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Honda Accord (1990-1993) Maintenance and Repair

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Comments

  • exqueezmepleezexqueezmepleez Member Posts: 3
    I bought a filter with pan gasket for my transmission but can't seem to find the pan. Sounds stupid but it isn't on the bottom of the transmission and havn't found a diagram of one either. Was I sold something that isn't for my car after all, or is the darn thing hidden on a side that I can't see. I do my own repairs and maintenance myself and only own a Chilton's manual. Please let me know where of if it is. Thank you. :confuse:
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Even if there was a pan (which I don't think they do), you would not have to remove it to drain the tranny. There is a drain plug (with a 3/8" drive hole in it for a breaker bar). The drain plug has a magnet on it, to catch loose material. Wipe the magnet off before re installing the plug. I can't believe the Chilton manual doesn't cover this. I am pretty sure the filter is internal, and the tranny would have to be taken apart to change it. Are you having trouble with the tranny?
  • exqueezmepleezexqueezmepleez Member Posts: 3
    Thanks for responding to me. I already drained the fluid a week ago and got my passing gear back but with as filthy as the fluid was I wanted to drain it again with a filter change. I was told that it has 2 filters in it, one requires a complete tear down to get to, and the other is a little barrel shaped filter accessible through a pan. I was sold a filter with a rectangle gasket from Kragens. Reason for wanting to change fluid again is it is still a little slipish. (if that is a word) Thanks :confuse:
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    I would change the fluid two more times, with a short drive in between. That is considered a flush, in 90 Accord terms. Does it have a pan? I sure don't remember one on my 92.
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    having never seen the interior of the door, i cannot say. what i suggest you consider is taking the panelling off one of the doors that works and comparing the two (the one broken and the one not).

    that's not great advice, but seems like it might get you further in sleuthing a fix.

    some googling turned up:
    http://autorepair.about.com/cs/faqs/l/bl066e.htm
    http://www.pauldesign.ru/honda/shopmanual.html
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    I finally went to U pick and got it myself. 10 bucks, It looks like one little piece was broken(the one that holds one of the cables).

    I have anohter question about transmission. I asked the mechanic about flushing the trans, he told me if i had the history of trans flushes. i said no. My trans has been working for 133 000 miles no problem, no leaks. He advised me not to flush it because it can create trouble.... Is that true?
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    A "Power Flush" with a machine is not recommended by many Honda technicians. What Honda described as a trans flush in my 92 Accord service manual was "Change the transmission fluid 3 times, with a short drive between each change to circulate the fluid". When you drain the transmission, you only drain about 60% of the fluid. This is why you have to change it 3 times to replace most of the fluid. It takes 3 quarts for each drain and fill. I would use Honda ATF-Z1 if I were you. Other fluids can cause harsh shifting.
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    good news! a 10 spot and you fixed it. good for you.

    i tend to agree with elroy5 w.r.t. transmission drain and replace. this is something you can do yourself if you have ramps. i think the key thing is use Honda fluids as elroy points out.

    this is going to sound conflicted, but if you've had the transmission regularly serviced at on honda dealership (say every 30K), and if they are using a machine which automates the process, i don't think that sort of "flushing" is going to cause problems...

    if however, the transmission has never been a problem, and has never been serviced in this manner, i'm thinking the drain and replace 3 times is the more conservative thing to do.
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    the three time flush is with ramp or without? Problem is I am driving to canada and i am debating on doing a transmission flush or not. As I said, tranny never been tocuhed in 6 yeard I have owned the car. What do you suggest me? In case of doing it myself(the flushing), is there any harm or worries i should be afraid of? I cannot afford another AT now. :confuse: :confuse:
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Changing the fluid three times (using Honda ATF-Z1) will not harm anything. My 92 Accord had over 100,000 miles on it before I changed the fluid, and it shifted a little smoother after that. Some shops flush the trans with a machine that just uses the transmission's own pump to circulate the new fluid into, and old fluid out of the transmission. This is completely safe. It's the "power flush" machines that are a no-no, because they will actually jam particles where they wouldn't normally go.
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    if the unit was having problems which were the result of debris restricting a passage, i would think a power flush would be a good thing.

    anyway, your advice is all good. the person didn't realize perhaps you need to drain and refill the unit with fluid 3 times (yes using the ramps at home) to get most of the old fluid out of the unit as you've explained before.

    So you think the typical dealer calls the machine (that just uses the car's pump) a flush? Dang, that's no better than the drain and fill you propose, except it's automated and expensive, right? :shades:
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    So you think the typical dealer calls the machine (that just uses the car's pump) a flush? Dang, that's no better than the drain and fill you propose, except it's automated and expensive, right?

    The machine that uses the transmission's own pump will do a better job, because it will get all the old fluid out (not just dilute it). Unless the fluid is really dirty, this extra expense is not necessary, and the 3 change method will do, IMO. The "power flush" is not recommended by some techs because it can force large particles from the bottom of the transmission up into very close tolerance areas, where they could become trapped and clog things up.
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    hi elroy,
    I will get the ramps and do it. What you are telling about particles in areas which can get clogged is exactly what the mecahinc told me. I guess I can do the flush by myself. I will use the Trans liquid you told me.

    Thanks
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    It can be a challenge to put the fluid in, considering where the dipstick hole is. Determine exactly what you will need to do the job by going through the motions (probably a long funnel with a small outlet). It takes 3 quarts of fluid for each change. When you take the drive between drain and refills, use all the gears (up to 40mph), and use reverse some too.

    Most of all, be careful, and take your time. The engine will be hot. Good luck :)
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    a funnel and flexible segment of tubing which fits in the dipstick?
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    It's important to make sure you have exactly what you need to fill the transmission (tools, funnel), before you drain the old fluid out. If flexible tubing, or a long skinny funnel, is needed, it would be a good idea to acquire these before hand. Trying to get the transmission fluid bottle down where the fill hole is, would be difficult, if not impossible.
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    Hi elroy5,
    I guess I have to buy the ATF-Z1 at a honda dealer, isn't ? I just called one and it is 6.96 per qt.... Is that all right?

    Gonna do this next weekend.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Yes, the dealer is the only place you can get it. Wow, $6.96 when I bought some at the local dealer it was less than $5.00/quart. For 9 quarts that will run up quite a bill. :cry: Is there another dealer in your area? The next nearest dealer around here is 60 miles away, so hardly worth the trip (so even if it was $7/quart, I guess I would have to pay up). Hopefully they quoted you the wrong price.
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    Yep, I found out about other dealers around here(Miami,FL) the cheapest is 6.07 so will be 60 bucks for the 3 time change. I think is worth it. I will let you know how it went on Monday!
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    hey man i didn't see this ,....very nice. I painted mine with the color it had before...very nice too
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    ATF:
    http://www.handaaccessories.com/accmaint01.html
    even with shipping, i think you should be able to do a bit better ordering it from here.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    It seems even HandA is overpriced. This is my receipt from Barker Honda for 4 quarts of ATF-Z1. Bring a copy of this receipt to your local dealer, and ask why the price they charge is so high.
    Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    consistently, i think H+A has good pricing, so i bet list has increased.

    that was 2 years ago. just two years ago, couldn't you buy your house for a truck-load less money? ;)

    ok, contact information is on the receipt, so the original poster can call and find out how much it costs today at that dealership BEFORE asking some other dealer in his area to match it.

    i trust the H+A pricing myself.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    I may go back tomorrow, to get two more quarts for my next drain and fill. I will see what the price is now. Never even noticed the date on the receipt. :surprise: I will not take HandA's word for it anymore however, where it state's Honda's retail price.
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    i went for the ATF yesterday 62 bucks!!! 9 qts..so roy you better be right, otherwise I will pass you the bill!! lol :):):)
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Do you have all the tools (funnel, etc) to do the job? It's actually easier than changing the engine oil, if you have the right tools (no filter to change). Hope everything goes as planned. :D
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    The ATF-Z1 did go up (to $5.49/quart). Still not as bad as some dealers, but not as good as HandA. Barker Honda is not as cool as I thought they were. :(
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    hi el roy,
    12:20 Am just finished the transmission task. To my surprise, i wanted to replace the thermostast, and when i took the hose and screws off....voila...no thermostast installed.. been driving my car for 5 yrs with no thersmostas... i gotta love this honda.
    Roy, I replaced the trans fluid three times. the drain was awful, the fluid was black and the magnet on the drain bolt was all covered with tiny pieces of metallic matter. Second drain the liquid was more clear and the thrird the fluid looked pretty red(as the new one)..So, I guess it has good new fluid now. The only thing was, i Put my car on stands off the floor and I did the running and testing between changes on the stands from 1 - 40 mph and reverse. no problem.

    I noticed though on the stands the speed didn;t go up with rpm as it did on regular driving. RPM went over 2000 for the transmission to kick in.

    out of curiosity, any idea of why this happens? tires off the ground, acceleration-speed behaves different to hte acc-speed (from 1- 55) regular driving.

    my 'enterprise' is ready to conquer the North(Miami- Montreal)...

    :) Thanks for your advice!! :)
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    been driving my car for 5 yrs with no thersmostas...

    That was probably hurting your gas mileage. The engine takes much longer to warm up with no thermostat.

    tires off the ground, acceleration-speed behaves different to hte acc-speed (from 1- 55) regular driving.

    Don't know about that one, never tried that wheels off the ground thing. The transmission shifted fine afterwards (on the ground) right?

    my 'enterprise' is ready to conquer the North(Miami- Montreal)...

    Hope you have a few days for that trip. ;) Good luck, and many miles of Happy Hondaing to you. :)
  • user777user777 Member Posts: 3,341
    i think you're supposed to drive it in forward and reverse gear for a bit between changes. i think you actually want to load the transmission, but this isn't done at a dealership...

    anyway with it almost practically pink/red, you should now notice some improved shift quality.

    how many bottles of ATF did it ultimately take for the whole process?
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    about hte thermsotast and the mileage, I am noticing it already!

    eventhough the car was on stands, i ran it from 1-4 speed and reverse several times. ANd paid attention to the color of the fluid during the several drains. the last one had pretty much the same color as the new fluid.

    user777 i used pretty much the 9 qts. Less than 8 oz left in the last qt. I kept it just in case after the fluid settles down down,I might need to ad some more.

    Anohter curiosity, since i instaled the thermostat, i had to do the drain adn refill of the cooling system. Eventhough it takes more than a gallon to do the whole refill, the autoparts stores sell the antifreeze by gallons. So they make you buy two gallons, eventhough you are gonna used 1 and 1/4 or less.

    yes elroy, my hondy runs smoother now. I can hardly feel the tran kicking in. 4th speed reached at 40 mph. i have to be careful now , i just step on the gas pedal and rpm goes up pretty quick....he is a fighter!!!

    guys thanks again for this forum. speaking of this, i was looking for some hints about water in the trunk, and a user here sent me to a 'honda only forum' telling me the answer was there....not exactly..this is the best honda forum i have found
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Don't know about the capacity of the cooling system, I would have to look that up. This does, however, lead me to ask a few questions. When you refilled the cooling system, did you turn the heater all the way up, and bleed the system of air? It can cause problems if you don't do it right.
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    yes i did, tehre is a bolt near the thermostat area that you have to open so the air can bleed out
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Great! It's all good then. Good luck on the trip. :)
  • kamillionkamillion Member Posts: 3
    i replaced the thermal switch. checked the relays. the relay doesnt get 12v so something before the relay is bad. the fan itself works when bypassed. need info on cooling fan control. both switches on engine seem to work. the on by the thermostat is open and closed when supposed to. the one behind it on the engine is the thermal switch wich i replaced. it has one wire on it. then there is one behind that.
  • kamillionkamillion Member Posts: 3
    the fan is good. the relay is good. the switch is good. can it be the radiator fan timer? its located under the carpet on the passenger side. the relay is not getting the 12v required to turn it on. i am stumped cause i havent checked the timer yet. but its an expensive part so i wanna be sure that is it. anyone have any ideas on how to test it before i buy the part? thanks.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Use this link. It may help you solve the problem. Good luck.

    http://techauto.bravehost.com/overheating.html
  • shanakasshanakas Member Posts: 1
    Hi, new to this forum. i have a 92 EX coupe M/T with 150k miles. car runs great, but for a few minor things.

    1. car noticeably shakes around 1800rpm to about 3000rpm, mainly in 2nd and 3rd gear. more noticeable when accelerating hard. however, if i stay on that gear and in that rpm range, it will go away. i ruled out axles/half shafts and think it's possibly the EGR ports clogged. i want to make sure before i spend for this....any thoughts?

    2. my car idles low after warmed up. i'd say around 600rpm. it gets lower when i use any power accesories, like sunroof or windows. anything wrong with this?

    3. how can i find an OEM alarm key fob. my car is fitted with the dealer installed honda oem security system. apparently, it is so rare, that my dealer has no info on this. i know it works, as the light blinks, but it is in valet mode as i do not have the key fob to activate it. any ideas???

    Thanks!
  • waliswalis Member Posts: 35
    Hi engineer, I got the valve cover kits for my Honda but I'm a little stuck. I received three sets of gasket plus the valve cover gasket itself. Now, my problem is with the four thin gaskets that I just can figure out where they go. I have the obvious ones figure out (since they were present when I removed the valve cover)...the main gasket going around the cover, the four thick gaskets going inside the groves in the valve cover, the four that go around the silver bolts...now, the last set of four thin gaskets is the one I can't figure out. Please guide me as to where and how they should fit. Thank you so much!
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    now, the last set of four thin gaskets is the one I can't figure out.

    Do you mean o-rings (little rubber circles)? If so, these go under the rocker arm assembly. These are a lot more difficult to change. When you put the little chrome nuts on the valve cover, be careful not to over tighten them. The little studs are easy to break off. The torque for the little nuts is only 7-lb.ft. I suggest using a nut-driver, or 1/4" drive socket-driver with a socket to tighten them. Using something larger (like a ratchet) you would be more likely to snap the studs off, which would create a big problem (replacing stud bolts). If oil is getting into the spark plug tubes it will likely be necessary to change the o-rings, unfortunately. Good luck
  • waliswalis Member Posts: 35
    thank you so much 'elroy'. I'd do the ones I can do and hope for the best. If the oil still leaks, I'd then come back here to seek guidance once again and tackle the difficult one. Thanks again!
  • robo_geekrobo_geek Member Posts: 20
    the idle speed is controlled by the EACV (Elect air control valve).

    when accessories come on, alternator should go into higher output mode, and ECU signal should boost idle via EACV

    If idle is too slow, either you've got a vacuum leak, eacv is sticking, or somehow it's not getting the right input from the ecu. The EACV has a filter screen that can be cleaned with solvent, and the whole valve can be easily washed out with solvent if it's sticking. If you're getting a misfire under load, that could also be a vaccum leak.

    You should run a compression test as well as a test for vacuum leaks.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Member Posts: 4,116
    Sorry Walis, I totally forgot to check this forum. Elroy has good credibility with this stuff too.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    I had to change the o-rings in my old 92 Accord. It's not a difficult job. The hardest part for me was setting the valves (seems like you need three hands). :)
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    hello roy, 1670 miles, the 'enterprise' arrived safe and sound to montreal .

    Only one problem though it might happen to anyone of you. brake lights were on even with the engine off. there is a small flexible plastic attached to the brake pedal which opens and closes a small switch. in my car it fell off, so i replace with a piece of plastic for the rest of the trip. If that happens and you don;t see it right away it will drain your battery and it can be a pain in the neck.

    cheers
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Ah, the dreaded brake switch :cry: . It can also prevent the shift lever from coming out of park (if the switch gets stuck in the other position). So has the problem been fixed? Keep checking it, to make sure. Everything else working out ok, I hope. Good luck
  • FukuyamaFukuyama Member Posts: 75
    yeah man, a piece of plastic glued with some gum did it for the rest of the trip! :D need to put a flexible material like silicone or something similar...looks like hard plastic won't do it
  • exqueezmepleezexqueezmepleez Member Posts: 3
    Well I just want to say thanks to everyone who shared their knowledge from experience with me. The triple flush of the transaxle was the answer. I have only owned this 1990 Accord EX for 7 months and have spent more time under it than driving it. First, two hoses blew the first day I owned it, then the air idle control valve started having seizures, the high pressure line for the power steering, the seal on the distributor, the harmonic balancer fell off on the freeway, the left front cv boot blew and two lug studs had been cross threded with an impact so i got those at the same time, the transaxle slippage, and just the other day both cv boots on the right front blew all over so I am GIVING UP! She is for sale. I am a single mother of two young girls, looking for work and I do all my own repairs. I'm pretty sure I have spent more on parts and tow trucks than I did on the whole car (I know my labor alone exceeds the purchase price) :sick: Anyway what I'm trying to say is thanks for everyone's help and suggestions but I'm gonna call it quits. What a shame too because this was the first "PRETTY" car I have ever owned, darn. I just hope whatever I end up with next isn't as much of a challenge. thanks again to this forum and all of you. ;)
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    Sorry to hear about your experience. Sounds like the car has been through 18 years of hell. Hope you didn't pay too much for it. And I hope you have better luck with your next car. :(
  • 1992rustbucket1992rustbucket Member Posts: 5
    I have a new master cylinder to replace my old one and was wondering if anyone knows of a link that might help me. The removal and install looks pretty straight-forward but the bleeding will take some time. Any suggestions?

    Thank You,
    Cary
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