Lexus LS 600h/600h L

ljflx · March 2007

That car didn't have the exec chair.

cyclone4 · March 2007

Depending on the trunk size, I am hoping to special order it without any of that rear seat upgrade stuff. My dealer told me that I could special order it sometime this April. But everything hinges on the trunk space. I am not going to lease/purchase a car worth $100K+ with a tiny trunk. My thinking right now is that I will make a one payment (up front) lease option for 3 years. This will give me a lot of flexibility with the rapidly changing hybrid technology after 3 years.

feverhart · March 2007

You may want to check this link: http://link.brightcove.com/services/link/bcpid452319854/bctid694324497

480 hp and 0-60 in less than 5.4 seconds, WOW!

gtoskyline · March 2007

480hp sounds reasonable. GS450h has combined 339hp from 292hp ICE+ 197hp electric motor, gaining 47hp from electric drive.
LS600hL has a detuned 5.0L v8 ~400hp, an even more powerful electric motor and more powerful battery pack. The total hp will be over 450 for sure.

ljflx · March 2007

Well they e-mailed me back with this lingo:

The 2008 Lexus LS 600h is expected to start arriving in mid-2007. I apologize the information regarding the trunk size in the 2008
LS 600h is not yet available. As we approach the launch date of the LS 600h we will upload any new information we may have regarding the vehicle onto Lexus.com in the near future. The retail delivery of the new LS 600h will be the responsibility our Lexus dealers.

Now it's hard to understand or believe that Lexus doesn't know the trunk size of the car at this point unless they are tinkering with type of battery and/or battery placement, even now at this late date. The other logical alternative is they are still deciding on rear seat packaging to make standardized and this affects trunk size. The one that's far out there is they are embarrassed to disclose it but they have to at some point so why delay it.

My instinct says the car is being held up because they want the best battery available inside of it and that affects trunk size. I don't think they want to release this car and then a month or two later there's a battery upgrade on new ones delivered at that time. That will tick off the first buyers and Lexus would have to give a free dealer upgrade to those early buyers. They want this car to be golden from the first car that is sold to the last with clear cut-offs to the new batteries to be produced and differentiated prices reflecting an old battery vs a newer gen battery.

rennybosch · March 2007

I get the impression that the 600h will only come in a long wheel base, and therefore there is no need for the L designation. The message from Lexus quoted by ljflx seems to confirm that. Does anybody have any indication that there will be a short LS 600h? If not, the title of this thread can be shortened.

cyclone4 · March 2007

Len,

You make too much sense

I have been thinking of this same possibility as well. Maybe, just maybe, they are delaying the arrival of this car so that they can equip it with a new generation battery. This would change everything with the trunk size.

cyclone4 · March 2007

There is a short wheel base LS600h. However, this version is only available in Japan, Europe, and perhaps some other nations. However, here in the States, the LWB version is the only option.

rennybosch · March 2007

Thanks for the clarification, cyclone 4.

maxhonda99 · April 2007

Just saw a ad on ESPN2 at about 9:52PM EST during the Mets/Cardinals game. A ad for the LS600h zoomed by, must have been only about a 10 second spot....clearly stated...438 BHP.....

drfill · April 2007

I broke the story at High End Lounge.

Summer '07.

Surprised the car won't reach 450HP. Hopefully, a real improvement in economy is realized, or a sub-five second 0-60.

DrFill

cyclone4 · April 2007

The pricing for the new LS600HL was just announced by Lexus today. It starts at $104,000. This is lower than I thought it would be based on recent comments. The big question now is, what does this base price include. It obviously does not include the ottoman seat upgrade which I don't want in the first place. I imagine that it also does not include the advanced pre-collision system. I am also dying to find out the specs on the trunk size without the ottoman seat upgrade, cool box, etc. If anyone knows more info on this, it would be greatly appreciated.

ljflx · April 2007

Cyclone - If the price is out then the trunk size must be out too. Go back to the LS at Lexus.com for what is standard and optional. I doubt they changed that.

cyclone4 · April 2007

This is strange but I cannot find it anymore on the Lexus site.

cyclone4 · April 2007

I just chatted with a Lexus rep and he told me that the official announcement on pricing and options will be on the Lexus website on Monday, April 9. It is amazing how slow they are on these things.

ljflx · April 2007

They seemed to have removed it. This is the best I could find. You can click on the launch link on the right also but the detailed spec of standard and option features isn't there.

http://www.lexus.com/fcv/ls_hybrid.html

cyclone4 · April 2007

I hope I am not disappointed when I see the specs on the trunk. Hopefully, the trunk space will be reasonably large without the rear seat upgrade package. It looks like I have to wait until Monday to find out for sure.

ljflx · April 2007

Cyclone,

The way I configured the LS460L I end up with an 18' trunk. I'm actually quite satisfied with the trunk on the Infiniti G35 I just leased.

BTW thanks for the nice words on my property pix.

cyclone4 · April 2007

"BTW thanks for the nice words on my property pix."

You are quite welcome. You do have a gorgeous "piece" (large) of property.

Getting back to the LS, I know you ordered your LS460L so that you will have the full trunk space. I am just wondering how big of a trunk I can get if I special order the LS600HL. Hopefully, the answer will be known Monday.

ljflx · April 2007

When I looked at the LS460L trunk size on cars that had the rear seat upgrade it didn't look all that small to me. I had to ask my sales guy if Lexus had the right calculations on the size. The trunk size actually was not all that crucial to me because I use my SUV on long hauls with a lot of luggage anyway. My issue was I'd rather the money be put to better use than on back seat goodies that my kids would not make much use of and as an added bonus I get the large trunk. The one thing I do like is that cool box though. Keys for me were the air suspension, lux package and the navigation and ML radio. I also really wanted the pre-collision though that was of less importance overall. But in my mind I traded off Lexus link and the rear seat package for the pre-collision package as that tradeoff was just about a perfect wash.

BTW - the new Infiniti crossover that comes out in 2008 has all around cameras that will beam in a view all around the vehicle into the cabin. I'm hoping Lexus does something similar on the LX570 as I see that as my next SUV in 18 months.

cyclone4 · April 2007

I just got off the phone with the salesman at my dealer. He told me that Lexus is now confirming that the trunk size in the LS600HL (without the rear seat upgrade) will be the same size as that in the LS460L (with the rear seat upgrade LS460L). That means it will be 12 cubic feet. That is not too bad. The horror stories about a minuscule trunk were unfounded, at least without the rear seat upgrade.

Len, I am also very impressed with the LX570. My wife has been driving the RX400h since May 1, 2005 on a 3 year lease. I am not sure yet what we will be getting (it will be another SUV) next year at this time, but the LX570 is too big for our needs. Our kids are grown up now and away from home so we don't need a huge vehicle.

My excitement is now reaching new high levels about my prospects of owning the LS600HL within the next 4 months. It will be interesting to see how most of them will be shipped. My guess is that most will be shipped without the ottoman seat, rear seat upgrade options. If that is the case, I would not have to special order (as long as it comes with the advanced pre-collision).

ljflx · April 2007

Cyclone,

I'd check back with that dealer about how the car is configured where you live. Lexus configures the cars based on what regional dealers come to consensus on. So dealers in the midwest or far west may feel there customers want the car configured differently than dealers in the northeast do. Here where I live most LS460L's (don't know about the 460SWB) have been shipped with the rear seat upgrade as a stndardized option. My instinct though is that te LS600HL will not be impacted by the rear seat upgrade and that it will have the same size trunk with or without it. But the dealer would know for sure.

The more I look at the LX570 the more I like it. I'd say it's 80-20 I take that in 18 months. I still have the need for the larger SUV and I bet that thing rides like an LS460.

BTW - 3 days of satellite radio in the G35 and I'm hooked on it. Sat radio has an all traffic channel that is a great asset also. But in the LS's equipped with nav you get real time traffic updates anyway and I'm interested to see how well that works.

Hold onto your dream and excitement. The LS600HL is absolutely amazing.

cyclone4 · April 2007

You may be right about the trunk size. It might be the same size with or without the rear seat upgrade. I get confused between rear seat upgrade, ottoman seat, cool box, etc. The good news is that the trunk will not be all that small. A couple months ago, the dealer was telling me that the trunk space would be the same as in the GS450h. I tried to explain to them that I thought they were wrong. It will be interesting to see the exact specs with the various options next week.

I am also looking forward to satellite radio. BTW, I think the merger between XM and Sirius will be approved by the government. That will make satellite radio even better. For example, one will be able to get both MLB and the NFL once the merger is approved.

cyclone4 · April 2007

I just chatted with a rep at Lexus. He finally has some info about the options and pricing. There are 4 interior packages: 1)Premium includes goes for $4,000 and includes rear power seats with head rests with memory, rear heated/cooled seats, rear seat side airbags, advanced parking system and Lexus Link. Premium package 2 is $7,450 and includes everything in one plus 4 zone climate control with air purifier, 9 inch DVD screen, rear cool box, rear audio control panel, power rear door sun shades, additional wood trim. 3) Premium package 2 with advanced pre-collision goes for $12,000 and includes everything listed above plus the advanced pre-collision. 4) This is the executive rear seat package. It includes everything above plus executive seating. This goes for $17,000 and must be special ordered. There you have it.

In my case, I think I need to special order since, I do not want or need any of that reat seat packaging. However, I do want the advanced pre-collision. I know that ljflx special ordered his LS460L without all the rear seat "stuff". Hopefully, I can do the same with the LS600HL. I think I am in pretty good shape since I am first on the list and the dealer will hopefully accomodate me. It will probably take several months to get here but I am willing to wait to get what I want.

ljflx · April 2007

So fully loaded the car tops out at $121K. My dealer had said it would run to $120K on custom orders in the late fall and the exec seating is always custom order. So he was right.

Cyclone - the $104K base car sounds like more than enough. My feeling is most of these will ship in the $108,000- $111,750 price range though. If they had put the DVD screens in the headrests I'd take that car in a heartbeat and hope for a 12' trunk at a minimum. The 9" screen though might interfere with vision at the rear window. I still think this was a mistake and that they will go the headrest way at some point.

My car arrives May 16th now. They got the final ticket on it today. I will likely be in California that week though so I may not pick it up to the very end of May. I'm also thinking of waiting to June 1 and doing a 39 month lease so that I'm primed for a new model year car when this lease is up.

Glad I took that G35. Not only do I love that car but it gives me flexibility to wait for the LS460L.

I'm getting jealous about this LS600HL though. This thing is awesome. I'd order it right away if I were you.

cyclone4 · April 2007

Happy to hear you are enjoying the G35.

I believe you are correct that most will ship in the $108,000-$111,750 range. I sure hope they allow me to special order it just as you did with the LS460L. I don't see why not, do you? I am talking to the dealer first thing tomorrow and heck I may order it tomorrow if they let me and as long as I am assured that the trunk will be at least 12 cf.

Officially, the Lexus rep told me that the exact specs and pricing will be announced by Lexus on April 23, but he did reveal all the above information. In fact, I left word for him to call me tomorrow so that I can further discuss the options and specs. I will update when I have new information.

ljflx · April 2007

They will let you custom order it - it's just a 3-4 month wait. But I wouldn't be surprised if he gets a few cars in just base form either given it's such a loaded car - but they will be few and far in between.

I'd ask if he has any allotment of cars at the $104K price point and what colors and something we usually forget - what tires come on the car. You may want to give him a heads-up on your preference. I always ask for the Michelins over the Dunlops.

BTW - are ther special colors (something my dealer said would be the case) on the LS600HL? You may want to ask him that. Supposedly there wil be additional exterior colors not available on the LS460 and 460L. My dealer had said he thought that would be the case when he told me about that $120K price.

sidgriggs · April 2007

My dealer said all of their cars are coming in at 2 price levels: 115,000 & 125,000 The 125,000 includes all the back seat goodies. Dallas area dealer.

ljflx · April 2007

I think Cyclone has a better handle on prices from his dealer given the more detailed data he posted. I've seen the type of sheets he quoted from on other Lexus vehicles and in fact have the one for the LS460 and 460L at home.

cyclone4 · April 2007

Here is the very latest. I again talked to the Lexus rep today (he actually called me) and I also talked to my dealer. The pricing of the packages I listed above is very accurate. I just found out that the exact trunk size is 11.65cf no matter what options one chooses (with the possible exception of the executive seating). I would obviously prefer it to be bigger, but this is not a deal breaker for me. It is basically the same size as the LS460L with the rear seat goodies. The size of that trunk is 12cf. Less than 6 cubic inches difference is almost nothing. However, there is a large difference between the GS450H (7.5cf) and the LS600HL (11.65cf).

The dealer thinks that I can special order it without a lot of those rear seat goodies and just go with the advanced pre-collision system. I am likely going to order it by the end of the week.

ljflx · April 2007

Charlie,

Go get it partner. I had a feeling the trunk size didn't matter with or without the rear seat stuff. Did my wanting/taking the pre-collision effect your desire for it? I just thought that was a great technology for the money and probably a better long-term asset on the car. We've really configured the cars the same way if you get that option, albeit you're going with the hybrid and it's extra greatness.

Are you buying or leasing? Keep us posted. BTW - are there specialized colors and what's your prefernce on color. I took the smokey granite mica and light gray interior.

cyclone4 · April 2007

Len,

I am 99% sure that I am getting it. As far as the pre-collision is concerned, your ordering it has not factored into my decision. I see this as great safety feature. Besides, this is the advanced pre-collision with camera pointing to the driver, etc. I love new technological features. I am pretty sure that I will order the smoky granite mica (formerly known as flint mica) with a black interior. This is the color combo that I have on my 2004 LS430. I have not grown tired of it. It looks very classy in my opinion.

I am leasing. You know a hell of a lot more about this than I do, but I am thinking about a one payment lease (up front) for 3 years. I will probably have to put down about $55,000 up front. I own my current car and I can probably get $38,0000 to $40,000 for it if I sell it myself. I already have a couple people interested in it. 3 years from now I will have the freedom of choice. I am sure that technology will be rapidly changing with the hybrids. What do you think? Am I doing the right thing with this one payment lease option?

I am not sure about the specialized colors. I forgot to ask the dealer today, but I think there are a few different colors available with the LS600HL.

ljflx · April 2007

I always like month to month leases. But running a present value on a stream of payments vs one upfront payment is easy if you know the interest rate on the money you'll be passing up with the upfront payment. There's not a great amount of money at issue here - just whether you want the larger capital on hand.

I also would lease as the technology improvements will be large in 3 years. Funny how we both thought the same exact way on the pre-collision.

Best of luck and it's always a pleasure to discuss this stuff with you. You're a class act.

cyclone4 · April 2007

Thank you for your kind words Len. The feeling is mutual.

I told the salesman today to go ahead and find out about the special order (what options I can order and what I can leave out as far as the rear seating area is concerned). This is it! As soon as he comes back with the special order info, I am ordering this car. He thinks it will be early next week before I can actually place the order.

cyclone4 · April 2007

Len,

The salesman just called me with the optional information. He is telling me that I will have no choice on some of the bundled packaging according to the sheet he just received from Lexus. For example, the advanced pre-collision comes with 4 zone air, adjustable rear seats, cool box, etc., etc. I tried to tell him that I don't think I need to order some of these options in order to get the advanced pre-collision system. Afterall, what is the purpose of a special order? He said that we both (him and me) have to study this tomorrow and call a high level Lexus rep for a better answer.

I know that when you special ordered your LS460L you were not forced to take those rear seat options. So, I don't see why I cannot do the same with the LS600HL. More will be revealed tomorrow.

BTW, he told me that the LS460L's have been arriving with the Bridgestone tires. He assumes that will also be the case for the LS600HL. Are Michelins better than Bridgestone?

feverhart · April 2007

Nope! I've used both on my LS 430s, including the Pilot Sport. For me Bridgestone was superior. Check out Tire Rack ratings, and reviews.

ljflx · April 2007

I'd take either tire. Bridgestones are excellent tires also in my experience and would be my second choice but right on the heels of the Michelins. Dunlops I'm not all that happy with.

On the LS460L the pre-collision is an independent option from other packages. Be careful here with the dealer as they tend to mess up and the spec sheet is confusing and leaves a lot to be desired. When I was ordering they were confusing what is required to get the pre-collision (symbol is PS on spec sheets) on the SWB with the LWB. For example to get it on the SWB you need one of the nav packages. But nav is standard on the LS460L. So the dealer called Lexus while I was there and was told the pre-collision option had no package requirement for the LWB model. Apparently the back-up camera is a key item for the pre-collision system and you have to get nav to get it. But again that's standard on the 460L and hybrid. The lux package, rear seat packages etc are not required to get the pre-collison option on the LS460 and as I noted there is no requirement at all on the LS460L. I would think that would be the same for the hybrid.

Make sure your dealer is not getting anything confused with the 9100 model - which is the LS460SWB. 9120 is the body number for the LS460L. All of the data I just noted comes from the 4 page spec sheet LS460 Suggested Price Guide.

cyclone4 · April 2007

Thanks as always Len. I will certainly go over it with him tomorrow with a fine tooth comb.

ljflx · April 2007

Let me know what you do - particularly color combo. I'm still wondering if they have additional color combos beyond the LS460/460L.

cyclone4 · April 2007

I basically ordered my LS600HL this afternoon but there is a bit of a question on what options I'll be getting. As it stands right now I will be getting the bundled package but I will know for sure by Monday. Here is the story on the optional packages. The following options are not an "option" with the advanced pre-collision package: Lexus Link, cooler and air purifier + roof rear air conditioner, overseas special utility package, slide power mid control wire turn rear seat adjuster, pedestrian +p brake pre crash system (love this), slide power mid control wire turn rear seat adjuster, WNPA back monitor (could be back-up camera), RR display television and VTR, and finally LED + halogen + AFS +infrared rays headlamp.

I am pretty sure that some of these are just part of the pre-collision system and are therefore necessary. I am not sure why they are listing the LED....headlamp since that is standard. But it may have something to do with the portion that says "infrared rays". Maybe this is also related to the pre collision system.

Now here is the "stinker". As you all know they will build very few of these (maybe 2,000) the first year at least. The salesman whom I have known and trust for years, told me that yes I can special order it and he is waiting to hear from the Lexus Midwest production manager in Chicago. However, since the supply is so incredibly limited, I will have a much better chance of getting one if I go ahead and order it with the bundled package and the various options with the advanced pre-collision system. That package comes to a "cool" $12,000. Even the color combo could be a problem since they will allocate so few with the various color combos. I ordered it with smoky granite mica with black interior. If someone orders one with a different color combo and it comes in that way, he will get his car before I do even though I am first on the list. By Monday, the Midwest production manager will give us his opinion on whether or not I have a chance to get one special ordered exactly as I prefer it. I think that the answer is yes I can, but I may not get it until next year sometime. Thus, I may bite the bullet and go with the bundled package. That way, I will probably have possession by later June or July of this year.

Len, as far as other colors are concerned, the only thing I found out is that there is a very special Nieman Marcus edition. The exterior color for this is almost the same as the smoky granite mica. Wow! I am out of breath

ljflx · April 2007

Cyclone - I'd take that car however they sent it to me as long as it didn't have the exec seating. If your first paragraph is right it means I'm again getting Lexus link. i had no idea you got that with the pre-collision.

BTW - I can't tell you how much I love this little G35. Wife loves it even more and my son is going around telling everyone he gets it later this year. I knew I should have built a 4 car garage. I let the builder talk me out of it!

cyclone4 · April 2007

Len, I am looking at the spec sheet with the plain pre-collision system (instead of advanced) and for the LS600HL it does not list Lexus Link as a necessary option. However, there may be a "trick" involved here that I am missing. I am definitely not getting the executive seating.

That G35 must be something else. I wish you continued enjoyment.

ljflx · April 2007

Cyclone - The car looks great in the Smokey granite mica. I also love the grey birdseye wood. It's a nice change of pace and it looks like granite to me.

drfill · April 2007

Mercedes S-Class sales have taken a dip recently, well for the entire first quarter.

But that doesn't mean that the people have taken a liking to the Lexus LS. Or even that they are cross-shopped.

It's strickly a coincidence. I'm sure of it!

http://prnewswire.com/cgi-bin/stories.pl?ACCT=104&STORY=/www/story/04-03-2007/00- 04559001&EDATE=

And the 600hL will have equally limited effect as well.

DrFill

pat · April 2007

Hey doc, I moved your other post - here's the link: drfill, "Luxury Lounge" #833, 16 Apr 2007 10:09 am.

cyclone4 · April 2007

I got the expected news from the dealer today. Basically, the Midwest production manager told my dealer that if I special order, I have zero chance of getting the LS600HL at least until some time next year. In fact, they are not even taking any special orders now. They are making so few of these cars that the news is not shocking to me.

Thus, my order is in for the Premium 2 Package with the Advanced Pre-collision system. I was told that even with this non-special order, it may be the end of the year before I can get this car. It depends on the color combos, etc. They were not at all kidding when they said they are only making about 2,000 of these the first year. BTW, I ordered the granite smokey mica with black interior.

ljflx · April 2007

Charlie,

All my best wishes with the car when you get it. It's a dream and has me really tempted right now.

In the current issue of Lexus magazine they have the LS600HL in the Nieman Marcus edition. That specialized color looks spectacular. My wife looked at it and wants to know if we can change our order. IMO there is no comparison to the way thr LS looks in LWB vs SWB. The car was really designed to be a LWB car in my eyes.

Don't know if the Nieman Marcus car is in the on-line mag but here's the link anyway.

http://www.lexus.com/magazine/q107/feature_600h/feature_600h_0.html

cyclone4 · April 2007

Thanks Len!I just hope that I can get mine by sometime this summer. Right now it feels like a wonderful dream that will eventually come true. Hey, maybe you can cancel your LS460L order and dream along with me as you await for your LS600HL

houdini1 · April 2007

Hmmm...I don't see any big difference in the looks of the swb and the lwb. We're talking about what, 4 or 5 inches? You would think it was a couple of feet the way some carry on.

They obviously would look the same from the front and rear and IMO a couple of inches does not make much difference on the side view. Can anyone post the two side by side for comparison?

ljflx · April 2007

Charlie,

I am very tempted right now. With the addition of the G35 I have time to wait as well. That is a real special car.

Lexus LS 600h/600h L

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