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Comments
t was not until people were responding to 12 psi over that I noticed that indeed what I typed was wrong and not what I carry in my tires.
What I meant to post is that I carry 5psi over for a total of 37 psi instead of the 32 on the door label. I have found that this is the sweet spot, for the tires on my Yaris. I carry a tread depth gauge and weekly perform tire pressure and tread depth operations. I also rotate and balance my tires twice a year.
This is how I always obtain extremely good life from my tires. I have been doing this for years with every car I have and it's really worth the effort. I always run my tires over the mfg suggested pressure but not 5 psi on every car. Some less, some a bit more, as I base it on taking readings with the tread depth gauge on a regular basis. By monitoring wear and determining what each vehicle needs for pressure, I'm able to extend tire life and obtain even tread depth across the entire surface of the tire. It is not unusual for me to obtain at least 20% greater life than stated for a particular brand and model of tire.
Thanks for calling that typo to my attention.
I have 8/32 tread depth front, and 6/32 tread wear rear. As you many know, the original equipment tires wear rather fast. There are much better tires as replacements.
Thanks!
Like most people, I usually inflate several psi higher than the door jamb sticker. That means 35psi for my Alero 4cyl. But 44psi is really pushing the limits of the Yaris's tiny tires. Plus, you're promoting premature tire wear because less of the tread is touching the pavement at that pressure.
Finally, and most importantly, you're seriously risking a catastrophic hydroplaning event!! The Yaris is light enough the way it is; with super-pumped tires, it'll skate over a rainpuddle and land you in a ditch. Please, the few mpg you save aren't worth your life.
Not opinions.
44psi is stamped on the side of the tire so that one knows the load limit and psi ceiling that is perfectly safe to use. Every tire sold, has that data on the sidewall for a reason. That reason is safety. There is no reason not to inflate to maximum pressure if that is what one wants to do.
On two gas saving webpages, which I am not allowed to show here, most are doing the max shown on the sidewall. None are having problems, and all are getting better mileage. I do not think there is a safety problem with going up to the max on the sidewall. Tire wear is normal.
One of the greatest causes of premature wear is underinflation. All one has to do is walk behind the tire store to the pile of tires they have removed when installing new tires. You will notice that the very center of the tread surface has at least 50% remaining while the shoulder of the tire is bald. This is what you get when you run the _auto makers_ suggested pressure. (Not that of the tire maker). They do not care how much tire life you get, they just want to you experience a soft ride. Believe me I used to own five tire stores. I know of what I speak. I have no reason to mislead you. Do yourself and your wallet a favor. Run at least 5psi more than the pressure indicated on the door sticker. You will increase your tire life by at least 10,000 miles, minimum. Check them once a month and you're all set.
Cheers!
Go to www.GasPrices.com and use the FUEL LOG feature.
One that varies widely, depending on a several variables.
1) Is it a Sedan, or Hatchback?
2) Does it have a manual or automatic transmission?
3) How heavy is one's right foot?
4) Flat terrain, or hilly?
5) City, freeway or mixed?
6) What percentage of mileage if mixed?
Obviously a topic that can be discussed for a very long time.
Bottom line, what I use as an indicator when buying a new car is the Fuel Economy Numbers on the Window Sticker.
Why? Because the one thing we do know is that all new cars of the same model year are tested under the same conditions. Therefore, while your mileage may be greater or lesser than what's on the sticker, at least you can compare one car to the next with the peace of mind knowing they all went through the same test.
Cheers!
BTW, the Yaris LB rides like a Cadillac compared to the Fit. And the Fit handles like a MINI compared to the Yaris LB - although for 2008, on the LB I test drove, the handling at 70-80 is more stable than on the 2007 - about what my 2007 was like AFTER I added the TRD sway bar to it. I suspect that a 2008 Yaris LB with the sway bar would be slick.
Gosh I love micro-cars!
When I first drove it off the lot, the tank was full. I drove it 118 miles and then topped it off. I did the math, and it said 47 mpg. My ex said 'no way that's right' and I checked again after a further 39 miles--and it took 8.6 tenths of a gallon--45 mpg. I called her again--she also has a brand new Yaris--and told her, and she said 'something doesn't add up' so I waited until there was only one bar left on the guage and put around ten gallons or whatever in the tank--did the math and that time it said 38.6 mpg. Boy was I disappointed! The next time I filled her up, I waited until down to two bars, and did the math, and that time it said 42.7 mpg. I can be happy with that. I think I will inflate the tires now to 37 psi, after reading this forum, and see if it improves. I do a lot of idling, so if I cut that off, I'm sure it will do better. What's the BEST mpg anyone has enjoyed with their four-door, 5-speed manual tranny yaris?
This is combined driving with 40 psi in tires. Note I drive very conservatively and shift early "low rpm's" and coast to red lights, often seeing them change to green without having to stop. I am thinking of installing a K&N airfilter to get another mpg but have heard of some problems with the toyota's, any experience out there?
Remember that Toyota's engineers know what they are doing and to achieve long engine life leave your car alone. Ignore the boastful claims from people who have them installed and "claim a performance increase" as the "seat of the pants" experience is largely affected by the ego of the owner, how much he/she invested in a certain "improvement". If you want a true measurable result just look at the dyno test info which reveals little if any difference. Certainly not enough to put up with the hassle of repeatedly having to clean the filer assembly. Take it from someone who knows....
Inflate tires to slightly below maximum number on the side wall. Get the tires good and warmed up.
>With the load normally carried.
>Find a good stretch of straight smooth road.
>When there is no traffic and the car still on the road, put a chalk mark across the tread of a front and rear tire. Put the mark in a couple of places, so you can find at least one, later.
>With as little turning of the steering wheel possible, drive 1/2 mile. Coast to a stop and examine the chalk marks. It will probably be worn off in the middle. Tire is over inflated.
> Let a little air out , re chalk and do it again.
> Continue doing this until the chalk wears off evenly, across the tread.
> At that point, the tire pressure is correct and all the tread is on the road evenly.
> Go home and let the car sit in the shade a few hours. When you would normally check your pressure, do so. That is the "Cold" pressure you want to keep the tires at.
> You may notice that one end of the car requires more than the other.
> If the chalk refuses to wear evenly "ACROSS" the tread, you may have an alignment problem.
You will now have an accurate point of reference for your tires on your car with your gauge.
Kip
I'm getting 35 in the city. Love this little car. More headroom than my accord!
The one thing I don't like is the way the transmission upshifts automatically when coasting down a hill at higher speeds. Other than that I am very happy. I spent 8 hours in the car last week on a long road trip and it was pretty comfortable. Really quiet too for a smaller car.
I paid 14,500 for a 07 Sedan automatic with the upgraded interior. (HD heater, power, cruise, carpet, mats, 15" tires yada yada)
Total cost of ownership is very very good if it holds up.
Later!
04/18/2008 264.0 miles, 4.988 gals, no highway driving. 52.92 mpg
04/09/2008 235.7 miles, 4.661 gals, no highway driving. 50.56 mpg
April has been good to me, my best month ever. avg. 51.8 mpg
yes, I am a hypermiler!
But I'm an easy driver, and with my Yaris I easily hit 38 mpg ALL THE TIME on my 40 mile freeway commute during the commute hour (in other words, some slow and go sections).
On the other hand maybe our numbers are very close, since I live in Cali and we use 10% ethanol in our gas, which is supposed to knock mileage down by 10% - almost exactly the spread between our two numbers.
I have a 40 mile commute, 50% highway, 50% stop and go.
I am sure that in summer the numbers will improve quite a bit.
I get your drift though....I have a 4cyl Honda sedan getting 30 at 80mph.
My Echo, with the predecessor engine to the Yaris, and an automatic, only got 30 mpg.
34 mpg is pretty darn good. Most of my manual transmission cars hit 30 mpg, not 34, and when one of my cars does better than 30 I'm really happy.
In other words, I take your post as an accolade not a disparagement.
I disagree with the above. I do not have a Yaris, but I am easily able to get into the 35-38 MPG range with an '07 Accord 4-cyl automatic on my commute. My commute is 15 miles one way consisting of 1/3 city, 2/3 highway. I pretty much drive at the speed limit on all roads. Occasionally someone will get anxious because I accelerate slower than most.
It comes down to getting feedback while driving, a Scangauge II in my case, in order to adjust your driving habits. I am what most consider a hypermiler. I do not shut the engine off while driving though. Most of the techniques are very easy to learn and use and take a couple of weeks to master. I am confident I could push a manual Yaris into the 50mpg range doing what I do now in my Accord.
Easy to say, very hard to do.
At least from my perspective there are many times when I feel that I'm crawling along. Even worse is during take off from a dead stop. This is where most drivers really use up quite a bit of fuel, get agitated.. :mad: ... if I'm not sprinting off with them, and freely use their horns instead of passing me, despite the fact that I'm in the slow lane, and there is a fast lane open for them to use.
Using this instrument and running on the freeway, I get 33 mpg at 60 mph in my wifes 2006 Avalon. While driving the same freeway route, and monitoring the readout in my 2008 Yaris Hatchback Automatic, I get 44 mpg at 60 mph. Not bad for those two vehicles.....
Some people have the "Ability" to achieve really good mileage, and others do not!
Those that do not, seem to enjoy faulting those that do. Goes back to the old saying, "Misery Loves Company".
Main drag going through our small town is 4-6 lanes. There is a traffic light about every 1/4 mile. A couple of weeks ago, I had the displeasure of watching a "teeny bopper" running the crap out of his Corolla or Civic. . The light would change and away he would go. He was locking down his brakes before the rest of the traffic was half way to the light he was stopping at. By the time we got there, the light had turned green and we didn't need to stop.
I expect he complains about his mileage also. But he was "COOL" !
Hat was on backwards, stereo was loud, and he probably thought he was actually impressing someone. :P
Kip
There are hyper milers and the kid with the Corolla. What about the normal guy? The guy who needs to get to work on time, and does not want to spend an hour saving a gallon of gas?
This guy needs to stop listening to those who claim that they will get better than sticker mpg.
Great point! That is the "ability" thing, we don't all have.
Many don't even have the ability to drive an "economy car". They feel they must have the fastest or the biggest thing on the road. Those that do get the slower more economical car simply don't have the ability or the will to take advantage of that car's potential.
We all have the opportunity to save gas. We don't all have the ability to learn how to not tail gate, not wait until the last minute to use the brakes. We can't master how to time traffic lights, and go easy on the throttle from stops. All these things burn extra fuel, are harder on brakes and tires, and won't add or subtract much time for the commute.
For me personally it doesn't make good sense to drive a tiny low powered car and achieve the same mileage as a larger faster one. Therefore I try to get the best mileage possible from whatever I'm driving. Keeping traffic conditions in mind.
Consider the guy with the Corolla. He left those traffic lights the same time as the rest of us and he had to stop at every one. The rest of the cars moved through them without stopping and burning the extra fuel. Corolla boy was doing 3 no-no as far as fuel economy is concerned.
1. Accelerated hard from the light.
2. Had to get moving from a stopped condition, which is hard on fuel.
3. Accelerated way longer than necessary , then having to brake hard.
Occasionally there is a car that simply will not get the mileage it should. Occasionally there are cars that get better than "average". But for all cars, the driver has the opportunity to extract that car's potential. .
The person that pays attention to those things will get the mileage, save the money, and get there just as soon in the normal commute.
On a 30 mile commute of Pure Highway, the person driving 75MPH will get there in 24 minutes. The one driving 65 will take 3.7 minutes longer.
The guy getting 35 mpg is getting 20% better mileage than the one getting 29 mpg.. In effect, in todays world he is paying say $3. 79 for the gas to go that 35 miles. The 29 mpg driver will pay $3.79 + 20% or $4.54. Which is better?
Many will make an extra fuel stop or drive an extra distance to save 3 cents per gallon. I will definitely apply some fuel saving techniques to save $.75 per gallon.
In a traffic commute, it didn't take any more time. On a highway commute I spent 3.7 minutes extra.
I get 20% better mileage than my wife driving the same car in same conditions. She feels the need to challenge every traffic light, curve and stop sign. I don't.
The car I normally drive is a Pilot. She normally drives a CR-V. At 30K the tires on the Pilot are at about 40% remaining. We just spent $500+ replacing the tires on her CR-V. At 32K miles. The old ones were shot. Not only is she spending $4.54 for fuel we can add the price of a new set of tires and upcoming brake replacement.
Different strokes. !
Kip
There are hyper milers and the kid with the Corolla. What about the normal guy? The guy who needs to get to work on time, and does not want to spend an hour saving a gallon of gas?
This guy needs to stop listening to those who claim that they will get better than sticker mpg."
I would argue the average guy is exactly who should be listening. There are far more of them than the other two groups you mention. Small incremental changes in driving habits add up and can make a difference in overall fuel mileage in your current vehicle, no matter what it is.
On a side note, my 15 mile commute takes an additional 3 minutes driving 60mph on the highway section vs. the 80-85mph that I used to do.
A nice Yaris 5 speed is starting to sound nice.
On a side note, my 15 mile commute takes an additional 3 minutes driving 60mph on the highway section vs. the 80-85mph that I used to do.
A nice Yaris 5 speed is starting to sound nice.
Very nice post.... Right On!
Let me share from experience that I too, had a talk with myself and began driving 60 to 65mph in my new Yaris 2dr hatch and I'm not only enjoying the increased savings in fuel, but find I arrive at my destination feeling more calm. In addition, one other "rule" I decided to obey was to decide to do less lane changing. Thereby reducing the possibility of an accident. This too has brought a completely different experience once I allowed a couple of weeks to adapt to it.
Now, I'm here to say that your "a nice Yaris 5 speed" comment is right on target.
I am enjoying mine more everyday, as I pass the very gas station that I used to stop at weekly. Even more humorous, and satisfying was the comment by the owner the last time I filled the Yaris.....My I haven't seen you in awhile? To which I bit my lip until I drove out onto the street and began to laugh in satisfaction and sheer contentment. This is the best investment I've made in a long time.....
Actually it's easy to exceed the fuel economy numbers printed on the new car price sticker. It's all in how you drive and where.
It's important to remember that the EPA fuel economy numbers are the result of testing in a lab. Not driving the car in real world conditions. Thus vehicle aerodynamics are left out of the equation. When actually _driving the car_ the shape and coefficient of drag play a major role.
Then we have the styling and overall "looks" of a car are which are quite deceiving. A perfect example of this is my 2008 Yaris 2 door hatchback.
Most people will agree that the big bulbous front end, results in a lot of drag. You'd be wrong, by a wide margin.
Most people looking at a low, sleek tapered nose, like on the front of my very aerodynamic Mercedes AMG SL 65 Roadster would result in a lot less drag than the Yaris. They'd be wrong.
Here are the true numbers (lower is better)
.28 CD for 2008 Yaris 2dr Hatchback (all for the low low price of $14,800)
.30 CD for 2008 MBZ SL 65 AMG (all for the not so low price of $192,000)
Now, obviously I did not buy the Mercedes for it's fuel economy, I'm simply using it as an example of how well Toyota has a handle on the aerodynamics of it's cars. Thus providing every opportunity for the owners to obtain some very good results in the mileage department.....
I'm sorry but you tell me what you are saving after you spend the three hundred bucks for the miserscan and the K&I filter not to mention the time wasted on all of this plus driving slow!
Timing red lights, coasting to a stop, installing springs in the back of your garage so you can capture the wasted energy of parking your car at night.
(good grief)
The ratings are not calculated at high speeds, and drag is exponential.
My Honda Accord Sedan 4cyl gets the same mileage at 80mpg as my Yaris Sedan - and it weighs a third more. Yaris is blunt in front and steep in rear.
Toyota blew it in this area. Regardless, I'm sure they were not concerned with the 80mph driver in this class of car. Your Mercedes is engineered to outperform the Yaris if you apply the handicap considering the difference in class.
Yes, I know I could just slow down.
I agree with you 100%.
However, there are people that simply do not have the ability to do that.
Sad but true!
Kip
The intrinsic cost are often overlooked by people who are focused only on the gas gauge.
Negative externalities are also ignored. There are other people on the road.
Again....sure you can do it. But does it really make sense?
Timing red lights, coasting to a stop, installing springs in the back of your garage so you can capture the wasted energy of parking your car at night.
Very funny.... but you must be drifting off into another land. At no time did I say that I made any modifications to the car other than to install the electronic readout, which is no different that those cars that come from the factory with trip computers.
I happen to be having fun with all this, sorry to have lightened up your serious negative side. I will leave you alone to stew.....
Simple really.
1) Leave for work, allowing yourself time to get there without having to ride peoples bumpers. Or weave wildly in and out of lanes.
2) Calculate the time spent driving at a reasonable speed (like the speed limit) and you will find that it's not an hour.....it's usually just a few extra minutes.
3) Learn to relax...and breathe.... you will live longer.
After all, your only driving to work.....
Of course there are other people on the road. If not, there would be no traffic and no need for traffic lights. As I wrote in post 346, which you choose to ignore:
"Therefore I try to get the best mileage possible from whatever I'm driving. Keeping traffic conditions in mind."
However I'm not going to let other drivers dictate my particular driving style. I'm not going to exceed the speed limit on local streets more than 5 mph. I'm not exceeding 65 on the free ways. On 2 lane highways, I will drive 5 mph over the posted speed limit. If I notice traffic stacking up behind me, I will pull over or speed up slightly. I don't really care that the guy behind me is not happy going 5 mph over the speed limit. I'm not going to tail gate the car ahead of me because the guy behind me wants to rush me along. I'm not going to run right up to a stop sign or red light before slamming on brakes, because that is what the guy behind me wants to do.
On a 30 mile commute, all road, I will get there within 3-5 minutes of when you do. In traffic, we will get there about the same time. I will burn less fuel and be more refreshed than if I was rushing the entire time.
What you consider a normal driver and what I consider a normal driver are different. I'm not a hypermiler by a long shot. But, every time I beat that EPA sticker by a good margin, I win. :shades: If you are happy getting poor mileage, great!
Kip
blah, blah, blah.......I choose to live normally. Stay over to the right if you don't like me in your mirrors.
Like most small-engined cars, I expect the best way to get high mpg out of the Yaris is to drive it moderately, keeping the revs and speeds down as much as possible. And as with any car, the more your foot is not on the gas pedal (i.e. coasting or using a very light touch), the less gas you'll use. No rocket science involved there.