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Comments
It's going to take the refusal on the part of the US electorate to elect politicians who will risk the economic security of this country by continuing to hold up safe US oil extraction and refining from known reserves and/or shale, thus making us continually dependent on our enemies in the Middle East, and the election of politicians who are not in the pockets of the farm subsidy/ethanol wacko crowd.
Yesterday the average was $3.834.
I think you are terribly misinformed. When Cellulosic Ethanol becomes reality it will require ALL new production facilities. You know what happens to all those little towns that have become dependent on the local still to employ them? That's right they become statistics. Casualties of the corn ethanol boondoggle. There are 90 towns in the Midwest that had a corn still in the late 70s or early 80s that are no longer there.
The fat cats at ADM are not spending a penny of their money. It is all OUR TAX DOLLARS building this corn ethanol infrastructure. For Nothing....The sad part is most every one including Congress know they have been hood winked by a slick sales pitch.
Ethanol equals less MPG and less MPG equals more tax revenue.
If we as a nation insist on using food crops or any crop for fuel, at least turn it to bio diesel so we can get more MPG per acre and save the corn mash for drinking.
If we drink enough we won’t drive, we will not consume fuel, problem solved.
And while I might make light of this issue, I take it very seriously.
As others have stated, almost no new technology is being used to make ethanol today, from corn. My friend, a chemical engineer who helped design ethanol plants back in the '80s, said they're just taking those same designs and building them today.
Corn prices stall VeraSun ethanol plant
VeraSun Energy Corp., the second-largest U.S. ethanol producer by capacity, has delayed the opening of a 110-million-gallon-a-year distillery in Hankinson, N.D., because of rising corn prices.
Last update: June 25, 2008 - 11:29 PM
VeraSun Energy Corp., the second-largest U.S. ethanol producer by capacity, has delayed the opening of a 110-million-gallon-a-year distillery in Hankinson, N.D., because of rising corn prices. The plant is the third that the Brookings, S.D.-based company has delayed. "They're looking at very expensive corn right now. Ethanol prices have increased, but they need to increase more as corn and natural gas" have each climbed, said Joseph Gomes Jr., an analyst at Oppenheimer & Co. Inc. in New York. VeraSun stock rose 13 cents, or 3.3 percent, to $4.11 in New York Stock Exchange trading. The shares have fallen 69 percent in the past year.
BLOOMBERG NEWS
They seem to be doing a bit better from an energy standpoint. The Blueflint plant here uses waste heat from the coal power plant instead of natural gas.
S.C. passes ethanol law challenged by oil companies
http://www.usatoday.com/money/industries/energy/2008-06-26-ethanol-blend-tax-cre- dit_N.htm
Everybody wants the money, go figure.
Floods may push corn inventories to historical low
USDA to report acreage; analysts warn of $10 corn and possible supply crisis
By Moming Zhou, MarketWatch
Last update: 12:15 p.m. EDT June 27, 2008
SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch) -- Recent Midwest flooding may have damaged millions of acres of corn crops, analysts expect the U.S. Department of Agriculture to say in its crop acreage report slated for release Monday.
The loss of acreage could slash U.S. corn production and push the 2009 season's year-end stocks to the lowest level since just after World War II, analysts said. And the real damage is likely to be even worse than what Monday's 8:30 a.m. EDT report will show, as it's still too early to evaluate the full impact of the flooding.
"The report is already obsolete," said Elaine Kub, a grains analyst at commodities-information provider DTN. Many acres could be abandoned at a later date and the acreage situation will be worse than the report sounds, she said.
The acreage report is likely to show that the U.S. will harvest 77 million acres of corn in the 2009 season, down 1.8 million from the USDA's March report, according to an estimate from Shawn Hackett, president of agriculture futures brokerage Hackett Financial Advisors.
Corn yields are also expected to be hurt by the Midwest flooding, which by some estimates was the worst since 1993.
Shrinking acreage and falling yields could push 2009 year-end corn inventories to as low as 300 million bushels, down 80% from the previous year, Hackett projected. This will be the lowest inventory level the U.S. has seen since 1947.
The USDA, without fully considering the impact of flooding, projected in early June that corn year-end stocks would stand at 673 million bushels in 2009, down 53% from a year ago and the lowest in 13 years.
The acreage report on Monday is based on surveys the USDA did in the first two weeks of this month, before the majority of the flooding occurred, according to Dawn Keen, an economist at the USDA. Given that, it may not fully reflect the flooding damage.
Monday's report will also include acreage information for other crops such as soybeans and wheat. Soybean acreage is expected to fall, also hurt by the flooding. Soybeans futures climbed to an all-time high of $15.998 a bushel on Friday on the Chicago Board of Trade. Wheat is also on the rise. In an effort to more accurately assess the damage, the USDA said more surveys will be conducted in July and the latest information will be included in its Aug. 12 crop production report.
Cool weather seen crimping corn crops
Massive flooding, despite its scale, isn't the only reason for reduced production. Cooler-than-normal weather is also hurting harvests.
Temperatures in the Corn Belt, where Iowa, Illinois and other top corn producers are located, have averaged two to four degrees below normal in the past week, according to AccuWeather.com.
Cooler weather will push back corn's maturation date and potentially translate into a delayed harvest, according to Dale Mohler, senior meteorologist at AccuWeather. "This crop can't take additional setbacks, but instead needs ideal weather," he said.
Lower temperature and heavy flooding are likely to drive corn prices higher to $10-a-bushel level, Hackett said. Corn futures recorded a new all-time high of $7.673 a bushel Friday on the CBOT, up nearly 70% this year.
"If bad weather is seen in the July-August timeframe, then we would be talking about a corn supply crisis that would probably require some type of government intervention," said Hackett.
Government intervention?
Indeed, falling corn production and surging prices may force the federal government to revise its ethanol policies, which mandate the use of the biofuel and impose tariff on ethanol imports.
The Environmental Protection Agency is considering a petition for a 50% roll-back of the Renewable Fuels Standard, which mandates fuel makers to use nine billion gallons of biofuels this year, mostly corn-based ethanol. .
The nine-million-gallon ethanol mandate is expected to cost the U.S. three billion bushels of corn, or nearly a quarter of this year's corn production.
The possible "corn crisis" could add more pressure to the EPA to "lower the mandate for corn ethanol," Hackett said.
To alleviate the crisis, the government could also lower the 54-cent-a-gallon tariff imposed on ethanol imports, Hackett said. Ethanol prices in Brazil are much lower than in the U.S. and a partial cut in the tariff will encourage imports to replace domestic production.
But some analysts think the tariff will be left intact. "Despite some sound economic rationale for repealing the tariff, political consideration in favor of upholding the tariff continue to outweigh calls to eliminate it," said Divya Reddy, an energy analyst at Eurasia Group.
It is funny that they would roll back the mandate. Is it because we ain't got no ethanol to lace our gas with. I hope they take it out of our gas for a while. I would like to get a little better mileage.
"I don't even think there's a difference in mileage." http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080628/AUTO03/806280303/1149-
Comments like that just make me wonder. Of course there is a difference in mileage. But I suppose we should let people have their delusions, don't want to upset the apple cart by actually measuring the mpg.
"...and the car's components seemed to handle the fuel fine, said Bruce Jones, a researcher at Minnesota State University, Mankato, who has helped lead the studies."
I wonder if Bruce will back that claim up in a few years when some cars start having issues. Probably not.
Ethanol plant to be built in U.P.
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080628/AUTO01/806280320/1148- /AUTO01
They plan to use wood chips.
"This is a game-changer for Michigan," said Granholm :confuse:
Fifty jobs is not a game changer. 17,000 workers just left GM. They would need to build 340 woody chip to E plants to make up for all the workers that left from GM this go around.
How many gallons to the acre of forest they cut down. How many years to replace those trees? I thought they were going to use some fast growing weed like switchgrass. in this cellulosic ethanol. I get it. They cut down ALL the forests and plant corn.
PS
I want to find the pump that sells E-Zero regular unleaded. Making ADM and Verasun rich is not something I am interested in. It does cut your mileage. I wonder if the pumps have the warning from the EPA & MFG?
"Crop's high price kills profit for ethanol plants"
"The $7-a-bushel corn and construction costs that have nearly doubled in the past year brought the fledgling firm to its knees last week."
http://www.daily-journal.com/archives/dj/display.php?id=423244
What goes up too fast - explodes. :surprise:
Now my car normally gets 32-33 mpg driving around locally and 33-35 mpg out on the highway. On the E10 tank I got just under 31 mpg. Now I had just put on new tires a few days before, so I figure maybe that has something to do with it as well, so I'll wait until I run the next tank through...
In the meantime, my daughter turns 16 and gets her learners permit and she's learning to handle the clutch and 6 speed, so ALL the miles on this next tank of gas are going to be local and at least half are with a new driver behind the wheel not driving as efficiently as she eventually will be.
Filled up this morning and the calculation came out to 32.9 mpg. So E10 gave me in the neighborhood of 8-10% less mileage. And I paid $3.95 for it vs $3.99 for regular unleaded.
Color me not impressed
Now add to that the hit on your food bill. :mad:
Demand for 'environmentally friendly' plant-based fuels has led to a slump in global food production and sent grocery bills soaring, according to the damning report from the World Bank.
Since April, all diesel and petrol sold in the UK has contained 2.5 per cent biofuel. By 2010 the figure will increase to five per cent.
The EU had planned a ten per cent biofuel target for 2020.
However, following growing concerns that plant-derived fuels could be doing more harm than good, MEPs will vote whether to scrap the plan on Monday.
The World Bank report, leaked to the Guardian, is based on the most detailed assessment of the food crisis so far.
Kenneth Richter, of Friends of the Earth, said: 'This report shows that when MEPs vote on biofuels targets next week they will have the fate of millions in their hands.
'Finding enough land to grow ten per cent of Europe's transport fuel will lead to more hunger and suffering as well as doing next to nothing to reduce carbon dioxide emissions.
'Politicians must act responsibly and change course on this disastrous transport policy.
The same goes for our bought off Congress. They need to put the people ahead of their own greed.
Critics say biofuels take up land that would otherwise be used for food, reducing supplies and driving up prices.
The grain needed to fill the tank of a 4x4 car could feed one person for a year.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7493789.stm
http://www.epa.gov/OMS/renewablefuels/rfs-texas-letter.pdf
Gary,
Small towns in the USA dying off because an industry in the area ended has been a characteristic of American society since the 1800s.
We have survived so far. And the people in those little towns will move on to bigger and better things or stay there and work in another job. If the town "goes away" the people don't just sit in their little house and starve to death.
They don't all just wither and die because a company moves on.
America is stronger than you seem to give it credit for.
I understand that. I just don't like the government causing the problems. If you have not guessed I am against our government sticking there nose into private business. The ethanol boondoggle of the late 1970s is identical to this ethanol mess. It has not saved us any imported oil. It has only managed to be part of the huge run up in the price of oil and FOOD cost. It is easy for you to not worry. So far your gas has not been laced with 10% ethanol causing a reduction in your fuel economy as it has here in the land of flakes.
EU-"no" to biofuels
Survey Says...
I usually never come to work with more than half a tank of gas in my Ranger and never keep track of my MPG as I use it so little, maybe 5,000 to 7,000 miles a year.
While it sits in the parking lot at work while I’m gone 15 days I must lose a lot of alcohol to evaporation.
What a bargin :sick:
If you have ten gallons of fuel in a 13 gallon tank, it feels like a very small faction could evaporate into that empty space. Now put that 10 gallons of fuel in a sealed oil tanker and I can see it all eventually becoming airborne.
An interesting question to ponder though.
For most people, that is less than one mile per gallon...
Of course, the argument could be made that the mixture of ethanol/gasoline creates a fuel that is less than the sum of its parts.. Whether that is valid or not, I have no idea, but it doesn't seem likely.
And.. one more point.. Where I live, tanks are labeled, "May contain up to 10% ethanol". So, it may have 10%, or less... or, even none at all.. You'll never know.
I'm not a fan of ethanol.. it seems to be one big political boondoggle... but, 10% less MPG? Seems like there might be more variables at work.
regards,
kyfdx
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1.The ethanol issue
2.We are planning to purchase "maybe" a Taurus and I thank you for the MPG figures.
You should be THRILLED that AMERICAN innovation is trying to figure out how to power our cars. Flex fuels will create millions of jobs in America and keep BILLIONS of dollars in AMERICA.
Thank you
Sadly most of what you are saying is true. Except Ethanol has not SAVED US one penny in foreign oil. There are reasons to believe it has actually taken more oil to produce than the energy ethanol has provided. It was poorly mandated as a payoff to the agriculture lobby. It is corporate welfare and not to save oil. When we develop REAL alternatives I will be an early adopter. If you are truly interested in alternatives check out what T. Boone Pickins has to say.
Americans are 4% of the world population. The US has only 3% of the world oil reserves. The US uses 25% of annual oil production. That means we're sending American dollars out of the US to satisfy our oil adiction- $700 Billion per year.
Here is a link to July 22, 2008 Senate Testimony by Dr. Gal Luft, Executive Director of The INSTITUTE FOR THE ANALYSIS OF GLOBAL SECURITY (IAGS) on “Breaking Oil’s Monopoly in the Transportation Sector” : http://www.iags.org/LUFT_Senate_HSGA_072208.pdf
The Saudi's HATE ethanol.
Each gallon of ethanol is a reduction of American dollars transfering to t he Middle East
Currently the yearly $3 Billion dollar ethanol subsiday reduces by $16 billion American dollars sent to the middle east. It also reduces $6 Billion NOT paid out in farm subsidies paid NOT to farm!
Check it out: www.setamericafree.com or www.pickensplan.com .
Our technology will get better. It must. Pressure your Congressmen and Senators to make it SOONER!
PS
I think the Saudis love ethanol. They sell a barrel of oil to produce a barrel of ethanol from Corn. Except where they are using coal to produce ethanol. That's a real clean way to do it.
Something To It?
Ethanol is going to have to save me money or get me to use less gasoline (reduce my oil jones) for it to make sense. Right now it fails on both accounts. The price difference at the pump for the "blend" in my area ranges from NO difference to 2 or three cents lower. Less than 1%, and since I'm right around a 10% hit in mileage, I'm buying gas more often than I used to. So much for using less gas.
They can "mandate" that our cars need to run on ham sandwhiches by 2010. That doesn't mean it will make any sense once we start to see real world results.
I wish I could find such a gas station here in San Diego. I would not be so negative on Ethanol if it was an option and not a Government mandate. A mandate based on paying off corporations like ADM and Verasun. It is just a big smokescreen to make the masses feel like we have an alternative energy source. If it was a true alternative that did not need to be subsidized to exist I could get behind it. Give me some biodiesel made with algae and I will start to believe in alternative fuels.