Where Is Ford taking the Lincoln Motor Company?

fintail · June 2006

And a marketing specialty in household cleaners or furniture or something completely unrelated to cars. The results (endless failures) speak for themselves.

I have a marketing degree...so I can't criticize all of them (although I don't work in anything related to marketing)...but for one to manage a product, they should have some knowledge of and preferrably some enthusiasm for the product. Probably some cronyism at work there too.

fintail · June 2006

If there was evidence of "enterprise", that blindly deferential adage would hold water. Unfortunately...

douglasr · June 2006

"It's a lot easier to build a brand new factory then retro-fit an old one." Mr. Mark Fields said yesterday (06-14-06)at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce in Washington D.C.

In wide ranging remarks squarely aimed at the 'fairness' of the playing field, Mr. Fields added: "I am here because a successful domestic automobile company is a national treasure...We allowed ourselves to get bogged down in the accumulated decisions and systems of the past getting stuck in old ways of thinking and producing products of that thinking---vehicles trying to be all things to all people, but instead ended up being too little too few". These remarks account for his delaying by two years several key projects. His mantra to the rank and file: "If they will buy it, we will build it..."---turning round the assumption that "if we build it, they will buy it". One assumes that Mr. Fields intends for the consumer to be the arbiter of 'what Ford will build', since "we" ultimately must "buy-it". Therefore, "we" ultimately are in the drivers seat.

Mr. Fields admits that Ford Motor spends $1,110 per vehicle in health-care and pension costs. He admits that Ford, and the 'Big Three' have invested $29Bn, in U.S. factories in the last three years, and more than the transplants combined since 1980. He admits that "he watched first-hand" currency manipulation by the various Asian Governments in order to keep exports cheap. He admits that Ford Motor is for "open and fair trade", but that Ford can't compete against "The Japanese Government", when it comes to international financial agreements and currency evaluations. Mr. Fields in Washington to lobby members of Congress about these 'trade and currency' issues.

Mr. Fields remarks at the Chamber of Commerce underscores reality that a plan such as "The Springfield Plan" for Lincoln could indeed be a viable one, given that Governors often chip-in as much as $160,000 per job subsidy to bring manufacturing to their states. "You don't get as much help or credit when you invest just as much money updating an existing plant." Mr. Fields stated. And One hopes that Governor Granholm's staff sends Mr. Fields a note about that remark, given the Michigan Governor's offer of $113Mn to aide Wixom, (one third the cost of a new factory!) The difference Mr. Fields speaks of cummulatively adds, at $160K per worker, to a subsidy of $720Mn!---twice the price of a factory!!

Mr. Fields quotes the Henry Ford: "I don't do so much, I just go around lighting fires under other people." That might well be the truth, and some fires he may also be putting out. But if "we" are the arbiter of what is to come, if "we will buy it", Mr. Fields will build it...indeed. Then I have many suggestions for Mr. Fields. Some of them quite cheap to attain by auto industry standards, $1.7Bn or two.

...and about that lunch Mr. Fields? I am waiting. (Though I might have to wait a long time...but there are only 364 days and counting.) For if you do nothing before the 'last Lincoln' rolls off the line at Wixom, then you will be responsible for the demise of, in your words, "of a great national treasure": Lincoln. Without a new factory, without new designs, and improvement of existing ones, without a team to support it, regardless of whether or not the playing field is level (since like the roads we drive on, it never is) Lincoln will join Packard in the anals of automotive history.

Given your remarks, my questions to you are: What "innovations" will you unveil at Lincoln as your competitors are doing for their brands? If it is cheaper to build a new factory, than why not one for Lincoln...even if it is not amongst the fields of the Land of Lincoln. If Mr. Robertson at Rolls-Royce can tip his hand to the public about a product made in miniscule numbers at seven times the cost, why then can you not do so for Lincoln? If you can quote the Henry Ford, you should really read the words of the Henry Leland...and ultimately, Edsel Ford, since Lincoln's fate is in your hands. If you are in your job because successful domestic auto companies are a "national treasure" then where, Mr. Fields, is your commitment to the "national treasure" that is Lincoln?

DouglasR

(Sources: Ford Motor Company; U.S. Chamber of Commerce)

mirth · June 2006

If it is cheaper to build a new factory, than why not one for Lincoln...even if it is not amongst the fields of the Land of Lincoln.

Because then you have the troublesome problem of what to do with the old factory you are replacing. It costs money to retire a factory. But I guess the current logic is that's it's better to support more foreign investments then to support the companies that already invest here and provide jobs.

Give Fields a break. His plan has been at work for only 4 months now, in an industry where product plans are at least 2-3 years out. Every armchair expert has their opinion of how to save Ford/Lincoln, but don't want to get into the actual implementation part (you know, the hard part). The first goalpost in Fields' plan is to return NA operations to profitability by 2008 - that's what I'll be looking at. Is Ford going to take a hit in 2006? - of course. Do I think it's bad that Ford is keeping its product plan a bit closer to the vest (like Honda does) - no. Ford doesn't need to be revealing products that are 2 years away from production because a) the media has a notoriously short attention span so when the product finally did arrive it would already be old news and b) why give their rivals a heads up?

Every "expert" seems to think that just because Fields and his team haven't told the press something, that means that they're not doing anything. I expect the "experts" are in for a surprise.

I also see a lot of "the products coming out right now or last fall" aren't great, so Fields' plan must not be working. Hello? That stuff was headed for the factory before Fields even got promoted. Patience.

Sorry for a bit of a ramble but I think our national 30 second attention span and need for immediate gratification is setting unrealistic expectations on Ford's Way Forward plan. Now if you're skeptical given past failures, then I can understand...

[Deleted User] · June 2006

I do hope you are right. I suspect all the other armchair quarterbacks would like that too. Cuz we are Ford or Lincoln guys at heart.

But the Way Forward plan so far seems more of the same: close plants, eliminate or delay proposed models, and try like heck to build what others are selling. I'd love it if Ford were holding cards close for a change. For years now, every new model has been revealed and touted long before its introduction. If you have reason to believe they are stopping that insanity, I say that's wonderful.

douglasr · June 2006

As M points out about those 'troublesome problems'...they are already going to do that with Wixom. They are already commited to that mistake of closing the plant without any announcement as to the future course for Lincoln---not individual products or design, just the fate of the marque. Unless, of course, it is all bluff to get the government to give huge tax breaks for investing in plants as Mr. Fields reputedly told lawmakers on the Hill yesterday (AutoNews). Bluff or not, compelled to close Wixom or not...regardless of the vintage of the 'Way Forward Plan', the Plan itself is deficient in this respect towards the fate of Lincoln. Without which, L-M dealers will have a hard go of it, and Ford Motor can't sustain itself on merely on Mercury-Volvo-Jaguar-Land Rover sales at the top end.

This is the one time when Ford Motor simply must say something as to the fate of Lincoln. Even if it be a slight hint, otherwise the worst can be assumed. And no remarks made by the upper echelons as to what they intend to have considered for Lincoln---silence, of course begets acquiescence, in the words of Sir Thomas Moore---and I for one can't remain acquiescent, having logged more than 1Mn miles at the wheel of Lincolns. My "armchair" remains a converted Lincoln bucket seat, its fabric still in good shape after 35 years. But it is the company that is not. Yes, I would take the job if it were offered---to revive Lincoln, so I have no qualms about making my own opinions public.

Suprise the public with new designs when ready---yes; wait for the results to make themselves apparent---not when the course seems to head for the shoals and not the opens seas. It's fine to raise trade and currency issues along with competitive complacency among the companies, but Ford Motor still must put/paid to the competition in the product department before they can 'cry wolf'. I wish MR. Fields the very best in his endeavors, and I will be right there with him, if I am proved wrong, and acceed to his point of view. The spanner is cast: Lincoln must be saved, for as Lincoln goes, so goes the nation.

DouglasR

nvbanker · June 2006

I think some of the Division heads have made some weak promises about the Lincoln brand being flooded with exciting new produce - but if it's more of the Zephyr, then clearly Lincoln is going to just be the Country Club division of Mercury - and that won't work for me. Listen - the Town Car had SO much appeal, it owned the market and even outsold Cadillac a couple of years. You'd think someone would have wanted to continue that. I hated Nasser for most of his moves, but putting Lincoln into the PAG was a good move, I thought, and the LS was a GREAT car - not for me, too small, but a GREAT car. What he did to the Town Car was stupid, but Nasser didn't care about the Town Car except for livery and fleet sales, he was going to make Lincoln a performance company just like Cadillac is. Nasser gets canned, not altogether a bad move, but with his demise, died Lincoln, evidently, and Bill has undone everything Jacque did with Lincoln systematically ever since. Face it Doug, Lincoln is barely on a respirator, and the heartbeat is fading......

Which sadly, is why I'm driving a Lexus now instead of a Lincoln Town Car.

ehaase · June 2006

"Face it Doug, Lincoln is barely on a respirator, and the heartbeat is fading......"

The Lincoln you love is dead, but the brand will be around for awhile as a deluxe Ford. Reviving the Ford brand with more popular mainstream cars is a higher priority than putting more money into Lincon and Mercury. See the last two paragraphs of this article - http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/06166/698351-185.stm

euphonium · June 2006

"Which sadly, is why I'm driving a Lexus now instead of a Lincoln Town Car."

Lexus? I thought I read some time ago where you ordered a M/B 500 Sedan.

grbeck · June 2006

I agree...right now Ford needs to make sure that the FORD brand survives. Like it or not, keeping Lincoln stocked with fresh, unique product is not a priority at this point.

Another factor to consider is Jaguar...Ford will use Jaguar as its big gun in the luxury market. Jaguar can compete with the BMW and Mercedes, especially against the S-Class and 7-Series, something that Lincoln (or, for that matter, Cadillac) lacks the credibility to do.

The days of Lincoln being the top dog at Ford are over...

nvbanker · June 2006

"Lexus? I thought I read some time ago where you ordered a M/B 500 Sedan."

Hmmmm, and I didn't think anybody would notice - nothing wrong with your memory.....

I did order an S-500. While I was waiting for it to come in, I saw a LS-430 that I really liked, and bought it, cancelled the S. Am I sorry? Yes and no. I still like the design and style of the S-class better. And it drives better. The Lexus though, is better made, awfully quiet, and the dealer is a lot nicer. See how I justify myself? I may exchange it for a Benz someday, we'll see.

The Lexus does everything perfectly, and is about as much fun as a 62 Impala.

euphonium · June 2006

Agree with your buying from a nicer dealer. IMO owner/dealer relationship is a very important factor.

Good for you.

lemko · June 2006

...I wouldn't be ashamed to drive a Town Car, but it's at least ten years out of date and easily outclassed by Cadillac, the Chrysler 300C and the imports. If Chrysler builds the Imperial, Lincoln is dead. I see they might issue a long wheelbase 300 next year. Cool!

I would seriously consider a used Town Car as my "beater" if my '88 Park Ave croaks.

cowbell · June 2006

This article from the Detroit News seems to make Lincoln's future sound pretty promising:

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060616/AUTO01/606160380/1148-

But beyond the new product (the article doesn't even mention the MKS), I was surprised to hear how well Lincoln is doing right now. Sales are up, and despite all the whining and moaning about the Zephyr, it's selling incredibly well.

"The average Zephyr sits on a dealer's lot for just 19 days, compared with 27 days for a Lexus ES 330 and 47 days for a Cadillac CTS."

I've haven't driven or even been in a Zephyr, but Ford must have done something right with it because people want to buy it. I'm guessing the 221HP is more than enough for most drivers, while that doesn't impress the somewhat calloused reviewers.

A great interior with more than enough power for the vast majority of people seems to sell cars. Throw in the new 265HP 3.5L engine for a similar price, and I imagine it well sell even better.

bumpy · June 2006

The Lincoln you love is dead, but the brand will be around for awhile as a deluxe Ford.

When was it ever anything else? Lincolns have always been Fords with fancier seats and gadgets.

[Deleted User] · June 2006

Statistics...

Looking at it from the standpoint of inventory on dealer lots, the Zephyr looks like a runaway hit. However, actual sales numbers are not that impressive (both ES330/350 and CTS handily outsell the MkZ), due to an inability to build more Zephyrs while supplying enough Fusions as well. One of the downsides of building them both on the same line. Plus, Lincoln doesn't have to work too hard to better last year's dismal sales. Still, it's the right direction!

nvbanker · June 2006

"...I wouldn't be ashamed to drive a Town Car, but it's at least ten years out of date and easily outclassed by Cadillac"

Well, yeah, lemko, and it's also $20,000 cheaper! They have Town Cars on sale in Vegas right now for $29,000. Worth every penny too..... :P

douglasr · June 2006

"If there is a need to build a new car-line, then you've got plants here with people who know how to build vehicles." Gary Walkowicz, UAW 600 ---quoted in a WSJ article by staffwriter Jerry McCracken responding to the leaked report that Ford Motor will spend $9.2Bn in Mexico to expand plant capacity. As Mr. Fields noted in his speech in Washington, without saying so, companies make money approaching states or governments to build a new factory rather than preserve jobs at a revamped old factory---recovering twice the cost of the plant in job subsidies. Why Ford Motor is now approaching the U.S. Government pressing them for currency reform, and perhaps, tax breaks for investing in existing factories. The quid pro quo being that, without those subsidies, Ford Motor will make good on the leaked report that it will move more manufacturing capacity south of the Rio Grande.

Lincoln remained in independent chassis from all other Ford Motor products throughout the majority of its history. The L, K, Zephyr, Continentals being unique within the Ford Motor Empire. The 1949-51 Cosmopolitans, Capris and Customs being likewise based from shared Mercury components and made both in Michigan, New Jersey, and briefly in Los Angeles. 1952-1957 Lincolns utilising its own chassis and bodywork, likewise for the 1958-60 unibody Lincolns built at Wixom. While the original '61 grew from a T-Bird proposal, the stampings for both cars were unique, albeit shared certain packaging dimensions to ease production at Wixom. The Mark Series sharing components and chassis with T-Bird, (a Lincoln by any other name thru 1976) from 1968 onwards. After 1980 the 'Panther' platform was utilised in various forms for all of the large Lincolns plus Mercury and Crown Victoria, but Lincoln still kept its own body. Ford Motor wisely consolidated all Lincoln production to Wixom to hide that fact---admitting then that it would be 'suicide' to make Lincolns alongside Ford's and Mercury's, as they are now doing in Mexico, because it would kill exclusivity of the brand.

Yes, "Lincoln is on life-support", but Town Car sales are actually increasing---along with Zephyr. People are aware of the fact that this is the last year for the Town Car and no replacement is in the works, so sales have increased. Yet it is the mal-placed decisions at the top of the company that has made this a reality: 'The Way Forward" ("W.F" plan, aka William Ford!) Plan merely accentuates that reality. Despite the remarks of Mr. Giambetti at Lincoln about new product, and launching its new advertisement campaign, it merely hides the fact that within 362 days when Wixom closes, the fate of Lincoln will tip in the balance. You can bet that when the first Lincoln rolls off the line in Chicago, that the PR department will do its best to make the event a happy one, but it will not disquise the fact that Ford Motor has indeed weakened Lincoln to the point of tarting up a Ford chassis, adding 32% changed parts over its Ford counterpart, and repricing the vehicle. So that the popular perception of Lincoln being nothing more than a more expensive Ford has now prevailed.

But I disagree that such a situation can't be redressed. Look at what both Chrysler and Cadillac have achieved within the last four years as an example. Look at Bentley which sold only 414 cars worldwide in 1998---437 in the U.S. in 1999---now selling more than 3,600 cars in the U.S. alone, and took in no less than 170 pre-deposits for the new Bentley Continental GTC convertible in New York City alone, sight unseen. Cadillac sales having increased 37% since 2001, and Chrysler having gained considerably owing to the success of 300. Imperial will merely pick-up a step above 300 when the demise of Town Car will create customers for their car! Mr. Fields and Mr. Ford have made Mr. La Sorda's decisions about Imperial an easy one. Not what a management plan should do: help your competitors.

DouglasR

(Souces: Automotive News, Edmunds Online, WSJ, FT)

lemko · June 2006

...if this really IS the last year for the Town Car, maybe I should hurry up and get one - that is if I can really get one for $29K or less! I highly doubt I can get a new one that cheap around here.

displacedtexan · June 2006

I wonder what is meant in the article about shifting the focus of its advertising theme away from the vehicle and towards the customer. It'll be interesting to see what they come up with, hopefully something that'll reinforce the brand. It's bad advertising when someone walks away saying "did you see that really great ad? I don't remember what it was for, but the ad...."

displacedtexan · June 2006

Ford Motor wisely consolidated all Lincoln production to Wixom to hide that fact---admitting then that it would be 'suicide' to make Lincolns alongside Ford's and Mercury's, as they are now doing in Mexico, because it would kill exclusivity of the brand.

Excellent point which jumped out as I had just read a 1965 Car and Driver comparison of six luxury marques (Lincoln, Cadillac, Imperial, MB, Rolls Royce, and Jaguar - who today puts Lincoln in that same category). The author said it was noteworthy that the three American brands are all made in their own, unique factories, and this enabled the manufacturers to maintain consistent quality, one of the hallmarks of a luxury brand.

nvbanker · June 2006

"When was it ever anything else? Lincolns have always been Fords with fancier seats and gadgets."

I hope you're not serious with this jab.....

Up until very recently, Cadillacs were the same.
The Lexus I-30 was a fancy Toyota, as is the ES-330 today.
The Infiniti I-30 was a Maxima.

Everything Chrysler, has always been a Dodge, even the Imperial....

So, what's the big deal? The Town Car only shared what's under the hood until recently with Fords. The body and interior were totally unique. Well, they still are, they're just not luxurious anymore.

nvbanker · June 2006

"...if this really IS the last year for the Town Car, maybe I should hurry up and get one - that is if I can really get one for $29K or less! I highly doubt I can get a new one that cheap around here."

Well, you can sure get one here, Lemko - Findlay Signature Lincoln Mercury, Las Vegas. 702 457 0321. Admittedly, it's not the Cartier or the L, but they're the Signature model, and they have a bunch of them. Sticker on them is $43,000. Sale price, $29,999.

nvbanker · June 2006

"I wonder what is meant in the article about shifting the focus of its advertising theme away from the vehicle and towards the customer."

IIRC, this is called "Lifestyle Advertising" in the trade. Personally, I don't like it, and it doesn't work for me. This is what you do if your product won't sell itself, you create an ad that projects a desirable lifestyle, and try to attach it to your product. Thus, getting people excited about how they live, and feeling that getting a Zephyr will make them happy.

Another goofball decision by WCFjr, IMO. He's driving me crazy.....

displacedtexan · June 2006

Sorry, should have phrased my question better. I know the technicalities of what they said. I'm anxious to see how they bring it about.

Lifestyle advertising doesn't work for me, either. Remember Infinity's first advertising theme? Very out there. Didn't work. I agree one does it when one's product doesn't sell itself, which is why this advertising theme is distressing. Not a good sign.

nvbanker · June 2006

to Lincoln since 1990, when I bought my first Continental. It was just so "me". If I were that age today, the LS would be my car. I always thought someday, I'd be a Town Car guy. Now I'm ready for one, and the Town Car has been cheapened to an unacceptable level. It makes me sad to leave, but I had to.

douglasr · June 2006

...the loyalty of those who know it best", the tagline once ran in the 1920's. "The exterior prompts the contradictory feeling of a vehicle that looks like nothing special and nothing else."---Mark Hudson of Edmunds Inside Line (EIL) comments about their road-test of Zephyr. Which, they also conclude, they like---though the net affect of the test is telling people to wait for the Mk Z. with the bigger engine and uprated chassis, despite the pleasure of the interior. No doubt the designers were trying to hit the middle mark.

Asked during the trial with respect to the stolen James Bond Aston Martin DP-216-1, whether or not the James Bond Aston Martin DB5 was the most famous of all cars, Henry Ford Museum Curator Mary Seelhorst testified: "No...I think the most famous car is the Lincoln limo President Kennedy was riding in when he was assasinated."

That honor accorded to "GG300", the Hess & Eisenhardt converted four door convertible limousine delivered to and used by the White House June 14, 1961 until that day in Dallas, November 22, 1963. GG300 subsequently armoured after its use by the Warren Commission, painted black and returned to White House livery through 1977. After which, the car was placed in storage until JFK Jr. turned 21 by agreement with Jacklyn Kennedy-Onassis, where-upon it was placed on Public Display under the pervue of the Henry Ford Museum.

Other than being known as the "Car of Presidents"---Nixon going so far as to give a 1973 Town Car to Soviet General Secretary Leonid Brezhnev as a gift, which Brezhnev subequently wrecked at his Dacha outside Moscow---Lincoln has found its place quite often in the popular lore and culture of our nation. Even from the days of the Roaring Twenties, both police and rum-runners often preferred Lincoln as the vehicle of choice. Just after the Dearborn Police Department 'test-drove' a fleet of four-wheel braked Model L Lincolns in persuit of their jobs, noted author Erle Stanley Gardner of 'Perry Mason' fame purchased his 1931 Lincoln Model K V8 Roadster with the royalties from the first of his 80 Mason novels. Gardner transferred his appreciation for the Model K to his "Mason"---who drove Lincolns throughout the novels. Thus it came to be when Ford Motor picked up the sponsorship of the program Mark II's and Mark III's abounded...Raymond Burr's "Mason" driving a white Mark III convertible. Burr himself coming to appreciate and drive Lincolns and T-Birds throughout the 1950's and 1960's. The first of dozens of TV shows and even films where Lincoln was prominently placed with the characters---earning a place in our culture for Lincoln.

The descent of 'Camelot', and all the Kennedy personna providing an irresistible draw which even producers of James Bond's Thunderball used with 007 driving up to "Palmyria" in a gold 1965 Lincoln Continental covnertible, among numerous other Lincolns used throughout the Bond films---including the 1963 'defect' sedan, sans engine, crushed in the film 'Goldfinger'! Or the incredibly rare 1964 Lehmann-Petersen used at the begining of 'Thunderball'...with the bad guy unforgetably emerging in 'drag', which Sean Connery's 007 defeats. A stage moment which was only the tip of an iceberg for Lincoln...all now part of our popular memory.

While all those able to remember Dallas and the black & white TV era can well recall, the generations which have come long after those days sees a Lincoln as part of proms, livery and funeral services, between the '80's, '90's and the '00's, indelibly trapped living in the world of rental fleets and taxi cabs. That is the problem Mr. Fields and Mr. Ford face in trying to 'salvage' Lincoln, perhaps they themselves see it in a post Dallas, post McMillan & Wife guise. More important than that, these gentlemen will have to create new Lincolns able to inspire a would-be writer like Gardner.

They might never have to double-declutch their Model K transmissions, nor stuff the remainder of their Cubanos in their jacket pockets as JFK did himself when driving his '63 convertible with Chip Bohlen and their female companions at Palm Beach, but Mr. Fields along with his boss, will have to inpsire. They've added 24 months to the time-table, all while Wixom clicks down. Into the breech must come designs that even EON Productions making the latest Bond film will want to use---Lincolns worthy of public and popular affection, and not derision as EIL's MR. Hudson has cast down. The design staffs waiting for the call and instruction: "Build something bold..."

In the best 'Perry Mason' tradition, this call is for you Mr. Fields. Will they build: "the most famous car in the world..." as Ms. Seelhorst describes!

DouglasR

FYI: the Lincoln crushed in Goldfinger was a 'test-car' made from defective parts, engine removed; editing hides the fact that the car is switched from the '64 Odd-Job pulls up in.

(Sources: JFK Library; Hemmings Classic Car, July 2006; EON Productions; Motor-Trend Classic June 2006)

nvbanker · June 2006

Mr. Douglasr

lemko · June 2006

...I saw a 1968 Lincoln Continental limousine that was built for none other than "The Great One" Jackie Gleason.

Does anybody recall the 1960s Lincoln ads that showed CEOs of Fortune 500 companies and other successful businessmen with their Lincoln Continentals? That would really boost Lincolns image. Even a guy who is a "loser" would like to associate himself with somebody like Bill Gates even if the only thing they have in common is that they drive the same car.

"Why Bill Gates, CEO of Microsoft, chooses Lincoln Town Car" There would be Mr. Gates in an Armani suit, arms folded with serious determined look, standing in front of his shiny black Town Car parked in front of Microsoft's headquarters.

We could repeat the same theme with Donald Trump, Warren Buffet, Jack Welch, Ted Turner, etc.

[Deleted User] · June 2006

Yes, if you could get any of those guys to actually endorse the current Town Car. The 2006 Town Car does not have more than a fraction of the cachet that the Continental of 40 years ago had. Too bad.

scootertrash · June 2006

Warren Buffet drives a Town Car.

lemko · June 2006

...a 1989 Lincoln Town Car?

snakeweasel · June 2006

Well Donald Trump is a media hound (I really what to use another word but not sure if it would go over well), the fact that his face will be seen by even more people will appeal to him. Ted Turner to a much lesser extent, the others most likely won't do it.

nvbanker · June 2006

The 06 is pretty much a livery car. But Trump does have one, stretched. Don't know about the others mentioned, except Gates, who has a Lexus LS430.

Gates wouldn't be caught dead in a Town Car.....

douglasr · June 2006

"Gates wouldn't be caught dead in a Town Car..." as NVB states, but if Mr. Gates dies before his time, or he retires, more than likely he will be: in a Lincoln hearse! One more problem facing Fields & Ford to revitalise Lincoln....

GWB Sr. did infact have a 1989 Town Car Limousine, which used a special chassis and a 460 engine! I saw the car when I was at the White House the day President Bush returned from Texas, November 4, 1992...and it made an imposing Presidential Limousine with its extended roof and armoured appearance.

...yes, even Lehmann-Petersen/Ford Motor ran a series of advertisements showing the various concurrent CEO's of the nation's largest companies behind their recently acquired Lincolns. Gleason, as well as other Hollywood stars as Robert Vaughn, had at least two Lehmann-Peterson's. 'The Donald', among many others following in their foot-steps! But the silly super extended stretch jobs have now hurt Lincoln's image more than it has helped it.

...but getting Bill Gates to give up his Lexus, and buy a new Lincoln before he turns over day to day operations of Microsoft to the minions, or takes his "last ride" would be quite a coup!

DouglasR

nvbanker · June 2006

"if Mr. Gates dies before his time, or he retires, more than likely he will be: in a Lincoln hearse!"

LOL.....sure enough! :P

euphonium · June 2006

The Lincoln hearse will have both a luggage rack and hitch.

Gates will figure out how to take some of his billions with him.

nvbanker · June 2006

If Ford does build Hearses, they'll be Navigators......for sure.

rockylee · June 2006

You like the Town Car ? :surprise: I didn't figure that kind of car would be in your tastes.

Rocky

douglasr · June 2006

"I am proud that the State of Illinois has wisely invested in this innovative manufacturing site..." Governor Rod R. Blagojevich commented August 10, 2004 when Ford Motor re-opened their Chicago plant. After an $800Mn investment by Ford Motor and the dozen suppliers at the 155 acre site, 2,300 jobs with an additional 1,400 were preserved at the 1924 Assembly Plant. Mr. Fields taking over North American Operations a year later---commenting in Washington that: "You don't get as much help or credit when you invest just as much money updating existing plants." at the U.S. Chamber of Commerce, who said at the same gathering, as I may have stated before: "It's a lot easier to build a brand new factory than retro fit an old one."

By contrast Mr. Fields tells us that up to $160K per job in subsidies are often received, bringing in up to $720Mn for a new factory. Chicago, of course, will become Lincoln's defacto home after Wixom closes, during the third shift. At the time Ford Motor invested in the plant at 130th & Torrence Avenue the State agreed to up to $100Mn in road improvements, spending $25Mn immediately. Additional tax. economic and jobs programs credits totalled $58Mn for the 2,600 workers now at the plant. In toto, Ford Motor received the comparable equivalent in subsidies, credits, tax incentives for the 80 year old Chicago Ford Plant that BMW AG spent to build the Rolls-Royce factory at Goodwood: more than L66Mn Pounds, roughly $85Mn. Ford and its "just-in-time" suppliers located within the economic development zone created for the Chicago plant spent ten times that amount refitting the plant. Yet government expenditures more than tipped the difference for Chicago, making it a viable move for Ford Motor. The same could be applied to Wixom, or a new greenfield site for Lincoln.

In raw numbers what Mr. Fields states is true, but prior events have nor totally borne out his remarks---Governor Blagojevich and Mayor Daly of Chicago making it entirely possible to uprate an old plant. The announcement of its opening led by the Governor himself, before being officially opened by Ford Motor executives. Not unlike a young Henry & Benson Ford throwing the 'switch' to start-up the Rouge! The Governor and the State of Illinois very much providing for and giving credit to Ford Motor for retrofitting an existing plant, that August 10, 2004. Goodwood was 'up to speed' building the 'Best Car in the World' from scratch.

Thus it can be so for Lincoln...either in a new factory or a 'retrofitted' old one. What seems less than retro, infact, is Mr. Fields attitude toward long established Ford Motor factories. There are 43 of them in America, let us hope that one of them remains to build Lincolns---exclusively. Mr. Gardner would be pleased.

DouglasR

source: Ford Motor company; U.S. Chamber of Commerce; Governor Rod R. Blagojevich, Illinois; Mayer Richard M. Daly, Chicago)

(NVB: thank you for the kind remarks!!)

nvbanker · June 2006

Lincoln is Lincoln no more..... :sick:

rockylee · June 2006

I believe Lincoln can be rebuilt. I'm not impressed with them building cars in Mexico. The Baby boomers that remember america in the golden years still have enough numbers that don't want a mexican made car because Uncle Bill wants to swing another $100 million in his pocket.

Rocky

P.S. nv, I agree Lincoln isn't close to the same.

euphonium · June 2006

Courtesy of Scootertrash in the Lincoln chapter.

Shortcut to: http://media.ford.com/products/presskit_display.cfm?vehicle_id=1458&press_sectio- n_id=398&make_id=93

douglasr · June 2006

...precisely why Lincoln should not be allowed to die...or remain marginalised...it deserves more than just the third shift at Hermisilio or Chicago. And the battle within Ford over Lincoln clearly is heating up: why the team under Mr. Horbury is having a hard time creating a fresh look for Lincoln that Mr. Engel, Thomas, Najjar, etc. did in 1961. That is what they are trying to do for Lincoln again, and the Mark S is an example of what they are attempting, though not succeeding, in doing. At least they are doing something, though it be based on a Volvo. Not enough to save Lincoln...

Turning the "switch-off" at Wixom will indeed kill the brand, with the launch of the 385 platform stretched from the 500 not due for another 12 months after Wixom closes. What will Lincoln build between the Zephyr and its trucks as the Mark LT? Cadillac will have a Zeta based car perhaps under wraps and tempting the public, and Imperial will certainly be teasing the public. The Way-Forward Plan having delivered Town Car customers into the laps of the opposition. Even Lexus, Nissan, BMW, and Mercedes will benefit. No doubt splash, pizzaz, and inspiration are needed. But the '61 happened at a moment in history that in part was a fluke, and a very good one at that. A black '63 used at the studios for inspiration for some of the latest show cars...yet that steam seems to now be dimmed within the halls of Dearborn, Irvine, and London design studios. The designers as Mr. Horbury and Freeman Thomas still have the chance to cast the die for Lincoln again. Chicago, unfortunately, is waiting---in part because Ford Motor needs to recover part of that $800Mn they invested to keep the 80 plus year old factory open.

Lincoln...is not dead yet, nor should it be forced into the fate of Packard. Studebaker-Packard CEO James Nance found out when he signed his "Manangement Contract" with Curtiss Wright in July 25, 1956 yeilding 52% control of Studebaker-Packard to Wright's Roy Hurley, in exchange for $35Mn stock-option financing for the 1957 model year---effectively killing Packard, the notation that operations be shifted to South Bend for 1957 on the last page of the agreement---Mr. Fields can still be persuaded not to close Wixom, or to build a new factory. He would not wish to become known as the 'James Nance' of Lincoln!!---or Ford Motor.

If anything, on the day the last Lincoln rolls out of Wixom, perhaps then they should announce the opening of a new secretly built plant, and a new prototype car rolling through the sheets as the last Town Car comes off the line. Crewe, after-all, was built as part of a "secret-factories & air-armaments program" initiated by Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain & Lord Beaverbrook in 1937-38. Perhaps that is what Mr. Fields is truly up to as he stumps America, which I paraphrase and call his "We can fight the competition, but we can't fight the Japanese Government"---or rather: "We'd like to fight 'em on the sales lots, but not on the beaches" speech.

I would hope the epitaph of Lincoln should not be, as an author might write of Ford Motor Company in 2017, on the hundredth anniversary of The Rouge: "Never in the course of history, have so few, given up so much, at the expense of the very many."

...and we see by the notation for the 2007 Town Car that St. Thomas is noted as the new home of Lincoln? But no official announcement about that fact has been made. Perhaps Ford Motor is too embarrassed to make that announcement as their North American CEO Mr. Fields stumps the country telling us how "American" Ford cars remain versus the competition assembled in this country as Honda.

DouglasR

(Sources: Ford Motor Company; U.S.Chamber of Commerce, remarks of Mr. Mark Fields, June 16, 2006; 'Curtiss-Wright, Greatness & Decline' Louis R. Eltscher & Edward M. Young, Twayne Publishers, NY)

douglasr · June 2006

Ford Motor Company does not confirm that production has begun at St. Thomas for Town Car, yet the '06 Model Year at Wixom began July 18, 2005---Wixom still up and running. "They may already be building the '07 at St. Thomas for pre-production" were the only remarks made by a company spokesperson. (06-23-06) And the Wixom plant could indeed fall into the hands of Magna International's Siegfried Wolf, who intends to build a 'specialty vehicle' within the U.S. for domestic and international sale---with the comment to FT staffwriter James McIntosh: "If we kill all industrial jobs people have no opportunity to earn money, and if you have no money, you can't buy cars..."

Thus it shall come to pass that Lincoln is built in three countries: Mexico, the U.S. at Chicago, and Canada at St. Thomas if fate holds, and production shifted across the border. But for a time, it will NOT be made in America! Before the E385 Ford 500 platform version is made in Chicago at Torrence Avenue, and after Wixom closes, Lincoln will become a defacto: IMPORT---with high American content! Perhaps it will take more than Ford Motor's average of $3,209 in incentives to move the metal off the lot when that becomes true, if the designs aren't really 'hot'.

We can expect then, that the Mark S will be made at the Volvo plant in Europe, built in left and right hand drive, exported to America at least, and around the globe at best. While this idea might be a cheerful one, the bond traders don't agree: up-grading the risk factor today that Ford will default on its debts to 9.39 versus 9.26 for GM! This fact holding eventhough Ford has not posted anywhere near the losses of GM, and indeed has posted a profit overall!!

The 'Way Fordward' for Lincoln, perhaps, now an international one: piggybacking production on any and all Ford Motor plants around the globe. Gaining capacity on one hand, at the expense of exclusivity on the other. One would wager that Mr. Fields and his people believe that it makes little or no difference where the car is assembled and by whom, rather that there's no way forward for Lincoln without such a reality. Thus, by making Lincoln into an Import, they have ensured that this issue must be faced by the buying public at the top end of its market for Lincoln. Some may conclude that if they want an import, they might as well buy one: from the Germans, Japanese, or Koreans...others concluding that they only care about the car and the price!

Officially "Unconfirmed", it stands that Town Car will become an import, but at least it will survive to do battle against Imperial and Zeta platform Cadillacs.

DouglasR

(Sources: Ford Motor Company; Financial Times 06-23-06); WSJ)

scootertrash · June 2006

Lincoln's New Home?
link title

displacedtexan · June 2006

The 'Way Fordward' for Lincoln, perhaps, now an international one: piggybacking production on any and all Ford Motor plants around the globe. Gaining capacity on one hand, at the expense of exclusivity on the other. One would wager that Mr. Fields and his people believe that it makes little or no difference where the car is assembled and by whom, rather that there's no way forward for Lincoln without such a reality.

Lincoln, or any domestic marque, loses me as a consumer when manufacturing moves across our borders. I'll buy a foreign marque made within our borders, with the concomitant benefit to our workers and their local economies, first.

euphonium · June 2006

Buy his brand regardless of where it is made, here or there as the most important part of the deal is transferred and goes to the home office and that part is called Gross Profit.

The UAW'r is now reaping what he sowed. His craftsmanship and attention to detail has been surpassed by more meticulous and concerned factory workers in other countries causing the American consumer to develop a snooty attitude about buying American. :mad:

exalteddragon1 · June 2006

Its true, and our governmnet needs to come in and help our automakers. The Japanese government helped make all of there industries powerful and helps to keep our foreign competition.

I'm not suggesting we go this far, but something needs to be done. A good deal of US MFG is going to Mexico, and mostly the unions just want more money.

I will not buy a Camry made here b/c the profits still go back to Japan. The allegence is not to american workers. I view these workers like the humans in the pods in the Matix, getting brainwashed by the system to beilieve they are in a better world.

How much money did Toyota or Honda give to support America after the 9/11 attacks? Nothing. How much did GM and Ford give? Millions.

We need to bring this manufacturing back. Manufacturing is one of the basic sources of a nations power. Would we have won WWII if all of our production was in Japan?

displacedtexan · June 2006

We need to bring this manufacturing back. Manufacturing is one of the basic sources of a nations power. Would we have won WWII if all of our production was in Japan?

Exactly why I would not support a domestic brand which sends its manufacturing overseas. I see the retention of domestic manufacturing as a matter of national security.

We were able to wage war in WWII by taking peace-time manufacturing and putting it on a war footing, and we were able to do this because we had the factories and workers here, on our shores. Don't you think if the situation arose again the US Government wouldn't hesitate to take Japanese or German-owned factories and turn them to domestic war support? Oh, sure, there'd be some squawking from the owners of the factories, but the equipment and material would be here for our taking. We can't do that if a domestic owner has their factories overseas. It's also one of the reasons I find outsourcing our IT worrisome.

Economically, yes, profits from the sale of a Camry may go to Japan, but the cars are 75% domestic content, assembled by workers (not UAW) here, and they spend their paychecks here, in local businesses. If I buy a Mexican-made MKZ, the profits may come here and enrich the owners of a domestic company, but I don't think that goes as far to enrich the macroeconomics of the country.

As an aside, it would be interesting to do an economic study to determine which gives the US economy a bigger bang for its buck: buy a foreign marque made here, or a domestic marque made in Mexico.

How much money did Toyota or Honda give to support America after the 9/11 attacks? Nothing. How much did GM and Ford give? Millions.

I agree totally, which is one reason when I bought my LS I shopped domestic brands made on our shores. Daimler Chrysler was out; BMW and VW were out; Infinity was out (part owned by the French). The LS was perfect: a domestic brand made in Michigan.

Where Is Ford taking the Lincoln Motor Company?

Comments

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles