Hyundai Santa Fe vs Toyota RAV4 vs Mazda CX-7 vs Ford Edge

carlitos92 · January 2007

I didn't agree with sranger's definition (nor, as I said, do the government/manufacturers/automotive press) but nevertheless, he did define an SUV as having a >3000 lb towing capacity. Therefore, in his world, the CX-7 does not qualify. Not that there is a towing "package" for the CX-7, anyway...

stever · January 2007

According to the link in another post I made today, no one tows anymore anyway.

steve_, "Towing tips for SUVs" #362, 22 Jan 2007 2:11 pm

berniedg · January 2007

Nothing focuses the mind better than necessity, eh.
When gas hits $9/$10 per gallon, 3 categories of vehicles will become crystal clear.
You drive a truck, because you need it to work or haul heavy stuff, a minivan because you transport people,
or a 2010 2.2l CRD diesel/hybrid Honda Accord Hatchback/wagon, VW TDI, or such, that gets easy 40mpg.

aviboy97 · January 2007

I said the Tribute V6 w/tow can be considered an SUV, if you go by the definition* of what an SUV is.

The CX-7 does not have a tow cap. of at least 3500lbs, so, it cannot be considered a SUV. It only has a tow cap. of 2000lbs. Once again, going by the definition*.

Once again, I think it is retarded to have multiple definitions, however, consumers are the ones who caused it. To me, they are all SUV's.

*source for crossover SUV, and SUV definition is Wikipedia.

vbbuilt · January 2007

Mr. Aviboy, I love yankin' your chain. I introduced this entire thread "tongue in cheek"...to me, this is supposed to be a light-hearted exchange. It's interesting to watch people voice their opinions and in the final analysis...who cares? Everyone's opinion is valid and I haven't disagreed with anyone. :P

So, should I continue on or should we just let this discussion die peacefully?

Ok, I'm done....next topic?

Vince.

cxrabbit · January 2007

SUV, car, crossover, truck... I think I'll just call mine Nathan. Oh wait, cars are supposed to be "girls" aren't they?

*waits for another debate*

vbbuilt · January 2007

Gyrl, you can call yours whatever you want!

astegman · January 2007

Call me nuts, but I've always considered my cars to be male! Even my Lexus RX300, which I've seen for years described as "the woman's SUV." I don't know what it is, but my cars have all been given male names. I mean, I had 2 Chevy Blazers...not exactly that feminine. And for a number of years, I had a 1965 Mustang convertible (which, even with its pale yellow color, was very butch...I called him Boomer). Anyway, my current car, the CX-7, is named D'brickashaw, after a player on the Jets.

chstr1 · January 2007

OK....you and D'brickashaw are NUTS

astegman · January 2007

OK....you and D'brickashaw are NUTS

No doubt about it, and proud of it.

stever · January 2007

One last gasp:

"consumers have no idea what a crossover is. They are totally confused." But people like crossovers -- they're buying them in droves because the vehicles are new, they're not trucks or minivans and they have a smoother drive than trucks, the auto consultant said."

Selling Crossovers Is Easier Than Defining Them (Ad Age)

Sure hope Ol' Red cranks in the morning. :shades:

explorerx4 · January 2007

i guess i'll keep my suv. everyone knows what it is and it does not seem to be conflicted.

pelican19 · January 2007

Absolutely! On a recent hunting trip my buddy got stuck in some real bad mud( Blazer ). I was up in Stewart AFB with another friend driving an Explorer. Pulled him out of the mud with no problems. We call it old reliable. He has over 140k miles and it still kicks [non-permissible content removed].

picard12 · February 2007

I test drive the RAV4 V6 2007 and Santa Fe V6 3.3L GLS 2007, RDX. I haven't test the mazda CX7. The RDX engine is noisy and suspension is really too firm for my taste. Its suspension is firmer than cheap budget cars. My kidneys bounced around my abdomen while I was test driving the RDX. I have to take a pass on it. The Santa Fe engine is as quiet as Lexus RX 350. I also test drive the RX 350 on Feb 1, 2007. Santa Fe has very good interior and good stereo system. I am not an audiophile hence I can't comment on its quality. The front driver seat of Santa Fe is very comfortable as well as passenger rear seats. although Santa Fe looks bulky compare to RAV 4 and mazda CX-7, it handles reasonably well on urban streets. I didn't have chance to test drive it on the highway. Canadian driver magazine did extensive testing of Santa Fe by asking 7 different regular joes to test drive them. These drivers range from homemaker, professor, students, professionals. All of them indicated that the Santa Fe perform well on pylon obstacle test and emergency stop test. They didn't feel dizzy during the pylon obstacle test at all. The Santa Fe had minimal body lean during fast turn around the pylons. I also noticed the metal sheeting work of Santa Fe is very good.

The RAV 4 interior wasn't as quiet as the Santa Fe during my test drive. I did like the RAV 4 optitron dash board compare to Santa Fe. It looks much more sophisticated than the Santa Fe blue dials. I wouldn't test drive the CX-7 because it would have the 4cyl turbo as RDX. Turbo 4cyl engine tend to be more noisy than V6 engine.

wjbushsr · February 2007

I wouldn't knock all four cylinder turbos into that bunch.

My CX-7's four banger with the turbo is as quiet if not quieter than my 2002 Camry XLE.
I have 22k on my CX-7 now.

carlitos92 · February 2007

Yeah, I definitely would not count the CX-7 out without a test drive. I've not been up close to a SF, but from my recollection, the RDX and CX-7 are very different animals, even if they do share a lot of specification data. I would guess that the Mazda rides harder than the Hyundai, but to me, the CX-7 is still tolerable, but a lot of fun.

FWIW, I felt the CX-7 dash was WAY more beautiful and sophisticated than the RAV's, but naturally, all that is in the eye of the beholder.

In my opinion, the RDX has the racetrack edge, but for normal day-to-day driving, the CX-7 is quite close, with the SF a distant third, because Hyundai doesn't even have sportiness as a selling point. At the rate they're going, though, Hyundai may surpass them all in quality if the other manufacturers aren't careful...

Isn't it great to be spoiled for choice for a change?

piast · February 2007

I think it it is pretty good and honest, but no doubt many will still argue with the verdict. Looks like performance numbers improved(?) the most for the Ford Edge since Dec review from the same mag. Unfortunately it still finished last. Santa Fe finished second "if only by a nose" to......

philmo · February 2007

A kindly review of the Santa Fe appeared yesterday in the New York Times. Lots of emphasis on safety features and Hyundai's rising standards.

stever · February 2007

Here's the link (for as long as it lasts):

"There are a few standouts in this rather large group, including relatively compact models like the RAV4, the CR-V and the Subaru Forester. I would add the new Santa Fe to that group. It is roomy, cleanly designed, reasonably priced and it comes with a lot of safety features."

A Korean Crossover Gets Its Green Card (New York Times - registration may be required).

joe97 · February 2007

Here is the link to the New York Times review posted at the main 2007 Hyundai Santa Fe forum, including a very elegant photo:

joe97, "2007 Hyundai Santa Fe" #1806, 3 Feb 2007 1:38 pm

defreitasm · February 2007

I drove the Sante Fe and to be honest when I hit a moderatly bumpy road the bumps seemed to resonate through the seat and into my back. Maybe it was just stiff because it's new or the seats are too firm. I didn't feel the same way in the CX7 and I have no regret after 2400 miles other than the usual common gripes. Come to think of it, none of the other competitive models I test drove seemed to ride as bad as the Sante Fe. Handling seemed fine and other than the bumpy ride issue the Sante Fe seemed well put together. I have not heard anyone else complain about a bumpy ride so maybe it was just the one I drove. I really tried to like the Sante Fe, but it just didn't thrill me. Looks wise it wasn't bad, but it's not as sporty looking as the CX7 and most of the colors were nothing to write home about. At least not the ones I saw on the lot, but looks may be secondary to some folks.

kontent · February 2007

You want a bumpy ride, try a Jeep Liberty. No rear independent suspension means that when you hit a pot hole it's like getting kicked in the butt. The Santa Fe will be a huge upgrade for me.

defreitasm · February 2007

"You want a bumpy ride, try a Jeep Liberty. No rear independent suspension means that when you hit a pot hole it's like getting kicked in the butt. The Santa Fe will be a huge upgrade for me."

No thanks.... I'll pass. LOL

The vehicles like Jeep Libertys, FJ Cruisers, Xterras, etc. are really a different category and can rough it out much better than these soft "urban conversions" SUVs that are now being reffered to as CUVs.

Good luck with your Sante Fe. The Sante Fe ride was actually tolerable, but I was more concerned with my wife's tolerance because of her bad back, which is very sensitive. I came real close to buying a Honda Pilot because it had a nice soft ride, but I wanted something quick and nimble and without that dreadful box look. If the Pilot was more like an MDX without the high price, I would have went that route.

jasdmw · February 2007

Was at the Toronto Auto Show last night. Shopping for something to replace the 01 Sienna. Have a relative at the Oakville plant and was hoping to take advantage of the A plan. Not likely! The Edge and MKX were extremely disappointing. Fit finish and overall quality feel was sub par. Edge had no less than 3 colours of plastic on the dash. Lines and joints everywhere; pieces didn't fit or align and these were show cars!!!!!!. That rod to lift the tailgate in the MKX; what a joke! No comparison with the Lexus or Acura. And the GM products (Acadia, etc) are in the same boat as the Fords. Looks like all that cost cutting is working; the parts fit, finish and quality is way down.

On the other hand, the Santa Fe was totally impressive. Nice materials, good design; nice quality feel. If I had to buy today, that would likely be the winner.

driverdm · February 2007

jasdmw, remember that the Edge for the autoshow, probably hasn't changed since the first autoshow it was unveiled at early last year. Also, remember that several reviews have said that the interior was well put together. Sometimes, one example does not speak for every product.

To some degree, style is a personal matter. I actually like the color scheme. It makes the vehicle look modern and different to me. The seats also look very good. Take a look in a Land Rover (Range or RR Sport) and you'll something a little familiar with the Edge. The only part of the interior I do not care for is the center stack. It's livable, just not as nice as I'd like it.

The Santa Fe looks beautiful in pictures but sitting in the interior, there are many areas where you see the cost cutting.

By the way, I own a Mazda6, and am thinking about of buying a VW Passat (the reliability frightens me though) or a used STS so I am not a Ford Fanboy. I do love the Edge and Fusion. I hate the Taurus and Taurus X. Anyway back to topic.

defreitasm · February 2007

"Was at the Toronto Auto Show last night. Shopping for something to replace the 01 Sienna. Have a relative at the Oakville plant and was hoping to take advantage of the A plan. Not likely! The Edge and MKX were extremely disappointing. Fit finish and overall quality feel was sub par. Edge had no less than 3 colours of plastic on the dash. Lines and joints everywhere; pieces didn't fit or align and these were show cars!!!!!!. That rod to lift the tailgate in the MKX; what a joke! No comparison with the Lexus or Acura. And the GM products (Acadia, etc) are in the same boat as the Fords. Looks like all that cost cutting is working; the parts fit, finish and quality is way down.

On the other hand, the Santa Fe was totally impressive. Nice materials, good design; nice quality feel. If I had to buy today, that would likely be the winner."

I don't know if it's really safe to the Sante Fe the best of the bunch and based on your post it appears that your claim is based on your observations at a trade show, unless you hae driven them but necglected to mention it. I wouldn't recommend buying any of these vehicles without driving them.

I have driven most of them but not the Edge. It was't available when I was shopping but I had no interest in that vehicle. I parked next to an Edge the other day and it just didn't look like something I would want. Just my opinion but they did a lousy enough job on the exterior eccents that I wouldn't even bother looking inside.

I drove a CRV and based on appearance it was nice. It rode decent but the 4 cylander was just too wimpy. Let's face it... it's a Civic. The other problem is that the luxury options are very dismal. I had to rule it out. I tried to stay Honda after owning a 2000 Accord and Odyssey so I then looked at a Pilot. Nice ride, solid and not tinny like the CRV, but the steeringwas sloppy and let's face it the Pilot is a Box. Plenty of power but plenty of weight so it was like driving a boat.

RDX is a real improvemen but in my book it's an expensive Civic and if I were going that high I would go MDX.

Murano was very nice but too much money for what it is and I just couldn't go with that it because of that funky transmission.

The Sante Fe is an improvemnet over the 2005 and prior designs. It looked decent and I could have lived with it's appearance though not sporty enough for me. I just couldn't deal with the bumpy ride but I think most of it was because of the seat design. I really tried to like this car and it is a great value with a great warranty, but I just couldn't pukk the trigger. I also found there colors boring though that would not have stopped me.

I also looked at the Suzuki line because they have a great warranty. I originally was interested in the Grand Vitara last year since the larger XL7 was too much like a truck. The good news is that the 2007 XL7 is redesigned but the bad news it is based on the Equinox. It drove nice but it rttled a bit too much over the bumps. The Suzukis are a great value and it I ha really considered it because the dealer is convenient and I bought my Jetta there but the XL7 just didn't win me over. I really would have lked a VW Toureg, but 40,000 is wa

the GrandVitara was a bit smally more than I am ready to part with on a second car. That also leaves out the upscaled Audi version for 50,000. I have to admit, the German cars are really well put together driving machines despite the reliabilty ratings. I don't keep a car much past the warranty anyway so though reliabilty is important it is not my main criteria for a new vehicle

Ultimately I had to go with the CX7. It has most of what I wanted in a car. It is by know means perfect, but it had the looks, feel, performance and options I wanted. I got the most expensive model loaded and the MSRP was about 33,000. I paid invoice at about 30,000 and the only thing it doesn't have which I might consider adding on my next car is remote start. Everyone who sees it or rides in it loves it. A buddy of mine got in it the other day and asked me if it was an MDX. I guess he missed the big Mazda logo on the steering wheel. LOL

I the end they are all decent cars and there is no wrong choice. To put it blunty a we used to say when I worked in a car dealership... "There's an [non-permissible content removed] for every seat"

suttons · March 2007

From several online reviews of the EDGE I've read, it's now apparent that women gravitate towards the CX-Series Mazdas over the EDGE. Edmund's own review proves this:
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/FullTests/articleId=120069
Donna really disses the EDGE in comparison.

Would anyone else agree that the Mazdas should now be considered the "girlie" Cabriolet of Crossovers?

akirby · March 2007

Not sure about that. My wife prefers the MKX over both the Edge and CX-7/9 but she definitely preferred the Edge over the Mazdas. She dismissed the Mazdas entirely but I managed to get it back on the short list for a test drive later this year.

We also like the Saturn Outlook. First GM product I've considered owning in many, many years.

colonel717 · March 2007

I think that when people test drive a vehicle they need to consider things like over inflated tires as a partial cause for the bumpy ride feel. I recently bought a Santa Fe and the tires were over inflated 8-10 lbs. Since I lowered the psi, the ride is somewhat smoother.

akirby · March 2007

They do this for shipping to keep the tires from flatspotting. The dealers are supposed to put them back to the proper pressure but often don't.

parker4551 · March 2007

I can't believe how people are going on and on about the quality of this Korean manufacturer. I have ridden in several new Hyundai's and they just squeak, moan, and flex like no one would believe. I couldn't believe it when I rode in my secretary's new Minivan that had 10,000 miles on it. Absolutely miserable, however, she didn't seem to notice it, I am wondering if this group of people who purchase Korean made cars expect less out of their vehicles, giving the vehicles higher marks than they deserve. My wife and I bought a Mazda 6 in 2003, and have had only one minor problem, now at 65,000 miles no squeaks or rattles. And I will tell you this, if any of my vehicles had a rattle or squeak it would drive me and my wife nuts.
I can deal with computer failures, battery failures, turbo failures, these things can be diagnosed and fixed, but when it comes to a car squeaking and flexing, there doesn't seem to be a technician good enough in the world to fix these kinds of problems.

vbbuilt · March 2007

You must've had the bad luck to ride in one of Hyundai's earliest models, circa 90's. I had a 2004 Santa Fe and have nothing but praise for it. I put 65K miles on it before buying the CX-7. Rock-solid vehicle...couldn't rave enough about it! Only reason I sold it, cuz I got bored with it. :P

Vince

gllund · March 2007

Hi...had my 2007 Santa Fe for about 6 months now. No creaks or noises at all. The only thing I hear is the grandkids babyseat making a noise when I go over bumps. Otherwise, noise free. Love my new car. Gord

colonel717 · March 2007

I have bought 4 vehicle new. 89 Integra, 98 Accord, 2002 Santa Fe and recently 2007 Santa Fe. I have high quality expectaitons. My experience with Hyundai is just as good or better than that of the other 2.

parker4551 · March 2007

Possibly, their vans and cars are not as good as the Santa Fe. I have been in a 2007 Entourage van, with 10,000 miles on it, and it was awful, also was in a recent model Sonata with 32,000 miles on, also made a lot of noise.
Perhaps, it is a differenc in model.

pelican19 · March 2007

I had the 03 Santa Fe and now own the 07 Limited AWD. Both were quiet and tight. I bought my wife the 07 Entourage SE. Handles well, great pickup, lots of room and creature comforts. The back door has been looked at 3 times for a terrible rattle and the mpg city STINKS! Getting 12.5 at best. With the kids screaming and carrying on and the DVD and the radio on constantly its amazing we can even hear that door rattle. Its a van not a limo so we gave it a pass for now...

parker4551 · March 2007

Sounds more like the experience I have had in other Hyundai vehicles, terrible rattles in recent models. Must be something different going on with the Santa Fe's production.

explorerx4 · March 2007

i went to the hyundai web site to see if they had a picture of the back of the entourage with the hatch open, which they did. there is a little post at the bottom of the opening that sticks up, which is where the hatch locks to when closed. try wrapping some electrical tape around the post(6-7 times). i did it with my wife's escape and have not heard the rattle in over a year. it is worth a try.

pelican19 · March 2007

Sounds like a plan. At this point I am willing to try anything. On the last visit to the shop they put a really gooey type of grease to quiet it down. I got a little upset with them. This is just a quick fix and a mess IMO. It would be too easy to get grease all over our clothes and try to keep the kids away from that too. Yeah, right! They are natural magnets to getting dirty.

Will let you know how the tape works out...

explorerx4 · March 2007

maybe they can't put the tape on, due to legal issues, who knows. hope it works for you!

philmo · March 2007

I finally took a peek at an Edge in the dealership -- which had 6 to 8 of them on the lot. Based on observation alone and not willing to go on a test drive after a visual inspection I'd have to pick the Santa Fe if I had to choose today. Some concerns...

-Rear seat folds almost flat. "Almost" translates into torture in the middle of the night when camping.

-Looking forward from the rear bumper with the rear seat folded down it is apparent that the gear shifter is crooked. That just cannot be good. In other words, when all the way forward it moves slightly to the left toward the driver. When moved rearward it lists toward the passenger.

-The lower door panels are made of some very flimsy plastic sure to be busted up when getting out while wearing hiking, boarding or fishing boots.

-The carpeting on the rear seat back was already severely worn, worse than my rent-controlled apartment in Santa Monica in the 80s.

Not all bad, some good...

-The engine compartment was interesting in terms of access and layout.

-The rear hatch is among the widest in class.

-Laptop storage in the center console.

Still, I'm happy to be patient to see what 2008 brings. There an interesting review today in the New York Times on the Saturn Outlook and GMC Acadia.

parker4551 · March 2007

I am not that impressed with the Edge for right at $30,000. I am also having mixed feelings about $28500 for a 4 cylinder turbo that essenitally has the seating of a car, al a Mazda CX-7. And I can't wrap my mind around buying a Hyundai for $26000, with the stigma associated with that brand.
Yesterday I went to the local GMC dealership and they only had one Acadia for around $34000, now that is a little bit more than what we are talking about here and one will have to wait until they are begging to give them away, but I am getting a lot more car for my money. I might even be tempted to look at a Lexus RX since those are plentiful on the lots, and there might be some good deals to be had. Although I am not sure about buying that kind of vehicle due to the snob factor involved. Everyone always thinks you pay more for that kind of vehicle then you do. Perfect example, my buddy likes to buy larger than needed pickups, like a Chevy 2500, stickering close to $50,000, but at the slightest mention of me buying a Lexus he thinks I am Mr. Big Bucks.

maximafan · March 2007

Hey, Parker, I get that same silly roll of the
eyes or the sing-song voice of, "Ooh, she got a Lexus!" Well, I say Phooey to them. It's a
great car and I've had no problems in 7 months and 10,000 miles. And, yes, there are some
good deals on the RX, particularly on leases.

vbbuilt · March 2007

"I went to the local GMC dealership and they only had one Acadia"

Just be sure to get Extended Warranty if you choose GMC. By all accounts, GMC is at the bottom of the stack in terms of reliability. American car manufacturers, as a group, are really poor in quality.

Vince.

parker4551 · March 2007

Yeah, I think I will have to check out the RX. All these vehicles are getting closely priced, at least to me. A few thousand either way at $30,000 means little to me. I will miss the back seat once in a while, but if I want to carry a lot of people I have an Armada.
As far as GMC's reliablity, I know very little about it, however, I do remember all the problems they had with the Envoy and the cracked engine block, that it and many of its similarly equipped vehicles shared.

stever · March 2007

I wouldn't say "by all accounts."

J.D. Powers New IQS: The Rest of the Story (GM FastLane Blog)

If you don't like JD Power surveys, here's a great one you can fill out:

Consumers' Most Wanted Vehicles for 2007

parker4551 · March 2007

Well I guess not by all accounts, but I give very little weight to JD power. They poll people that aren't necessarily car saavy. Just like my sister, who can't tell the difference between the smoothness of a V6 versus a 4, or can't hear a squeak in a car to save her soul, because her radio is blasting. However, she got the survey, sent it in, loves her car.

audia8q · March 2007

I give very little weight to JD power. They poll people that aren't necessarily car savvy.

I didn't realize you had to be car savvy to fill out a survey...does that mean that the folks who fill out the Consumer reports survey are more or less savvy than the people who fill out the JDP surveys? Just wondering which survey we should believe, since only car savvy people can properly fill out the survey.

hardhawk · March 2007

The Envoy never had a cracked engine block issue. When they first came out in the spring of 2001 they had gotten a batch of bad front suspension parts (1 part was bad) and they replaced them all on the Envoy's, Trailblazer's and Bravada's. I have had my Envoy since July of 2001 and it has had no major issues. A few minor ones, but not a lot of them. For me, the Envoy has been a great vehicle. I would have no hesitation at all to buy the Acadia or the Enclave. No Saturn dealer close to me so Outlook is not an option.

parker4551 · March 2007

You don't have to be car savvy to fill out the survey, but it will definetly influence the results. And yes that goes for the consumer reports surveys as well.
Heck people have a hard enough time in this country punching a ballot correctly, even if they have a 50/50 of getting it right. Furthermore, how else can you explain things like Sanjaya on American Idol.

Hyundai Santa Fe vs Toyota RAV4 vs Mazda CX-7 vs Ford Edge

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