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BMW 5-Series Lease Questions

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  • sm05sm05 Member Posts: 22
    Thread No #935 under - BMW 3-Series: Lease Questions
  • candyman3candyman3 Member Posts: 6
    :mad: Craigf14, does this mean they dropped off the car on Sat, and now there is a difference in MF? I had several bad experiences with Classic before, mainly in the service dept. I've decided to work out the best deal possible at Moritz/Dallas and then see if Classic will match...
  • craigf14craigf14 Member Posts: 15
    Yes, I test drove the car all day Saturday. Apparently tax credits became available this past week so now they will only sell the car at MSRP rather than the $1500 off of MSRP they already offered. Yes, tax credits certianly help with the payment amonunt, but Classic does not lose a dime by passing the tax credits on to the buyer which Classic is not willing to do. Alos, I was just told that the MF of .0009 is not neogiatable. They will not even consider the MF of .0005 that apparently BMW is offering. These Dallas dealerships are tough.

    Apparently, Classic wants the entire profit between invoice and cost and want to almost double the MF.
  • fm1fm1 Member Posts: 20
    How much tax credit they are offering? Are you getting full 6.25%? Thanks.

    fm
  • candyman3candyman3 Member Posts: 6
    Sorry to hear that. I bought my old X5 from Moritz because I ran into the same issues (Even though I grew up in Richardson). I now live in Frisco and will be near the new Classic when it opens in December.
    Couple questions:

    1. Does it really matter if you buy a 530 from Moritz or Classic? When I had my X5 in for service at Classic- I always felt like a second class citizen (could never get loaner cars, free car washes,etc.) My thought now is get my price at Moritz and get Classic to match it. If not, just get it from Moritz.
    2.What exactly is the tax credit, and where can I find out more info on it?

    SC
  • pintobean3pintobean3 Member Posts: 4
    I got my new BMW yesterday! Thanks for your help 'oneon3putts'.

    Another question, while I was signing papers...dealer offered me some sort of tires and rims replacement program for $375. I said "no" to it but was it worth to get it? It supposed to cover road hazard damages but not on wheel damages from turning corner to close to scratch your wheel.

    I just wonder.

    Thanks for all your help!!
  • sm05sm05 Member Posts: 22
    Yes, the tire wrranty is definitly worth especially if you have run flats...
  • sm05sm05 Member Posts: 22
    Thread No #935 under - BMW 3-Series: Lease Questions. I need to get back to the dealer ..

    Thx in advance............
  • sm05sm05 Member Posts: 22
    Sorry for bringing 3-series question here .. but there was not answer there and I need to get back to dealer...

    Can someone Please help ?

    335i,metallic,PP.SP,Auto,Navig,Sirus,Comfort access,Heated seats,Paddle shifters,Wood trim.

    MSRP: 48,490.00
    24 months 12k miles.
    MF 0.0015
    Residual = 71%

    inception fees = 2332.00
    Payment 24 months = 628.49 ( incl tax )

    8 SD's = 584.00 per month

    Is this a good deal.

    Thx.
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    Okay, I'm assuming that this is a 335i sedan. The price I got was just a tad more:

    Option Description Invoice MSRP
    335i Base $35,605.00 $38,700.00
    205 Steptronic Auto Trans $1,210.00 $1,275.00
    ZSP Sport Package $1,455.00 $1,600.00
    ZPP Premium Package $2,230.00 $2,450.00
    609 Nav $1,910.00 $2,100.00
    655 Sirius $540.00 $595.00
    322 Comfort $455.00 $500.00
    2XA Paddle $90.00 $100.00
    494 Heated Seats $455.00 $500.00
    Destination Charge $695.00 $695.00
    Totals $44,645.00 $48,515.00

    Here are the calculations:

    MSRP $48,515.00
    Cap Cost $47,425.00
    Residual % 73.00%
    Residual $ $35,415.95
    Lease Term 24
    Monthly Depreciation $500.38
    Net Money Factor 0.00101
    Monthly Interest $83.67
    Base Payment $584.05

    The residual should be 73% on a 12k lease. I don't know if that was a typo on your message. The cap cost break down is:

    Invoice $44,645.00
    Amt over invoice $1,775.00
    MACO $380
    Inception $625
    Total $47,425.00
    $0 Down payment (Cap reduction)
    Refundable SD $5,200

    What is the $2332.00 inception fee? Is that a down payment? I don't know where you live, so I don't know if $1,775 over invoice is a good deal. You need to clarify what the $2332 is...
  • sm05sm05 Member Posts: 22
    Hi , Thanks.
    This is the breakup I got from the dealer. He says he makes only 570.00 out of the deal. Its a demo.

    335i sedan,metallic,PP.SP,Auto,Navig,Sirus,Comfort access,Heated seats,Paddle shifters,Wood trim.

    MSRP: 48,490.00
    24 months 12k miles.
    Residual 71% = 34427
    Demo Miles = 1500 -501 @15c/mile = -(149.00) ( discount)
    Mileage Adj: +2% = 969.80
    Adj residual value = 35247.00
    Rate = 0.0015
    dealer price = 45,100.00
    selling price = 45,670.00

    Adjusted selling price = 45685.00

    assignment fee = 625.00
    tax = 1047

    total Cap Cost = 47,367.70

    inception fees = 2332.

    Payment 24 months = $$628.49

    Inception =
    First months payment of $545,
    1 Security deposit = ( I have to confirm this )
    Bank fee of $625
    MV Tax 3 yrs $262.50.
    Document fee of $159,
    State Tire tax of $6.00

    It looks like he added tax to the Cap Cost. Is this normal?

    He is giving at 71% residual but adding 969.80 to residual bring 73% ?? a funky way i thought.....

    Also, for 8 SD's of 4800.00 for 24 months then he is giving rate .00132 , 73% residual, Cap Cost 46,819.58 .
    Pymt Monthly $$584.44
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    Okay, it looks he's ALL over the place with this. Why is he deducting the 1500 demo miles from the residual? Also, why minus the 501 in the mileage calculation? I've never heard of rolling tax into the cap. Why would you do that? You're going to pay interest on it. Also, what's the MV tax for 3 years? Is that a state law? Document fee of $159, state? In addition, there's an assignment fee of $625 (profit), but then you're paying another inception at signing of $625. At 8 SDs, you're MF should be 0.00101, he's marking it up by 0.00031. He's making more than $570...Look at my prior calculation, he was making $1700 on a NEW car, so he's at least making that here...Way too many variables here. With that kind of monthly, you can get into a 530i given it's low MF right now...
  • craigf14craigf14 Member Posts: 15
    Yes, full 6.25% tax credits if they have the car you want on their lot, not if it is ordered or if they have to trade for it.
  • sm05sm05 Member Posts: 22
    I tried to break it up -

    MSRP: $48,490.00 24 months 12k miles.
    Invoice Price = $44645.00
    Residual 71% = $34427.00
    Adj residual value = $35247.00 ( $34427 + $969.80 ){It should have actually been $35396 for 73% so he is up by $149.00}
    As I am not paying tax $1047 upfront its spread across 24months and he is adding to Cap Cost to charge interest on that as well ?
    Total Cap = $44645.00 + $1047 + $570.00( his profit) =
    $46,262.00
    Monthly Depr = $458.96
    Int = $122.26
    pymt = $581
    Pymt with tax = $581 + $43 = $624 close to his offer of $628.49. What do you think ?

    However, I need to check on the MF markup to .00132 with 8SD's
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    If you're spreading the tax, then what is the $1047 added to the cap cost? In a lease, you're paying the difference between the cap and the residual. Look at your calculation, you're adding $1047 to the cap but in your payment you're adding $43 tax to the base. I wouldn't do this deal...Order a new car with the SAME options, and offer them this to start:

    MSRP $48,515.00
    Cap Cost $46,220.00
    Residual % 73.00%
    Residual $ $35,415.95
    Lease Term 24
    Monthly Depreciation $450.17
    Net Money Factor 0.00101
    Monthly Interest $82.45
    Base Payment $532.62

    Invoice $44,645.00
    Cap Additions to Invoice:
    Amt over invoice $570.00
    MACO $380.00 (Dealers in certain small areas won't charge this)
    Inception Markup $0.00
    Inception Fee $625.00
    Down Payment $0.00

    MF
    Buy rate 0.0015 w/one SD
    Additional SD = 7
    Total SD = 8
    Net MF 0.00101

    That's $570 over invoice (amount that he SAID he was making) and work up from there depending on what the going rate is for that car in your area. You can figure out your tax by Base Payment * tax rate...
  • sm05sm05 Member Posts: 22
    Ahh.. You got it! Double Taxation ....

    Yes a new car or I will bring this one down by $40.
    If this does'nt work, I may go for the 530xi we discussed earlier...

    I will keep you posted..
    thx for a lot.....
  • sm05sm05 Member Posts: 22
    While pricing the new car Metallic Paint $475.00 shows up as $0 charge value on edmunds but a $475 is added to the on the BMW website.
    Should dealers addin this to the MSRP as an additional charge?
  • candyman3candyman3 Member Posts: 6
    Craigf14,I visited Moritz today and got a pretty good quote. Email me at scandy95@yahoo.com and I will pass along contact info.

    SC
  • tdbrphtdbrph Member Posts: 40
    There is no charge for metallic paint or floor mats ;) on the 530i

    Triston
  • shuale_ejsshuale_ejs Member Posts: 115
    Hi Car Man,

    I went to a dealer yesterday and put a $500 deposit down on a 525i MT cold weather package w/sirius radio. He said I needed to put a deposit down for them to order the car.

    The details are as follows:

    MSRP $45,540
    Selling Price $43,690
    Residual 15,000 miles per year 36 months 60% ($27,324
    Money Factor .00075
    $525 plus tax per month 36 months

    I thought this was a good deal but now I'm getting worried that it's not. What do you think?

    Also, I think the dealer included the destination charge twice, once in the selling price and then again at the end. I say that because if the MSRP includes the destination charge then the selling price should include it as well, correct?

    Lastly, in previous postings you mentioned you can bring down the MF by paying additional security deposits. How does that work? I can't figure out where in my calculations to put the SDs to bring down the MF and my payments.

    Thanks in advance!
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    Check out the MY 2007 pricing for the 525xi here's the MSRP and invoice of the car:

    Option Description Invoice MSRP
    525 Base $40,200.00 $43,500.00
    ZCP Cold Weather $685.00 $750.00
    655 Sirius $540.00 $595.00
    Destination Charge $695.00 $695.00
    Totals $42,120.00 $45,540.00

    Here are the calculations based on the numbers he gave you:

    MSRP $45,540.00
    Cap Cost $44,295.00
    Residual % 60.00%
    Residual $ $27,324.00
    Lease Term 36
    Monthly Depreciation $471.42
    Net Money Factor 0.00075
    Monthly Interest $53.71
    Base Payment $525.13

    Assuming you are rolling the MACO ($400 guess) and inception ($625) into the cap cost. What that in mind, it is around $1150 over invoice...And it looks like they are marking up the MF by .00025 from the buy rate. If you are 1st time BMWFS customer, you can do 8 SDs (1st to drop the .00015 add-on plus 7 more). If you do so the price will be:

    MSRP $45,540.00
    Cap Cost $44,295.00
    Residual % 60.00%
    Residual $ $27,324.00
    Lease Term 36
    Monthly Depreciation $471.42
    Net Money Factor 0.00026
    Monthly Interest $18.62
    Base Payment $490.04

    But you'll have to come up with around $4,400 in SD. And yes, dest charge is in both invoice and msrp...Good luck!
  • shuale_ejsshuale_ejs Member Posts: 115
    Thank you. So based on your experience and knowledge...is this a good deal?
  • kg6ckg6c Member Posts: 18
    I put a deposit down on a 2007 525i with Automotic transmission and heated seats. I am not applying any SD for the lowering of the MOney Factor. My urgent question is that the dealer told me that he is giving me the lowest MF 12K/36mths at 0.0008. However, I am trying to read the posts and I want to confirm that he is saying the true, or is 0.0005 the lowest he can go. This is for a PA dealership.
    Also, he said that he ws only charging me $500 over invoice when based on the numbers on Edmunds, it is $890 over invoice. Please please let me know what the MF should I be getting.ALso, if anyone out there has gotten a deal for 0.0005 at a PA dealer.
    Thanks
    K
    Thanks
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    Umm, it's certainly not bad. I would try to see if you can get the "buy" rate of 0.0005 and with total of 7 SDs (if you're a 1st time BMWFS cust, 6 if you're a prior cust) you can get that down to 0.00008. That would payment between $15 to $20 a month. Or try to knock another $600 off the cap and give them the markup on the MF. Also make sure that the inception is $625, they can mark that up to $825.
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    The buy rate is .0005, so he's marking it up by .0003 (max markup is .0004). I don't about PA, but here in CA I got the buy rate at .0005 and put down SDs to drop it to .00008. Wouldn't hurt to try. Or try another dealership.
  • shuale_ejsshuale_ejs Member Posts: 115
    I understand paying additonal security deposits (for being a 1st time customer...which they didn't offer me) to drop the MF but am i getting interest on my money for the 36 months that they are going to have it? If not, I don't understand how that would be beneficial if i can earn interest by keeping it in my bank account.

    And how do I get them to drop the MF...do I just ask? Or is there some technique to it...I'm not a haggler (can u tell?)but I don't want to be taken advantage of either.

    P.S. I plan on calling my sales guy in the morning to let him know that his lease calculation included the destination charge of $695 twice...my selling price should be $43,690 (which already includes the destination charge) not $44,385.

    Let's suppose another dealer (Dealer B)gives me a better price...can I get my security deposit back from Dealer A; or, does my paying Dealer A a deposit make it a "done deal"?
  • kg6ckg6c Member Posts: 18
    Sticker 45970. Invoice 42560. Selling Price 43470. MF 0.0008. 12000 miles/year. 36 months lease.

    2K out of pocket which includes tags, title, registration and first months payment.

    $527 cap cost reduction.

    $493.97 monthly payment which includes 9% sales tax (PA) and Interest.

    My only concern is, that if i can actually get the MF down to 0.0005 and the price 400$ lower ($500 above invoice), then the payment drops to $453.

    Am i just being greedy, or is that actually possible?.

    the car is really basic. white, beige leatherette, auto and heated seats.

    thanks in advance
  • kindzcarkindzcar Member Posts: 29
    The dealer that I am working with provided me with a MF of .00076. This is after the max SD. How are other dealers providing lower MF's and how can I lower my MF through my dealer. The MSRP on the car 530 xi is 58,618, selling price 55,758. I was quoted 687 incl tax a month 12k per year. Out of pocket is doc fee, title fee, motor vehicle and 1st month= roughly 1400+ 5,600 SD.

    Any help on the MF would be great. I have about 5 dealers to work with but they all seem to be giving me the same numbers and have the NYC suburb dealer attitude. I am also trying to leverage a MZ4 that my bro wants to lease to the dealers, but they dont seem to care.

    Any help would be great.
  • dhanleydhanley Member Posts: 1,531
    "but am i getting interest on my money for the 36 months that they are going to have it? If not, I don't understand how that would be beneficial if i can earn interest by keeping it in my bank account. "

    Simple. Let's say you give them six security deposits of $500 each for a grand total of $3000. Let's also say that lowers your payments $40 a month. That means by giving them $3000 you save $480 a year. That's like getting over 11% interest. Much better than your bank will give.
  • shuale_ejsshuale_ejs Member Posts: 115
    Thank you...your explaination helped!

    One last thing...I put down a security deposit Wed night for the 525i...but now i think i want the 530i so i faxed out some requests this morning. If i get a better deal can i cancel the order with dealer A without losing my deposit?
  • dhanleydhanley Member Posts: 1,531
    Hm--i think in most cases, a deposit is refundable.

    I'd want to step up to a 530i as well. :)
  • craigf14craigf14 Member Posts: 15
    I just leased my 530i earlier today for 15K/36 months. I received $2500 off of MSRP and a MF of .00075 with full sales tax credits. I know this deal can be beat in California and some other places, but I think it is about as good as it gets in the DFW area. I had the same deal on the table from both Autobahn and Moritz. Both Classic and Dallas BMW had no desire to even get close. If anyone would like additional information, please post an email address and I will get back to you.

    Thanks to all for their help and suggestions.
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    The captive MF for the 530xi is 0.00125...So with the max deduction of 0.00049, it comes out to 0.00076. You are getting the lowest MF available with your SDs...The xi has a higher MF than the 530i (0.00050).
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    Does your cap cost include the inception ($625) and MACO ($200-$400)? Because your numbers doesn't really work out...
  • jluc3jluc3 Member Posts: 2
    Hi craigf14,
    I'm also in the DFW area, and ready to lease from Moritz. What are the details of your lease? Did you also get a quote for the 525i? The best offer I could get on a 525i is 2000 off MSRP with MF .0009 with 1 month SD. I might also go with the 530i. Would appreciate if you could email me the details of your deal and with whom you were dealing with at Moritz and Autobahn.
    Thanks.
    jluc3
  • allnewallnew Member Posts: 3
    Looking to lease a 530xi in NY metro area. Last dealer I spoke to wants about $1000 over invoice for

    Auto Trans
    Cold Weather
    Premium Pkg
    Fold Down Seats
    Navigation

    Lease comes to $640 per month without taxes, nothing down.

    How'm I doin?
  • oneon3puttsoneon3putts Member Posts: 32
    How many years and miles? Are the MACO and inception included in the cap?
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi lewh2. I'm sure that it wouldn't lease someone a vehicle with a negative money factor, but I don't see why it wouldn't be possible to apply seven multiple security deposits to this car's lease program to lower its factor to .00001 unless BMW FS has some sort of minimum money factor that I am not aware of.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi pesagent. The money factor that you were quoted for this car is a little high. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate money factor for a 36 month lease of a 2007 530i is .00050 with the payment of a security deposit at lease signing. It appears as though the dealer that you are working with may be trying to mark your car's money factor up. Make sure to insist that they use the buy rate to calculate your vehicle's monthly payment. This car's selling price looks a little high as well. Try stopping by the following discussion to see how much other community members have paid for similar cars lately: "BMW 5-Series: Prices Paid & Buying Experience".

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    You're very welcome, tinoco. Thanks for the additional information. OK, so you are interested in leasing a 2007 BMW 530i that has an MSRP of $55,270 and a selling price of $52,621. A base '07 530i has a spread of around $3,600 between its full MSRP and dealer invoice price. You are being given a discount of around $2,650 on this car. This looks like a fair price to me. Using the prices that you mentioned in your post and BMW's actual lease program, I estimate that this car's 36 month, 12,000 mile per year, zero down, pre-tax monthly payment should be around $554. If you opt to have your car's security deposit waived, this payment would increase to around $567. This is close to what you were quoted, if there was another fee added in there it would probably be around the same.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Good question, twnmango. Unlike down payments, I believe that multiple security deposits are refunded in the event of a total loss. It wouldn't hurt to check with the F&I person at the dealer to make sure though.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi 0audilicious0. The dealer that you are working with is marking up this car's money factor quite a bit. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate for a 36 month lease of a 2007 530i is only .00050 with the payment of a security deposit at lease signing and .00065 with the deposit waived. Make sure that you don't pay any more than this.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi dylan77. Do you mean $1,000 above sticker or $1,000 over invoice? $1,000 over MSRP is a terrible deal, while $1,000 over invoice is a good deal. As far as ordering your vehicle goes, generally speaking dealers are more willing to discount vehicles that they already have in stock. The reason behind this is that they are constantly paying floorplan interest on vehicles that they already have in inventory. The sooner they sell units that they already have in stock, the sooner they can stop paying interest on them. Furthermore, dealers think that a bird in hand is worth two in the bush so to speak. There is always a risk that a consumer who orders a vehicle will back out before it it arrives, but if they take immediate delivery of a vehicle that is in stock the deal is sealed. So in general dealers are usually willing to discount vehicles that they already have more than ordered vehicles.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Here you go, fm1. According to my calculations, if you were to lease a 2007 BMW 530i with an MSRP of $55,970 and a selling price of $52,970 through BMW Financial Services right now for 36 months with 12,000 miles per year, your zero down, pre-tax monthly payment should be around $565.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hello baudo. This vehicle's lease program varies depending upon how long you lease it for and its mileage allowance. You never mentioned these items, so for now I will assume that you are interested in a 36 month lease with 15,000 miles per year. Let me know if you want something different. BMW Financial Services' current buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36 month lease of a 2007 530xi Wagon with 15,000 miles per year are .00090 and 60%, respectively.

    Car_man
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  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Greetings newlease2. Since you are new to the world of leasing, you definitely should check out the following informative articles that are available here at Edmunds.com prior to visiting any dealers: 10 Steps to Leasing a New Car and Calculate Your Own Lease Payment.

    As far as this deal goes, the money factor that you were quoted is right in line with BMW Financial Services' current buy rate for this model. This is a good sign because it means that the dealer you are working with is not marking your car's money factor up to add additional hidden profit to your deal. You were quoted a $2,156 discount on this car. This seems like a reasonable price to me, but you definitely should stop by the following discussion to see how much other community members have paid for similar cars lately: "BMW 5-Series: Prices Paid & Buying Experience".

    Car_man
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  • allnewallnew Member Posts: 3
    I'm not sure what MACO is and the dealer didn't mention it.

    Inception is not included.

    36 months/12,000 miles
  • fm1fm1 Member Posts: 20
    Hi car man,

    MSRP for 07 530 is $56720. Dealer is giving $3000 off MSRP+6.25% tax credit + all weather floor mats. MF is .0009 which I can bring down to .00048 by putting 7 SDs. What do you think about this deal? Somehow dealer is not negotiating on MF. BTW, in TX. we have to pay entire sales tax upfront. Thanks.

    fm
  • dhanleydhanley Member Posts: 1,531
    Is this tax credit a texas thing? From bmw or from the state?
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi fm1. I am sorry, but I had to delete your post because it contained your e-mail address. Edmunds.com does not allow community members to post their addresses in the forums. If you want someone to e-mail you, make your e-mail address public in your profile and tell them to check there. Thanks.

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