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Comments
C&D probably prints sales brochures for BMW.
Still an impressive vehicle, though not quite the WINNER I was expecting. Will have to see if the longer term renting will change my impression.
At this price point/class the Infiniti is a winner.
At this price point and whatever class the 300C AWD with a bunch of options on it is in, it too is a winner.
At the discount price of the STS with the DI engine, it will pull sales from the CTS.
The CTS will, in perhaps 6 months, probably be pretty much discounted, too -- then, with the addition of the bluetooth factory feature (which even the 300C offers via a package called Uconnect), the CTS might be an appropriately priced winner.
Gawd, it sure is purty -- but even with the great (apparent) build quality and pretty decent power -- a maxed out 300C with the current discount structure seems like so much more car for da moola. But, it is a bit porky -- yea, I know so is the CTS, so what else is new.
I do believe I am still going to wait for the new LWB V6 AWD A4 Sline -- then my choice will most likely be between the Audi A4, Cadillac CTS DI and the Infiniti G35X.
The rumored updated 300C (D?) will be out then too -- the Cadillac, IMHO, will need hmmm, about a 10-12% nominal discount at that point.
Then, it could be the winner -- if I say it often enough and fast enough, while I'm squinting. . ."it could happen!"
:surprise:
And I think the automotive press agrees with me. Motor Trend has given the 2008 CTS the COTY award this year. The aformentioned Car and Driver put the '08 CTS on their 10Best list this year. The BMW 3-series was on it, but the G35 was not. Not that the G35 didn't deserve to be on the list, but the new G35 is evolutionary improvement over the old car. The '08 CTS is night and day over the '07 CTS. Sometimes you get awards for how far you've come.
The STS with the DI engine picking off CTS sales? I'd love the get some of the tree you've been smoking. The STS is just a plain boring vehicle next to the CTS. The only thing it has going for it over the CTS is a V8 option and soon that won't even be a differentiator.
The 300C is a nice car...my favorite rental these days (leg room for days!). But the interior quality just is not the same class as the CTS or anything else in the class.
The A4 is a very very nice vehicle. Audi has probably done more than anyone in transforming FWD cars into Quattro cars that can get around a curve. If somebody buys an Audi over other cars in the class, I can't blame them.
I beg to differ on that. I have a 07 STS-4 and have driven a number of 07 CTS's in which the 08 is different but it is still a bottom of the line Caddy. Very Nice, but no STS.
thebug...
C&D believes that if you're a car enthusiast then you want a race car for the street. I think we all realize this is not the case. A great sport sedan/coupe is a combination of style, luxury, technology, handling and performance. The fact that a car can lap Nurburgring or Laguna Seca faster and quicker than any other car in it's class doesn't make it the optimal car for a car enthusiast's daily driver.
I haven't owned an American car since 1999 and swore I would never own another after that awful Jeep Grand Cherokee, but since the introduction of the CTS I've slowly changed my mind. The 08 CTS is everything I had hoped it would be, correcting all of the problems of the previous models. I would have already put my order in for an 08 CTS if it weren't for the fact that Cadillac will be building a coupe, hopefully in 08 as an 09.
Thesis: The STS is boring
1. The exterior styling is bland. The original '05 STS was supposed to be introduced in '04 but got held back because Bob Lutz thought the styling wasn't sophisticated enough. I don't know what that car looked like because the car that went to production didn't light many eyes afire. Considering that the '02 'Slade, the '03 CTS, the '04 XLR and the '04 SRX were all considered to be "out there" styling exercises (some succeeded, some sort-of succeeded). The '05 STS looked to be to be an unfinished project. The lines were too toned down from the other A&S efforts. The sides were too slad sided without any emotion lines to break up the wide expanses of nothing. The rear clip and spoiler looked completely unfinished and the spoiler didn't look integrated at all. I spent some time in my mind trying to defend it when it first was released, but the more I looked at it, the more I couldn't defend it.
2. The interior was a better effort but it falls because Cadillac compromised it with poor quality plastics. All you have to do is put your hand on top of the '08 CTS's dash and feel the soft feel of the leatherette compared to the hard plastics of the STS to know that the CTS's game got updated from what had been done three years previous. It's not that the STS's interior is bad...far from it. But once you get back the center stack that was pretty well done, the rest of it is lacking, I'm sorry to say. Keep in mind, I'm the same guy who told my Caddy dealer back in '03 that I thought my new CTS's interior wasn't enough for the class (and the SRX's original CTS-based interior was a joke for the class).
3. The seats are boring. The STS's seats are pretty much the same units in the CTS and SRX. Outside of some styling differences, the seats showed no improvement from the other vehicles...again, just trying to put more of the same across the product line.
The STS-V did change some of my pain points, but the main problems of the car remain. The '08 STS does spice up the front clip with the new family grill, but I think the CTS is a better interpretation of that effort. The side vents on the new STS just look slapped on...not an integrated part of the design as the CTS or even the '07 Slade.
Given the styling effort on the CTS, I am hopeful on the replacement for the STS/DTS since I was getting a little worried after the STS came out.
The manual tranny is available with either the base or DI engine. Check your dealer for availability since most dealers these days special order the manual transmission for customers who specifically want it.
I would disagree on the "door-thunk" noise...not that it couldn't be better...I think it could be. But I've owned a '76 Deville and a '80 Deville and those doors sounded nothing like modern cars. :-)
You're not ever going to get the torque of a Hemi V8 until Caddy puts a V8 Northstar in this car. Wait a year or two and it will happen...and a V-series car is a certainty next year anyway.
No flash to pass? That's the first time I've heard that complaint...even the last CTS had that feature. Weird.
Finally about the pimped up Vogue Tyres (r) and pinstriping.....Cadillac as a division of GM is going to have to get firm with the dealers on crap like this. Coming back from the airport this weekend I saw a brand new red '08 CTS in the airport parking lot...and then I took a doubletake to see a saddle-colored fake convertible coach roof stuck to the top of it. It's like somebody wearing a obvious bad toupee, only much worse. In the last 5 years, I think I only saw 2 CTS's that were ever inflicted by this kind of aftermarket travesty, and now just 2+ months out the gate and I see my first '08 CTS to get the '79 Caddy Phaeton treatment (yes this was a real factory car from Cadillac, look it up!)
thebug...
http://www.cadillac.com/cadillacjsp/financing/offers-financing-models.jsp?tab=20- 08&model=cts
As a person who was impacted by the B20 constraint problem I thought I would pass on this recent observation.
My brother was visiting Phoenix this past weekend and noticed new 2008 CTS cars in the rental fleet there. Knowing that my CTS order was delayed because of the Wood Steering wheel, he observed that all of the rental CTS cars had the Wood Steering wheel! I found this a bit frustrating and disconcerting.
Why would Cadillac put a constrained item on generic rental units at the expense of sold customer's cars? It doesn't make sense to me but I admit I am a novice at understanding the machinations of the car business. It really strikes me as disingenuous to talk about constraints to money in hand customers and then on the other hand do something like this?
This is a case where I truly wish for greater transparency on the part of Cadillac.
-CB
Sounds like they used vacunm motors to open/close those vent doors and the higher the engine revs the lower the vac. which means the doors snap either shut or open which ever way they are designed.
Now if you want to add either, it's gonna cost a lot more. The shift knob alone is reported to cost better than $350 and the wheel about $600. Personally, I like the wood shift knob. I don't care for the wood wheel.
The 2008 is quieter than the 2007, more solid, and I think heavyer. I dont feel a performance issue once I'm off the line and moving...she responds to throttle and I'm OK with it. BUT I agree......she is not faster off the line or even as fast as my 2007.
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2007/cadillac/cts/100717104/specs.html
Not 275,,,,
I'll throw this out there too and I'll stop knocking my new baby. On the AWD cars, the brake pedal is too close to the gas pedal which causes some drivers to clip the edge of the brake pad while your applying gas. Doesnt happen on 2007's, or 2008 NON AWD cars but somthing with the AWD models and the tunnel that enchroach's into the cabin has caused the brake pedal to be too close to the gas pedal. Scary feeling when your applying gas to be hitting the brake at the same time.
Size 10 regular foot in case your wondering.
I've also tried for 900 miles to re-train my foot to no avail. Anyone else with AWD's feel this issue?
thebug...
I got the information from my dealer a couple of weeks ago. I hadn't heard anything so I called the 1800 Cadillac number that supposedly can tell you things. After a long routine of verifying who I was all they could determine was it was to be built the week of 12/3.
Based on other discussions I have seen, I would have thought I would know my VIN by now and possible delivery dates.
I think I'm in the home stretch but information is thin on the ground.
-CB
As it turns out, I just got an email from my dealer that my car has been built and shipped! No delivery date yet but maybe this coming week or the week after at the latest. I get my wish to get it before Christmas. The timing is also opportune because the Maryland state tax is increasing 20% from 5% to 6% effectice Jan 1. I did not vote for the democrat Governor O'Malley who pushed this tax hike through.
Through a neat trick I learned about, I went to cadillac.com and was able to enter my VIN number and look at and printout my actual vehicle's window sticker. Very cool.
-CB
AG
a) what are you all doing for hands-free telephony? The car doesn't come with Bluetooth, a rather obvious oversight.
b) are most of you who've purchased buying at MSRP, or are there deals to be had?
Search Sticker by VIN
-CB
Bluetooth
I have to admit this isn't a big deal for me as I make relatively few cell phone calls. I did recently buy a new Palm Centro which has bluetooth. I also picked up a jabra bluetooth earpiece for about $12 that seems to work ok. There are many devices on the market that plug into the cigarette lighter. Some swear by the Onstar phone hookup. I have no experience. Personally, I prefer to listen to music than yak on the phone!
Price
Given the date of the year and the fact that I believe the GM factory shuts down after next week until next year, I think I would wait until next year to try to price a new CTS.
In my case, I needed to order mine because of the features I wanted. I did my homework and then sent out a request for bids from all my local dealers. I stated in my request that I wanted specific features and would need to order. I did not need to be sold on the car. I knew all about the car and had test driven it. It would be an easy order for a dealer. Only one dealer out of a half dozen actually responded with an actual quote. The others either didn't respond or wanted to "sell" me rather than just give me a quote. The dealer that gave me a quote was easy to deal with. I negotiated a little further and reached my target price and the order was placed on Oct 26.
I paid about $3k below MSRP or about $1k plus over supposed invoice. Not a steal or a bargain but I consider it a fair price given the short supply.
I would think that the new year will bring new supply online that will catch up with demand. Also, with the new year will be all the car shows and everyone will be distracted by 2009 models.
With patience you'll probably get a great deal on what seems to be fantastic car.
-CB
Did you get the DI ?