Subaru Forester (up to 2005)

p0926 · March 2006

Plus... about the only way you're going to get over 79k miles on a 2004 is by racking up a lot of hwy miles. Yes talk to the previous owner but I'd still pay for an independent mechanic to give it the once over (an honest dealer shouldn't mind a 2nd opinion). There haven't been any reported problems with the 2004s (nary a recall) so you should be able to look forward to many more trouble free miles.

-Frank

pert · March 2006

I would like to get my oil analyzed on my next oil change. How would I go about it. Thank you in advance

erikwi · March 2006

Hi all! I've been seriously considering a new Forester but I just don't know about Subarus. I've been driving VW's for 12 years but am frustrated with VW. The closest dealer is about 45 minutes from my house. The Subaru dealer is less than 5 minutes from my house. Are they really as good as everyone says they are? In order to get my VW serviced, I have to take a day off, when I can get one. A Subaru would be much easier to get serviced. Any advice?

mnf · March 2006

Read back in the forms and you will get some good feedback and some not so from a few. I can tell you I have owned many of Hondas and I still miss my 2000 Accord but for a all year round spunky nice car/suv you cant go wrong. Before I purchased my 2004 Forester I would see people at the gas station or store and i would go up to them and ask them on what they thought and not once did get a.. bad report....Good Luck .. Matt

raybear · March 2006

I've been driving VW's for 12 years

The key here is the plural, VW's, had you driven a Subaru it might have been the only one.

kavoom · March 2006

I am on my third Suby, an 04 Forester (Feb 05 purchase). That year has gotten great ratings on reliability and best small SUV for the year if I am not mistaken.

My last Subaru a 99 Outback "Sport" went 147K miles before trading in. I put One set of front brakes on, one timing belt, maintenance and one set of replacement tires which they left two on when I got rid of it.

I traded and got 2,500. But heck, I needed a new clutch, another timing belt, another set of tires, brakes and a body fix on the front right quarter panel. I was figuring around 2K for all of that over a six month period.

I got a killer deal getting it in 05. They are selling used ones with 19K miles for almost what I paid new. I tow a pop up camper (1,800 lbs)like a dream.

Oh and the dealer sold mine, I talked to the buyer before and I see his daughter tooling around in my old Suby occasionally with a big smile on her face.

Yes, suby's are worth it, I've always gotten my money's worth...And even the looks of the Tribeca's are growing on me.

kavoom · March 2006

Oh, I forgot to mention, my girlfriend who was ambivalent about mine new, just bought a new 06 two weeks ago. The safety ratings are what got her and the 04's were at the top of small SUV safety in 04 and the only ones not needing a tip over label as I understand...

once_for_all · March 2006

I have 50k on my '03 XS Forester, zero problems whatsoever. I still have 10k left on my OEM Geo tires even. Average tank mpg is about 27-27.5 (20% city).

So is it worth it? So far it is a great car. I wish it was a bit quieter. Part of the noise is due to the OEM tires, the other part due to window sealing.

Maybe the question to ask is would you buy another? Emphatically yes.

John

erikwi · March 2006

I've had really good luck with VW's but I'm starting a new job April 1 and getting it to Greensboro will be even harder if I have any problems. Plus with the way my GTI likes to spin tires on wet pavement, if it snows I'd have a hard time getting home. That's 2 reasons right there why to get a Forester. I've looked back over previous posts and gotten good info and I've talked to people that have Outbacks. None had anything negative to say about Subaru or the dealer for that matter.

I will say this though. I did a search on various websites for used Foresters and only found 4 within 100 miles of my house. I guess people hang on until the wheels fall of!

I would like some real world data though. What kind of fuel economy do you see? Any problems with pinging or spark knock on regular unleaded? I've read about piston slap and engines that rev themselves up. Is that a common problem?

Thanks!

204meca · March 2006

03 Forester XS, manual, 28K; 23-24mpg 70% short city trips, 29-31 mpg highway (I drive with a light foot), regular fuel, no pinging, reasonable power, only 1 problem ("cold clutch judder" that affected a few 03, replaced entire clutch assembly under warranty), no complaints. Piston slap apparently a problem on pre 03 models. I got it for the AWD, towing 2,000 bass boat & felt it was the best combination of reliablity, overall low operational cost, and comfort. It is a great car for what I needed.

erikwi · March 2006

I had a friend who had an early Subie, I think it was just called a Subaru GL sedan. That was back in the before they were AWD. Ed told me one time that all he'd ever done was brakes, water pump and thermostat, and spark plugs. Car had 100k+ on it when he was sideswiped on the highway and totaled it. He went out and found another just like it.

Thanks for the info. The 06 Forester is sounding better and better!

growler5 · March 2006

Fuel economy on '05 XS, manual , 26k miles: winter (Oct-Mar)is 28mpg, summer (Apr-Sep) is 30 mpg on regular, pings a bit once in a while (probably cheap gas), no slap. In 16 months, no unexpected service bills, just the usual ones for oil changes, tire rotation, etc.

The only glitch that ever needed attention was the hill-holder (prevents car from rolling backwards when stopped on an uphill incline). Easily adjusted for once and for all in 10 minutes at the dealer, or by you with instructions available on the web.

If you do buy a Forester, for essential amenities you'll want to add on the auto-dim mirror, arm rest, rubber mat for cargo area, and side cargo nets. And that moon roof is sooooo nice ....

ateixeira · March 2006

Don't get one, they are too reliable. Mine is 9 years old now and I don't have any excuses to trade it in, so they get annoying in that way.

It's true, though, I want a new one with heated seats and that giant moonroof, but I can't justify trading in my perfectly good '98.

We seem to get a lot of ex-VW owners.

-juice

erikwi · March 2006

Well, I don't particularly want a new car but my new job will make it all but impossible to get the VW to the dealer because it's about a 45 min. drive from my house. From work it's over an hour. If I didn't think I would have any more trouble with the VW I'd keep it but I've lost confidence in it.

That Subie is really looking good now! Especially if I won't lose much on fuel economy! You folks have been GREAT! When I get my Subie I know where to go for questions and suggestions.

ateixeira · March 2006

Cool, good luck shopping and drop back in to let us know when you get it, OK?

-juice

erikwi · March 2006

Thanks and will do! One last question. What oil does the Forester need? My VW takes synthetic 5W-30(required to keep warranty) and I have a bunch of quarts. Advance had it on sale last year and I bought like 10 cases with 6 in each case. I know I know, I shouldn't bought that much but I figured I'd have the car forever. If I had known then what I know now, I wouldn't have bought all that Syntec. Most everything now takes 5-30, even for my big 4x4 pickup. Will this stuff work in the Subie?

bigjohngo · March 2006

I recently spoke with someone regarding a 86,000 miles 2002 Forester Model S (used). I am very interested in purchasing this car, but I am unsure about the quality and cost of repair that I might need to do for the car in the near future.

So, could anyone who has owned a Forester 2002 model to share their advice with me?

once_for_all · March 2006

yup, the standard (at least in '03) is 5W30.

Its about $6 a quart here in CA now for Mobil 1, you probably got a spanking deal.

John

erikwi · March 2006

It was like 3.49 a quart, so yeah I got a deal! Good to know I should still be able to use it. Don't know if they'd let me exchange it for another weight.

Thanks John!

slazenger · March 2006

I am assuming that this is a private party deal. Try to get records for the following:

* There was a recall to avoid head gasket problem. It involved adding Subaru coolant additive. Make sure that this has been taken care of.
* Oil changes (every 7500miles).
* Tire rotations (every 7500miles).
* air filter replacement (every 15000 miles).
* Spark plugs replacement, coolant flush and fill with special additive from Subaru at 60K.
* When you get car inspected, pay special attention to
- Timing belt (recommended replacement - 105000miles)
- Wheel bearings
- Cat converter (I don't know if it is possible to get this tested)

Good Luck!

growler5 · March 2006

We seem to get a lot of ex-VW owners.

Now that you mention it, I did own a VW in the past - a VW Dasher. The Forester reminds me a lot of the Dasher (a hatchback) with the ability to haul a lot of stuff in the back.

The wife remembers the Dasher differently. When I brought up the idea of comparison-shopping the Passat wagon against the Forester, she nixed it right away. The memories of frequent vi$it$ to the local VW dealer'$ :sick: $ervice $hop still haunts her.

ateixeira · March 2006

The nail-in-the-coffin for a lot of ex-VW owners is the poor dealer service. A lot of people had to wait for ignition coils to come in, VW finally recalled them but could not get production to meet demand for the replacements.

-juice

erikwi · March 2006

All my problems have been under warranty so far though the day is coming where it'll be out of warranty. The only expense is taking a day off of work and driving 45 min. to the dealer. My previous GTI was rock solid reliable with only a couple of glitches. It was the previous experience with the brand (and getting one heck of a deal) that made me stick with them. Not any more though!

Every time I turn around I think of another question to ask you folks. How does the Forester do on windy days? Does it get knocked around or is it like a rock in the road?

once_for_all · March 2006

it is much better in the wind than high profile SUVs, and anything with a solid rear axle (John stating the obvious). We had a Trooper that really was scary on a mountain pass with cross winds. The Forester is much better, but it isn't a Legacy or Impreza either.

John

ateixeira · March 2006

It's tall and boxy, so you'll feel the wind more than you would in your GTI, but not as much as in a taller RAV4 or CR-V, for instance.

-juice

erikwi · March 2006

I've been hit before with a cross wind and changed lanes in that GTI so any improvement would be good.

I have all but convinced myself to go with the Forester with the premium package (I miss my sunroof) but I'm waiting to see if I'll have enough monthly income to afford it. I'm calling the dealer tomorrow and checking on what I want.

once_for_all · March 2006

you might look at the lease if you are cash strapped, I think it was $199 or low $200 (less than half compared to my payments on a 4 year loan).

John

once_for_all · March 2006

hmmm no more Forester leases in central California anyway.

But 2006 X is at $18,995.

Smoking deal.

John

once_for_all · March 2006

Fitzmall has X MTs at about $18.5, Autos at $19, PP MT at $22.1, PP Auto at $22.7.

Man great time to buy a Forester.

John

erikwi · March 2006

I did the build your own SOA's website and came up with $26k or so but that's like I would want it. I definately want heated seats and the moonroof would be nice...............

I'm going to go talk to the dealer and just see what I can do. I'd rather sell my car than trade since I'll lose a lot of my equity. I'm just going to check it out and see what they'll offer.

204meca · March 2006

Took my XS to the dealer today for 30K service & splash guards - Thank God for the Subbie Bucks!

While there, I sat in an 06. I thought the armrest extension feature was pretty slick. The 03's is back too far for me to comfortably use. I did not have a tape measure, but they look almost identical in size & mounting. Does anyone know if the could be swapped without any fuss? I may have to save up more SBs!

ateixeira · March 2006

The X is the better value because the rebate is bigger.

Notice it's a pretty huge jump in price to the Premium models ($3600-3700). Too bad the $2000 does not apply to those. I'd be tempted.

-juice

ezshift5 · April 2006

...03 Forester XS, manual, 28K; 23-24mpg 70% short city trips, 29-31 mpg highway (I drive with a light foot), regular fuel, no pinging, reasonable power, only 1 problem ("cold clutch judder" that affected a few 03, replaced entire clutch assembly under warranty), no complaints.

...204...

I've been Forester lusting since '03 intro....

..if I understand you correctly the 'cold clutch judder' (very descriptive term) vanished when dealer intervened with new clutch, pressure plate, TO bearing etc.......

..is this condition - folks please join in here - a real concern with 03 and subsequent Foresters.......

Lord knows I like a good clutch.............and the Forester would be replacing my venerated VW (there's that name again) diesel pickup down the road (NPI)..

all the best, ez..

once_for_all · April 2006

ez,

It's a non-issue. The clutch pressure plate assemble was redesigned and used on most '03 + Subarus with the 2.5 liter engine. Not all of the clutches had problems.

Why do I say "most" 2003 subies? Mine is an '03 but was manufactured in Oct 2002 and the new clutches were not standard until December 2002+ fabrication dates. I haven't had any issues with my XS. But I did drive a 2003 X model that had the shudder pulling out of the dealer's lot. Fortunately, you can tell right away when you have a problem. It was apparently caused by one or more weak springs on the clutch plate, IIRC.

John

erikwi · April 2006

Another question for you folks. Will removing the roof rack cross bars affect fuel economy? It's something that I don't need or wouldn't use much.

ateixeira · April 2006

I think some new ones don't even come with those standard. But yes, they are removeable and should help reduce drag.

I've never taken mine off, and still have a lifetime average of 25.1 mpg.

-juice

erikwi · April 2006

The 06 Premium package I looked at had the roof rack with crossbars on it. I didn't notice if it was an option though. I'll pay more attention as I shop around some more. Thanks juice!!

nnyluh · April 2006

My dealer is suggesting a far more extensive (and expensive) 30K service. They will perform the following:

Change engine oil, set tire pressure, check fluid levels, check all hoses and belts, general visual inspection, lube hinges and locks, 4 wheel brake service and inspection, tire rotation, adjust emergency brake, road test vehicle, wash vehicle, replace air filter, balance front tires, inspect coolant and radiator, inspect exhaust system, check all filters, check battery and charging system, replace fuel filter, replace spark plugs, replace PVC valve, cooling system flush, transmission and differential service.

They charge $495.95 plus tax and hazardous waste charge and they note that 6 cyl and turbo models may cost extra.

Does this price seem ok for what they will do? Are these services all necessary?

Thanks in advance,

JD

samiam_68 · April 2006

My 30K mile service on my 04 XT was about $312. Same work done, except washing the car.

nnyluh · April 2006

I am in New York State, where is your dealer?

JD

samiam_68 · April 2006

Northern NJ - Libery Subaru.

rochcom · April 2006

I have posted this information several times before. Dealers have become accustomed to doing much more maintenance than is currently required for most automobiles. Gone are the days of tuneups, regular lubes, and most inspections. Cars are designed to last longer and need much less maintenance. At 30,000 miles, there are certain fluid changes that are required, and it is not a bad idea to have belts, hoses, exhaust and suspension given a visual inspection. I have paid btween $160 and $220 for this by bypassing the dealers's set maintenance prices and insisting that they do only the specific items listed in the owner's manual. Otherwise, they would have charged considerably more. For example, my dealer likes to do a "brake service" that involves cleaning and lubricating the calipers. In extreme environments, this might be a good idea, but I have gotten away with not doing it. They also like to rotate tires, but the store where I bought them does that for free. My Forester, a 1998, has 125,000 miles on it and it is still going strong. Doing unnecessary work does not really pay off in the end.

As for the timing belt, I had mine changed at 103,000 miles along with the other belts. I paid $205 about two years ago for all of the belts. Some dealers seem to charge what the traffic will bear. Beware!

ateixeira · April 2006

My windshield is 9 years old and you're welcome to inspect it. It's unscathed.

Bad luck? Or maybe you follow trucks that might toss out debris too closely?

My wife tends to crack her windshields, lost two on her Mazda 626. I complain that she tailgates trucks...

-juice

dstew1 · April 2006

Juice, when you're in an XT there's no such thing as "tailgating"; instead it's called "preparing to pass". :shades:

Doug

ateixeira · April 2006

It had been a while since I'd driven a 2.5T-equipped car.

So I'm driving Bob's WRX back from NY, and hit the gas, and almost hit the car in front of me! Yikes, I'm not used to having nearly that much torque!

It's dangerous and irresponsible, even. I want a black one. :shades:

-juice

nnyluh · April 2006

Thanks for the information. They now quote $365, but it is much better than my $495.

Thanks,

JD

kumari · April 2006

Juice, when you're in an XT there's no such thing as "tailgating"; instead it's called "preparing to pass".

Doug

Ya got that right, Doug!! LOL :shades:

Samantha

dstew1 · April 2006

Let's put it this way - if there were no other cars on the road, I'd save a LOT of money on brake pads over the life of my XT.

Over 7 months I've collected plenty of empirical evidence (like the scenario you described in Bob's WRX) suggesting that most other cars aren't nearly as fun to drive as mine. I'm not advocating breaking the speed limit, but simply reaching it as quickly as possible.

Doug

pretzelb · April 2006

Let's put it this way - if there were no other cars on the road, I'd save a LOT of money on brake pads over the life of my XT.

Over 7 months I've collected plenty of empirical evidence (like the scenario you described in Bob's WRX) suggesting that most other cars aren't nearly as fun to drive as mine. I'm not advocating breaking the speed limit, but simply reaching it as quickly as possible.

I keep having to repeat this mantra in my head "must not test drive an XT ... the X is good enough for me" for fear that I will be tempted and then find ways to justify the expense.

dstew1 · April 2006

It all depends on what you look for in a car and what kind of driving experience you want, pretzelb, as well as how heavily you can weigh those qualities against your bank account.

I'm probably a little younger than most here, perhaps a little weaker and more susceptible to temptation, and willing to commit the extra $$$. I wavered for a couple weeks between the X Premium and XT, but knew what I'd end up with all along.

Doug

Subaru Forester (up to 2005)

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