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2007 Ford Edge
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Comments
I had a Mazda Protege5 where just a slight presure would put you through the windshield. Now that was annoying.
Maybe Ford should add Brake Assist.
Mark.
Have you actually checked your 60-0 braking distance? This is not somthing that you can tell by the seat of your pants. It is almost impossible to tell without measuring it ( unless you hit the person in front of you with good brakes.. ).
The ONLY thing Ford did to the brakes from the pre-production models was add vented rear rotors. I would not exactly call that "back to the drawing board". Since the front does 80% of the stopping, this will not solve the problem.
For example, Edmunds tested their new long term Edge which is a full 2007 production model and it produced the same hair raising 150ft stopping distances. Here is a direct quote from the article Edmunds wrote about adding the Edge that they bought from dealer stock to their long term fleet:
"When it comes to cars geared for family duty, stopping is more important than going fast. In the case of the Edge, stopping from 60 mph in 158 feet is not getting the job done. Relatively low mileage may be a factor in this poor result, but even with only 818 miles on the odometer we expect better."
P.S. I look at two Edges a local dealer had. One had vented rear disc, the other did not. Anyone who buys one of these things needs to take a look first...
That would seemingly indicate that the front brakes are not reliably doing their ~80% "share".
2007 Ford Edge Scores "Top Safety Pick" Award
Oh, sorry, that's right, if it can't be driven it's more safe.
I'd be carfeful if you're trying to make a statement about Ford quality. Ford's last two new products have matched or beaten all the competition quality wise; would you like to take a bet on the Edge maintaining this trend?
tidester, host
The Article I quoted from with the 158ft stop was written By Mike Schmidt , Vehicle Testing Assistant
Date posted: 01-10-2007. The test was done on a standard production vehicle that they added to their long term test fleet. So YES it was tested AFTER the fixes that delayed the edge's release...
It is not bashing to tell the truth. If yours stops better than 146ft. It is the best stopping test to date...
So far: MotorTrend, Car and Drive, Edmunds, MotorWeek have ALL seen the same problem.
tidester, host
I found that the front end dives sharply on hard braking and the brake pedal feels mushy. I did one panic stop from 45mph. I did it in front of the dealership. There was a row of cars parked on the street. It took 13 parking lot spaces to come to stop. The cars were parked about 9' apart. That is about 120' from only 45mph???
After that one hard stop, the brake fade was rather obvious and the pedal was even softer. I would NOT want to drive this thing in Atlanta Highway traffic. After the brakes heat up a little in stop and go traffic, the stopping distances will get much worse...
"So all these statistics doesnot mean anything.."
These stastics might not mean much to you, but I don't want to significantly increase the odds of me having an accident simply because Ford created a poor design. I also plan to tow a boat with it, so that will make it an even more serious issue for me.
You also might want to read this:
http://blogs.edmunds.com/.ee98071/6
P.S. You milage will certianly improve. It will probably gain 2-3mpg over time ( and you quit pressing the accelerator hard on your new toy )
It was fairly simple... Get up to 45mph and hit the brakes when I was even with one of the parked cars and count how many we passed until it stopped... This is not exactly rocket science...
Did you "stomp and steer"? i.e. hit & hold the brake pedal as hard as you could?
I hit the brakes as hard as I could and held the wheel so that it stopped in a straight line. It stopped more or less in a straight line with little or no steering input...
I did not try a power slid or anything if that is what you are getting at...
Order of finish:
Last: Edge
3rd Highlander
2nd Santa Fe (Hyundai fer cripes sake)
1st Murano (One UGLY mutha if u ask me.)
Oh, and these are the old Murano and Highlander, not the brand new ones which will be out soon.
BTW, Braking for the Ford - worst in the group. 149ft from 60mph. The Murano needed only 121 ft.
Also, gas mileage - worst in the Edge. Hey Bill Ford, Mr Green Jeans, what say you about that?
This is also interesting - the Ford is about 10% heavier than the rest yet it's cargo volume is almost 20% smaller.
The Ford did win one category - exterior looks. Though the interior was back to the bottom of the heap.
Unbelievable that Ford would try to foist this off on the public after the Firestone/Explorer disaster, and the exploding police cars and the story that Volvo engineers are teed off that FOrd is trying to lower the strength of the roof in their cars, etc etc.
Hey, Mulally, what say you about this?
Order of finish:
Last: Edge
3rd Highlander
2nd Santa Fe (Hyundai fer cripes sake)
1st Murano (One UGLY mutha if u ask me.)
Oh, and these are the old Murano and Highlander, not the brand new ones which will be out soon.
BTW, Braking for the Ford - worst in the group. 149ft from 60mph. The Murano needed only 121 ft.
Well that should end the "they fixed the brakes in the production model debate...."
Does any one really still belive that an extra 28ft stop does not increase your odds of rear ending another car?
Sure. It's only a factor in a full panic stop and I can't remember the last time I had to make one of those. And even then it has to be a situation where you can't steer around whatever stopped in front of you.
Maybe people really do not care about little things like braking ability... I guess I do...
tidester, host
http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/reviews/rt2619b.shtml
Another disparagement between the two tests is the reverse spec. Edmunds puts 0-60 at 8.3 seconds while MW puts it at 7.5 seconds. Both used a fully loaded SEL+.
I wonder why the differences?
http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/reviews/rt2619b.shtml
Another disparagement between the two tests is the reverse spec. Edmunds puts 0-60 at 8.3 seconds while MW puts it at 7.5 seconds. Both used a fully loaded SEL+.
I wonder why the differences?
Different road surfaces can yield different stopping results. So far the braking test of the Edge have ranged from 146' - 161'. Take the average and you are over 150'. The same is true of acceleration test preformed on differnet days and locations. One done on a cool dry day near sea level where the air is more dense might have a 25hp ( or more ) advantage over a test preformed on a hot humid day at higher elevation.
The best test are ones where different vehicles are tested on the same day on the same road surface. This shows the true performance differences. The MT test for example showed a 28ft difference between the best in class and worst in class on braking on the same road surface...
There is also the question of options on the cars, particularly was it a FWD or AWD. I read the Motorweek article and they never said which drivetrain theirs' had. The AWD will be slower for sure.
The March 07 Motor Trend test used and AWD w/big moonroof option. They got 7.7 0-60 time. And 16.8 all round mpg.
BTW, I am very unimpressed with motorweeks 'tests' or 'reviews' or whatever they call em. They seem to be little more than resated advertising.
On a dry high traction pavement the shortest stopping distance might very well be attained by disabling ABS. But then you risk losing control of the vehicle due to inadvertent lock up of the front wheels, or even the rears for that matter.
It will be interesting to see how long it takes those very same engineers to figure out that the best of all worlds would be to disable ABS unless VSC indicates an impending loss of directional control.
So, that extra stopping distance for the Ford Edge may very well be a GOOD compromise.
*Maybe* what you're saying is that the Edge, given it's weight and choice of brake sizing and hardware, could not stop quicker unless it lost directional control? I dunno. Are you a Ford engineer?
"It will be interesting to see how long it takes those very same engineers to figure out that the best of all worlds would be to disable ABS unless VSC indicates an impending loss of directional control."
Is totally out of touch with reality. PLEASE stop making recommendations that, if followed, endangers people's lives.
I've had a career as an enigneer in the auto industry, a significant portion intimately with brake systems, and I know from experience that disabling the ABS is one of the dumbest thing a vehicle owner could do.
The rest of his post is pretty non-sensical as well.
Interesting that his conclusion is that its good that it takes the Edge a lot longer to stop than the competition.
I estimate that would take about 3,000 feet starting at 60 mph in a two ton vehicle. :surprise:
tidester, host
I estimate that would take about 3,000 feet starting at 60 mph in a two ton vehicle.
tidester, host"
HAHA Yeah, but if it's in a straight line, maybe it's a GOOD compromise! And, what size foot did you assume? :>)
I also didn't realize how much of a disadvantage the Edge has from a packaging standpoint. Add to this the visibility issues, weight and mileage issues, and interior quality issues, and it seems Ford has produced a bunt when they needed a home run. I mean really, every car in that test has been on the market for a while; did Ford bother to test any of them? How to you release a car like this that you know isn't going to measure up?
I'll still give one of these a drive for myself, largely because I'm a Ford fan and I really like the looks of this car, but I don't expect to be terribly surprised. The Edge seems to be the opposite of the 500; a great looking car with not a whole lot going for it beyond that. I hope for Ford's sake that the Edge's looks can carry it until some of the shortcomings are addressed. Once again, it looks like we've got another "yeah, but wait for the two year refresh" scenario.
I expect the Edge to be as reliable as the Fusion which means it is not likely to break. :P
Seriously though, it looks like Ford did the same thing with the Edge that it did with the Fusion - engineer to a price point $2K less than the competition (in this case the Murano). This requires compromises in some areas. Note this was done prior to the new regime and I don't think you'll see that going forward.
I've heard from one of the engineers that they're switching to Michelins for 2008 and that should improve the braking.
Where did you see them listed as "power fold seats"? Ford calls it the "EasyFold™ remote second row seat-back release" on their site. If you ask me both say that the folding action is power activated and has nothing to do with the action of retracting them to their upright positions.
The system in the Expedition, Explorer and some others is called the "3rd Row PowerFold™ seat" and they do go up and down with the touch of a button. Ironically, that name doesn't tell me that it folds them back up either but the two names are definitely different.
The "job" of the ABS ECU firmware is to detect impending wheel lock-up (it doesn't wait for the wheel to actually "lock", it "looks" at the rate at which the tire is slowing toward lock) during braking as early as is feasibly possible given current technological product availability and cost.
Ideally ABS could use a linear servo system but due to current product COST limitations it must use a "bang-bang", PWM, Pulse-Width Modulation,type servo loop.
Another cost related compromise.
There are so many variables, roadbed type, roadbed condition, tire adhesions, etc, etc, etc, involved in this it is incomprehensible for most of us to get our minds around the problem.
If you read up on current information in this subject you will find while that is sometimes the result, ABS is NOT designed into these systems as an aid in stopping quicker or in a shorter distance.
It is there SOLELY to help you maintain directional control, allow you to provide stearing inputs if needed, and/or prevent under/overstearing during severe or hard braking where otherwise you might lose control due to brake induced lockup.
VSC can detect the onset of skidding, overstearing or understearing, and react with corrective measures, long before your own seat-of-the-pants sensor will.
So why not delay the onset of ABS activation until these is an impending or actual need for it as an aid to maintaining directional control?