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Honda Fit Maintenance

SylviaSylvia Member Posts: 1,636
in Honda
Keep your Fit maintained...
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Comments

  • vchiuvchiu Member Posts: 564
    I have a question regarding the breaking in of my fit. 1.5 CVT (Bought in China, as described previously)

    I have clocked up about 850 km (530 miles) going at 50 mph max. My dealer told me to go max 50 mph for 1200 miles and max 62 mph up to 3100 miles (5000 Km)
    The user's manual writes not to go at full throttle during the first 620 miles, and nothing more.

    Has someone an advice? I am tempted to just comply with the U/M. Can I drive normally after the 620 first miles without ruining the powertrain?

    The recommanded service intervals are set at 5000 km = 3100 miles. In Europe, a modern car has generally 3 times bigger intervals, some times 4, 5 or 6 times bigger. Has any one an idea why?

    Is it possible to download an English version of the Fit User's manual? As the engine is supposedly the same...

    Guarantee is 2 years/60000 km here.
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    First, manufacturers and dealers and user groups all have different theories on break-in. You can trust the recommendation in the Honda manual most of all. Generally, nowadays most people with theories about break-in aren't worried about freeway speeds - up to about 80 mph anyway - as they are about how hard you are accelerating, whether on city streets or on the freeway. In other words, avoid full throttle, double the factory recommended mileage to be conservative if you want to, but don't worry about speed. This assumes you are not loading the vehicle with five adults and heavy luggage.

    The concern about top speeds could relate to older manufacturing techniques that had less precise tolerances and relied more heavily on "break in" by the driver. Honda and most other international manufacturers have gone way beyond this level of concern.

    As to oil changes, several factors are probably at work:

    1. Quality of oils used in Europe - almost always full synthetic. It is unlikely that dealers in other parts of the world use full synthetic routinely, certainly not here in America. While in America, Honda recommends 10,000 mile oil changes EXCEPT for short drives, dusty drives, etc., they know the "car culture" here is such that most people will do 3,000 mile oil changes anyway, possibly 5,000 mile oil changes if they feel brave.

    2. Driving conditions - amount of short trips, traffic congestion, time idling, rapid acceleration, lack of freeway miles. I have been to Shanghai, and suspect your driving conditions are fairly harsh relative to the USA.

    3. Desire to protect the environment by using less motor oil (Europe) hence longer drain intervals. Desire to protect the car (China) where a car represents a higher proportion of net wealth.

    4. Desire to make more money (for dealer), but also to provide more safety and better service (do a lot of routine checks, like fluid levels and tire pressures, that many owners might skip, and also keep the eye on the car in a new and critical market; spot problems early, better customer satisfaction).

    5. Desire to make car look like it is better made (manufacturer) because it has longer oil change intervals.

    Personally, given your driving environment, I'd recommend going with the factory recommended oil change and service intervals. I think the reality is, if you read the fine print on US manuals, many services have to be performed on a "time basis" if the annual mileage is low, and the odds are your annual mileage will be low.
  • vchiuvchiu Member Posts: 564
    Thank you for your advices

    Fit Update

    I am back from a round trip to Hainan , with about 2000 km more on the clock.
    We left last thursday night with 4 adults and 2 small kids and all the luggage and we managed to cram everything quite well in the FIT. As it wqs the Chinese new year, the motorway was crowded with cars and I averaged about 60 mph with 7 Liter/100 km (30 mpg I guess) with an uneven speed (from 50 to 75 mph)

    The car handled quite well, the CVT matching the 1.5 quite well. We even did about 100 miles on unpaved roads as such are frequent in less developed areas of China.

    On the return stretch, traffic allowed for a cruise at 90 mph. Although the mpg is pretty reasonable at 80, it was down to 20 mpg at 90, that is the consumption of my 740i when doing 100 mph. When going this pace, the engine feels a bit strained, whereas it maintains 80 mh quite easily (car was full like an egg).

    Overall, this car has some touring abilities and can keep-up with a good pace quite well. up to 85 mph, engine/CVT make a smooth couple.

    The board computer which was too optimistic, became pessimistic, estimating mpg 10% more than real.

    in any case a very fair delivery for such a small package.

    Same Engine with a Turbo would be a dream.
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    That's great! But please check your tire pressure monthly (underinflation being the #1 cause of tire failure), and keep good oil in your car (I can see why the manual recommends 3,000 mile oil changes) you are really putting the Fit to a work out - over here you won't see 4 adults in a Ford Expedition, much less 4 adults, 2 kids, and luggage in a subcompact - doing 90! It's mostly single people and couples over here....
  • vchiuvchiu Member Posts: 564
    Right.

    I have 175X14 tires which handle well enough by the way

    Well actually, as I am European, I went at European pace, because the road conditions allowed, but generally it is more 70 sometimes 60.

    I did not push the Fit above 100 MpH. 80 is fine anyway, so the FIT should FIT well on US roads.

    Thre are a lot of minivans here much shorter than the FIT where one cram 6 guests on 3 rows.
  • coldstorage5coldstorage5 Member Posts: 76
    Does any know where Ican buy Honda Fit oil filters.
    I also noticed on the oil cap to use 10w20 oil.
    Why is that??
    Thanx
    Silver Sport Owner :)
  • dewaltdakotadewaltdakota Member Posts: 364
    The reply for almost all things Fit seems to be College Hills Honda!

    The oil filters are $5.35 each, and include the washer. Those wiper blades are pretty funky too, so you might want to toss a couple of those into your shopping basket, as well.
  • coldstorage5coldstorage5 Member Posts: 76
    Hello,
    Why does the Fit use 5w20 oil??
    Will 5W30 work??
    What type would you recomend??
    I always use mobil 1 synthetic
    Is this amsoil good??
    Never heard of it.
    Thanx
  • coldstorage5coldstorage5 Member Posts: 76
    Cant wait, Im so fired up.
    $100 off Msrp. I bought the mats and the cargo cover at an online store. I also bought 5 oil filters.
    Any suggestion on breaking the car in.
    I wont go over 60 mph and plan to change the oil at 1K.

    Silver Sport here i come. :) :P
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    There might be some tips in the owner's manual. It's probably the best place to start. I usually break my cars in by not driving with more than 3/4 throttle for acceleration for the first 600 miles, driving it normally (not aggressively) for the next 1500 or so miles, and then just driving it normally (sometimes aggressively) thereafter. Modern cars seem to takes about 6,000-10,000 miles to break in.

    A lot of constant speed freeway driving isn't good for it initially. City driving (without a lot of stop and go in hot weather) is actually better - the rpm vary more. Stop and go in hot weather is bad because underhood temperatures can build up.

    Try to be gentler on your brakes the first few hundred miles - smooth, drawn out stops (but don't create any safety issues for yourself).

    MOST IMPORTANTLY don't buy a car with more than 6-10 miles on it. If you do, it's probably been test driven, and given the demographic of the target audience and the newness of the car, it might have been driven harder than you'd like.
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    "more than 6-10 miles"

    I think 35 - 50 may be a more reasonable threshold.
  • hungarian83hungarian83 Member Posts: 678
    Mine had 5 miles. 10 or maybe 15 is the maximum for a brand new car that hasn't been driven at all except for the factory test and getting to and from trucks, ships, and trains.

    35-50 has already been tested at least once or twice by potential buyers at the dealership.
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    I've picked up new cars in the past too with under 10 miles on the odo. I was only pointing out that new cars with up to 50 miles on them would not be highly unusual, and the dealer would consider them "brand new".
  • jethadenjethaden Member Posts: 36
    Manual says breaking is 600 miles for engine.
    No hard breaking for 200 miles.
    And do Not change oil until the computer says too. I do not necessarily understand the oil change thing, but they may have added extra additives to initial oil to aid breaking. Just a guess.

    FitFreak.net review suggested not to exceed 60% of peak RPM for first 1000 km, ie about 3600 RPM.

    Some short higher RPM is good to seat rings better. Or so I have always been told.
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    This all jibes with my undertanding, except the oil change interval on the first oil change. I particularly agree with "short higher rpm" to help seal the rings, although supposedly the cylinders have cross-hatching to help the rings seat without help from us.

    Supposedly the factory oil has extra moly to handle wear during break in while the tolerances are close; otherwise it is a perfectly normal, conventional oil, not a break in oil.

    Most of us think the advice to not change the oil until the indicator light says so, as being part of Honda's mission to reduce environmental impact caused by changing oil before absolutely necessary. In other words, we ignore it and change at a variety of intervals:

    1,000 miles for those who believe the most metal particles migrate into the factory oil during that period. I follow this regimen both because I think the first 1,000 miles are the most critical break in period(and also because any API rated oil under moderate driving is good for 1,000 miles) and also because I want to get full synthetic in as soon as possible so I can start driving a little more aggressively while keeping full peace of mind. I follow up with a 5,000 mile oil change and do 5,000 mile oil changes thereafter, but I also use Mobil 1 full synthetic. Given how tight the engine is, I don't want the toughest possible oil in there. Since I drive stick shifts, lugging the motor (which loads the bearings) is probably more of a problem with me than high rpm.

    3,000 miles for almost everyone who believes in 3,000 mile oil changes.

    5,000 miles or half the indicator life for those who believe 10,000 miles is TDF (too darn far) but at the same time assume that if Honda thinks the motor can go 10,000 miles between changes, then there obviously is no need to change at 3,000 miles. (5,000 miles also matches Honda's severe service recommendation, giving it extra validation).

    I think the oil life calculator is the greatest thing for cars since radios. It provides a minimum level of protection if you drive the full period, and at the same time takes into account short-trip, cold weather drives to shorten the interval. The average driver finds it much harder to forget/ignor. It does NOT optimize engine protection, only lcd (least common denominator) protection and consumer happiness.

    For anyone who tells you 10,000 mile oil changes are fine, Hondas are easy on oil and last forever, I would counter "yeah, but how many people REALLY stretch it out to 10,000 miles?" Every Honda dealer I know wants you in there every 3,000 miles for an oil change unless you tell them you do all freeway driving, in which case they begrudgingly tell you 5,000 miles is ok.

    (Also, true high mileage cars of any make are rare; after about 60,000-80,000 miles, most cars find second homes with lighter drivers, and become obsolete or just generally break down from causes other than engine failure before they ever hit high miles.)
  • w9cww9cw Member Posts: 888
    micweb wrote: "(Also, true high mileage cars of any make are rare; after about 60,000-80,000 miles, most cars find second homes with lighter drivers, and become obsolete or just generally break down from causes other than engine failure before they ever hit high miles.)"

    Three of my cars have over 100K miles, and all were bought new. Two SAABs have over 150K and a Volvo has over 200K. All are in excellent shape mechanically and aesthetically - and, they continue to provide daily service.

    I don't think "true high mileage cars are rare." Of course, it depends on how one defines high mileage. Many new cars today will easily reach 250K without major repairs.
  • chrisducatichrisducati Member Posts: 394
    Yeah, everyone I know drives their cars well over 100k. I buy about every three years or four years and put between 30 and 40 thousand a year on a car. My sister put 70k in one year on a kia a few years ago. She gave it to her daughter after it had well over 100k. She is still driving it today with no problems to report. I remember when an American made car with 70 k on it was near the end of its life. From talk around the water cooler most of the people with American cars seem to think the car is still like that. They expect to have to start sinking money into it above 70k. People who have owned foreign makes generally do not think that.
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    Holy Cow! You guys commute daily to Alaska to go to work, to put on that kind of mileage?! :surprise:

    Or maybe you use it as a Taxi? ;)
  • moparbadmoparbad Member Posts: 3,870
    30,000 to 40,000 a year for me. One of the reason's I have multiple vehicles to share the miles!
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    Amazing! 40,000 miles would equal about 110 miles a day, everyday, 365 days a year. Do you guys get time to sleep? :P I usually don't put on 40,000 miles before I trade in my car! My last 2 cars had about 28,000 miles (3 1/2 years) and 34,000 miles(4 years), respectively when I traded them in.
  • mtngalmtngal Member Posts: 1,911
    I drive 150 miles round trip (with a 6,000 foot elevation change) daily - at least I carpool with my husband. And too many weekends find me driving somewhere - even if it is only 100 miles (round trip) to Costco or Walmart or the movies. Once a month (or more often) I drive 600 miles to visit family, so it doesn't take long for the miles to add up. On the other hand, I can drive 3 or 4 miles to go hiking, off-roading, snowshoeing, cross-country skiing etc. depending on the season. There are rewards to living in the middle of a national forest. I sold a 4 year old Tacoma with 188,000 miles on it (hated it), have 130,000 miles on a '98 Wrangler that has been mostly a second, off-road vehicle.

    And that's why I'm hoping to buy a Fit in the next couple of days - the Unlimited's 18 mpg (if I'm lucky) is killing my budget!
  • bodble2bodble2 Member Posts: 4,514
    "...100 miles (round trip) to Costco"

    Amazing! It's 20 miles, tops, for me to Costco. And I've always thought that's a pain! Did I say amazing? :P ;)

    I hope the Fit is up to the task of climbing all those mountains for you!
  • moparbadmoparbad Member Posts: 3,870
    Check out the Long and Grinding Road article on the subject of Extreme Commuters in the May 1 Newsweek.

    Anyone commuting 90 minutes or more each way to work in their new Fit?
  • coldstorage5coldstorage5 Member Posts: 76
    Hello,
    Some things I noticed.
    1) I like being higher than regular cars.
    2) the handleing is awesome.
    3) No heat gauge but a little blue light on until the car is warmed up.
    4) stereo is good not great
    5) Not a smooth ride. but the handeling is outstanding.
    Smooth enough though.
    Question.
    Do I have to use the dealer to change the oil??
    The mecanic said to change the oil after 5K (Yeah Right)
    I want to do all oil changes and put in synthetic.
    So Is the warrenty void if I do the oil changes????
  • sntgizmosntgizmo Member Posts: 4
    Changing your own oil does not void the factory warranty. Be sure to use the specified grade and weight though. The oil filter is in a dream location on this car. It is right up front pointing straight down with nothing in the way to drip oil all over.
  • bamacarbamacar Member Posts: 749
    Fit has a timing chain, but Honda and Toyota both have about 60-80% chains these days.

    Toyota still has a belt on Solara V6, Tundra and Sequoia V8s, LandCruiser, 4runner V8 and Highlander V6.

    Honda uses chains on the Civic, Accord 4, CRV, Element, Insight, and S2000. The timing belts are with the V6 used on the Pilot, Odyssey, Ridgeline, and Accord V6.
  • plektoplekto Member Posts: 3,738
    I've heard from others that do change their own oil that a brand-new car needs the following schedule:

    First change 500 miles. The grit in the oil is noticeable. The engine is breaking in and that means bits of metal are breaking off as it polishes itself clean.

    Second change another 1000 miles. - Grit shoud be microscopic by now.

    Third change 3000 miles. Grit should be gone.

    After that, normal 3-5K changes.
  • nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    Honda IMPLORES and ENTREATS new owners to wait as long as they can stand it to do that first oil change - it is because of the special oil they put in at the factory, which helps the seals seat.

    On my RSX I waited until 7000 miles for the first oil change.

    Most internal engine parts these days are cut by machines with a lot more precision than in the old days - I don't think there are "bits of metal" to break off and get suspended in the oil any more.

    Just an opinion, but one that happens to be backed up by the manufacturer's own instructions.

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

  • gearhead1gearhead1 Member Posts: 408
    Agreed, Honda is insistent that you wait at least till the oil minder reads 10-15% percent befroe you change the oil the first time people. there are alot of self appointed oil experts on here that have no business giving antiquated advise from yesteryear, Honda is the premier engine builder in the world and they know their engines period. They say wait till 10 or 15% in the oil minder dash display. This is critical to the break in of you engine . The factory fill has a very high moly content that will help your rings seat. 10 or 15 % will probably put you in the nieghbor hood of 5,000 miles. This is OK.

    My salesman says Honda has directly told him there is 7 sensors in the crank case that analyse the oil for contaminents and that is linked to your maintenance minder. I asked him like 3 times if that is directly from Honda and he said that is directly from his Honda reps. Take it for what it's worth.

    Do some reading at bobistheoilguy.com and those guys are so anal they send in their used oil for analysis and they report it is perfectly fine for oil to go 6,000 miles are more. Just make sure you use a very good filter such as Napa Gold (the best wix filter) Do not use the Honda filter the dealers will use. It's Honeywell (made by Fram) Fram is crap. It's probably Ok for 3,000 mile but not up to the task of enduring 6,000 miles or more. The Honda filter on your car from the factory is one of the best filters out there, but it's probably not what you'll get at the dealer. Follow the maintenance minder. You can trust it. stop second guessing Honda. They are the experts.
  • reddroverrreddroverr Member Posts: 509
    I think it is best to follow manufacturer guidlines.
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    Another poster assured you that you won't be voiding your warranty. This is true, but you have to be able to prove you did the oil change and used the required oil (5-20 API SM). My strategy would be to take it to the dealer's fast change oil lane (or use a coupon) but do my own "mid cycle" oil changes (when the indicator says 50% oil life left). I would use full synthetic and carry in the same full synthetic for the dealer to use when they change the oil for you.

    Prices can vary a lot for oil changes at dealers, so shop around. Virtually no "service" per se is required, so don't let them pad your bill by upseling a routine oil change to a "minor service" or "major service."
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    I think the salesman is misinformed about sensors that actually check the oil for contamination; that would be new, and expensive (it's hard enough to check for contamination in a lab!).

    There are two current types of "maintenance minders":

    1. Simple mileage reminders, that read your mileage since their last reset.

    2. OLM or "oil life monitors" but really "oil life calculators" that take many pieces of information from your car's ECM (engine control module or computer) about the amount of time spent warming up vs. the amount of time spent driving at proper operating temperature; the average trip length; coolant temperature variations (stop and go in hot weather; short commute in freezing weather). Nothing requires special sensors, just grinding the information that is flowing through your car's computer all the time any way, and distilling it down to a personalized oil change recommendation.

    A lot of people who do easy freeway commutes (in their minds) are surprised to see the recommendation for an oil change come in earlier than expected; some drivers who think they are severe service drivers get longer than expected oil changes. For example, I have a 35 mile, one way, daily commute that entails a couple of blocks to get on the freeway, 10 blocks at the other end to get to work. Despite flying at 70-75 mph on the freeway, my trip computer indicates I only have an average speed of 38 mph, meaning the impact of the small portion of street, with a slow down or two on the freeway, is much greater than I imagined.

    The problem with OLM's (the Fit has the more sophisticated OLM/calculator, not the older "maintenance minder") is that they are driven by an industry agenda to minimize perceived maintenance costs and to be environmentally sound (longer oil change intervals).

    For example, Europe is biased towards long engine life rather than fuel economy, so the additives in most oils and very grade range of the oil itself (5-40 is not uncommon) optimize protection, not fuel economy. At the same time manufacturers like Benz and BMW demand "long life" oils which are designed to maintain a specified level of protection longer, so as to to keep their customers out of the routine service bay for as long as possible.

    Over here it is the opposite. Our oils emphasize fuel economy and catalytic converter life over longevity of engine parts; our public resists paying for full synthetic oils much less long-life full synthetic oils (the BMW and Mercedes spec oils are full synthetics); and manufacturers count on the widespread culture of 3,000 mile oil changes (which most consumers guiltily push out to 5,000 miles) to actually provide the real protection needed.

    Honda is the most aggressive about its oil change intervals (10,000 miles without a full synthetic or long-life spec requirement) and service categories (it is harder to fall into the shorter oil change, "severe service" category than it is with other manufacturers). At the same time, I bought two Hondas in the past five years from two different dealers, and both service departments scheduled me for 3,000 mile oil changes, over my protests.

    Now I ask you, who makes better engines - Honda, on the one hand, or BMW/Mercedes on the other? It's a trick question, because in many ways the small Honda engines are actually the better ones - due to their smaller displacement they get driven harder, and due to the younger age of their drivers they get driven harder. So which engines should get the better oil? If Mercedes and BMW's need full synthetic, how come Honda can get by with the cheapest oil on sale at Autozone? (That's another trick question - I don't think they can.)

    You said, in part "Stop second guessing Honda. They are the experts." I agree with the second part, but disagree with the first part. They ARE the experts, but what would they say if we told them (1) we drive our car like a taxi; or (ii) we really, really plan on driving it to 150,000 or 200,000 miles and don't want it to wear to the point of oil consumption during that interval? I suspect they would immediately get nervous and recommend 3,000 or 5,000 mile oil changes with a full synthetic or, better yet, a long life formulation full synthetic. Also, the engineers to design their cars are only part of the larger corporate "voice" that we ultimately hear.

    On that "other" website (bob's), both 20 and 30 weight multigrade oils are shown, by oil sample tests of used oil, as shearing down to 15 weight and 20 weight by the end of only 3,000 miles. Very few oils are shear stable (guess what - full synthetics do better). In manufacturer required wear sequence tests, the amount of wear permitted is surprisingly high - but the actual rate of wear (as opposed to total over the test) is less in the beginning and increases towards the end of the oil's life. The tests used prior to the development of 5-20 oil weren't even that severe, they were way out of date. That's why oils like Mobil 1 (and most recently Pennzoil Platinum) could honestly claim they greatly exceeded wear and other standards.

    Going 10,000 miles between oil changes also ignores other issues. How often do you check your tire pressure? I check mine monthly - but sometimes despite my best efforts forget. The average American consumer NEVER checks their tire pressure, it only gets checked when the oil is changed. So 3,000 (or at least 5,000, as opposed to 10,000)mile oil change intervals have significant hidden benefits.

    It would be nice to trust Honda (or other manufacturers that still have long oil change intervals - Ford and Chrysler have revised their recommendations significantly downward, and Toyota has revised their recommendation downward following their sludge problems). But in the meantime, I follow two rules:

    1. 3,000 miles for nonsynthetic oils;
    2. 5,000 miles or 50% of the OLM for full synthetic oils.

    And even for #1, I choose a conventionally priced oil that is really 50% synthetic (TropArtic).
  • mtngalmtngal Member Posts: 1,911
    I'm going to pick up the Fit tomorrow afternoon (Silver Sport Auto). I've been using nonsynthetic oil in one of our current vehicles (3,000 mile oil changes) and Mobile 1 in the other (5,000 mile oil changes). I thought that Mobile 1 was a full synthetic oil, but now I'm confused. Is it or is it a blend? Since I'm hoping to get at least 200,000 miles out of this car, I'm really interested in this discussion of oil changes and oil types.

    I will say we've had good luck with high mileage vehicles - we put 188,000 miles on a Tacoma using non-synthetic every 3,000 - 4,000 miles and 290,000 on a Nissan Hardbody with very irregular non-synthetic oil changes (my other half was terrible about getting it done on time way back when). When he sold the Nissan, it had a blown auto tranny but the engine was still running perfectly.
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    Mobil "1" (the "1" is the key) has always been full synthetic. They also sell a conventional and blended oil under the Mobil name, but drop the "1". When in doubt, read the label, or if you get it at a car dealer, specify "fully synthetic" and as for the left over oil back - that's good both for checking the viscoscity grade they used and to make sure they themselves did not confuse the various lines of Mobil oils.

    Also see www.mobil1.com
  • growwisegrowwise Member Posts: 296
    Don't knock the timing belts. They last longer than chains in some cars (chain failure is common but not because of what you think.. it's the oiler which can be at fault). Belts nowadays are kevlar reinforced (kevlar being the fibres used for bulletproof vests) so they are not just rubber.

    As far as mobil1 is concerned, its the best oil you can get out there. They did a test on BMW once where it ran for one million miles in the lab. I can attest for mobil1 since I have put over 100k miles on my car and engine is like new. I only wish my tranny will live as long as my engine does. Note: Do your tranny fluid flush every 30k miles. I mean full flush not just part of it.
  • bamacarbamacar Member Posts: 749
    I did not knock timing belts, but I will now. I have had many cars and trucks with both. I have never had either break, and I have had many cars well over 100k miles and decades old. I have never had to replace or had a problem with a chain. I have replaced many timing belts some to the tune of 300 bucks.

    Yes, timing belts and timing chains have improved over the years. Timing chains tend to last much longer and require much less cost and time in maintenance.

    Soon (probably less than 2 years) this will be a nonissue with Honda and Toyota anyway. As soon as Toyota puts its new V-8 and V-6 in all models there will be no more timing belts. As soon as Honda comes out with the next Accord and Pilot/Ridgeline/Odyssey (both V6 engines), they will also have no timing belts. You may not like timing chains but you will no longer have a choice with a new Honda or Toyota.
  • shneorshneor Member Posts: 66
    I own a 1988 Mazda 323 with 241K miles on it, bought used with 88K miles. I use 20-50 oil with the addition of 4 oz. of Tufoil every oil chamge (5000 miles). I plan to use Tufoil on my new silver BM Fit starting with the first oil change. My Mazda engine runs very nicely but only 26 mpg.
  • demspmeoffdemspmeoff Member Posts: 3
    Folks...

    It's nice to see so many different experiences and opinions about the FIT. I got my vivid pearl blue Sport AT last Wednesday and love it so far. But...

    ...my sales person advised me that I the car has synthetic oil and it shouldn't be changed for...wait for it...

    10,000 miles!

    Now, I've gone every 3000 miles like clockwork with all my other cars. My eyebrows raised, the saleswoman indicated greed led to these 3000 mile intervals.

    I'm thinking the vast majority here are going to advise that the advice is crazy. Has anyone else heard such a thing? (I do understand there is an oil life maintenance "life" indicator as you flip through the trip odometers.)

    Thoughts?

    Thanks...

    Jim
  • gearhead1gearhead1 Member Posts: 408
    I'm thinking the vast majority here are going to advise that the advice is crazy. Has anyone else heard such a thing? (I do understand there is an oil life maintenance "life" indicator as you flip through the trip odometers.)

    Follow your oil maintenance minder on your dash display for your first oil change. Change it when it gets down to 10-15 percent which will probably be in the 5,000 mile nieghborhood. This is Honda's recommendation for breaking in their motor with the high moly factory fill. I don't think it's synthetic.

    If you feel you must change it arounf 3,000 miles just cahnge the oil when the minder says 50% after your first oil change. Don't reset the minder because it's tied to all the other maintenance schedules. You could change it at at 50%, then take it to zero and change it and reset the oil life minder at that point. Your car will never know what you did. ;)

    Personally after exhaustive research on this issue for myself. I am fully satisfied that even regular dino oil can comfortably go 5,000 miles or more, some say even 10,000, so I'm satisfied with Honda's recommendation which falls somewhere between 4,500 and 6,500 miles depending on your driving conditions.
  • reddroverrreddroverr Member Posts: 509
    I think in general 5-7k is pretty good for oil changes. 3k is overkill I believe..and probably was nudged along by the oil and oil change industry. After all they put a sticker on your window that tells you to do it..it MUST be in your best interest. ;)

    I would follow the owner's guide book rather than the salesperson. Might even effect your warranty if you don't.
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    On the oil change issue, I went into a bit of a rant in message #3520, which you can read by clicking on the "faded link" above.

    Basically I agree with the more recent posters that even dino oil (BRAND NAME dino oil) will go 5,000-6,000 miles in non-severe driving conditions (at least 5 mile trips, no extensive idling) BUT what the more recent posters fail to directly confront is Honda's recent absurd position that 10,000 mile oil changes with conventional oil are fine for almost everyone.

    The Fit of course has the newer type of algorithmic oil life calculator that takes into account individual driving habits. I would probably change oil at the 50% mark as suggested by the other poster, or at least not go beyond 20% remaining life, to allow a comfortable margin. For that matter, given the high freeway rpm on the standard transmission model, and the possibility of extended high rpm on the "sport shift" automatic version, I'd feel more comfortable with full synthetic oil - but that's just my opinion.
  • andmoonandmoon Member Posts: 320
    After many years of 3K changes I answered the interval question by having my used motor oil tested.
    The answer depends on the car.
    My 03 wrx that is not babied is projected to be good for 13K miles between oil changes. Mobil 1 tested after 5K miles. 10K should be safe.
    My 90 sdl (diesel) oil was tested after 3K miles (rotella synthetic) and is projected to be safe for 8K miles.
    I still change at 5K and 3K intervals but if my manual recs. 10K that's how long I'd take it IF an oil analysis says it's okay.
    New MB cdi (diesels) are set to go for 13K mile oil changes. I think vw tdi's for 10K. I see nothing wrong w/ a gasser going 10K.
  • gearhead1gearhead1 Member Posts: 408
    BUT what the more recent posters fail to directly confront is Honda's recent absurd position that 10,000 mile oil changes with conventional oil are fine for almost everyone.

    I didn't know 10,000 miles was Honda's official positon. I thought I heard someoone mention a Honda salesman told them 10,000 miles, and I don't doubt a salesman could say that, but it is not Honda's position. Salesman just talk, why, I don't know.

    Can you supply a link to this 10,000 mile number? I would think if this was Honda's position, I would have heard of someone's oil minder reaching zero at 10,000 miles, and I've never heard of this. The Longest mileage I've heard from a Honda oil life monitor is 6,500 I think.
  • reddroverrreddroverr Member Posts: 509
    you got your oil tested? Where and how much was it?

    if we really want to get nit picky...Click and Clack say that summer driving degrades oil faster. So throw that in to the equation if you want.

    It is all a bit of overkill to me. My celica was going stong after 240k miles and oil changes at less than optimal intervals at times.
  • micwebmicweb Member Posts: 1,617
    My 2003 Civic manual called for 10,000 mile oil changes. If the oil life monitor is kicking in before then, obviously the driving that a lot of us do is "severe" or in between. My dealer wanted me to do 3,000 mile oil changes but that made my blood boil.

    I now have a Cobalt and the oil life monitor projects a 6,000-7,500 mile oil change. I have heard of other others with Chevy oil monitors getting much longer oil change intervals. Since I think I have one of the easiest driving patterns possible (35 mile freeway commute in a mild climate, light to moderate traffic, getting 35+ mpg so you know I'm not racing it) it makes me wonder what kind of idealized conditions the "longer interval" drivers are seeing. It's opened my eyes to what a realistic oil change interval should be for me on our other cars.
  • demspmeoffdemspmeoff Member Posts: 3
    Thanks much, GH...and to everyone else who replied. Bottom line seems to be somewhere in between, but it appears as if I can trust that oil maintenance minder.

    Thanks again...happy FITS!

    Jim
  • wvwolfwvwolf Member Posts: 4
    The Fit uses 5w20 because the machining tolerances these days are much more precise than cars of yesteryear. When pistons move, there is a very thin gap between the pistons and cylinder walls which is filled by oil to lubricate the motion as well as seal the gap. The lighter the oil that accomplishes this, the less energy lost to friction as the pistons move up and down. Thinner oil also distributes itself more quickly and thoroughly throughout the engine, even when cold. While you could use a thicker viscosity oil, it's rather pointless and will only make the engine slightly less efficient as the pistons have to push through a thicker liquid which causes more friction and heat.
    The engine is designed to work well with 20 weight oil and that's what I would use.
    As for synthetic vs. regular oil, they both do the job. Synthetic is more expensive but claims to be more viscous resulting in even less friction and heat which might increase mpg a microscopic smidge. It also claims to take longer to break down and lose its lubricating qualities than traditional oil. In theory this means you can go longer between oil changes. However, understand that one of the reasons for changing the oil, besides the lubricating qualities, is to get rid of all the microscopic metal particles acquired through wear that are now floating in the oil. If you go longer between oil changes, those particles are circulating longer.
    If you don't abuse the engine and change oil more or less frequently, the engine will probably last a couple hundred thousand miles using either type so the differences are probably negligible.
  • moonchildmoonchild Member Posts: 15
    Thank you for an in-depth, well written and articulate article. I will be paying more attention to items that you write. :)
  • 99accent99accent Member Posts: 237
    the new sonata has no belt
  • kagedudekagedude Member Posts: 407
    For my Honda Fit Sport, whenever I turn the wheel all the way, it feels like its hitting or rubbing on something like the tire hitting the wheel well. Anyone have this symptom? I'm not comfortable turning a full radius because of that. Thanks.
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