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Buying American Cars What Does It Mean?

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  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    edited December 2012
    I did my first trip in 1998 on a Harley Road King. I started off from Key West, FL and rode just about every road I could find, rode up to the Arctic Circle, then grabbed the ferry at Skagway and rode it to Bellingham, WA. Then came back to SC via the southern route through Arizona, New Mexico, etc., and took 7 weeks to make the trip.

    The last time (2010) I went I took my wife & younger daughter. Flew that time to Anchorage, rode the observation car on the train, stopping and staying the nite ate each stop along the way. After 6-7 days, we finally made it into Fairbanks and flew home.

    You see things there that you don't see anywhere else...
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    Of all those, the Quest was the most comfy and the most "American" ride (the Voyager was made in Ontario, while the Quest was made in Ohio).

    It's probably a pretty safe bet the Voyager had the content percentage contest down, but probably too late to know for sure at this point.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited December 2012
    I don't even know if they tracked that back in '89. Wiki says the engine was from Michigan. The next generation was still made in Winsor but Chrysler added production in St. Louis. That was my last car with real rain gutters. :cry:
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,312
    edited December 2012
    Here's the best way to really see Alaska:
    2014 Alcan 5000 Rally

    I ran the 2000 Alcan 5000 in an American(but not UAW)-made truck...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited December 2012
    My first trip up took 6 weeks from Mississippi back in '70 in the Bug. Not enough time. Anything faster than 6 days or so north from the MT/WA border is too fast. You need at least a day at Liard to soak in the hot springs too. :shades:
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'm still rather mystified that a company who says they are so 'American' was completely hamstrung here, and I mean completely, when the awful tsunami hit there in 2011

    That statement makes no sense when you consider the Camry was still the best selling car in the country last year.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    that's a far cry from basically shutting down production

    Not sure if you realize this, but Toyota manufactured over 13 million cars and trucks in N. American in 2011.

    Does that sound like production was shut down to you? :confuse:

    For 2012 they will exceed 15 million but they also expanded capacity.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    cessation of production

    image
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    edited December 2012
    An entire assembly built overseas, where the pads were not installed, was installed on the car, not just pads by themselves

    Double standard alert!

    Chevy gets a pass because the brake assembly for the Sonic is built in Korea?

    Then Toyota gets a pass for rusty frames supplied by Dana and made in the USA. Note their trucks with a J first in their VIN do not have the same issue. Also remember Dana paid $25 million to settle since their frames didn't meet agreed upon standards.

    Yet you've never seen it that way and mention those frames OFTEN.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The Equinox is another bread-and-butter segment where they could use some improvement...it's too big to be a compact

    I disagree, the 'nox has been a hit. It's selling at higher volumes and for more money too, vs. its predecessor.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    According to Consumer Reports, even though the Volt is excellent, GM as a whole didn't place for 2012 in the top list, which was all Asian brands.

    Slight correction - Audi made it on the list at #8. The other 9 were Asian.
  • nvbankernvbanker Member Posts: 7,239
    Do you guys discuss anything other than Alaska on this forum any longer?
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Welcome back from the weekend. :)
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    No, the UAW gets a pass since the goof originated in Korea. Chevrolet, being the division, must take full responsibility for the goof--and they did--just like Toyota should and did.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    edited December 2012
    There are still inspections and tests performed on each car, how that one got by is puzzling.

    Maybe the final inspector is eating lunch with those Chrysler guys.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    ateixera, look back over a year on our posts here. You will see again and again and again and again by the usual suspects here, how the only reason the Malibu was the best-selling car in the country for a month or two was that Japanese production was way, way down.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Malibu led for, what, one month?

    And that was with a conquest rebate targeted specifically at Honda and Toyota.

    Camry still was the best seller for the year by a wide margin.

    The reason I remember is the troll from the Toyota threads appeared and then disappeared just as quickly.

    You didn't subscribe back then, but no response from the troll once the Camry took over again, or since.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    edited December 2012
    I thought it was two months, but I could be wrong. It beat the Fusion too which was unusual at the time.

    I'm not certain about the 'targeted specifically at Honda and Toyota'. I bought one at that time and I remember no special rebates for trading in a Toyota or Honda, or anything like that.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    edited December 2012
    But they were selling cars at $3895 below invoice, as I pointed out to a troll in the Toyota thread here:

    http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.efda853/14058#MSG14058
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    edited December 2012
    Fitzmall may have been, but although I think I got a good deal, I didn't get that and I doubt many other dealers were approaching "Fitzmall"'s deals.

    The car was a very good value, IMHO less 'snoozeworthy' than a Camry, and price will make people shift allegiances.

    So, still...what is making you say there were rebates or allowances that were 'directly aimed at Accord and Camry'? I'm not aware of any in particular.

    I'm fairly sure, but less so, that there was a month or two when the Cruze was America's best-selling car too in that general tsunami period.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    price will make people shift allegiances

    That was my point - Toyota removed incentives, GM jumped on the opportunity and increased them at the same time.

    Hard to search for rebate history ....

    Supply was cut drastically from Japan, but that affected Lexus and models like the Prius a lot more than American made cars like the Camry.

    Corolla won the small car sales crown, Sienna won the minivan sales crown, and the Camry was the best selling car in 2011, the same year the tsunami happened.

    Why?

    Because they build those cars here in the USA.

    The Japan-built models got hammered, but not the US built ones.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    http://www.autoblog.com/2011/05/04/automaker-incentives-sink-to-five-year-low/

    Note the date, May 2011, tsunami was in April.

    Not by coincidence that's the same month the Malibu won the sales crown overall.

    Toyota had the lowest incentives among the top six automakers

    General Motors came in last


    Of course rebate amount varies by model, but Malibu rebates peaked right when Camry rebates were eliminated.
  • uplanderguyuplanderguy Member Posts: 16,054
    I'm pretty sure that if you look back at the numerous posts about it here, American production of Japanese nameplates were way down because of the tsunami too. Auto analysts even commented repeatedly about the increase of market share of U.S. automakers during the tsunami and following period because of the tsunami--and did not differentiate between Japanese and U.S. production. Look back, and you will see that.
    2024 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray 2LT; 2019 Chevrolet Equinox LT; 2015 Chevrolet Cruze LS
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It's funny, when I said supply was short, Big 3 fans said it was a drop in demand, and that supply was plentiful at dealers.

    Some models were more affected than others. I'm not sure what % of Toyota/Lexus are imported, but it's enough that overall supply was still short. You go to a dealer and they're out of model X, so they show you model Y that's made in the USA. Then they start to run out of model Y, also.

    The volume models are made here and obviously did OK, given 3 of them won sales crowns.

    All it takes is one part (an ABS computer, as one example). When that happens they have to find a new supplier, and that can take a while, depending upon what it is.

    To hedge their bets, they eliminated rebates. Those didn't come back until towards the end of summer. Of course you lose some sales.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Edit: I think the Taco was also the best selling compact pickup, so could be 4.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    No, the UAW gets a pass since the goof originated in Korea. Chevrolet, being the division, must take full responsibility for the goof--and they did--just like Toyota should and did.

    I never saw that incident as much a failure of the UAW as it was a failure of the QC process at Chevrolet, which is the all-important process at the critical new-model introduction time period.

    Lets be honest, though... These "lapses" can occur with any manufacturer.

    Ford is the current whipping boy in that regard, but as I've said before, every manufacturer gets a turn at the wheel at one time or another.

    In GM's defense, it seems they took the appropriate action. I haven't heard much negative news about the Sonic, and its one of the models my younger daughter is considering as her graduation "gift"... Or, as I like to say, her last payment from me while she's on my "payroll".
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Is that accurate?

    It says the Routan is made in Germany. I kinda doubt that, aren't they built alongside Caravans?
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    ...and Bentleys made in Brazil.

    I'm kind of doubting that list...
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    And Volvo S80 from Switzerland :confuse:
  • tachtach Member Posts: 3
    I will check with VW... thanks
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    image

    I remember this Chilly Willy cartoon set in Alaska where he went into a diner and flapjacks were $60!
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490

    Seems pretty far fetched but the tech may be here quicker than you think.


    Looks like it may be further along than either one of us thought...

    http://news.msn.com/science-technology/click-print-shoot-group-developing-a-down- loadable-gun
  • obyoneobyone Member Posts: 7,841
    Spam attack!! ROTFLMAO!
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Anyone else struggle to find any gifts not made in China? :sick:

    Bought myself a new rake. Plastic made in US, wood made in Brazil, where I was born.
  • andre1969andre1969 Member Posts: 25,652
    My Mom and stepdad got me a Mag Lite flashlight for Christmas, and shockingly, it was made in the US. Also got a few dress shirts, but they were made in Indonesia, China, etc.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    Gift cards, I think they are made in the USA :shades:

    I brought back a few things from Europe for people - all made in Germany or Switzerland (as they care more about domestic industry there).
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    Anyone else struggle to find any gifts not made in China?

    It's difficult.

    I got my son a few guitar related items made by a company called Dunlop Manufacturing. It seems everything I or my son have ever bought from them is American made.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I wouldn't be surprised if the plastic cards are made elsewhere. :D

    Got 3 for the wife, she loves 'em. I don't, they fill up my wallet!
  • ClairesClaires Member Posts: 1,222
    Whoops, looks like Santa had a layover in Istanbul last night. Sorry for the interruption.

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  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    No much labor involved, I am sure the globalists can stand having those made here.

    I receive online based cars (Amazon and ebay this year), they stay on my desk. What to buy... My brother did get me some American made car care products this year.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    I brought back a few things from Europe for people - all made in Germany or Switzerland (as they care more about domestic industry there).

    I think that's true. IMO, the tendency in Germany, at least, is more towards taking the long view over possible short term profits.

    As an example, in Rothenburg, Germany, there's a very famous Christmas shop... Kathe Wohlfahrt's... It's really big, and crammed full of Christmas items and decorations, none of them very inexpensive.

    I can't say everything in it is domestically made, but in the USA I have little doubt a comparable shop would be full of Chinese (or similar made) items.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    edited December 2012
    Also a region that still has employer-sponsored apprenticeships rather than haughty HR and hiring people expecting employees to come on board fully trained in order to receive an ever-smaller piece of the pie. Must be a cultural difference, if not a completely different mindset.

    I bought a Steiff bear and a weird puppet for kids - both made in Germany (although the former tried an experiment with a few cheaper ranges in our most favored "partner" which failed). And a few trinkets and foodstuffs, all made in Germany or Switzerland and labeled as such - none of the deceptive packaging found here. And it's just not the smalls and decorations - you can still find locally made appliances, cultlery, and other household goods.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    edited December 2012
    gifts not made in China?

    I got my family boxes of Hershey chocolates. Didn't check to see if they were made in the US or Mexico though. And the raw materials - I know the cocoa is mostly sourced from Africa.

    Good gifts. Eat and toss the trash. Nothing to store in the closet to pull out in case the donor visits and wonders where the gift is. :shades:

    btw, if anyone knows of a case like this, please reply:

    If you were recently denied auto warranty coverage for a surprising reason, please email PR@edmunds.com no later than Wednesday, January 9, 2013 to tell your story to a reporter.
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    Our cats got cat toys and treats made in U.S.A.
    Got some Knob Creek bourbon for my brother made in U.S.A.
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    I have a nice 3-cell Maglite in my Mercury Grand Marquis' glovebox. Nice solid flashlight.
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    I'd like a nice Black Forest cuckoo clock myself.
  • busirisbusiris Member Posts: 3,490
    I'd like a nice Black Forest cuckoo clock myself.

    I have 2 German Cuckoo clocks I've brought back from past trips.

    The kicker is that every time my friends from Germany come over for a visit, they just look at them hanging on the wall and laugh out loud. They think its such a "touristy" thing for Americans.

    Still, I really like having at least a few things that were made by actual craftsmen.
  • fintailfintail Member Posts: 57,092
    Food is a good gift. We all have too much junk anyway. I got a box of Lindt chocolate (made in France, not Switzerland), and a few Swiss Lindt bars. American Hershey stuff is fine too - wouldn't want chocolate processed in China, seems a bit risky. Probably like inhaling the outgassing from a new Chery or BYD :shades:
  • gagricegagrice Member Posts: 31,450
    We give Sees candy, still made in the USA. But you pay the price difference. It is $17 to $21 per pound. No HFCS or preservatives.
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