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2008 Cadillac CTS

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Comments

  • srynsryn Member Posts: 29
    Thanks rayainsw; see my response immediately above.
  • miko99miko99 Member Posts: 5
    The sticker on my '08 CTS also calls for 35 PSI for the P235/50R18 All Season (97V) Michelin tires.
  • 150mphclub150mphclub Member Posts: 316
    I am quite surprised. I have the FE2 suspension and P235/50R18 All Season (97V) Michelin tires on my '09 CTS. 35 psi rides quite comfortably both city & highway.
  • jgaffney1jgaffney1 Member Posts: 41
    08 CTS DI.......36 lbs.....and rides like a dream.....
  • srynsryn Member Posts: 29
    I'm assuming the DI engine, once broken in, will do better than the 17.1 mpg I've gotten over the last two tankfulls? I'm still under 800 miles total.
  • bingomanbingoman Member Posts: 373
    I think that the first few times you fill up the tank it stretches a little so that it takes more gas than you used. This throws off your mileage calculations for the first few hundred miles. ;):D
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Member Posts: 1,739
    Now that is a new one :surprise:
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    I don't see how that is possible. There is an pressure release valve that lets pressure out and the gas vapours are collected by the charcoal filter and recyled into the intake manifold (but not counted by the computer although the oxygen sensor will detect it). I have found that my SRX is getting better mileage this summer, with 20,000 miles on it now, than last summer when it was new. The difference is about 1 MPG or so.
  • bingomanbingoman Member Posts: 373
    I was just kidding, thats why the "wink" and "smile".
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    OK.
  • sls002sls002 Member Posts: 2,788
    My experience with new cars is that your mileage will improve after the engine is broken in, which will take about 10,000+ miles. However the improvement is probably less than 10%, or maybe 1-2 MPG. I find that fuel consumption varies from tankfull to tankfull and averaging 5 tanks results in a more consistent consumption rate.
  • jgaffney1jgaffney1 Member Posts: 41
    17 MPG is about right in the city. 24 or more even on the highway with cruise control. Gas milage is hard to put your finger on (for me anyway) because during the course of any tank full I know I have "play time" and really stick my foot in it.

    In Northern NJ there are quite a few open roads..(real open) I mean....REALLY open...where play time just seems to "happen".

    I guess if I was that mindfull of gas mileage I'd would have gone and bought a Toyota.......:)
  • james104james104 Member Posts: 21
    Well I have had my 2009 CTS DI for a few weeks and I offer up these impressions (IE. My OPINIONS) for anyone who might find them helpful. Obviously I am discussing my vehicle with the options I have purchased; please do your homework as not everything I mention is standard on the vehicle.

    To begin with, I must come clean; on an earlier post I mentioned how I ordered my car without the navigation and sunroof options. I discussed how I agreed with others who have posted to this forum how awful the translucent "cheesecloth" sunroof cover was, and that was the reason I was not getting a sunroof. Ok, you all know what is coming. My dealer called a month ago and said that the car I ordered did not have a build date because GM ran out of the polished chrome wheels (which I ordered) and would not set a build date until all parts were available. Ok, this was understandable. He then went on to say the I could get the exact car I wanted, albeit with the navigation and sunroof options as this car was in fact being built. A standard dealer tactic? Maybe; however, I asked for his best price on this vehicle and found it to be a better deal percentage-wise than my original order (of course more actual dollars but luckily I had the funds to do it) and I said what the heck and bought it (very unlike me I can assure you). I took possession of the car about a week and a half later. So, my first impressions after a couple of weeks living with the 2009 CTS are as follows:

    1. I love the sunroof. I live in Dallas, TX and we have been in triple digits this summer. The car does NOT get hotter with the cheesecloth cover - it works great. I also thought I would mind the little bit of extra light coming in the interior - I do not mind it; actually I believe it compliments the light grey interior on my vehicle to be a little brighter inside (again, the cheesecloth cover does not let a whole lot of light in - it is very subtle). I also LOVE how large the actual glass area is on the sunroof.
    2. Originally I thought the navigation option an expensive extravagance...and it is. Having said that, consider if you will (and assuming you have the funds), in my opinion, the option is a nice one to have. At first I did not think I needed it because my iPhone has Google maps on it, which works GREAT. I have used my phone on lots of business trips in lots of rental cars and it worked, and continues to work, like a charm. However, like anything else that is a luxury option, the built-in navigation is NICE. I can keep my eyes on the road, I do not have to even guess at which exit or lane to be in on a multiple lane exit, etc. as the navigation system talks you through it. I do not use it everyday true, but I am surprised on how much I do use it. You start getting very used to all the POI (points of interest) icons which show you gas stations, restaurants, etc near you. Helpful when traveling around parts of the D/FW Metroplex I am not familiar with. Also, with the 8” screen, more information and options show up with the audio system, setting preferences is easier, etc. An extravagance? Maybe; but like my ventilated seats (an absolute necessity in Dallas), a darn good one.
    3. I like the way the light titanium (grey) interior has black carpeting so stains do not easily show. I think the light color of the seats, ceiling and trim - looks very sophisticated. Do be advised that scuffmarks do show up easily on the door kick panels. I clean these weekly (yes I am THAT type). :>
    4. Time to insert some rants. I agree somewhat with the posters RE. the location (and angle in my opinion) for the dead pedal (footrest). I am 5’-11” and I find it sometimes to be too far for me, sometimes actually ok. This can vary some days depending upon how I feel when driving. Some days fine, while others I notice it, but not terribly. I have yet to take a long trip in the vehicle, so I might have more of an opinion after spending several hours in the car. One item that I have noticed; (as I shift around a lot – no matter how comfortable I am) when I bring my left leg up closer to the seat to get it in a more vertical position I can never really get it in a comfortable position as the seat is close to the floor making the floor pan seem very high. For comparison I never had this issue in my 2002 New Beetle Turbo S.
    5. The seats are of average comfort when not compared to anything else…they are fine but my friends 2007 Infiniti M35 has MUCH better front seats, (in terms of plush-ness and road holding grip-the-body comfort) as does the Lexus GS 350 I test drove (in terms of plush-ness). The CTS headrest is not as cushy/comfy feeling as on the M. (The headrest comfort on the CTS is about the same as on the Lexus).
    6. The center stack is wide and hard, so leaning your leg against it is not entirely comfortable to me. This one I knew before purchasing the vehicle as I discovered this on the test drive. Obviously not a deal breaker for me.
    7. The interior is extremely good looking; however, I still find the brushed (aluminum-look) plastic cheap looking and may replace it at a later date with real brushed aluminum trim. The plastic chrome trim on the clock looks exactly like, well, plastic chrome! To nearly the same extent, so does the plastic chrome trim rings around the gage nacelle clusters. The wood inserts are as good as in cars in this class – actually a little better than most. I admit that I find the more matte finished wood on the Infiniti M35 better looking. I find the rear seat headrests a little small and not as elegant as the competition in its’ class, or even as nice as in a late model Toyota Camry. The sill below the side window is high and narrow – not good for leaning your elbow on when the window is closed…even when the window is open, the sills are high. I notice the high sills most often when pulling up to a mailbox, ATM, etc. I would suggest reviewing how this works for you when test driving the car.
    8. Back to the love: I love the thick-grip leather-wrapped steering wheel with the wood insert at the top. I love the wood insert on the shifter. I love the steering wheel controls, the way they are set up and the way that they function. I love all of the user-defined preferences that can be set by the individual, I love the feel of the radio controls and the steering wheel mounted stalks. I love the extending sun visors (to block sun from the side windows). The shifter has a great, short shift from park into drive – hard to explain, go and try it. It just feels great.
    9. The Bluetooth works flawlessly with my iPhone, I love the voice-activated feature to use the phone (especially since the iPhone does not have a voice-activated feature on it’s own - don’t get me started on this omission). The iPod connection works quite well – (well there are some niggling problems, I will discuss the negative next), having all of the iPod choices (Artist, Songs, Album
  • james104james104 Member Posts: 21
    ). The iPod connection works quite well – (well there are some niggling problems, I will discuss the negative next), having all of the iPod choices (Artist, Songs, Album, Genre, etc) show up on that big 8” touch screen, awesome! No more fumbling with an MP3 player connected to an aux. port and manually fussing with the MP3 player while driving…heaven! When the audio unit is switched off, the iPod is switched off; it will not drain the car’s battery. Also, the car charges the iPod when it is on. The negative: Sometimes the system says it has an error and needs the iPod to be re-booted. It does not…so far I just press the “back” button on the Navigation unit’s touch screen and I can get back to a previous menu. This has only happened when I quickly bounce in and out of menus too often and too fast. That’s the only negative.
    10. The XM radio is cool, as I never had it before. I am hearing lots of new material rather than the same old clear channel crap on the local stations (yes, I do like to visit the world away from the iPod once in a while to stay caught up). It is nice to have more variety with talk radio as well.
    11. The way the auto locking doors work is better than on most vehicles (that I know about anyway) as you just have to walk away from the car for it to lock; no touching the door handle, etc as with my wife’s Highlander, or my friend’s Infiniti M35. Just walk up to the locked trunk to open it (assuming the key is in your pocket, bag, or purse). No fumbling with key fobs. You can set how long after you exit the car for the doors to lock, as well as what audio and visual cues (if any) you want to confirm the doors lock (IE horn and lights, horn only, lights only, etc.). The auto start is great for starting the car and cooling it off, or warming it up (depends on the season of course) as all your HVAC comes on exactly as it was when you last turned the vehicle off. Even just running the car for 15 seconds before getting in takes the extreme temperature edge off (no sense running the car too long prior to driving with gas prices as they are).
    12. I will not go into any detail, but the FE2 suspension (IE. All-Season tire performance package is great, as are the dark-blasting capability of the HID (type of headlight lamp) and adaptive headlights (IE. The headlights will turn as you turn the steering wheel).
    13. One cool gimmick: When turning on the car, the needles on the gages all rotate at the same time to “redline” and then back to zero…cool to watch…I have not grown tired of this “pre-show” yet. FYI: The Infiniti M35 has this “feature” as well.
    14. The driving experience: I am no expert, but the car to me feels very responsive when I want it too be, while maintaining an extremely comfortable ride when you just want to cruise and are taking it easy. Kind of like my Les Paul (electric) guitar…a great biting attack when cranked and played hard, and smooth as jazzy Mark Knopfler silk when played gently for all you pickers out there).
    15. I went ahead and paid the 18 bucks for the 130 minutes of phone talk time (1 year) in case of emergency, or if I just simply forget my phone. We’ll see if this is a good investment in time. I do like having the peace of mind with On Star for emergency (IE. Crash) situations, to call for help, or hopefully have help called for me if I am incapacitated.
    That is it for now; I hope these opinions/comments were helpful in some way.
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Member Posts: 1,739
    Great posts. One feature I love on my wifes STS nav that we use even more on a trip is the ability to go site seeing after programing in the motels address and not have to worry about getting lost. Do I turn here or here and what was the name of the street I need to find. We just enjoy the stieseeing, not worrying about having to back track. When done just tell it to return to the motel and sit back and follow orders. (Only time I don't mind a woman telling me where to go) Please ladies, just a joke, no flames please. :shades:
  • james104james104 Member Posts: 21
    Thank you dmathews3, I got a lot out of this forum prior to deciding on the CTS, I just wanted to give a little back! Your comment RE. sightseeing is one I did not think of...thank you for the tip. A couple of more thoughts:
    Yes, one can buy a less expensive after market GPS that has all of the same functions. Just consider it will have a smaller screen thus showing less map and or features at a time, and has to be put in and taken down constantly when leaving the vehicle, less it tempt thieves (I have had a previous car's side window smashed in to get at a radar detector). Again, built-in is a luxury nicety!

    I forgot to mention how well the rear parking sensor system works. The system has the familiar audible beep sensors, with the added bonus of a three lamp lighting system mounted above the rear window that you see in the rear view mirror when backing up. The combination of visual and audible cues is very effective foe me when backing up. I actually like it much better than my wife's back up camera on her Highlander.
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Member Posts: 1,739
    I drove a DTS with both front and rear parking sensors and found the front ones were 10 times more valuable to me as I very seldom ever back up. So they should make them both available on all Caddies.
  • bingomanbingoman Member Posts: 373
    What do you use the front sensor for?
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Member Posts: 1,739
    For the same things you use the rear for. Pulling into my local quickie food store that has those big " pipes full on concrete to bang up against. Being the front/rear bumpers are plastic and if needed to be repainted they that that big buck paint that bends.
  • 150mphclub150mphclub Member Posts: 316
    I now have 750 miles on my odometer. I just filled up after a 425 mile trip (about 85% highway & 15% city). I got 28.4 mpg for the trip.
  • bingomanbingoman Member Posts: 373
    What speed did you drive on the highway?
  • james104james104 Member Posts: 21
    Recently someone on my block had to leave their 2008 Tahoe parked outside at night - in the morning the vehicle was up on blocks. That got me thinking that my 18" polished chrome "bling" wheels on my CTS are probably a target. Does anybody have any experience with wheel locks? I know nothing is going to be 100% security, but I was just wondering. I have seen McGard and Gorilla brands advertised. Any thoughts? Also, I thought about keeping the wheel lock key in the trunk with the spare - but I wonder if thieves will think the key is in the glove compartment and break a window to get into the vehicle. Argh...what to do, what to do?
    Another question - the Owner's manual says tinting the windows may decrease the sensitivity of the GPS. Of course I would not get a metallic tint, but I do not think that it particularly states metallic tint. Any tint I think. Thoughts / experience? :confuse:
  • bingomanbingoman Member Posts: 373
    I had locks on my last car. I kept the key in a plastic bag with the replaced nuts in the wheel well. I don't think anyone would want to waste time breaking into the car and looking for the key, which could be anywhere, the glove compartment, the center console, the door pockets, etc., while the horn is blaring. I would expect they would come with a set of keys or bypass the car for an easier target.
  • 150mphclub150mphclub Member Posts: 316
    I kept it around 67/68 until I hit 500 on the odometer. Then I kicked it up to 72/73.

    I am driving to Vail on 8/23. I plan to keep it in the 77/78 range for that trip. Will report when I get back.
  • jgaffney1jgaffney1 Member Posts: 41
    I have the step before Limo tint all around except for the windshield.....it has no effect on my gps. All works fine.
  • srynsryn Member Posts: 29
    I'm jealous. My driving is roughly 65% city; 35% highway. My last two fills have reflected a butt-ugly 17 and 17.1 miles per gallon respectively. Nothing like V-8 gas mileage on V-6 response.
  • jgaffney1jgaffney1 Member Posts: 41
    Yes..smaller on the passenger side because of the AWD transfer case hump and the brake pedal is closer to the gas pedal by a hair causing "clipping" of the brake pad when you step on the gas until such time when you re-train your foot.
  • srynsryn Member Posts: 29
    How can you tell for sure whether the car is a FE2 or FE3 suspension? I don't see any such designation on the sticker.
  • james104james104 Member Posts: 21
    My understanding is the PERFORMANCE COLLECTION 18" All-Season Tire Performance Package is the FE2 suspension, and the PERFORMANCE PACKAGE - 18" SUMMER TIRE is the FE3 suspension. I believe the FE2 and FE3 designations are internal GM descriptions.
  • rcantwellrcantwell Member Posts: 77
    One way is the tires. The FE2 will have the 18 inch all season tires, and the FE3 will have the 18 inch summer only tires. I think. Hope this helps.
  • james104james104 Member Posts: 21
    Did anybody get the optional compact spare tire? Does it just have a steel rim? Mine is on order and the dealer says he is having trouble getting one...

    BTW thanks for your responses to my previous questions bingoman and jgaffney1.
  • bingomanbingoman Member Posts: 373
    The compact spare is a black painted, cast alloy, five spoke wheel. It can be used for up to three thousand miles at up to 65 mph.

    I drove on it for about two hundred miles after a mishap coming home from Vegas, and I had no problems with handling, although I drove at only 55 mph because of a misunderstanding. I had the flashers on on the freeway and no one gave me any trouble. The left rear tire was destroyed by a large piece of road debris and I would have been up the proverbial creek if I had had the inflator kit.
  • sevenfeet0sevenfeet0 Member Posts: 486
    The previous generation CTS had this black wheel too. I had to use it once with my '03 CTS after a flat. I was surprised that someone actually bothered to style a wheel that most likely wouldn't get seen. Considering that most compact spares are about as a attractive as a utility truck, this one is actually nice to look at.
  • jgaffney1jgaffney1 Member Posts: 41
    I have 2008 CTS DI AWD and I was told the olny thing I have is an air punp and a can of fix a flat in my trunk. The spares were eliminated.....
    I have never checked under the trunk cover....guess I should! :)
  • sevenfeet0sevenfeet0 Member Posts: 486
    This was a great post...thanks for your comments. As many of the regulars around here know, I've been wanting to get back to a CTS for some time since I sold my '03 to get into a '05 SRX (kids happen). But our family just hasn't been able to make the financial argument work yet.

    That being said, my wife and I rented a CTS from Avis last weekend while in the Boston area visiting family. Since many of her family members were spread out over south east Massachusetts, this gave my wife and I a lot more time with the car...about 300 driving miles versus the last two times I've rented the CTS (also in Boston but only for short two day business trips). This was also the first time my wife had gotten a chance to drive the vehicle. She really really liked it...enough to offer to trade our SRX for it.

    Needless to say after three years of driving the SRX kidmobile (which we like), getting back behind the wheel of a true sports sedan is extremely inviting. Our SRX is based on the old CTS, which is good and bad. Good since it's a rear drive sporty vehicle at heart. Bad since it relies on the original CTS dashboard design, which has the distinction of being expensive and looking cheap all at once. The SRX has lots of room behind the second seat and hauls lots of gear (kids bikes, Costco, Home Depot). But it's rides high like other SUVs and just doesn't have the complete sporting spirit of the '03 CTS LuxSport it replaced.

    We'll keep the SRX into '09 but now Cadillac will have two vehicles we could replace it with. The first is the '10 SRX due next summer to replace our car. The new SRX will copy the CTS interior again, but this time that's not a bad thing. It'll be smaller than our SRX so I doubt it'll haul as much stuff, but I'm hoping the interior packaging is better than our car. The new pictures that got released today are promising. But this car is a FWD/AWD car and will likely never have the sporting spirit of the outgoing model.

    The CTS Sport Wagon on the other hand is something that I might be able to get behind. We could get our CTS and still be able to haul things. Gas mileage would likely be about the same as the sedan. It probably would weigh in the same class as the sedan. And all practical options for the wagon have been announced as being identical for the sedan...right down to mating a 304 HP DI engine with a 6-speed manual transmission if you choose (only available elsewhere at BMW and VW I think). AWD is available and 19" wheels are standard on this car. (!!!)

    There have been some occasions where the best in class hauling capabilities of the current SRX comes in real handy, and either way we'd have to give it up for either vehicle. The '10 SRX is an easy fit but may not make us any happier (unless there's a hybrid coming...my wife wants that). The CTS Sport Wagon I think is the vehicle we might end up with since we sacrifice almost nothing from the base car outside of its profile and get a new profile that will be unique, especially since the Dodge Magnum is now dead.
  • paopao Member Posts: 1,867
    The spare tire is an option and can be ordered
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Member Posts: 5,504
    ". . .which has the distinction of being expensive and looking cheap all at once."

    Well, that phrase alone is why we (or at least I) enjoy having you pipe in from time to time.

    Interesting comments -- having some hauling capacity has always been an objective of mine, and it eliminates all cars without fold-down rear seats. The European Avant/Sportwagon, which comprise ~50% of what's on the road over there hasn't caught on over here, but with the recent fuel price panic, it might.

    As always, continue to keep us posted on your journey.
    '08 Acura TSX, '17 Subaru Forester
  • knotemknotem Member Posts: 62
    "The upcoming discounts cover "nearly all" 2008 model-year cars and truck as well as some 2009 models. The promotion excludes 2008 medium-duty trucks but includes the 2009 Chevy Cobalt and HHR, the Pontiac Vibe and G5 and the Cadillac CTS."

    http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/correct-gm-brings-back-employee-pricing/st- ory.aspx?guid=%7B12636C54%2D6191%2D408B%2DACD7%2D4A0D0DA6BFC2%7D&dist=hplatest
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,192
    "The upcoming discounts cover "nearly all" 2008 model-year cars and truck as well as some 2009 models. The promotion excludes 2008 medium-duty trucks but includes the 2009 Chevy Cobalt and HHR, the Pontiac Vibe and G5 and the Cadillac CTS."

    The fact that the 2009 CTS is included, I find VERY interesting.....
    - Ray
    Not surprised that most every 'left-over' 2008 is included.....
    2022 X3 M40i
  • 150mphclub150mphclub Member Posts: 316
    You are very welcome everyone. This is probably a direct result of my already having purchased my 2009 CTS. It is certainly surprising, because 2009 CTS sales have been very good.
  • knotemknotem Member Posts: 62
    I need and advice, please!

    I knew that I can nock down $3k to $4k from the MSRP price, or pay from $0 to $500 above invoice and get the 2008 CTS, but I don’t know how to deal on the Employee Purchase plan.

    A dealer has RWD CTS with all options on his website:
    MSRP $48,420. After Employee Purchase Plan $42,812 - $2,000 Manufacturing rebate for 2008 model = $40,812. It’ll cost me $37,312 + tax and license when I take off the $3,500 GM MasterCard credit discount.

    All dealers in California have similar price deal on their websites

    I believe it’s a great price. My question is can I still make a deal with the dealer below the GM Employee Purchase Plan?

    Does anyone on this board bought any GM car in the past with an Employee Purchase Plan below the Plan price.

    Thanks
  • 150mphclub150mphclub Member Posts: 316
    You can't.

    Read all the fine print on your GM Mastercard. I do not believe your credits can be used with the Employee Purchase Plan.

    I also believe the Employee Purchase Plan is in lieu of all rebates.

    In other words--the Employee Purchase Plan IS the rock bottom price.

    If anyone knows differently, please cite your sources when you reply.
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Member Posts: 1,739
    Thats not true. Can't get through to the Caddy site but at the Chevy site for example the Trailblazer is $28490, employee price is $26005 minus $6000 total cash back for a price of $20005 plus options. Also I am a GM retired and I always use my GM Mastercard monies on a new GM purchase. Look here: http://www.cadillac.com/currentoffers/?zip=48911 So I would recheck your facts before posting.
  • rayainswrayainsw Member Posts: 3,192
    "Does anyone on this board bought any GM car in the past with an Employee Purchase Plan below the Plan price. "

    I bought a GM vehicle in 2005, the last time they offered a
    "Employee Price To All" program".

    The dealer a ( $49 over invoice ) fixed price dealer in NC took
    an additional $300 off the employee price - that was approx $23K,
    as I recall.

    Good luck!
    - Ray
    Drove a 2009 CTS this week, loaded, still not sufficiently impressed,
    even at Employee Price - of over $6K off.....
    2022 X3 M40i
  • briantucsonbriantucson Member Posts: 23
    As someone who is a current GM 'family' employee, I qualify for the GM employee pricing, and purchased my 2008 CTS in this fashion.

    I don't believe it's possible to negotiate a price lower than this. It is possible to use rebate dollars from your GM Card to get additional $$ off, but....this is not the result of any negotiations you can do.

    GM also offers low financing rates, and those can be combined with the lower purchase price to reduce your monthly payments (for those of us who purchase).
  • montanatruckmontanatruck Member Posts: 1
    is there any aftermarket headrests for the new CTS with adjustment other than up down? :D
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Member Posts: 1,739
    If you are a GM employee or family member who is entitled to the GMS price it is best to buy in the first part of the model run giving a month or two for the rebates to come into being. Why because the car costs the same in sept. as it does the following Aug. It's possible a bigger rebate may come along at the end of the run but in most cases it won't match what you have been paying for those 10 or 11 months plus you are driving a brand new current model car, not a year old one. As in any case there can be exceptions to the rule.
  • bingomanbingoman Member Posts: 373
    I don't know of anyone making a replacement headrest, but my solution is a small pillow or bolster that hangs from the headrest posts and sits behind my shoulders. This moves my head forward about two inches away from the headrest. I am much more comfortable this way.
  • sandy25sandy25 Member Posts: 65
    In addition to the employee discount on both the 2008 and 2009, Cadillac is offering a $2000 rebate on the 2008. Since this is the end of the model year does it make more sense to spend the extra $2k and get the 2009 when you cosnider the eventual trade-in value?
  • traderjtraderj Member Posts: 39
    I am also currently shopping the CTS and I asked the manger at the Cadillac dealership that exact question. He told me that you also have to take into account that there has been a price increase for the "09 of approx $1100-, so in effect, you are actually paying $3,000- less for the '08. If you trade it in 3-4 years what will the difference in value be? I don't know. Is $3000- reasonable? Maybe!
    Does anyone else have an opinion on this?
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