Subaru Forester Transmission Questions

kdshapiro · March 2007

I'm wondering if it's the piston slap problem. My car exhibits this when the temperature goes below 40 degrees. It's a tap, tap, tapping. Above 2K the car noise drowns it out. Below 1500 you can't hear it. In warmer weather it disappears.

paisan · March 2007

I'm saying CV due to the "clicking" he mentions. A bearing is more a whirrling than a clicking.

-mike

morseth · March 2007

Ken:

At first, I also thought maybe it was piston slap. But it doesn't make sense to me that the vehicle needs to be in motion to hear it. I would think if it was piston slap, that I would hear it while standing still and reving the engine while cold. It only happens between a very specific speed range and RPM. The engine idles smooth and quiet, even after a cold start first thing in the morning (I'm in PA, and it's still cold here right now).

I could be wrong, but my gut feeling is that it's not the piston slap problem.

-Bryan

morseth · March 2007

Michael:

If it were a CV joint problem or bearing problem, does it make sense that shifting into Neutral makes the noise go away? Is this because I am just coasting and no longer delivering torque to the wheels?

Is it common to have a faulty CV joint or bad wheel bearing right off the showroom floor? The car has less than 200 miles on it!

Bryan

xwesx · March 2007

No, your conclusion is correct on this one - if it does not happen while the vehicle is not in motion, then it is further down the system - it is not the engine.

I agree that a wheel bearing tends to be a "whirring" noise to start. Seems strange to me though that you would hear a CV while driving straight ahead. The sound happening while turning one direction only, though, that is a classic symptom... until it gets very bad, anyway!

Very rare to have a problem like that "fresh off the showroom floor," but there are ALWAYS some defective parts to leave every assembly line. Always.

kdshapiro · March 2007

Bryan - I don't hear the piston slap until the engine hits a little before 2K. Meaning the noise is not there at idle or start up. Search the Subaru boards for piston slap for more information. Piston slap is *not* heard at idle.

Piston slap is a distinct tick-tick-ticking, which sounds like it comes from the passenger rear part of the engine compartment underneath.

Ken

paisan · March 2007

Could it be something like un-removed packing material from around the struts? I know when the STi first started shipping 99% of the dealers didn't un-pack some of the packing material and it caused issues.

-mike

morseth · March 2007

Ken:

Thanks very much for the info. It could very well be piston slap that I am hearing. The car is still very new to me, so I'll need a few more hours behind the wheel to help me understand what I am hearing.

I've gotten some great information from all of you here. I'm going to look at and try some things over the next couple of weeks. I'll report back and let all of you know what I find out.

Thanks again for everyone that contributed ideas. It's very much appreciated!

-Bryan

kdshapiro · March 2007

Good luck and keep us posted.

ksych · March 2007

Hi Bryan, I am so glad I cam across your article. I am having the exact same problem you are having and just about to take my car in for first oil change. I too have a 2007 Subaru XT. I much appreciate any information you can provide regarding your experience with the dealer (that is of course assuming you have taken your car in). Did they ever find the cause of the annoying noise?

morseth · March 2007

Hi Ksych:

I still need to make the service appointment, hopefully next week. My work schedule is killing me right now, and I just don't have time to take it in for service this week.

I've just about 100% ruled out piston slap. I'm getting really good at hearing the noise now, and can make it come and go at will. It's definitely tied to the various lateral G force and weight distribution on the car. When going over a bump, making the car light on the suspension, the noise gets louder just like when I make a sudden left hand swerve. If I hit a dip in the road, making the car crouch down heavier on the suspension, the noise goes away like when I make a right hand swerve. It's got something to do with the weight distribution and the G forces exerted on whatever is making this noise.

I'll report back here for sure with whatever results I get from the service department at the dealer. If you find an answer before I do, please post back here as well.

-Bryan

joseph50 · April 2007

I was stranded for a time in a parking lot today.
(2001 Forester S, autotranny.)
Just loud clicks around the base of the steering wheel column when I pushed the thumb depress button on the shifter nob.
Finally, after many tries, the shifter shifted.

I called a few area dealer service desks.
I was told that it could be a one-time solenoid issue; a dying solenoid in which I would never be able to shift out of park; a possible brake light issue that would cause such a meltdown in shiftability...

Anyway, before I have it checked out tomorrow (assuming I can get the car rolling) I thought I would check it out for your opinions here.

Thank you.

subearu · April 2007

Check your owners manual, there is a manual way of unlocking the shift-brake interlock if/when it gives up so you aren't stranded. Should be a plastic flap somewhere on the faceplate of the shifter area, iirc.

-Brian

joseph50 · May 2007

(Much belated) Thanks for that particular bit of heads up, Brian.

siennashoppr · June 2007

I have a 2002 Forester L with 59K miles. Like many other I have the ubiquitous "lifter noise" during winter that the dealer says is normal. Last time that I brought it to Subaru there was also vibration noise (almost like when you play with a taut rubber band on a shoebox) during acceleration. I asked them to do AT service and afterwards they said its all fine (they also forgot to put the transmission dipstick back in). The sound is now louder. Anyone have ideas as to cause before I go back to the dealer for a couple of hundred dollar check up?

maggiex5 · June 2007

Hi again...I just posted the message about the used transmission for my car. The used one I've found is from a 2000 Forester (not a 2002), so would this fit a 1999 model?
Thanks,
Maggie

ateixeira · June 2007

I don't see why not.

1998 was the DOHC engine. 1999 and 2000 were both SOHC, so same drivetrain.

In fact I think the auto trans was the same for all those years. I'm not certain, though.

paisan · July 2007

There were some differences. I would suggest looking for one of the same year as the TCU connections changed from year to year and it won't be a direct "plug and play" swap.

-mike

samwilkie · July 2007

I have a forester that I have just changed the oil and filter on. I started the car up to let the oil circulate and then put it in reverse and the car did not go into gear, same with puttig it in drive. I know I changed the oil filter and am pretty sure I changed the oil, rather than the transmission fluid...although I could be wrong. The sump took 4 Litres of oil so I assume I emptied the sump, not the transmission fluid.

Can you tell me if there's something preventing the car going into gear. Note the car was going into gear before I changed the oil.

thoughts?

ateixeira · August 2007

I wonder if you hit something on the park-brake interlock? You have to step on the brakes to get it out of Park, perhaps something in that mechanism broke?

jjelenic · November 2007

LAST ONE YEAR "CHECK ENGINE" IS ON AND CODE P0741 (torque converter clutch cirquit performance or stuck off) received from E1 is coming on the computer. Few times authorised service have tryied to resolve but again and again same problem. Performences seems to be same as before.
Complete AT electronics changed.

paisan · November 2007

was the TCU changed and/or the solenoid? Could also be a fault in the wiring itself.

-mike

jjelenic · November 2007

the complete electronics incl. solenoid valves changed. no idea what is going on. transmission oil also changed twice. wiring checked few times.??? Do you have any idea what could be the reason?

arielphf · November 2007

I am inhereting a 2000 Forester AT that has an issue with the transmission. It shifts perfectly into park, reverse and neutral, but when you go to shift it into drive, it just sits there. If you rev the engine, it seems to 'prime the pump' and, will then sort of drift into drive (or jump in, if you are still reving it). What the previous owner tells me is that, when he wanted to go into drive, he'd first put it into neutral, rev the engine 2 or 3 times, then put it into drive as the engine was slowing down. He said he had it down to a science, and was so used to this proceedure that he almost didn't notice it, and said that it had done this ever since he got the car and hasn't gotten any worse in that time.

Once you have it in gear, it works fine. But whenever you want to shift it from any gear into drive, you have to go through this proceedure.

What I want to know is what might be causing this? I didn't spend anything on the car, so I could probably afford to fix it if it isn't a transmission replacement or anything, but I'd love to have some idea what I might be dealing with. Thanks.

Ariel

gutap1 · November 2007

I have the exact same problem you descibed with my 99 Forester. Any insight on this problem would be appreciated.

arielphf · November 2007

Unfortunately, what I am discovering is that it is probably a problem that will require rebuilding the transmission. My father (who has rebuilt cars for 40 years) told me that what I described sounded like someone had once let the car's transmission fluid get low and that it strained the fluid's pump. Now, when the pump tries to put enough fluid into the linkage that it needs to to shift, it is weak and it takes longer to get enough in place.

My mechanic says that it would be cheaper for him to simply find a used transmission and put that into my car than to rebuild mine. So that's what I have him looking for. I sure hope he doesn't find one until after Christmas. LOL!

Ariel

gutap1 · November 2007

I'm not sure I agree with that. It would seem to me that if the pump were weak it would have the same problem going into any gear. I've also heard of the same problem on a couple of other boards with the 99-2000 Foresters but unfortunately no explainations there either.

Tim

arielphf · November 2007

Oh, you're quite possibly right. My father is 5 hours away and has never seen the car in person, so don't hold him to any diagnoses he makes! LOL!

So you say this has happened with other foresters of the same vintage? That IS interesting! I've been driving the car for a while and find that it drops into drive with almost no hesitation when it's cold but if I've been driving for a while and try and get it to go, it takes a long time or a bit of gas to convince it to drift into drive. I've never not been able to make it go, but I don't think I'd consider this vehicle if I was looking for a getaway car. LOL!

With the money I saved by getting this car, a new (to me) transmission isn't out of the question, but if this problem is common in this make and model, I might find the same issue in another one. Very interesting to know. Thank you!

Ariel

morseth · December 2007

It's been multiple trips to the shop over the past 6 months (even a personal mechanic), and still no luck identifying the source of the noise. Nothing has exploded or fallen off the car yet, so I guess it could be worse.

The colder weather makes the noise more annoying that in the summer when it's warmer. Whatever it is must contract in the cold weather and rattle/vibrate more. The wheels have been rotated, but the noise hasn't changed location or amplitude, so I think I can rule out any sort of tire noise.

Has anyone else (especially Ksych that also had this issue) had a similar noise that they pinpointed and resolved yet? Still looking for answers

aatherton · December 2007

I think it is a CV joint because:
1. It clicks.
2. It increases with speed.
3, It worsens under load.
4. It goes away when shifted to neutral to remove the load.
5. It changes when steered from side to side.

suesubaru · December 2007

My '06 Forester with manual transmission often stalls as I go from stand-still to 1st or Reverse. I'm an experienced driver of 5-speeds, and have heard from one of two friends in my area who own Foresters with manual that he experiences the same thing and just has learned to keep the RPMs up. That seems wasteful of fuel. Dealer says "That's how it is." Anyone have similar experiences? Is this actually normal, or just me going from a totally loose, Mazda-truck 5-speed to a more jittery Subaru one? About a week ago, it bucked a little bit when I had made it into first. It was cold that day--29 or so.

aatherton · December 2007

"My '06 Forester with manual transmission often stalls as I go from stand-still to 1st..."

I was looking at Foresters last month and test drove a used '06 manual with 11K miles at the dealer, It was an extended solo 4-hour test drive, after which I filled the tank for $35 out of appreciation. It drove perfectly -- I did not notice any problems at all.

suesubaru · December 2007

Thanks, but I am well experienced with manuals and I am not imagining this; mine also has super low mileage. Any other replies appreciated.

Sue

paisan · December 2007

I drive manuals a lot as well. You do need to put a little extra RPM in on the Subies, my guess would be the parasitic loss due to the AWD.

Compared to say my 1990 240sx wich is RWD, I'd say I have to put in about 300 RPM higher and let out the clutch more gently not to stall it.

-mike

suesubaru · December 2007

Thanks, Mike. My 1990 Mazda truck took less RPMs, I'm sure. I wonder if there's a slight delay in the Subaru responding to gas too....I tend to move fast....

Sue

paisan · December 2007

I'm not sure but after about a week with any of my subies I got used to the clutch engagement and it wasn't a problem. I would say that you just need to get used to it and you'll be fine. Each car is a little different than the next, especially a MT car.

-mike

p0926 · December 2007

I've got an 04 MT Forester and the clutch is a little more touchy than most and does require some finesse in order to avoid jerky starts. Actually, I stalled it out at a stoplight just the other day (wasn't paying enough attention). I've never had a problem putting it into reverse though. I test drove a 07 back in the summer and it did seem to have a much smoother clutch so I assumed that my clutch just needed adjusting (60k miles on it).

-Frank

suesubaru · December 2007

Thanks, Frank. That sounds just like mine. I drove an '07 too at the local dealership and found it smoother. I only have, believe it or not, 6K miles on mine, though. I drive only to work in a small town and shopping. This means I do a lot of stop and go, though, so maybe have more chances than most folks do to stall in a year!! Thanks, anyway; every reply helps give perspective.

p0926 · December 2007

Well you should feel better then knowing someone with over 30 years of driving nothing but manuals can still manage to stall his Forester

But I'd still get another in a heartbeat!

-Frank

erik9 · December 2007

Hi all,

I bought an 07 forester 2.5 x last march.At around 1000 miles i noticed a bad wheel noise vibration while accelerating ,going around corners ,up hills and even on the freeway driving straight ahead!I took it to the dealer asap,they said it was tire noise,false..then they changed three wheel bearings!!! that didnt work either! then they changed the transmission! gave the car back to me and said it was fixed..as soon as i got a few hundred feet down the road the damn noise was back! I went for a ride with the subaru rep,he heard nothing!ha ha haww! after talking with customer service i took the car to another dealer and they replaced trhe same bearing that the previous dealer replaced 5000 miles before,that didnt work either!!
This car and subaru have caused me nothing but misery,i hate them with every drop of blood in my veins! i am taking these turkeys to court! BTW, i said it sounded like a front axle shaft from the vert beggining but they still ignore that possibility...Good luck with yours,i will never own another subaru ever! i cant wait to go to court..

paisan · December 2007

Hmm odd, I've had good luck with Subaru repairs, but most likely it's the dealer itself causing the issue here.

-mike

devore420 · December 2007

I've got an 04 XS, manual transmission, about 50K miles. Over the past two years I've noticed a pretty loud squeaking noise when depressing the clutch pedal. It happens only in the last few inches of clutch pedal travel before it's totally depressed. It's intermittent: some days it will be very loud, other days it's silent.

My local mechanic had been unable to determine the cause but assumed it just needed lubrication in the pedal linkage, which did sometimes seem to help. But recently I took the car into the dealer for a strut replacement and asked them to look at the clutch issue too.

They said it was the throwout bearing causing the noise, and that it would still be covered under the powertrain warranty. Also said it was not a safety or mechanical issue. And, it sounds like they'll need to drop the transmission in order to make the repair.

Anyone have opinon on whether this is worth doing? On the one hand, since it's under warranty still, it seems a good idea to have it fixed now and avoid any problems later on down the road. On the other, I'm reluctant to have them take apart the transmission to fix something that - at this point - is just an annoying noise.

Thanks for any info.

xwesx · December 2007

As I understand it, your father is on the right track, but, as Tim pointed out, the problem would be equal for all gears were it a pump. Around '99, there seems to be a more prevalent amount of automatic transmission problems dealing with some seals in the transmission that go bad, creating a leaky situation that does prevent proper pressure from building up to shift the car into drive from park. Your method of dealing with it is really the only available, but the seals will continue to worsen until you get no response at all. I did not read through the entire chain of prior posts, but my guess is that if you have owned this car a while, the problem has become progressively worse. '99 Outbacks also have this issue, though older and newer models do not seem to have any problems at all. I had 220,000 miles on a '96 Outback and the auto transmission was as perfect on the last day as it was the first day I drove it.

Unless there are model-year-specific transmission maps in the control unit, you could likely swap the transmission with one from a different year and lessen your chances of a recurring problem.

erik9 · December 2007

Mike,

Both of the dealers that worked on the car failed...also the car is a rattle trap..five repairs were made on the hatchback alone,the dash board vibrates,the glove compartment latch ticks and makes funny noises..the car feels unstable at freeway speeds (two non subaru mechs drove the car and described it as (squirrelly) it doesnt feel safe to say the least..

xwesx · December 2007

The Subaru clutches are touchy. They have a very precise trigger point compared to many other manuals I have driven. While it is *possible* to go from a stand-still without any added fuel, it sure is a slow, tedious proposition. The other manual I mainly drive is a '69 Chevy C20 pickup with original clutch, and it is geared very low (4 speed - or 3-speed w/ a granny). I can start that thing out in 3rd gear without any added fuel. So, when I picked up a manual 07 Outback, there was a definite learning curve when it came to my left foot's pedal-release motion. It has to be smooth, but not too quick. At first, I would rev the car to about 1500 before letting out the clutch, but got it down better after a little while and could easily get going without adding too much to the RPMs over idle. I still stalled it once in a while though, especially after driving my truck...

aatherton · December 2007

"... They said it was the throwout bearing causing the noise, and that it would still be covered under the powertrain warranty. Also said it was not a safety or mechanical issue. And, it sounds like they'll need to drop the transmission in order to make the repair. ... I'm reluctant to have them take apart the transmission to fix something that - at this point - is just an annoying noise."

The throwout bearing is in the clutch housing outside the transmission, but the transmission must be removed to get at it. NOT taken apart.
The throwout bearing is going bad, and must be replaced eventually. No point waiting to see if it holds up until after the warranty expires.

devore420 · December 2007

Thanks, that's the kind of information I was looking for. We'll get it fixed under warranty before the period expires.

Is it true that it is not a safety issue? What would happen when it gives out?

ateixeira · December 2007

Did you ever test drive this car?

Was it perfect when you bought it, then it just fell apart? Doesn't make sense to me. :confuse:

aatherton · December 2007

"... Is it true that it is not a safety issue? What would happen when it gives out?

You can see that it is not a safety issue.
The bearing is slowly giving out, making a noise now, then perhaps eventually seizing up and making such a bad noise and feeling that you cannot use the clutch pedal.
Meanwhile, you are having plenty of time to talk the to the dealer about it, and discuss it online. You have the choice of acting or not.
If you continue to do nothing, no bodily harm would happen to you. Safety issues are usually framed in terms of harm.

devore420 · December 2007

Got it. Since I didn't understand what would happen, I was concerned that - say - the bearing would give out in the middle of trying to make a left-hand turn would could potentially be dangerous. It sounds like it will get worse and worse slowly and like you said, I've got plenty of time to get it fixed.

Thanks again.

Subaru Forester Transmission Questions

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