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2013 and earlier-Honda Accord Lease Questions

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  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    Car_man provides residuals for many makes and models but for Hondas you can find them at the Weymouth Honda website if you go to their lease calculator. And yes, your credit rating impacts the money factor just as it impacts the interest rate if you are financing.
    I assure you, all dealers know how leasing works and they prey on the those that are uninformed. Next time, just tell the dealer to give you the money factor, residual and a breakdown of the capitalized cost along with the monthly payment. He won't come back with "why do the details matter." because he will realize that you understand that the details do matter.
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Yes, if two vehicles have the same money factor then the one with the higher residual values would indeed be cheaper to lease...assuming that their MSRPs and selling prices are the same.

    Car_man
    Host
    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    You're welcome sanman1. I'm impressed that you got them to use $1,500 in flex cash on your deal. That makes up for the silly $699 dealer fee. I think that you did well. Enjoy your new ride :) !

    Car_man
    Host
    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • sanman1sanman1 Member Posts: 121
    edited June 2013
    Thanks car_man. I think I did well..lol I'm not sure if I got them to do $1500 in flex cash. Maybe you meant the $500? Anyway, there was no money out of pocket and it is a 15k mile lease for 36 months. No money down and first payment and all fees were rolled into the lease deal. I pay $392 a month plus state sales tax. This particular V6 coupe doesn't seem to have any special lease deals going and the residual is a little low which can affect payment. If the resdidual was 58% then we are talking under $400 a month with tax incl. Car is awesome so far.
  • sittiesittie Member Posts: 3
    Thank you huskerfan5. After correcting the residual and adding in fees (Acq fee $595; Doc fee $516 and first month payment, we ended up with a monthly payment of $331 on the following amounts:
    Purch $26215
    MSRP $28860
    Res 54% (drop from 56% w/ 15k mi lease)
    Money factor .00089
    Flex cash $500
    Cash down $1000
    15k miles/yr
  • tweety6583tweety6583 Member Posts: 15
    Just got a 3yr 12k lease for $319/month, no cash down, no out of pocket, only thing due at signing was the first months payment of $319.

    I rolled the $595 acquisition fee, $250 doc fee, $791 of sales tax and registration all into the payment. Car was $25,163, dealer showed as $25,663 - $500 flex cash. Cap cost (total of above) was $26,799.

    I think I could have shaved another couple hundred if I waited until the end of the month or pushed harder, but dealer knew I did my homework and could get a quick sale at this price. In and out of dealer in under two hours, and the last hour was the salesperson helping me pair my phone and explaining all the electronics.

    How did I do?
  • jgtsjgts Member Posts: 1
    edited June 2013
    Finishing up a lease on a loaded Crosstour and interested in what I should be paying to lease an Accord EX V6 without Nav (2013). Dealers are giving me the run around on price so any help or ranges you can provide would be really appreciated!

    Also interested in lease pricing for the Sport. Was told last week by the dealer that 340 plus tax and 750 down would get me there. Seems like 13K total is a little high for a car that lists around 23K.

    I hate going to the dealership so would love to have the ammo to make it a one stop trip.

    Thank you very much for any insights you may have!!!!
  • carguy778carguy778 Member Posts: 33
    hey can you tell me where did you lease your car from. I m also looking for the same.

    Thanks
  • tweety6583tweety6583 Member Posts: 15
    Hey Carguy778,

    I shopped all around Cincinnati and Dayton Ohio area. Three very good dealers, Joe Morgan, Matt Castrucci, Allan Nott were all very competitive and I would have purchased from any of them. They all were in the same $320/range, other Honda dealers were $340 and above, I walked out at 6 other dealerships, but each time I was able to get closer to a realistic bottom line. My learning on this is as you approach end of month, you should be able to beat my $320 by another $10 to $15/month. Good Luck.
  • yoyolenyoyolen Member Posts: 2
  • yoyolenyoyolen Member Posts: 2
    edited June 2013
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    Honda Finance establishes the money factor based on your credit tier and the residual based on the model. Ask to see it in writing if you do not trust the dealer but they are not negotiable.
  • anthony212anthony212 Member Posts: 15
    Ok this is the quote I got from a dealership in NY. I feel like I'm getting ripped off.
    Honda Accord Ex-L Coupe i4
    36 months 12k lease
    Monthly Lease Fee $250.01
    Cap Cost Reduction 3658.19
    Tax on cap cost reduction 315.52
    Up Front Tax (8.625) 776.28
    Total Due At Inception 5000 (Thats the trade in for my Car)
    Less Cash Deposit 100
    Cash Due on Delivery 4900
    Purchase Option Price 16161.60
    He also used the $500 for Flex Cash

    How much lower can I get this guy I feel like I'm paying way to much for the car.
  • ral2167ral2167 Member Posts: 791
    edited June 2013
    yes-- if i did things right-- you would be getting ripped off.
    I used a lease calculator:
    MSRP: $28900
    Selling price: 25242 (28900 - 3658)
    Down Payment: 4900
    Sales tax: 8.625
    Lending rate-- you didn't supply this, but I used 1.9%
    Car value at end of loan: $16161.6

    I got $157.55/month. So how are they getting $250.01????? The only nice thing about this is the selling price of $25242. That is very good price.
  • anthony212anthony212 Member Posts: 15
    It was 10 mins before closing when he told me his price after we kept going back and forth. I honestly have no clue where he got the $250.01 doesn't make sense. Btw which calculator did you use?
  • ral2167ral2167 Member Posts: 791
    I use this one:
    http://www.bankrate.com/calculators/auto/auto-lease-calculator.aspx

    It's accurate as I also lease and it matched exactly my lease payment when I plugged in my numbers.
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    I didn't do any calculations, but if the total due at signing is the $5,000, then the lease must include the Honda Finance fee, doc fees and registration so you would need to add those into the cap cost. That will get you a little closer.

    It's not advisable to pay so much at inception in case the car is stolen or totalled.
  • anthony212anthony212 Member Posts: 15
    I know it's not smart to put down money on the car, but he kept telling me the less money I put down the higher the price would jump, but still that quote he gave me just didn't sound right.
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    He's right, your payment would go up close to $150 but it's not worth the risk paying $5,000 up front. The additional interest you will be paying on the lease should be considered cheap insurance. He will make the same either way you go but he wants you to pay more upfront because he thinks, psychologically, you would be more apt to close the deal at a lower monthly payment.
  • anthony212anthony212 Member Posts: 15
    Still don't understand how he came up with $250 a month, anyway I'm going to a different dealership today. And would like to get it down to $250 with little / no money down
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    anthony, you need to understand how leasing works or no one is going to take you seriously. Read this forum and the prices paid forum. Keep in mind that in NY, you will have about $1K in cap cost for Honda Finance fee, doc fees and registration. If you use the Jun money factor found in this forum with your residual and include the $1K as I mentioned, and take the best deal for an EX-L found in the Prices Paid forum, you won't come anywhere near $250 if you aren't putting anything down. Use the calculator, use a price that you are comfortable with, arrive at the monthly cost using 36 equal monthly payments (no extra money at inception). Then use that amount for your negotiations and don't let the salesman change the parameters of what to include or exclude from the lease as that will make it difficult to compare scenarios.
  • CarMan@EdmundsCarMan@Edmunds Member Posts: 38,514
    Hi yoyolen. Honda Finance's June buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 36-month lease of a 2013 Accord LX 4-cylinder (they vary by trim level) with 15,000 miles per year are .00089 and 58% for consumers who qualify for its "Super Preferred" credit tier.

    Car_man
    Host
    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • pjny77pjny77 Member Posts: 12
    I have the same EXACT question for the group. I'm looking at a 2013 Honda Accord and possibly the Acura TSX, but wasn't sure how much wiggle room there is with the manufacturer lease offers.

    I'm comfortable with the terms, but was wondering if there was more room to negotiate. I'm sure they are basing their numbers on MSRP, not invoice.
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    It is extremely rare when a manufacturer lease offer is the best deal you can make. They generally build in plenty of profit for the dealer. You negotiate the lease cost by negotiating the price the leasing company will pay for the car and applying it to the lease formula that includes money factor, residual, etc. The price should the same as if you are purchasing the car yourself. After all, the dealer should make the same profit whether he sells the car to you or to Honda Finance. When you see the manufacturer's offer, they have come up with a price that essentially no dealer would turn down. You can certainly negotiate a better price.
  • marbetd77marbetd77 Member Posts: 13
    My dealer contacted us for an early lease buy out (ends May 2014). Currently we pay $365.62/month for accord EX-L V6 with Navi. Put zero down. I have the June money factor and residual value (.00089 and 58%) plus there's the possibility of $500 flex cash. Any idea if July would have better numbers, and if the flex cash would be available?
    .
  • lavjrlavjr Member Posts: 18
    Hi Guys,

    Is this a good deal please?
    2013 Honda Accord EX Sedan
    Selling Price 22605
    American Honda Finance 790
    Cash Difference 23395
    W.T.& L.A 6.5
    Electronic Fee 89.95
    Dealer Fees 699
    Total Taxable Amt 24190.45
    Lemon Law 2
    Dade Cty Tax 50
    Sales Tax 1,451.43
    Tag Fee tbd
    Sub-Total 25,693.88
    $315.00 tax in per month.
    36 months
    12 miles per year
    *$0.00 due at signing*.
    residual for the 2013 Accord EX is 60. Money f actor is :0.00089

    Thank you,

    Luiz
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    I'll let others talk about price but they bumped up the $595 Honda Finance Fee.
  • jgstaffojgstaffo Member Posts: 1
    I just took in my 10 year old toyota sienna mini-van, which has about 185,000 miles on it in to see how much I could get for a trade in on a 2013 Accord LX Sedan. The lease offer was $210 a month with a $500 down payment. My trade in was valued at $2300 which was taken off of the monthly payment as well as the down payment. I believe it was originally a $2,000 down payment with no trade in so $1,500 was taken off of that. Is this a good deal and is it true that dealerships offer better prices as the month comes to an end in order to get sales numbers up? Any comments or weigh in here would be great. Thanks!
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    What exactly is the deal? Is it you give him your Sienna and $500 and you then pay $210 per month or do you give him your Sienna, another $500 for the down payment, $595M for the Honda Finance fee, more cash for his documentation fee, your state's title/registration and, of course, sales taxes. In a typical lease, every $1,000 you pay up front lowers the payment by about $30, so your $210 + cash + trade is equivalent to $304. That is not a good deal. If it's the second case, you are really being taken to the cleaners.
  • gmanusmcgmanusmc Member Posts: 699
    I see your excellent posts where you try to explain leasing calculations to folks in the hopes of clearing up all their confusion and it is evident you have a firm grasp on the mechanics of leasing. What I can't understand is why shoppers don't just do their calculations based on no money (zero dollars) due at signing. That way if you have a target payment that you must reach, you just adjust the amount at signing, bargain for a better selling price (and/or better trade allowance if applicable), and make sure you are receiving the best money factor the dealer can offer. Jgstaffo's deal is a prime example of how a dealer can confuse the shopper by throwing all those numbers into the pot. I wish folks could just simplify and control the process - I know - I'm preaching to the choir.
    2016 ES350 Lux/Atomic Silver
    2017 Accord Sport CVT Mod Steel Metallic
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    Thanks, you nailed it. Get the money factor and residual, take your target purchase price and add all the fees and TTL, throw it into a calculator and come up with 36 equal payments, then negotiate off that.
  • positronuspositronus Member Posts: 1
    Hey guys,

    Love this forum. Have been reading it quite a bit, wish I saw it on my last lease! I never thought negotiating price first and then calculating lease price off that is the way to do it...well because dealers told me that it's not how lease works. Not it makes sense what you preach and I know better!

    So I currently have Honda Pilot EX lease for which ends January 2014, I wanted to get into Accord Sport or EX Manual. Is now a good time to start shopping for a lease and when is a good time to start really buying? I always though August/September. If timing is good, is 6 month turn over on a lease to get into new one a doable thing?

    What do you think about TrueCar.com? It seems like a good tool and the prices they show are around 10% lower than MSRP.

    And last question, is residual value calculated off MSRP or selling price of a vehicle?

    Thanks!
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    Generally speaking, Aug and Sep may be good times to purchase a car but since you need to factor in money factors and residuals for a lease, you can't necessarily say that's the case if you are leasing. Residuals drop during the year and the money factor is a product of economic conditions and marketing strategy. Makes no sense to start shopping for a lease now. Money factors and residuals are set monthly, so it wouldn't even make sense to shop for a lease today unless you make a deal before Jul 1.
    Early lease terminations, unless there is a program by the manufactures, generally won't be in your favor.
    Residuals are based on MSRP.
    Tried using Truecar once. Never got any dealer replies. Based on what I've seen in forums, Truecar changed their pricing structure and deals are no longer as favorable. Regardless, you should negotiate up from dealer cost, not down from MSRP. You can price an Accord at $100K and take 50% off MSRP and it would still be a terrible deal.
  • gpb59gpb59 Member Posts: 106
    Car man, can you give me July (if you have) or June money factor on Accord EX-L with nav for 4 cyl and 6 cyl? thanks
  • gpb59gpb59 Member Posts: 106
    with 10k miles or 12k miles per year
  • camokatucamokatu Member Posts: 19
    edited July 2013
    CarMan,

    Are residual and money factor for Accord Sport Manual with 12K miles per year for July available?

    Thanks!
  • camokatucamokatu Member Posts: 19
    Thanks huskerfan5,

    Sorry, forgot my other login and don't remember email I used :confuse:

    When you say "Regardless, you should negotiate up from dealer cost", how can I find out what dealer cost is? As I understand there are number of things at play here - holbacks, hidden incentives, etc.

    I see that residual for Sport is 59%, I used Weymouth Honda lease calculator. I am trying to time when I will lease this vehicle, so when, if possible can I expect this number to go to 58%?

    Lastly, I thought that 2014 models are available starting August/September, but one of the dealers told me it's November/December, is this true?

    Thanks!
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    I'll answer in reverse order.
    Based on a look back in this forum, both the carryover 2012 and the redesigned 2013 were introduced in Sep so I would expect the same.
    As for residuals, I suggest you do some detective work and go back through old posts to determine when Honda has traditionally changed the residuals and maybe you can predict.
    You can buy a report from Consumer Reports where they claim to show dealer's cost. Of course, with incentives based on sales, not even the dealer actually knows today the final cost of the cars on his lot. My point was the MSRP's are meaningless so negotiating down is not the optimal way to go.
    Write down your new username so you don't develop multiple personality disorder :)
  • camokatucamokatu Member Posts: 19
    edited July 2013
    Thanks huskerfan5, I'll try to remember this one :blush:

    Reading through posts I see "flex cash" mentioned. What does this term mean?
  • camokatucamokatu Member Posts: 19
    I've read enough posts and articles to see that dealers sometimes charge made up fees, or inflate real fees during leasing. Is there a list or perhaps someone can reply with one of the legitimate fees that one can expect to see during lease negotiations and their range values.

    Thanks!
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    The Honda Finance lease inception fee is $595. You can get the tier one credit money factors by asking Car_man in this forum or going to the lease calculator at the Weymouth Honda website. I'm not even aware that Honda Finance lets dealers mark it up at all.
    I believe $500 flex cash is money made available to certain dealers by Honda to sweeten the deal. A savvy buyer following the Prices Paid forum will negotiate a deal based on his location and then ask for the $500 flex cash. If anyone can add to this, please jump in.
  • cnivenscnivens Member Posts: 1
    So I'm still digesting this site and reading through the forum, but went in to honda to test drive and get more info on leasing an Accord EX-L w/ navi (not a V-6). I used the Weymouth Honda calculator that I saw referenced on here...I'm getting VERY different amounts than what the dealership told me.

    Total sale price of the car is $29,140, $554 due on delivery, and for a 36 month/12,000 mile lease, they told me $388.92 with a $1,500 downpayment...from reading on here I am thinking this is not a good deal at all...any help?
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    The main difference is that Weymouth is selling the car for about $1K under invoice and your dealer for $1K above invoice. If you "digested" my posts, you would know that you want to minimize what you pay at inception. I'm sure it was the salesman who suggested putting $1500 down. Do you know why? It's because if you put down only $1,000, your payment would come to over $400 and psychologically, that sounds so much worse than $388 and your payment would be over $430 if you didn't put anything down.
    Incidentally, even if the numbers were close to Weymouth, there is no way I could tell you if you got a good deal since it varies by state. If one state has high sales tax and high registration fees and another has no tax and low registration fees, the same scenario could be a good deal in one state and a bad deal in another. You need to provide details if you want help.
    Read the prices paid forum and get an idea of what your car should go for where you live and let the next salesman know you did your homework and you'll be treated differently. Your response should have been, "could you double check that, I think you added the $1000 to the invoice instead of subtracting it" and after he gave you the new price (which will probably be less than $1,000 under invoice) you can negotiate from there.
  • camokatucamokatu Member Posts: 19
    I am new to all of this, so apologies if this is dumb question, but how do you find out invoice price on the car? If in Weymouth example I add $500-$1000 I get approximate invoice price, but what about other dealers? Does everyone pay the same invoice price?
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    You can find the invoice price on this site by clicking "New Cars" in upper left and selecting your make. KBB.com also has new car pricing. I have found that Edmunds frequently doesn't show the premium for certain colors while KBB does.
    Not sure what you mean by "does everyone pay invoice price". You negotiatie the price of the car at each dealer. The Prices Paid forum is helpful for you to get an idea what others may be paying for your model in your location which will assist you in your negotiations. Study hard because the salesman will quickly size you up and try to take advantage of your lack of experience.
  • camokatucamokatu Member Posts: 19
    Thanks huskerfan5.

    Quick question so to start another thread.

    I was quoted a selling price of $22,883.72 for 2013 Accord EX Manual. I was told that monthly payments would be $309 with sign-and-drive no money down. Fees are $371.10. Residual 60%, MF 0.00089.

    According to my calculations from http://www.theautoleasecalculator.com the price with fees should be around $256 per month. Are my calculations correct? Is acquisition fee usually included in selling price, if not then payment is still around $273 per month.
  • camokatucamokatu Member Posts: 19
    edited July 2013
    Should read "Quick question so NOT to start another thread. "

    Doing more calculations, specifically adding destination price and acquision price to the mix yields a figure close to $309. I hate when they don't disclose everything up front.
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    Don't blame the dealer. Stop guessing and ask the dealer for the components of the capitalized costs.
    The breakdown will be on your lease agreement so its not like it is a top secret.
  • camokatucamokatu Member Posts: 19
    Yeah, I will. I am doing this over email, hard to see lease agreement.
  • huskerfan5huskerfan5 Member Posts: 165
    You won't see the lease agreement until you are ready to sign, but there is no reason not to have the detail before hand. As long as the salesman understands you know how the lease amount is calculated (many people have no clue), he shouldn't hesitate to give you the breakdown. You seem to be well past the point where the salesman tells you all you need to care about is the lease payment itself.
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