayenne's butt in severe off-road conditions. These are not really comparable as they look.

No reason for us to get "ugly". British Rover was really talking about the older design, which is truly "classic" and in fact as iconic a cultural symbol as the shape of an old Corvette or an older 911 or a Gullwing. Can you ever watch an old jungle movie without seeing one? (I'm still mad at Jurassic Park for using Ford Explorers).

Newer safety regulations and modern tastes do not really allow for those clean, very simple lines of the past.

Visiting Host

habitat1 · June 2007

I'm still mad at Jurassic Park for using Ford Explorers

If I'm not mistaken, they used Mercedes ML's.

And if I were going off roading, I think I'd still favor a Landcruiser or GX470. They may not have the ultimate capability of a Range Rover, but the maintenance and repair issues on the Discoveries, Range Rovers and LR3's amoung our friends and neighbors has been pretty dismal. The exception had been a friend who has a Range Rover Sport since late 2005 and never had a problem, but just two weeks ago, he was disabled for a week with an automatic transmission glitch.

kyfdx · June 2007

The first one used Fords.. I think the Mercedes was in the sequel..

habitat1 · June 2007

Just checked and, right you are, the ML was introduced with ads for The Lost World sequel in 1997.

Hard to believe the original was in 1993 - 14 years ago. I'm getting old.

Mr_Shiftright · June 2007

I was quite pleased when T-Rex crushed the Explorer but really disappointed that he didn't eat those obnoxious children.

I suspect this was not the type of product placement Porsche was looking for :P

habitat1 · June 2007

I was quite pleased when T-Rex crushed the Explorer but really disappointed that he didn't eat those obnoxious children.

Reminds me of a "Far Side" cartoon with two large polar bears coming upon an Igloo. "Boy, I love these - crunchy on the outside, gooey on the inside". :surprise:

highender · July 2007

Well....to be honest, I am pretty biased when it comes to Porsche...:-)

I still think the Cayenne, either the S or Turbo, is the best SUV , bar none, in terms of overall package and the original definition of "" SUV "" >>> meaning "sports utility vehicle."

turbo goes from 0-60 in 5.2 sec...better than many sports sedans or sports cars.... very good for a heavy SUV ( understatement)...

Plus it can really go off road...an important consideration, since Porsche wanted to sell many to MiddleEast and other parts of the world where the roads are not as developed nor as good as those found in the US.

We love the vehicle. We love the sports...we love the utility. Well, there is a lot of jealousy....Range Rover had to make the supercharged sports edition, to compete against the Cayenne, in terms of sports.

Well, I can see why some people who use and see vehicles as merely forms of transportation, to denigrate a great vehicle. Like Sex is just reproduction to some people.

The IMAX film "" SPEED "" used a Porsche Cayenne in one of its scenes... that should speak volumes.

Many people can afford a 911, maybe even a turbo 911, but with kids and lots of things...the Cayenne is jsut more practical. We had a Boxster S, but sold it due to lack of space for kids.... But what a great handling sports car....

To be fair,, I think the interior design of the RAnge Rover looks better. BUt some people feel it is more cluttered...which I disagree. I also like the looks....of both. We had lots of people stop and give a thumbs up for the car.....

british_rover · July 2007

I still think the Cayenne, either the S or Turbo, is the best SUV , bar none, in terms of overall package and the original definition of "" SUV "" >>> meaning "sports utility vehicle."

Err but it doesn't really have that much utility.

It has the smallest cargo area in its class. It rides like a tank, and it is the least reliable Porsche. Some years of the Range Rover are marked ahead of it by JD Powers.

We have a Cayenne on the lot a fair amount of the time because people trade then in for Range Rovers and Range Rover Sports. The minute someone test drives them back to back with a Range Rover Sport they lose all interest in the Cayenne.

Their first question is usually something like...

"Why do people pay extra to have that harsh uncomfortable ride? If I wanted a Sports Sedan I would get one. That kind of Ride is fine in a Sports car or sedan but in a SUV it is just uncomfortable."

Like you said it is a 5,000 lbs SUV and you know what you shouldn't try and drive it like a sports car because it isn't. It is too heavy, it is too tall and you will just get yourself in trouble.

stever · October 2009

2010 Porsche Panamera 4S Full Test and Video (Inside Line)

texases · October 2009

What do you all think about Piech's recent statements about the Cayenne and Panamera being too big, the wrong vehicles, and they'll radically change (or drop) them at the next update? Here's More

andys120 · October 2009

I think Piech is exactly right, like all cars Porsches have gotten too big and too heavy
and there's too much intramural model competition within the VW stable

stever · February 2014

"Porsche's top managers will soon be drawing up a new expansion plan stretching as far as five years beyond existing targets as the carmaker comes within reach of a 200,000-sales goal, sources familiar with the matter said.

Booming demand for SUVs may push the share of luxury four-by-fours of overall Porsche sales to 63 percent by 2018 from 47 percent last year, IHS said, thanks to the new Macan which will compete with BMW's X3 model and the Mercedes-Benz GLK.

But the steady push for volume does not thrill everyone at Porsche which advertises itself as a "manufacturer of exclusive premium cars."

Porsche Eyes New Targets as 2018 Goal Hit Early on SUVs-Sources (NY Times)

scott1256 · March 2014

Considering Porsche's results since the original 2005 Forbes article, they are certainly 'one of the best' car companies if not 'the best'.

Porsche's board of directors looks very wise in the 20/20 hindsight mirror.

Sales have more than tripled, from 54,234 in 2005 to 162,145 in 2013.

Profit margins are holding in the 18% range, at the top of the industry.

Strangely enough (to me) the volume and profit star for Porsche is the Cayenne series.

Cayenne sales in 2013 were over 84,000 units - about 52% of all Porsche sales.

Porsche - the world's best car company.

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