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Isuzu Axiom Maintenance and Repair

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Comments

  • walk_the_walk2walk_the_walk2 Member Posts: 140
    Dautlas: Rereading your entry, I realize I forgot to ask this basic question: does the problem with the Controller unit not recognizing your key affect BOTH keys? I would want to be sure it was not a KEY PROBLEM before swapping out the Keyless Entry and Anti-Theft Controller. If the problem is identical for both keys, then the dealer is probably right about the unit being flaky. Even so, I wonder if you could go through the re-calibration procedure with your existing key and the problem might go away/ Did the dealer already ask/try all that?
  • dautlasdautlas Member Posts: 11
    Walk_the_walk2: The problem started Feb. of this year but went away when the weather warmed. Now the mornings are cooling down into the fifties and the problem is back. The dealer suggested that the key was flaky and I should replace it first as it was the cheapest to start with. The key was $50.00 and another $40.00 to program for both of my keys. (I only had the one key) They had an issue connecting with the programmer at the time. They said it took three times to register the keys. At that point they thought that there was something wrong with the unit. Anyway I retired the original key to my wife as a spare key and I use the new key. Now the problem is with the new key but the back-up (original key) has been working. I don't think I can trust this unit anymore, it might not read either key and that would be bad depending on where I was at the time. My wife and I were talking about taking a trip to the mountains to do some 4 wheeling, not anymore with this problem. I really would like to remove this unit if possible. I ask the dealership if they could remove this system and they said no. I ask them for the information so I could remove this system myself and they said that they could not pass out the information for disabling a security device. Against some type of mandate of some kind. I am an electronic technician and with the right information I could disconnect this system. I also purchased a cd manual off of eBay for this model year but the information is vague about how this system works. I did some test but to no avail. Thanks for you reply. Dautlas
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    I know nothing about these systems. None on my 2002 Axiom.

    But do the keys have a battery in them? Could you try replacing the battery? Or if they are passive, can they be popped open and cleaned?

    "Ignorance is bliss and I smile a lot"

    Regards
    Bert
  • dautlasdautlas Member Posts: 11
    No battery and nothing to clean. It is a chip that is encased in epoxy. The thing is that not all Axioms had this system so there must be a way to remove this system and make it more like your axiom. I cannot find anyone that knows the difference between the two setups, an Axiom with and an Axiom without that can tell me what to change or remove Thanks for your reply.
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    Try this site for a start. Read their information and then go to:

    autolocksmithfinder.com

    Regards
    Bert
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    It just occurred to me that the ignition immobilizer is active when there are faults in the engine system. Like a cam out of time, low oil pressure, and lots of other things. I'd try plugging onto the OBD slot or what ever they call the analysis port and see if there are other car system problems that are keeping the car from starting.

    Regards
    Bert
  • dautlasdautlas Member Posts: 11
    Great idea, but the spare backup key (original key) works correctly to get the car started at present. This problem has been happening in the early morning hours on my way to work so the car has sat for about 12 hours at that point. This is the reason I purchased a second key because the original key could not be read by the immobilizer everytime. Now the new $90 key is starting to have the same problem. There has to be a way to remove or disconnect this system. Thanks for the reply.
  • walk_the_walk2walk_the_walk2 Member Posts: 140
    I also have a AS in Electronics, and looking at the wiring diagram for this PCU, I wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole. It is HEAVILY interconnected to the rest of the vehicle's electronics. Now, maybe you can do a comparison between the wiring of a non- AntiTheft and your own and find the differences and rewire it, but it looks more than difficult on first glance. (Then again, I figured out how to ditch that nasty electronic shock system, so it may be worth it in your case.)

    You say the manual you purchased on Ebay does not provide much information. Is it a Workshop Manual? Mine for my 02 Axiom came with two PDFs, one is a Workshop Manual that is 2100 pages alone! Is that the kind of manual you got, or did you get one of those Chilton-style manuals that is just an overview?

    I note that your profile has a private email address. I will adjust the settings on mine, so you can contact me by email, but it does not happen immediately. So, if you want to contact me sooner, you can contact me via my work email address listed on the Contacts page at: www.vivagen.net.
  • dautlasdautlas Member Posts: 11
    I think that I have the same manual as you, workshop manual for a 2002 model year. I cannot find a manual for the 2004 model year. There is a reference in section eight to the alarm system but this is for the door locks and alarm not the immobilizer system. I wish I could find the print on the immobilizer system then I could make a comparison to the two system and then maybe I could get this thing disconnected. I also have other things that I want to tackle like new heater controls so I could swap out the stereo and then install a 7inch LCD screen for my backup camera and my side view mirror cameras. I also have a guy lined up to help bend a grill guard for the Axiom. Thanks for the reply.
  • walk_the_walk2walk_the_walk2 Member Posts: 140
    Dautlas: Sounds like you have the same manual that I do then. And, the design for electrical components probably did not change over that period of 2001-2004. Minor changes in the wheels, but otherwise the same vehicle. I still think you are referring to the Anti-Theft Controller Module (ATCM), and want you to look at first page 6E-96, and then again in more detail on page 8D-21 (PDF pg. 1856). This controller is tied in heavily to your car's electrical wiring, but as the diagram on page 6E-96 indicates, there is really ONLY ONE WIRE that prevents the vehicle from starting, which is the connection shown going from the ATCM to the Powertrain Control Module (PCM), connecting to the PCM at connection #F70 with a white/green wire.

    Looks like the wire connection probably provides a ground connection to that transistor to disable the ignition (although it could be the opposite, it could pull it high to 12V). In any case, here are two very easy tests you could try to see if you can disable this system:

    1. Remove Fuse #29 in the interior fuse box and see if the car will start without the ATCM powered. If the car will start with the ATCM fuse removed, then your problem may be solved, if it does not remove other vital functionality that you cannot live without. (This is how you disable that dreadful Intelligent Suspension Control System, which defaults to a better ride when you remove the fuse.)

    2. If that does not work, see if you can access the connector where the white/green wire on the ATCM is located. With a voltmeter and an assistant, check the pin voltage on that connector when the vehicle is started to see if it goes high (12 VDC) or low/ground (0 VDC). Once you determine this, you should be able to figure out if disconnecting this wire will provide the answer to your situation, or if you need to wire up a jumper wire to bypass the ATCM.

    But, based on the block diagram on 6E-96, there appears to be only one wire that ties the ATCM to the PCM, as an input that enables or disables the ignition.

    Do your own due diligence on this - this is just my take on it, and there may be differences between the diagram and your unit (although I have found this manual to be very accurate with no deviances.)

    Good luck. Hope that helps.
  • dautlasdautlas Member Posts: 11
    This sounds good, I will review the manual pages that you are referring to and then make some tests. I will let you know how it goes. Thanks for the reply !!
  • dautlasdautlas Member Posts: 11
    I looked up the information that you relayed in the shop manual. The references that you are referring to are for the Anti-Theft Control Unit which is different than the engine Immobilizer Control Unit (ICU) I do have some limited BMP files that show some parts of the ICU but not enough detail to disconnect this system. I will try to froward these BMP files to your email address, maybe you will have better luck. Hope so!
  • jedmustangjedmustang Member Posts: 12
    I would like to report that I just had my shocks replaced by my local Meineke shop in Anchorage Alaska, with good success. Old front shocks were leaking, and I was also getting tired of the bouncing and bottoming as mentioned frequently on this forum. I printed out posting #61 and gave it to them for information. I bought the new shocks directly from the NAPA store. I first went to napa.com, which allows you to input your vehicle, and then provides the parts you need. It came up with the same shock parts numbers previously mentioned, NS 37159 and NS 37160. They appear to be exactly the same as Monroe. The NAPA price was $47 per shock. (Bought the shocks directly to avoid a large markup quoted by Meineke.) I then took them to Meineke for installation. Labor was 3.2 hours total, at $98/hr, including one extra hour for disconnecting the electronics as discribed in walkthewalk2's posting. The whole process seemed very straight forward to Meineke. They said they had to cut some bolts because of rusting.

    On my brief test drive home, I was pleased at the ride, and the lack of bouncing on some large speed bumps in my neighborhood.

    Thank you to all for the good advice posted on this forum.
  • walk_the_walk2walk_the_walk2 Member Posts: 140
    Thanks very much for the great feedback and also the tip about NAPA parts being cheaper. While I posted a lot of step-by-step detail on this procedure, it is BERT that deserves the credit as he did it first and posted it here first. So, thanks to Bert, too!
  • sgallegossgallegos Member Posts: 1
    we did the oil change in jiffy lube and run without change the oil for 400 miles after that when the engine blew out because not oil in the engine. my question is i have to replace the entire engine or there another wayto fix it for this kind of vehicle .
    I really love this car please somebody answer me
  • walk_the_walk2walk_the_walk2 Member Posts: 140
    Sorry to hear about what happened. I would guess that you had an oil leak or oil pump failure? I assume that this is not Jiffy Lube's fault somehow and they did not fail to fill the engine or properly tighten the oil drain plug?

    In any case, you have really only 3 options in my opinion:

    1. Rebuild your existing engine.
    2. Buy a used engine at a salvage yard
    3. Buy a new or refurbished engine from an Isuzu dealer or remanufactured engine supplier

    A long time ago, the same thing happened to me with a 70 Volkswagen Bug. I paid some local shade tree mechanic to rebuild the engine, but it only lasted for about two more years. So, i am not a big fan of option 1.

    Option 2 usually works well for most folks, as salvage yards typically offer a short warranty for the engines they sell. However, there is risk that the salvage yard engine has problems of its own.

    Option 3 is the best option if you can find a new or rebuilt engine. To get an idea of the cost for a new replacement engine, please contact Scarf Isuzu in Washington state, as they will offer you a better price usually. Then check on the Internet for rebuilt engines.

    Based on what I know about this vehicle, it does not look like a really difficult engine swap-out. It's rear wheel drive; there's lots of room under the hood; the Workshop manual is well documented; and so on. So, an engine swapout is probably the best bet.

    But, do keep in mind that given the blue book value of your Axiom, this whole thing probably doesn't make a lot of sense, financially speaking, unless you are doing this to avoid having a car payment for another vehicle.

    That's my two cents.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,146
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  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    Hi friends, I recently stumbled on this blog and am very happy. I know now I'm not the only Kook out there that loves the Isuzu Axiom. I have 2 Isuzus a 2002 Isuzu Axiom 2wd, brought brand new and have 41,000 miles. Babied the car since day 1. Overboard scheduled maintence. every 2 years changed brake fluid, tranny fluid, power steering fluid, differential fluid, antifreeze, spark plugs, pcv, air filter, fuel filter,etc.

    My daughter who gets jealous sometimes says I love the truck more than I love her,LOL.

    2. I always used 10W-30 in the engine, has anybody used 5W-30, I would like to know if the 5W-30 circulates more than the 10W-30 and possibly stops the ticking sound from the engine. My next oil change is in November and I wanted to see if this was a good idea.

    I can't remember how long ago the ticking sound started, but i don't think it was there when I bought the truck. It sounds at most times as if there is a diesel engine instead of a gasoline one.

    3. I also get the thump when starting from a stopped position though not all the time. (read in a different post that this wasn't a big issue and nothing to worry about) any thoughts?

    4. Also I defintely will try post #61, switching out the ISC for regular shocks, I'll probably try to do it in november, also did anybody have any inspection problems, did any trouble codes appear, or anything negative whatsoever with this modification, was the ride greatly improved, etc.

    I'm in NY and they hook up the car to a machine and test run on a dyno type machine to measure the gas output at the tailpipe. Also if there is a trouble code it's an automatic fail here in NY.

    5. The only problem to report is I had to change a speed sensor on the front drivers' side, of course to change the sensor I also had to get the bearing changed as it comes in a packaged together in one piece.

    6. I am also thinking about putting a Tow hitch on but can only find the round tube Tow hitch. I am worried about looks so I would prefer a hitch that doesn't stick out so much. any comments? If you have pictures of an installed hitch on an Axiom please e-mail them to me so I can see Bdd07@aol.com and decide.

    The second truck is an Isuzu Ascender 2005 4X4, good truck, no problems whatsoever. A Rebadged Envoy by GM , have it on the same 2 year maintence schedule as the Axiom, minus the fuel filter. I don't see one anywhere and don't know where it is. I assuming there's one inside the gas tank, does anyone know?

    The only problem I had is with the brakes, I'm the second owner and when I bought the truck it had uneven pads, I saw the pads that were installed were getting stuck, and all the aftermarket pads were getting stuck also, I filed down the top lip of the pads and no problems now, the pads wear evnly now.

    I also read that someone couldn't change the tranny fluid on the Axiom, I do all my own maintence on the truck and this was especially puzzling to me also. I came up with one of those garden spayers from home depot. I cut of the atomizer at the end of the wand and now pump the fluid in until it is full and leaking from the fill hole, I then idle the truck in neutral and continue filling until the fluid pours out of the fill hole again. It doesn't save time but it saves money on the tranny fluid and filter change and yes at times I get tired of pumping that garden sprayer but I like doing my own maintence.

    Thanks for reading and payiny attention future blogs wn't be so big as this one, because this was the first.
  • walk_the_walk2walk_the_walk2 Member Posts: 140
    Hi Axiom068:

    Welcome to the forum. Let me try to respond to some of your questions

    2. I live in Florida and have used synthetic 5W-30 for some time. (usually Mobil One, but sometimes other syn. brands). It has no effect on the ticking, which I notice from time to time. I tend to warm up my Ax for at least one minute before driving it, which may help, but I note that if I get to the one quart low mark, the ticking noise is more prevalent, so it's a good audible reminder. My guess is that this is a really common problem inherent in this engine, that appears after the engine is broken in.

    3. The thump is a powertrain problem of some kind, probably fluid related. I was eventually able to get rid of it after getting synthetic gear oil added to the rear end and synthetic tranny fluid. Since both happened at the same time, I am not sure which did the trick. But, the problem only very rarely happens now. Almost never.

    4. Of the 3 or 4 of us who have made this mod to the shocks, everyone likes it. Bert was the first to do it; I was the second and wrote the detailed primer on it for posterity... it seems to work fine, and i never notice my shocks anymore. Before, with ISC, I used to ALWAYS notice the sproingy, sproingy ride, which I attribute to too high of a derivative in the PID loop settings in the firmware.

    As for the trouble codes, I do not know, since I am too cheap to buy a scanner, but I don' t think so. You can test it easily enough, as one of the steps required is to remove the fuse for the ISC system, which is mentioned in my posting. If removing the fuse posts a trouble code, then yes, but I doubt that is the case. removing the fuse de-illuminates the shock absorber trouble indicator on the dash, that's all.

    5. Never had to change a speed sensor. Sounds expensive. How did you know your speed sensor had failed? What were the symptoms?

    6. I had a black anodized round tube-style tow hitch installed at the local UHAUL place here. They did a nice job, and it was less than $200, as I recall. They install a universal wiring harness, too, inside the compartment on the LH side of the hatch area, behind the removable panel, with lots of spare cabling. It looks fine and does not stick out that much. The one they use fits perfectly around the spare tire, which is critical. The tongue of the hitch is removable, if you go out on the town... there is a stainless steel pin that you remove to take out the part of the tongue that includes the ball. If I get time I'll send you some pics.

    I am also one of the few Axiom owners with chrome round side tubes as well, which I had to have custom-made.

    7. The fuel filter for the Ax is on the side mounted in a bracket. Can say on the [non-permissible content removed]-ender. Ask your NAPA guy - he should know.

    8. Great info on the brake pads, but I must be a little dense today, as I don't really get it... what is it you are doing to the pads to get them to behave? I now have very expensive drilled/slotted racing rotors and expensive Akebono pads on my 02 2WD Axiom... still having that annoying squalling problem when you first step on the brakes, or when you are stopping on a decline. So, I would like to know more about what you are suggesting...

    10. Your garden sprayer idea is the best thing since velcro was invented!

    There are two holes on the tranny for fluid; one to fill and the other to check, which is slightly higher. So, using your idea, you could just fill until it comes out the top hole. In my opinion, most Ax owners are ignoring their tranny's fluid changes to their detriment, as tranny failures are the #1 problem with this vehicle. So changing it often with synthetic fluid is money well spent. I'll try your idea soon, as I like doing my own maintenance too... it pains me to spend $300 or $600 every time i need something fixed on my car.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    I live in New York. lots of salt and harsh winters. I noticed entries about corrosion and am concerned. I'm going to go underneath and with a can of primer and some sandpaper with alot of elbow grease to fix the problem. I also noticed someone said something about undercoating. It is my belief that if you place undercoating you might be covering up corrosion and letting it get worse by not getting rid of it in the first place. In addition it will make it harder to inspect for corrosion in the future, so please be careful and make sure the corrosion has been eliminated before hand.

    walk the walk2, I thank you for you welcoming me, it is much appreciated.

    I now know that 5W-30 doesn't solve the ticking problem and am now stuck with a gasoline engine that sounds like a diesel at times. I agree when the oil gets low the ticking is at its worse, but it is also a great reminder to check the oil level.

    I also put synthetic gear oil in and the problem has subsided somewhat but not completely. As for the tranny fluid I use the pennzoil brand which is good, but I also change the fluid every 2 years.

    With that thumping sound, I noticed it after about 2 years of ownership. I took it to the isuzu dealer, which doesn't exist anymore, but I found the mechanic there especially knowledgable on the Axiom. The mechanic was a Woman with all sorts of service awards from Isuzu, I was impressed. But when asked about the 100,000 mile unbelievable fluid change, she stated you'll damage the tranny if you wait that long, she suggested every 4 years or 48,000 miles. As you can see I do it every 2 years just to make sure. And when you use the garden sprayer all you are paying for is the filter and the fluid, so it's not any great expense. Be careful in buying the garden sprayer, some of the sprayers have very little channels in which the fluid flows and would be very difficult to use with the thick tranny fluid, I brought the Roundup heavy duty sprayer and it works fine.

    But I also upgraded to the mightyvac MV7201. This thing is incredible. It suctions and evacuates at a flip of the switch and the pumping is considerably less than the garden sprayer. You can take the tranny fluid out of the bottle and then press in the directional control button, add a couple of pumps and in no time your tranny will be full with alot less of a mess and less effort. I brought 2 of them one I use for everything else because I'm just taking the fluid out and then putting them in jars get rid of the fluids. So, i'm not too concerned about fluid contamination. But the other one is strictly for the tranny.

    I will defintely try the shock upgrade but that will be in november. But it is a great idea about pulling the fuse and check for trouble codes. I will do that probably this weekend and will let you guys know the outcome.

    I do have 2 scanners which are very good. I have an Innova 3130 scan tool, which when you get a trouble code theres no looking in a book to find out what it means because the machine automatically tells you, it's wonderful. The price was around $130 something from amazon, I think. But compared to the other scanners like the scantron, this is worth it. It also does many other things that should please you.

    I also have an OTC ABS Reader II, this was expensive, it was about $450 on ebay. But it's great. It reads all the airbag codes- Abs codes-- and OBD codes and again you don't need to look up codes because the machine tells you. And yes that how I knew my ABS sensor was bad and which one it was. The ABS light came on and it showed the code and which sensor it was.

    But, one thing about the ABS code reader. From what I gather after the year 2000 Isuzu pretty much stopped issuing software for their trucks, so software for after the year 2000 is very rare. In fact I've never seen it, but heard about it.

    I also brought the dealer level workshop manual from helm publishing listed in the owners manual, extremely complete tells you everything. It also points out that Isuzu is using the GM Tech II scanner (TOO expensive for me), which lead me to believe all the electronics in the isuzus after 2000 are all GM codes. The OTC Scanner only has codes for up to the year 2000 for isuzus (mind you isuzu specific software), but goes up to 2005 for GM and I found using the scanner that the 2002 Chevy Jimmy and the 2002 isuzu Axiom have the same trouble codes, it's amazing I tell ya. Also for the 2005 Ascender I can also use the scanner using either the GM codes for the Envoy or the trailblazer it doesn't make a difference.

    In addition to get back to walk the walk2's question--- The speed sensor for the ABS comes toether with the bearings, I was able to purchase the whole unit from Timken for $110 from my local parts store (no pepboys, no autozone, etc) a real honest to goodness parts store where people know what there talking about, not young kids looking up part numbers and giving you the wrong part anyway, but of course the pepboys and autozones of the world have their place. Either way the part listed for $330 and I got it for $110 plus my own labor. If you do this kind of job get ready with a torch and a 5lb sledgehammer because you'll be whacking away at this thing for quite some time to get it off.

    to back track a little, inaddition to the synthetic fluid in the differential I also changed the rear brake drums and the rear brakes. This is where autozone came into play. I brought the Beck Arnley's drums from amazon. These are not the ones to buy. Amazon even let me post a warning against buying those for the isuzu. Beck Arnley somehow got the center hole dimensions wrong and it wont completely sit on the wheel. I went through this whole thing with Beck Arnle until the fessed up they were wrong and unfortunately at the time they had over 200 units in stock the same way. But autozone does have the right part and it fits perfect, albeit way more expensive, I think it was like $80 for 1 drum.

    But to continue the story with the rear diff. when i replaced the rear brakes I noticed they were glazed over and basically the same height as the replacements (?). I guess the rear brakes weren't being used at all. But when I changed the brakes and the drums everything went back to normal. The thud is very slight at times and not as hard and most times it doesn't happen.

    For the hitch there's one on ebay for $102. I'm going to order it and let you guys know how it came out. It's a curtis hitch with round tubing. I'm not to crazy about it, but it looks the same as the hidden hitch model. And the hidden hitch model in this instance it's not really a hidden hitch it protrudes from the back like I believe the curtis model will do.

    Also I saw a rodeo with the u-haul hitch and it protruded out a little bit and is very noticable. Is yours very noticable?

    Chrome round side tubes, huh--Flashy. But yes I have those also. The ones I
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    Wow, I'm the slowest typer in the world and spent hours writing post #274 and saw only half of it submitted, well it's getting late and I'll try to submit the rest later.

    forget it , i'll do most of it now.

    Chrome tubes.. I have the Manik chrome tubes brought from an online store way back when. I also have a chrome aftermarket roofrack made by Dyno..something, also brought from an online store many years ago. It's excellent, still looks good after all this time and looks better than the factory one, which I thought looks kind of odd. The rack is rated for 150lbs max. But I'm pretty sure I surpassed that a couple of times with the hard shell cargo carrier I brought from sears.

    It is really late, and I did anwer walk the walk2 question about the brakes but as you can see it was cut off. I didn't know we had a space limit and I went on and on and on. But I promise I'll finish it up again later.

    good night or in my case good morning it's almost 4:30 in the morning here.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    to get back to walk the walk2 about brakes. This goes for any car or truck out there, but it did happen on the Ascender and not the Axiom.

    Sometimes aftermarket manufacturers get the dimensions wrong on the equipment as in the case with the Axiom drums. The same is true for the Ascender brakes. The overall length of the brakes were to long and causing the brake pads to essentially get stuck in the caliper. This I found across many different brands.

    If the brake pads fit tight into the caliper, the pistons will have a very hard time pushing the pads into the rotor and this will cause uneven brake wear, grinding noises, squealing and the like. There has to be a little play in the brake pads to allow movement. Since the amount of length were taking about is minimal to get a free moving brake pad, I just used a file to file down the lips of the brake if you will (the metal tip at the very end of the brake pads) a couple of millimetrs until the pads were able to move freely. TA DA...the fix worked perfectly. No more strange noises and no uneven brake wear.

    Also do't forget to put the tacky stuff at the back of the brake pads. I have a bottle of the stuff but could not read the name but I believe it was made by permatex.

    Also, for brake bleeding, I use the Motive products brake bleeder. I think I got from Apexperformance.com or .net. It is truly a one man operation bleeder set and have changed my brake fluid on the 2 year schecule I follow. It can get messy at times trying to get a perfect seal but it is worth it compared to what the charge in a garage.

    well this has been your Gm trade secret from Eric Strommer....LOL (the guy from AOL that tells you how to fix things around the house)

    Well this has been your Isuzu trade secrets from Axiom068. I hope everyone can use the info I put in here and make your maintenence of your trucks a little bit better and a little bit easier.

    P.S. I plan to keep my truck until the wheels litterally fall off. Brought new and will keep for life.
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    Regarding Rust and corrosion: I have been using Corroseal Rust Converter. If your rust isn't coming off in big flakes or if it isn't really thick Corroseal works really well. It reacts with the rust and forms a surface like a hard clear varnish. And you can spray paint or primer right over it. You can spray it on with an undercoating gun or an engine cleaner sprayer. I'd pressure wash underneath first. I came across this stuff being used on steel boats on salt water. This not an undercoating material. Go to www.corroseal.com Try typing in NORUST web code in Google check out and you might get a 15% discount.

    The thump and engine click: I had the same thump and started greasing the U joints on the drive shaft (didn't even know they were there) also squirting some dry lube into the spline shaft at the back of the transmission. Thump gone.

    Engine noise I believe is a sticky lifter. Not a problem on my 2002 Axiom (so far) but a reoccurring problem on my Trooper V6 Cylinder. I'd warm the engine up and take the Air tube off the air cleaner, then heavily spray Marvel Mystery Oil into the throttle body till the engine runs a little rough and smokes like hell. Ticking would go away for quite a while.

    Welcome and Best Regards
    Bert
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    corroseal sounds like it would do the job. I'm not sure if it's diluted or concentrate strength. When using it do you need to mix it with water. The Gallon is $49.99 and wondering if a smaller size would suffice.

    Do you know if they sell similar stuff at any specialty stores or autopart stores?
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    You use it undiluted and it sprays on a little snotty. However you can clean up with water. If you spend the time trying to get it into all the crevices you will consume at lest 2/3rds of the gallon. There may be similar products. I'd search under the key words - Rust Converter.

    Regards
    Bert
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    Well I put the Hitch on this weekend and unlike the instructions it takes more than 30 minutes to install. There is one bolt--the last bolt-- that has to be "fishwired" through the frame to get to a pre-drilled bolt hole.

    For that to happen, to get access to a space big enough to enter the bolt in there was a couple of choices:

    1. remove rear bumper frome the frame---I can't see myself doing that. It looks rusty down there and I don't want to start breaking bolts and not get the bumper to align again.

    2. Get that section Tack welded-- this is a very strong possibility.

    3. leave said bolt off--- Hey how much damage can leaving one bolt off do?
    (author can see himself driving down the road and the trailer passing him)

    Conclusion, Tack welding it is!!!

    I also check what effect it would have on the car if the suspension 30Amp circuit breaker was removed for the shock upgrade.

    I used both computers and found nothing. The shock light even lights up in the dash when turning on the car and automatically goes off as it should. Does this happen to everybody that did the upgrade, everything seems normal?

    This might be a ghost system that isuzu did to get the owners to buy $180 a piece shocks.

    I checked the diagrams and could not find no reason not to remove it. Though it is connected to the ABS system , there are no fault lights to speak of.

    It looks like a done deal, I'm going to do the upgrade. But am wondering if the KYB shocks would be better than the Sensatrac shocks, any thoughts? let me know, thanks.
  • walk_the_walk2walk_the_walk2 Member Posts: 140
    edited October 2010
    I can't speak to the hitch installation - 'cept to say after reading your posting I am damn glad I paid U-Haul to do mine!

    As for the shocks - I was the 2nd one to ditch the sproingy, sproingy ISS system and go with manual shocks (like on Troopers and Rodeos). I posted the details of that install, which was also pretty grueling physically. I bought the afore-mentioned Monroe shocks after much investigation with Monroe Tech Support, as Bert could not recall the exact model numbers he had used. Since then others have done the Monroe switcheroo. As for me, I have used it like this for about 18 months with no problems whatsoever. In that time, I have had to use ABS brakes several times with no issues.

    However, I don't wanna sound like the final word on this - because if the specific model of Monroe shocks fit and worked fine for us, then the KYBs would probably work if they had a cross referenced exact fit match. But, you are boldly going where no one has gone before with that brand, so you're on your own.

    I would just suggest you take it to a Shocks place unless you really enjoy doing shocks, and if that is the case, then get some burly guy named Billy Bob with lots of extra upper body mass to help you remove the old ones. It's a bear.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    Should check to see if U-haul put all the bolts in ?....HAHA

    If I let some shop do it, what kind of backyard mechanic would I be...you know...we're built for punishment....stress...cursing...throwing tools.....

    with --sproingy-- do you mean excessive bouncing...because I get a rough and jarring ride when going over bumps in the roadway. But the handling is good, better than a regular truck.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    Just thought of the float pins,,(I call them).. The pins can sometimes get stuck in the caliper housing and will cause the support bracket for the caliper to rub up against the rotor.

    Float pins= the 2 bolts that you remove to get the caliper off. The ones with the rubber boot on. Whack 'em a couple of times with a rubber mallet. most times they'll free up. But other times there frozen in then you would need to get new ones. If they do free up, pull them off and re-lube and replace.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    Well with all the talk about corrosion here, I did a little checking.
    On the Autoblog it states that Isuzu will issue a recall for corrosion on the rear suspension lower link only. Isuzu owners can call 1-800-255-6727 before the official notification to owners is started.

    I read the press release and it only includes certain cold climate states, New York, being one of them. This came from an NHTSA campaign. The campaign #'s are 10V436000, PE09030,EA09018.

    The press release mentions to go to isuzu dealers for the fix, (note: replacement was never mentioned, just installation of a support bracket), Has anyone seen an isuzu dealer. All the one's I know of are no longer servicing isuzu products. The nearest one to me is about 50 miles away. I'm concerned once I drop the car off what will I do after that. Rent a car to get back home? Have a friend drive and pick me up? What will happen indeed.

    NOW NHTSA WHAT ABOUT THE REST OF THE TRUCK CORROSION PROBLEMS>

    To get back to the suspension upgrade to regular shocks (LOL) and to kiss the ISS system good-bye, I chose to stay true with the site and use the monroe Sensa trac shocks instead of the KYB's.

    Well all in all KYB's generally are regarded as giving a stiffer ride than the Monroes. But Since this was Shocktober month at monroe, (BUY 3 Get 1 free) and I found the shocks at rockauto.com for $33.79 each for the front and rear, I based my decision completely on the rebate and price of the shocks. The cheapest I found for the KYB's was on Amazon they were $49.96 and $53.00 and no rebates, but they did have free shipping.

    I checked the usual sites and stores pepboys, autozone, advanced auto and several online sites and these were the cheapest around.

    I'll let you guys know when I put them in and how it went.
  • jedmustangjedmustang Member Posts: 12
    Regarding the Shoctober Rebate. Be sure to keep the required box ends proof of purchase, reciept, and the proper rebate form. I had to dumpster dive to retrieve my box ends.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    Thanks Jedmustang, I'll be sure to keep the box ends.

    I just received the shocks today. The 37159's for the front were packed in the original box with all the parts, the box appears to be sealed by the manufacturer. But what caught my eye was that both shocks were fully extended without the plastic piece that holds them together. I thought it was bad to fully extend the shocks before installation.

    The 37160's had the plastic piece that holds them together and was packaged the same way as the 37159's.

    For everyone that did the replacement of shocks did the 37159's come fully extended? Please, let me know.
  • walk_the_walk2walk_the_walk2 Member Posts: 140
    It's been 18 months since I did the swap, so I don't recall what they looked like or whether they were extended or not. I do recall that the rear ones had longer threaded rods, but you probably can know that already.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    OK, I figured I'd check the project out before actually getting started. I noticed the original bushings on the front shocks are 4 times the size of the bushings on the monroe's.

    I'm assuming that evryone put the new smaller bushings on that came with the monroe shocks, am I right?

    Also the placement of the bushing and washers. Did you guys put the bushings and washers back in the same exact order. Washer-Bushing- Washer on top of the mounting point and another set of Washer-Bushing-Washer underneath the mounting point (i.e., hole where the shock stem goes through).

    It appears if I was to stay with the original mounting sequence, I would have to reuse the current washers which appear to be 4 times the size of the bushing that came with it.

    And if anybody wants to be relly,really, really nice--Please send pictures of one completed front shock and one completed rear shock to my e-mail address--which is- Axiom068@aol.com.

    This would be most appreciated a 1000 times over.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    I called monroe and they said the front shocks are packaged fully extended. I guess it was my misconception that you couldn't fully extend the shock before installation.

    But the rear shocks are packaged with the plastic strip holding them together.
  • carsonciggiacarsonciggia Member Posts: 1
    I have an axiom, I just picked up.I have a lighting issue. The main dome light works, however, the map lights and lights in the cosmetic mirrors are dead. I checked all of the fuses. I'm puzzled. Please help!!??
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    Try turning the head lights on first.

    Bert
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    And of course the bulbs might be burned out.
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    Well with the estimates of $290 for shock replacement mentioned herein. I went around Staten Island to find a cheaper price. Though I didn't find a super way cheaper price, the lowest was $225, but the shop did not have OxyAcetylene torches and I think would of charged way more to get the bolts off.

    So, in the interest of all backyard mechanics I thought that was way too much to replace and remove 2 bolts and 6nuts. So I did the only viable and cost effective solution to me. I did the job myself.

    Every nut and bolt was completely rusted. I used copious amounts of PB Blaster, WD-40, and liquid wrench. The Top nuts of the Shocks would not come loose. The
    bottom bolts of the front shocks were seized onto the metal sleeve and would not come loose even though the nuts came off with out a problem. I gave plenty of time for each penetrant to work it's magic, alas no magic was had.

    I pulled out my grinder and had to cut the top of each and every shock absorber. The rear shocks were the easiest to cut. I used a 4 1/2" grinder with a metal cut off wheel. No big problem fairly easy. But the fronts were a different story.

    Those 2 bolts in the front were the worst I have ever seen. Even with the nuts off the bolts would not come off as the metal sleeve for the shock absorber fused to the bolt. I cut the bolt head off and the tail end of the bolt off hoping to pry the shock out of the bracket, a good idea as far as I was concerned. While prying away one side of the shock absorber bracket broke and out came the shock absorber. This I had to get rewelded on for $120. That was the passenger side.

    For the drivers side I knew now I had to be more careful, instead of using such strong man tactics I had to use a more surgical approach. I cut the top off with the 4 1/2 grinder. This was not a problem. But the bottom bolt had to be cut from inside the bracket as the last idea didn't work. In order to get to the area that needed to be cut I had to bring out the big 7" grinder and cut off wheel and cut the bottom of the shock absorber completely off. This made a big mess as oil from the shock was spewing everywhere. then after burning the bushing off with the torch gotten at the home depot as part of a soldering kit. I was able to move the bottom eyelet of the shock back and forth so I could get the 4 1/2" grinder in there to make the 2 cuts. This was successful. After the 2 cuts were made the head and tail of the bolt popped off easily enough and the shock was replaced.

    With all 4 shocks changed I decided to hit some bumps and see what happens. Over the little bumps the shocks were indistinguishable from the electronic shocks but over the big bumps and pot hole size holes that New York is famous for the truck did not bottom out like before and was not as jarring. Cornering seems to be OK but was better with the electronic shocks, The ride on highway roads was smoother than the electronic shocks andis exactly what I had hoped for.

    All in all, this project is a heavy duty project and requires alot of patience and time. It most certainly was easier to pay the shop to do it. But if your like me and like to do things yourself and covet the title "Backyard Mechanic" then this project is right up your alley.

    I would like to thank everyone for the help I received, it was greatly appreciated and was a wonderful idea.
  • natesternatester Member Posts: 1
    I have a 2004 Isuzu Axiom with 65K miles that has frequent hesitations while I just cruzing down the road, mostly in the 50 -60 MPH range. Slight but very noticable. Any ideas out there would be very welcomed.
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    No messages since 3/3???????? either we are dieing off or our Axioms are.

    Last month 2002 Axiom Reduced Power light went off and engine lost almost all power. Shut off and waited for a minute then restarted and drove off fine.

    Anyone know what some of the reasons are for this happening?

    Cleaned out the PCV valve, ran a few bottles of Sea Foam through the gas and 1/2 bottle in the crank case. Now about 4K miles since the reduced power problem and everything seems OK. Don't really believe in liquid additive solutions but what the heck I gave it a try.

    Regards All
    Bert
  • axiom068axiom068 Member Posts: 16
    nope we're still here. It's just that the Axiom is running really good with no problems. I have no ideas for your situation excepr clogged fuel injectors.

    good luck and keep us posted on the problem
  • sassygrl996sassygrl996 Member Posts: 1
    I have a '02 Axiom. When braking, the slower the vehicle gets the more it feels like it is grabbing then missing, almost a jerking motion. Any ideas?

    Also, my clock doesn't work- it won't set and the compass works when I start it, but once past about 15mph, it stops working. Any ideas?
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    well the brake pulsing sounds like worn and slightly warped rotors. The
    rotors just don't last long on the Axiom unless you buy drilled/ventilated
    rotors and they're too expensive anyway. Clock and compass must be a fault
    to the antenna somewhere. They are both set by satellite signal. Don't
    know where to look so i can't help except to do a web search or someone with
    the whole manual out there.

    Regards
    Bert
  • a9x2a9x2 Member Posts: 25
    Drilled and slotted are NOT that expensive. Found rotors and pads for $120 on ebay, DRILLED AND SLOTTED. That was my 2nd brake job on the AX in Feb and it was actually cheaper than goin the conventional.
  • a9x2a9x2 Member Posts: 25
    I have the same issue. You need a new GPS Sensor(entire new screen) and the part is around $900 and labor is around $250. These are rates from City Isuzu, perhaps YMMV?
  • a9x2a9x2 Member Posts: 25
    MY CE light is goin on and off for about 3 months. Code read for bad EGR valve. Had it replace around when it came on but the light never went off. Dealer says they can't reset compt b/c they lost the Isuzu "Resetter" but still, shouldn't it have reset by now? I'm worried that it may be something other than the EGR. And I may not know if there really is a problem w/ my engine.
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    $120 pads and rotors on all four wheels? Yeah that's cheap, but if only the front then then an OK price. Either way I'd like to know if you get over 60K on them.
  • a9x2a9x2 Member Posts: 25
    edited May 2011
    Yes, I'm hoping they last that long thats about what the last ones did. Well I'm only about 9k into them so far so good :) Looked at my brake job from 09', at Firestone $149.99 for regular ones labor included. At the dealer --drilled and slotted, taxes $190 (lied in my last post, forgot to add labor cost). These rotors shouldn't warp moreover saving more money in the long run. These prices are for front only. I have to dig up the 09' recipt for the rear and the dealer didn't mention needing new ones this year so I didn't either ;) Also, do you own an ax b/c it doesn't have disc all wround :confuse:
  • bertbcfmbertbcfm Member Posts: 71
    My 2002 Axiom - AWD has disks all around and none of them seem to last too long. At least on the front. I wish there was some way to transfer a slightly higher percentage of braking to the rear brakes. Axiom's brakes have always been low performance even with new pads and rotors. I pull a 5 X 8 trailer and a trailer with a portable welder on it and both have electric brakes. When I'm pulling them I have better stopping power - go figure, huh? Warping has never been a problem for me, just accelerated wear on the front disks.

    Regards
    Bert
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