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Crossover SUV Comparison

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Comments

  • vad1819vad1819 Member Posts: 309
    I was talking Ford design, not a Mazda or wherelse. Let's wait for Flex. It may will better then TX.
  • u045777u045777 Member Posts: 33
    I've looked at a loaded 4WD/AWD Acadia, Highlander, Outlook, CX9, and MDX. I've discoved that the MDX is far superior and safer. And the MDX costs nearly the same as the competition when similarily equipped. Yup - go ahead and take the best off the list since Acura is not a paying advertiser on this site! You are overly biased towards paid advertisers.
  • cjsbcjsb Member Posts: 71
    Hoser, (fellow Canadian)

    Your search seems to be mirroring our's of several months ago and you've come to virtually the same shortlist.

    We arrived at the CX9, Acadia/Outlook (the Enclave's looks just weren't for us) and Veracruz. All three are very good! We elimnated the CX9 first for a number of different reasons and it came down to the wire with the GM's and the VC. As the readers here know we decided on the VC.

    I'll be interested to read your coming thoughts and posts.

    Best of luck!
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    I'm not sure if there are any Acura ads on the site - I hardly notice them since I'm not shopping myself. The ads are sold out a long time in advance so whether we tweak the discussion categories matters little.

    Remind us in a couple of months and we'll swap some more models in and out. Seems like every couple of months is a good interval for trying to attract new posters in here.

    steve_, "Crossover SUV Comparison" #4612, 30 Dec 2007 9:24 pm
  • freealfasfreealfas Member Posts: 652
    I could only imagine the carnage from swapping the lambda's out!!!

    Yikes, would be kind of funny though...

    you could prove you aren't bias by doing that...lol
  • unixxusunixxus Member Posts: 97
    "I've looked at a loaded 4WD/AWD Acadia, Highlander, Outlook, CX9, and MDX. I've discoved that the MDX is far superior and safer."

    Please enlighten us on how you discovered that the MDX is safer than the other CUVs you listed. I understand that it is more luxurious, but what makes it safer than the rest.
  • bobw3bobw3 Member Posts: 2,989
    If you can find the MDX for about the same price as the others you mentioned, and it meets your needs in terms of space, I'd take it in a second...excellent choice!
  • vad1819vad1819 Member Posts: 309
    "I've looked at a loaded 4WD/AWD Acadia, Highlander, Outlook, CX9, and MDX. I've discoved that the MDX is far superior and safer. And the MDX costs nearly the same as the competition when similarily equipped."

    Yes it's lux car, so it will be superior inside then above vehicles. You might need look inside the Enclave, then compare ride and superiority. I can agree with cost MDX and Enclave.
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    Please enlighten us on how you discovered that the MDX is safer than the other CUVs you listed. I understand that it is more luxurious, but what makes it safer than the rest.

    I haven't looked at the data but I would guess that accident avoidance could be one reason. The SH-AWD on the MDX should make it a better handler/stopper than these non-lux CUVs and that goes a long way for safety. Of course the stability controls on any of these CUVs might offset that advantage to a large degree.

    Just my $.02
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    No need to apologize for liking the Tribeca...I like that interior as well, and it drives nicely.

    I'd pick one over a CX7, too, perhaps because I drove a CX7 on a tight track during Mazda's Zoom Zoom Live event here in DC, and that turbo could never spool up. I swear the Mazda5 felt quicker in that environment.

    That plus the CX7 is smaller, though it is priced lower. Did you try a CX9? Too big?

    Tribeca could use a bigger gas tank - you'll be filling up often with just 16.9 gallons of capacity, but I didn't have much else to complain about. The 3rd row is small but if you're cross-shopping the CX7 you must be looking at 5 seater models.

    Go for it. Get a Chase Subaru credit card while you're at it, because you can earn $500/year and pay for most if not all of your service and accessories. Heck, even the body shop accepted Subaru Bucks.

    We own a Subaru and a Mazda, to be honest I think you'll be happy with either choice. But you prefer the Tribeca, so who cares what we think?
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 19,298
    my 16 yr old daughter says 'eww what is that?'
    i look over and say 'that's an enclave, the new hot buick'.
    she says 'i think it's ugly. no disrespect buicks, but they will never be hot'.
    2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • albookalbook Member Posts: 1,282
    So I'm supposed to believe that the next Equinox is going to compete with the Escape, Edge, Pilot, VC, and Highlander? Now that is impressive! GM IS smarter than I thought. I can't wait to see how they pull this off!

    Let me make it clear for you. T
    He Equinox competes with midsize CUVs. If Gm wanted it to compete with the Escape, it would have been Escape sized. It's really smart marketing. They leave all the small CUV customers for the Saturn Vue- something they need to do more of.

    Exactly what can't be said for the Lambdas? I was telling you that the Lambdas didn't exist in 2004 as neither did the Flex. Do you know something we don't?

    My statement was that when the FS arrived on the scene, it was suposed to serve as Ford's three row CUV. But it didn't sell well, and so now Ford has had to scramble to improve. Not to sound biased, but I don't see anything of that nature in the lambdas. I'm not saying they are better, but they are selling well and I doubt they will be replaced by a totally different product in 4 years. It's not about big CUV small CUV.
  • albookalbook Member Posts: 1,282
    Please enlighten us on how you discovered that the MDX is safer than the other CUVs you listed. I understand that it is more luxurious, but what makes it safer than the rest.

    Yes. The Outlook got 5 star crash test ratings, and I would think (call it a stereotype) the Highlander did too. Maybe you want to say the MDX had the best handling/ interior.
  • volkovvolkov Member Posts: 1,306
    Safest?
    By IIHS head restraint testing, results for the MDX were only "marginal" until June 07 manufacture date. Not sure what the issue was, but it must have been addressed because now it is rated "good".
  • albookalbook Member Posts: 1,282
    Are you tslking about the Outlook or MDX?
  • volkovvolkov Member Posts: 1,306
    Sorry, cut out "head restraint" - this has been added to the above post. Frontal and side results for 07/08 were always "good" for the MDX.
  • vad1819vad1819 Member Posts: 309
    It's not really design for teen age people. In there's understanding "hot" something like Ferrari or Porsche. So it's understandable.
    The Explorer looks even more ugly.
    Let's move to real world.
  • volkovvolkov Member Posts: 1,306
    Have now driven the Highlander SR5 and Hybrid limited. I did find the steering dead on the highway, but didn't notice in city driving which will be 95% of the time for this vehicle. Handling was solid though. Found both versions very quiet and comfortable. Satisfactory legroom and footroom can be achieved in both rows. My wife really loved the back-up camera in the Nav equipped Limited - this is not even an option in the VC. She liked the 'plood' along the centre console but found the rest of the plastics looked cheap. Little compartment for change etc on the far left under the dash was made of one piece of moulded plastic and seemed very low rent for a vehicle of this price point. Let me re-iterate, I hate the lack of a split 3rd row - very limiting. I was also astounded that there is no memory function on the power seats in the Limited trim. I didn't even look for that feature before as I was sure it would be present in a vehice of this price point....wrong! There is adequate leg and foot room in the 3rd row, but thigh support is non-existent given the seat bench is so low. VC or T-X are much better in this regard, but Highlander would be adequate for the short haul in-city trips the boys back there would be taking. We will be re-visiting the VC and TX this week I hope. Then we should be ready to make a real decision.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Equinox is big on the outside but space efficieny is hurt by a very intrusive shock tower, so it feels compact on the inside. The shelf idea compensates somewhat, but max cargo room is very limited.

    The Suzuki XL7 is built on the same platform and manages to squeeze in a 3rd row. Plus it gets a better engine, and a longer warranty. I would suggest trying that instead.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The highlight of the Highlander is the engine, which makes plenty of power yet manages to be fuel efficient as well, especially for a large V6. The 3.5l is chain driven so no belts to replace, like the old 3.3l.

    Oddly enough, the hybrid still uses that 3.3l. Not sure why, because the GS hybrid uses the 3.5l, so they have fitted HSD to that engine.

    How did you like the steering?

    My Toyota's is well weighted, but numb. They tend to try to isolate NVH, so the trade-off is a lack of feedback for all that quietness and isolation.
  • cjsbcjsb Member Posts: 71
    Hey Vad,

    I'm 37 and I don't think the Enclave hot either. And last I checked I think I'm in the real world. I gave up the hallucinogenics over a decade ago. But maybe I'm having flashbacks? lol.

    I don't think it's ugly. Just not for me. A bit too "done" for lack of a better way to explain it.

    I do however think Sheryl Crowe is fairly hot. As I do my wife who already knows I have a thing for Sheryl and has granted me permission to publicly declare my affections. She likes Ewan Mcgregor and Steve Yzerman so I think we're square.

    I digress. :D
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    If Gm wanted it to compete with the Escape, it would have been Escape sized. It's really smart marketing. They leave all the small CUV customers for the Saturn Vue- something they need to do more of.

    The VUE and the Equinox were identical vehicles when they were introduced. The VUE is now smaller and competes better with the Escape. So now are you going to try and tell me GM didn't have to replace a model with an all new one because they screwed up initially? Face the facts now. Ford did do a better job with its small and mid-sized CUVs and GM did a better job with its full-sized CUVs. That's all I'm saying.

    Since sales came up. This might be of interest to you. Looks like people are putting their money in the mid-size market right now. So which mfr made the right choice now?
  • vad1819vad1819 Member Posts: 309
    I think it has good shape. A lot surface. I don't think even any vehicle can be describe as a hot. May you have to look at different paint jobs.
    Are you or your wife hockey fan from Detroit area? If yes, good luck with Stanley cup.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    The VUE and the Equinox were identical vehicles when they were introduced

    That is incorrect. The Vue's wheelbase was about half a foot shorter, a significant difference. They were on the same platform, but they were far, far from being identical.

    The Pontiac Torrent is more of a clone of the Equinox. The Vue was always smaller.

    Equinox rides on a wheelbase over 112" long, longer then the 3-row Rendezvous was, for instance.

    That's why I found the interior space so disappointing. It only seats 5 and the cargo area is small.

    Mid-size outside, compact inside.
  • wlbrown9wlbrown9 Member Posts: 867
    Since sales came up. This might be of interest to you. Looks like people are putting their money in the mid-size market right now. So which mfr made the right choice now?

    Hum...since you mention money...assuming an average transaction of $30K on the GMs and $25K on the Edge that would give GM sales of a little over $4.1 Billion and Ford a little over $3.2 Billion. So, even though they sold about 131K Edge vs about 137K GMs, GM raked in an almost an extra Billion dollars. A Billion here a Billion there, pretty soon you are talking about real money :-).

    So, depending on how you spin the story/data, you could make either point. There is a lot unsaid in this story. Ford vs GM total CUV sales...then you could even look at Ford vs GM total CUV + SUV sales... Me, I'm too lazy to go and do the research :-) but maybe someone has that data handy.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Are you including Lincoln MKX sales, since you include Buick numbers for GM? Let's be fair, here.

    Also, there are extra costs associated with making 3 designs, so more revenues alone does not tell the whole picture. Surely it cost GM more to design the Acadia/Outlook/Enclave vs. Ford's budget for the Edge/MKX.

    Acadia and Outlook are nearly twins, but GM still had to build 2 designs on the Lambda platform. Ford sells twins so they only really did one basic design.

    We're beginning to sound like bean counters, let's go back to the merits of each vehicle, vs. the cost or revenues from them.
  • wlbrown9wlbrown9 Member Posts: 867
    I was commenting about the article referenced in the original post that showed the Edge at about 6K fewer sales than the 3 GM models. The author was Jean Halliday and the article was in Advertising Age.

    My point was that this was a very narrow viewpoint article and you could probably take a little additional data and spin the story just about any direction you wanted. That was what I was doing with my 'revenue' example. You could do Ford is winning, GM is winning or if you threw in the right data it could probably come up with Toyota is winning.

    I did drive in close to a yellow MKX this morning. Real decent looking from the outside...I think the Edge looks pretty good as well. Have not looked at them up close or inside though. I think it is probably competitive enough to consider if you are looking for a 5 passenger without heavy towing capability. I've seen ads in the local paper in the mid-low $20K range. So, it is really in a little different price bracket than the GM 7-8 passenger that start at $27K-$33K...the Edge looks to start at $25K range. Hum, MKX starts at $35, about $2K more that the Enclave and without too much trouble up over $40K....at least as expensive as the Buick.

    Here is the original article that I was commenting on http://adage.com/article?article_id=124819
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    I'm not sure if anyone has discussed this vehicle yet. I figure I would give my first thoughts. I'm guessing it is meant to compete with the Acura RDX. I gather this from the size and price. The 297hp engine seems like overkill for a vehicle that small, however, it seems to return decent fuel economy at 16-24 when equipped with AWD. After looking at the dimensions, the rear seat leg room is just awful. I think around 36-38 inches. Front passenger leg room seems to be OK, at over 44 inches. I go by leg room, because I am 6'3", and find that more important then the other dimensions. Rear cargo room is pretty dismal as well. I guess this vehicle is more eye candy and performance driven then actually functional. Not much room for passengers or cargo.

    Does Infiniti have a hit on their hands like they did with the FX? I would say no, for I am more impressed with the RDX's total package for this size of a vehicle. I think Infiniti would have been better suited to develop a 7 passenger crossover, perhaps a larger FX, maybe call it the "GX", to compete with the MDX and everything else we love to talk about in here. Just my.02
  • tencjeddtencjedd Member Posts: 44
    I wasn't aware 16 year old's were qualified enough to judge cars that are designed for people more than twice her age!

    I get questioned almost every time I'm at the gas station or the supermarket by someone wanting to know who makes it and how I like it. When total strangers tell you unsolicited how nice your car looks, there must be some truth to it. It would be easier for them to keep their mouth shut and say nothing. Speaking of which....!
  • tencjeddtencjedd Member Posts: 44
    One could argue that the lambdas are not CUVs, but simply a unibody SUV, since they don't have any car-like characteristics.

    Except for carlike gas mileage and carlike driving. You just don't consider the lambdas ride as carlike because you drive what is basically a car (the FS).

    A Lamda with bucket seats in the second row is nothing more than a minivan with AWD. That makes it a crossover!
  • epiphany1epiphany1 Member Posts: 4
    no
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Thanks for explaining the context of the comments, and I agree.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I checked one out at the DC Auto Show.

    Conclusion: it's TINY!

    I'm talking Nissan Versa-sized. No, come to think of it, it's much smaller than that.

    So disappointing. It's honestly a 2+2 with a small trunk. I wonder if it's really any more practical than their own G37.

    Given the total lack of utility I suppose they will call this one a Compact Crossover Coupe, maybe 3C?

    All I can say is it had better be the drive of a lifetime if it wants to sell in any significant volume. We looked at it for about 3 seconds and dismissed it as being too tiny even to be our small car.
  • albookalbook Member Posts: 1,282
    The VUE and the Equinox were identical vehicles when they were introduced.

    No. The midsize Equinox was always larger than the compact Vue.

    Face the facts now. Ford did do a better job with its small and mid-sized CUVs and GM did a better job with its full-sized CUVs. That's all I'm saying.

    Those aren't facts, that's subjective (okay, I'll give you that the Edge is nicer than the LARGER Equinox- but at least GM doesn't have a Caddillac version of it). But the Vue is now just as nice or nicer than the Escape. And the original Vue was the size of the last gen. CR-V, and smaller than this gen's Rav-4. Trust me. I know what I'm talking about.
  • albookalbook Member Posts: 1,282
    I see you have come to like the Highlander, but if you're not scared of Huyndai's reliability (I not, but some are) then I'd say get the VC. You'd probably get a better deal, and I think it's much more comfortable (especially in the 3rd row), and you get more for the money.

    Just my take. Good luck.
  • volkovvolkov Member Posts: 1,306
    I am actually on side with you. Just seems that my wife has really latched onto the big-screen back-up camera as the one thing in all this which impresses her most. It's integrated into the in-dash Nav screen so it's very clean. Anyone with experience putting in an aftermarket camera that didn't end up looking like an obvious add-on?? I am frankly surprised it isn't an option on the VC or T-X which offer only the sensors. Still, it would likely be easier to install a back-up camera than memory system for seat position. Am I the only one who considers the lack of memory seats a total rip-off in a CUV at the Highlander Limited's price?
  • rcf8000rcf8000 Member Posts: 619
    I agree that the Highlander Limited should have a memory driver's seat. The 4 Runner Limited has it. I also don't understand Toyota's putting 8 way power front passenger seats in the Camry XLE but not not the Highlander Limited or the 4 Runner Limited.
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    That is incorrect. The Vue's wheelbase was about half a foot shorter, a significant difference. They were on the same platform, but they were far, far from being identical.

    After partipating in the Escape threads for several years I was under the assumption that the VUE was longer, wider, and taller than the Escape. IIRC some mags criticized GM for not putting a 3rd row in the last VUE. No?
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    Those aren't facts, that's subjective (okay, I'll give you that the Edge is nicer than the LARGER Equinox- but at least GM doesn't have a Caddillac version of it).

    When going by sales they are facts.

    But the Vue is now just as nice or nicer than the Escape.

    Well it should be! The Escape platform is 8 years old now.

    And the original Vue was the size of the last gen. CR-V, and smaller than this gen's Rav-4. Trust me. I know what I'm talking about.

    I never said you don't know what you're talking about. I just don't understand why you can't see how Ford concentrated on getting new mid-sized CUVs out and held off on the full-sizers while GM did the opposite. Both were in big trouble a year or two back and couldn't do both at the same time.
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    See it here. From the Chicago Auto Show.

    Maybe a little too much Malibu going on there with some Veracruz thrown in towards the D pillar. All in all not bad. Another forum suggested it will be smaller than the rest of the Lambdas. I know they wanted it to be cheaper so maybe that's how they cut the costs.
  • hoser0ehhoser0eh Member Posts: 46
    As mentioned earlier, our Crossover search has come down to a tight contest between the CX9, Enclave and Veracruz. We were leaning towards the Enclave, unless the other contenders could entice us with a low enough price.
    We negotiated with all the salespeople involved and came up with final prices. The prices include taxes, fees, interest on the monthly payments etc., etc.
    The numbers (Canadian), rounded to the nearest hundred, are as follows:
    Enclave (43,600)
    Veracruz (43,900)
    CX-9 (45,500)

    And the winner is Buick Enclave. We get it at the end of the month (when we return our leased van).
    As it turns out, we did not need to drive the vehicles again, as the one my wife liked best, ended up being the least expensive, so it was an easy decision.
    My wife loves the vehicle, and has ordered it in cocoa colour with the cashmere cloth seats. They are bringing one in from a nearby dealer in a few days.

    Having driven the CX9, Veracruz and Highlander, I would not hesitate to recommend them as excellent choices as well, depending on your own particular needs. For us, however, the best choice is the Enclave.
  • vad1819vad1819 Member Posts: 309
    image
    So it got a the 3.6L engine's direct-injection technology helps produce power similar to many V-8 engines and uses regular unleaded gasoline. The Traverse is rated at an estimated 286 horsepower (213 kW)* and 255 lb.-ft. of torque (345 Nm)* with dual exhaust (281 hp/210 kW* and 253 lb.-ft./343 Nm* with single exhaust) - but delivers better-than-expected fuel economy. Ninety percent of the engine's peak torque is available from approximately 2,500 rpm to more than 6,000 rpm
  • vad1819vad1819 Member Posts: 309
    image
    This picture looks like Audi Q7, is it?
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Anyone with experience putting in an aftermarket camera that didn't end up looking like an obvious add-on??

    I considered doing this, and the most built-in looking solution I could find was one of those rear-view mirrors with a built-in LCD display. I could get power from the overhead console, and mount one of those license plate cameras that get power from the reverse lights. I think some of them are wireless.

    Found one that mounts on the driver's sun visor, it's a big image so click on the URL:

    http://www.kidsandcars.org/pictures/trailerhitch2.JPG

    Another option is a sonar backup sensor, but it sounds like your wife fell in love with the backup camera.

    FWIW, I ended up with a very, very simple solution - a fish-eye lens for the rear glass. You stick it on and it sort of bends light downward, and it actually works well when you have enough light. Tinted windows hurt a bit here.

    baggs: the old Vue was more space efficient, and boxier, so it seemed about the same size inside, but the Equinox was significantly longer.
  • jimmy2xjimmy2x Member Posts: 124
    I checked one out at the DC Auto Show.

    Conclusion: it's TINY!

    I'm talking Nissan Versa-sized. No, come to think of it, it's much smaller than that.

    So disappointing. It's honestly a 2+2 with a small trunk. I wonder if it's really any more practical than their own G37.

    Given the total lack of utility I suppose they will call this one a Compact Crossover Coupe, maybe 3C?

    All I can say is it had better be the drive of a lifetime if it wants to sell in any significant volume. We looked at it for about 3 seconds and dismissed it as being too tiny even to be our small car.

    Could not agree more. Saw one at the Philly show and almost laughed at it. Now if I could only get that red G37 they had on display ;) .
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Meh, I prefer the Outlook. It's boxier and more purposeful.

    It tries to be as stylish as the Enclave, but isn't, yet it doesn't have the more practical boxy shape of the Outlook and Acadia.

    At least it's more than just a rebadge. That hatch looks just like the Enclave's, though.

    In terms of style, I'd rate them like this:

    Enclave > Outlook > Acadia > Traverse
  • vad1819vad1819 Member Posts: 309
    Good choice. Congrat. You will love it. It's very comfy even for every day driving. The traveling with family priceless, lot space for cargo, leg and shoulder. We're using all the time 3rd row and my 15 years old daughter has no complains at all.
  • vad1819vad1819 Member Posts: 309
    I like:
    Front - Acadia, rear - Outlook, side Enclave or Traverse.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I like the rear of the Outlook best as well. The blacked out D-pillars specifically.

    Anyone worried about visibility in the Traverse? The windows in the back seem kind of small.

    FWIW, the reactions on that forum listed in the photos was extremely positive, and those are the people shopping for them.
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    I like:
    Front - Acadia, rear - Outlook, side Enclave or Traverse.

    I agree with you on that vad. Although, I'd still take a CX-9 over any of them.

    FWIW, the reactions on that forum listed in the photos was extremely positive, and those are the people shopping for them.

    The reactions on a Ford forum I frequent were positive as well once the official photos were posted. That's good news for GM.

    Aside from the exterior and some dash shape changes I don't see any reason to choose the Traverse over any of the other 3 Lambdas. I'm sure we'll take a long hard look at all but the Buick and since I like the looks of the other 3 it will come down to price if we choose to switch to GM. It's going to be hard not to buy a SYNC equipped vehicle though. I'm really liking what I see in that regard.

    Click here for more info on the Traverse. They also have an interior and exterior gallery with some good pics of both. I can't say I like the grey interior they used though. It makes the hard plastics stand out more or something and makes the interior look somewhat cheap IMO. I'd like to see pics of an all black interior. It's probably pretty sharp.
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