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Midsize Sedans 2.0

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Comments

  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    I saw a new Sonata parked next to an Azera. I'm probably a minority here, but even though I think the new Sonata looks decent, I prefer the Azera looks.
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    The Azera has a little more of a classic big luxo car look to it. The new 2011 Azera is upgraded.

    I took a a two week trip to Texas recently and saw quite a few of the new Sonatas on the freeway in both directions. I was pretty much in love with the looks originally but the more I see of them the less I like it, especially from the 3/4 rear view. Don't know if the styling will hold up in the eyes of the beholder. Kind of like Pontiac in the 90s with all the body cladding, got sick of that look pretty fast too.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    The 3/4 rear view is my favorite. Fortunately, the 2011 Sonata doesn't have body cladding. :)
  • syitalian25syitalian25 Member Posts: 303
    What you mean this angle? Sonata 3/4 Rear View

    I think it looks great from that view personally.
  • jayriderjayrider Member Posts: 3,602
    edited May 2010
    Just across the river from St. Louis, Mo. SW Illinois. Only 4 left-- I liked the car a lot but the nav was a waste to me. Plus I'm not ready to buy yet. May check out the 2011. They all have full warranty -- all silver with beige leather. If you want one fly - buy - drive. Or I'll go check one out for you and you can arrange for it to be shipped. Zero risk.
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,146
    I like your edit. :)

    I think the top dollar I ever spent on a vehicle purchase was around $28K. If anything, my budget has gone down over the years as I've become more financially astute and think, do I really need this much car?

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  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,146
    Given that, with some planning, you can almost always get a one-way fare to STL on SW for under $100 from anywhere but the two coasts, it would hardly be worth the shipping (assuming it's less than a 12-hour drive home).

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  • jayriderjayrider Member Posts: 3,602
    It would cost less to fly in and drive it home for sure. But imagine the neighbors when the transporter pulls up to your driveway and delivers your new ride. :shades:
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    It's just a personal thing I guess, kind of like art. The door handle in the rear is much higher up than the front one and kind of makes the car look like it's hitting the brakes doing a nosedive to me. I'm sure there are cars that I think look great thay others think look terrible. "Looks" is very subjective and personal which makes it impossible for somone to say someone else is wrong.

    I love the how CC looks and I realize the Sonata looks somewhat similar but a little overdone IMO. However, others may hate the CC looks and that's ok too. To each his own. There are some cars that just about everyone thinks are ugly or beautiful and they usually fall into the el cheapo and super expensive categories respectively. I don't think that applies to either the Sonata or CC though. They are both good looking in my opinion but I'm just not in love with the Sonata like I was originally.
  • j2jj2j Member Posts: 147
    "The CC is suffering from the same fate that the Phaeton did, it's a Volkswagen, a "people's car", yet it's not priced like a VW should be to 99% of car buyers. That's also why the Genesis sedan hasn't taken the Luxury class by storm in terms of sales (nor will the Equus). People don't think Hyundai or VW for $35K+ vehicles."

    ******
    Aside from the price, the CC suffers from the lack of utility (being a 4-seater until the recent 5 seat option) and VW's reputation for being problematic.

    As for the Genesis sedan, while it hasn't taken the mid-size luxury class by storm, it, nonetheless, has farily well for Hyundai, esp. considering that it was launched during the onset of the recession.

    Aside from the E Class and 5 Series, the Genesis was the best selling import E segment sedan in 2009 - doubling the sales of the Lexus GS and Infiniti M.

    Even the new M isn't outselling the Genesis in 2010.

    As for the Equus, Hyundai knows that it won't be a big seller (which is why Hyundai is only planning to bring over about 2K units annually; the 1st year's installment is already spoken for) - but they see it as a "halo" vehicle which will help pave the way for an eventual luxury brand from Hyundai.
  • yongseokyongseok Member Posts: 7
    However, according to the spec, Accord has more power than others.

    Camry : around 169 hp
    Altima : 175 hp
    Mazda : around 175 hp?
    Fusion : around 170 hp?
    Accord: 177 hp

    I knew it has less torque than others but why the acceleartion is not
    impressive to compare it to other midsize sedan?

    I'm really wondering where the power went away..... Even some review
    said accord has better "hp/weight" than others.
  • fushigifushigi Member Posts: 1,459
    Look at the torque numbers more than HP for off-the-line acceleration.

    Camry: 167 lb-ft @ 4100 RPM or 171 @ 4100
    Altima: 180 @ 3900
    Mazda: 167 @ 4000
    Fusion: 172 @ 4500
    Accord: LX: 161 @ 4300 or EX: 162 @ 4400

    And since it's a popular car to discuss recently ..

    Sonata: SE: 186 @ 4250 or other trims: 184 @ 4250

    All of the vehicles have more torque than the Accord and with the exception of the Fusion they hit it sooner. Also, Honda engines are known for feeling a little lackluster until you get the RPMs up so, while I've no data handy to back it up, I'll suggest the that torque curves of the other engines are flatter or at least reveal higher torque at lower RPMs.

    Transmission gearing also plays a significant role.
    2017 Infiniti QX60 (me), 2012 Hyundai Elantra (wife)
  • acdiiacdii Member Posts: 753
    Everywhere you look, you will see claims of this has so much Horse Power. But without torque, that HP is useless. Torque puts the HP to the ground, this is why diesel engines are so great when it comes to moving heavy things, they can produce a LOT of torque, and can move more mass with less HP. As an example, you can have an engine that produces 500 HP and 10 #' of torque, and an engine that produces 250 HP and 500 #' of torque, the lessor engine can move weight faster than the higher HP motor can. Both can move equal amounts of weight, but the more torque you can apply the faster that weight can be moved. So when looking at cars, keep in mind the HP/torque comparisons and not just the HP.
  • smarty666smarty666 Member Posts: 1,503
    edited May 2010
    You already beat me to the punch! lol! That is exactly what I was just going to say. HP means absolutely nothing in regards to power and acceleration since it is the torque that is what is important since that is what drives the car and gets that HP!

    The more torque you have, the faster you can go, especially from acceleration. That is why a V8 is faster then a V6, and why an V6 is faster than a I4 off the line! The more powerful the engine, the more torque they have. A V8 has more torque then a V6 and a V6 more than a I4!
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    It's a little more complicated than that. It does come down to torque, but it depends on where you get the torque and how it changes across the RPM band. HP is a calculation of torque X RPM. Increasing either torque or RPM will increase HP.

    You can have a diesel stump puller that makes gobs of torque at low RPM but it can't rev very high so you get lots of torque but not a lot of HP. (e.g. 350 HP, 750 lb/ft in a diesel truck engine). It's fast off the line but bogs down after that.

    Or you can have a high revving engine that makes lots of peak HP but relatively low torque (e.g. the S2000 with only 162 lb/ft of peak torque but gets 237 HP at 7800 RPM). It's slow off the line but starts screaming once you get it up to 8000 RPM.

    What you really need to see is the torque curve - how soon does it peak and how long does it stay there? The Ford 3.5L Ecoboost reaches 350 lb/ft at 1500 rpm and stays there until well past 5000 RPM (IIRC). This gives optimum performance at both lower and higher speeds.
  • temj12temj12 Member Posts: 450
    The peak torque on my Accord I4 5 spd manual kicks in @ about 3,000 rpms. When you reach that rpm range, you feel the surge. I consider that better because you are at the point where you may be merging into oncoming traffic. I particularly notice it when I am merging on the interstate. Some refer to it as feeling the VTEC
  • fushigifushigi Member Posts: 1,459
    Peak torque is at 4300 or 4400 according to Honda's web site. The engine is most likely entering the higher-torque portion of the torque curve around 3K so that's the power surge you're feeling. You're probably getting at least 80-85% of the peak torque at 3K-ish RPM.

    My cars have been like that as well; sedate at lower RPMs but then a surge about 2500-3000 that continues on up towards the redline. I prefer that kind of power delivery as it means normal, day-to-day driving doesn't include harder to temper/harsher acceleration that may be too fast for what traffic will allow. Yet the grunt that pushes you into your seatback is just a fraction of a second away when wanted/needed.
    2017 Infiniti QX60 (me), 2012 Hyundai Elantra (wife)
  • smarty666smarty666 Member Posts: 1,503
    Of course, I wasn't trying to simplifying the answer, but just make it short and simple without going into too much technical detail which you now have so I think between all of us we have answered the question quite nicely :shades: !
  • schnellesautoschnellesauto Member Posts: 59
    True. Yes you want whats called a "Flat Torque curve" One thing to note, the Ecoboost Ford V6 is also a turbocharged engine and suffers from some turbo lag which slightly effects those numbers. Still nice performance.

    My LS2 6.0L V8 makes a nice health300 lb/ft starting at only 1000rpm and stays there till at least 6000rpm. It maxes out at 400 lb/ft @ 4500rpm but still manages to keep it at 300 lb/ft till 6000rpm. It revs to 6500rpm. Even with a only a 4spd automatic it still pulls 0-60 in 4.6 seconds and the 1/4 mile in 13.0. I can still get up to 23mpg highway.
  • schnellesautoschnellesauto Member Posts: 59
    It also depends on the weight of the vehicle, the gearing, tires, all wheel drive, etc, not just 4cyl/V6/V8. There are some 4cyl that will beat some V8's. Subaru WRX STI anyone? Sometimes too much low end torque leads to too much "Sit and spin" and acceleration off the line can be hampered. STI will take my GTO everytime off the line because of the AWD. But once we hit 30mph+ I catch up and than blow past it.
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    I haven't seen any ecoboost reviews that noticed any turbo lag. These are small turbos so spool up isn't really a problem.
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    edited May 2010
    image

    Auto Pacific's Customer Satisfaction Award for 2010 along with the Lincoln MKT. Ford is for real and Suzuki just flat out hit the nail on the head with the Kizashi.

    I may still purchase one of these exciting midsize sedans from Japanese automaker Suzuki.

    This is indeed good news for Suzuki, as the brand has been facing dealership service issues in recent years. In the latest J.D. Power Customer Satisfaction Index (CSI), an annual measure of dealer service performance over three years of ownership, the automaker ranked at the bottom, among all brands. But Suzuki has made gains in Power's Sales Satisfaction Index (SSI) and now ranks mid-pack—an indicator that the automaker has made some substantial changes at the dealership level.

    The 2010 Lincoln MKT was the highest-rated vehicle among trucks and SUVs in AutoPacific's annual satisfaction measure.

    Vehicles are rated in 48 different categories that pertain to various areas of the ownership experience, and overall results are based on the research firm's polling of more than 42,000 new-vehicle owners during the first few months of ownership.


    http://www.thecarconnection.com/marty-blog/1045370_2010-suzuki-kizashi-lincoln-m- - - kt-top-satisfaction-ratings

    image

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

  • bobadbobad Member Posts: 1,587
    hit the nail on the head with the Kizashi

    Gesundheit!

    Hey, you mistakenly attached 2 pictures of the Kizachi (Gesundheit!) and forgot to post a picture of the MKT. Or did you? :blush:
  • smarty666smarty666 Member Posts: 1,503
    edited May 2010
    You do realize that regardless of how great a car a Suzuki may or may not be, Suzuki is rated at the bottom of the industry in customer service and satisfaction don't you? What difference does it make how great their cars are if the dealership, service depart, and corporate treat you like a piece of trash :confuse:

    No thank you sir! :sick:

    http://businesscenter.jdpower.com/news/pressrelease.aspx?ID=2010021
  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194
    You do realize that regardless of how great a car a Suzuki may or may not be, Suzuki is rated at the bottom of the industry in customer service and satisfaction don't you? What difference does it make how great their cars are if the dealership, service depart, and corporate treat you like a piece of trash

    That's kind of my feeling as well. Plus I don't think it is that good looking either. Rather bland.

    When it comes to big ticket items like cars, I don't do "obscure"!
  • smarty666smarty666 Member Posts: 1,503
    I'm not trying to pick on Suzuki by any means. I'm finding out that you have to think about more than just the car and the material possession of it when buying one. Another big thing is the treatment by the dealership, service department, and corporate!

    I'm running into this now with Nissan with my Maxima. I absolutely love the car inside and outside but their customer service at the dealership and corporate level is absolutely atrocious and I completely understand why they are ranked so low for that now! I guess I've been spoiled over the years with Infiniti, Acura, and MB customer service because those companies were a worlds better than Nissan in customer service and doing what they could to help you. Thanks God I love the car and how people just stare at it. If it wasn't for that, this entire experience would be horrendous!
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    edited May 2010
    just post two pictures of a Platinum Silver Metallic 2010 Suzuki Kizashi and no pictures of a 2010 Lincoln MKT? Because I could.

    Who cares about a stinkin SUV, even if it is from Ford? Eh?

    Now this 2012 Mitsubishi PX-MiEV SUV is a real SUV, that it is.

    image
    Mitsubishi PX-MiEV

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    edited May 2010
    Stopped by the car lots last Sunday and saw the new Regal out in the sunlight. Kind of reminds me of the Infiniti G37 and that is a good thing IMO. This CXL, while not powered up much, is a nice combination of luxury and economy. The 4 yr bumper to bumper is nice too. This will be on my list for later this year along with the turbo Sonata Limited, the Altima and the new G25. It's a shame the Mazda6 isn't on my list as I've had such great luck with my 07 Mazda6 but don't care for the new one that much.
  • smarty666smarty666 Member Posts: 1,503
    The new Regal is certainly nice to look at. I sat in two different trims of it at the NY Auto Show last month and both the inside and outside of the car is worlds better than the Buicks I had in the 1990s! But, I don't think they are just quite up to the snuff in material quality/ fit and finish that Lexus, Acura, Audi, and MB have but I would say they have gotten much much closer than they ever have before!

    Nice to have much more competition now then before. Its always great for us consumers because it means that all the companies, including the Japanese ones, who had a dominance in quality and sales the last 20 years, now have competition up to matching or at least close to matching their level and that will have to make them ever more diligent to improve upon their cars as well!
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Member Posts: 1,230
    Planning on waiting for the GS? I would...

    Click Me!
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    edited May 2010
    Don't forget the Regal CXL lists at $27k and that includes quite a few luxury features including leather. That's many thousands less than a comparable Lexus, Acura, Audi, and MB. So it wouldn't surprise me if the material quality wasn't quite up to the same level as those cars. Although the sample I saw at the auto show in March certainly looked to have a high quality of fit and finish--at least as good as anything else in its price class.
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    Exactly what I was going to reply with. The street price for the Buick(after intitial gotta have the newest buy theirs) will probably be around $5+k less than any Lexus or MB. Audi has the A3 which is only slightly higher but options add up real fast on Audis. Acura has the TSX which is pretty close in price and has more HP. So I would say Acura wins that one but then you have to like the TSX.....which I don't.

    The new G25 which should come in with 210-220 hp and be equipped very similar to the Regal CXL will probably only be a couple of grand more so that too will be a tough competitor. Then you have the Sonata turbo which will blow the doors off the Regal turbo when it comes out. IMO opinion the Regal has a decent combo of near luxury and economy mpg/reg gas that many of the others that it is trying to comete with don't have. I guess when it comes right down to it Buick hasn't really priced itself out of this discussion but it's stated intent to compete at the near luxury/luxury level has moved it out of the main topic of this discussion.

    It will be interesting to see if GM can pull it off with Buick. They have been getting some very good JD Power scores in recent years.
  • plektoplekto Member Posts: 3,738
    Actually the current G37 starts at less than $700 more than the Regal. The G25 will be closer to 25K. Regal CXL(or whatever they're calling the better trim model) versus the G25 that's better, faster, more luxurious AND less expensive?

    No way GM wins that one. Not even close.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    What planet did you price that G37 on? Currently on Planet Earth, the G37 starts at over $33k--over $6k more than the Regal CXL. I'd be very surprised if the G25 starts at $25k, or $8k less than the G37--that's Altima territory.

    The Regal will probably be bigger than the G25 and IMO more luxurious, esp. in CXL trim (the ONLY trim available at launch). The natural competitor for the G25 is cars like the IS and 325--not mid-sized family cars like the Regal.
  • acdiiacdii Member Posts: 753
    Who cares about a stinkin SUV, even if it is from Ford?

    An MKT isnt an SUV, its a station wagon. Get it right if you're going to bash something. :shades:

    I dont know what that "thing" is you posted a picture of, but it sure is fugly.

    I like my Fusion Sport, I like my dealer, and would choose it over an obscure one like Suzuki any day. There isn't one within 40 miles of me, and from what I can see of the pictures, the car is rudimentary, no flash that would want me to prefer it over my Ford. Motorweek had a show last week 8 family sedans under 25K, winner was Hyundai Sonata, runner up the anemic Camry.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    FWIW, Edmunds.com is estimating the base G25 will start at just under $30k, with no options. That seems realistic given the $33k+ starting price of the G37.

    http://www.edmunds.com/new/2011/infiniti/g25/101276758/optionsresults.html?actio- n=2
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    There are no wagons (well almost none), it's a "crossover".
  • plektoplekto Member Posts: 3,738
    What planet did you price that G37 on?

    Glad to be of service :)

    Cars Direct.com has the G37 for:
    CarsDirect Price: $30,292. This includes the $865 delivery charge, so if we remove that to get an official "advertised" price(since delivery varies as well across the U.S.), that's $29,427.

    This is the base model, but it's about as nicely equipped as a #4 or #5 package Regal. . IMO, having sat in both and driven both, the Regal closest to the G37 is the CL5 option. Sorry, rear side airbags and premium audio(ie - same as basic in the Infiniti.) are a bigger factor than a sunroof. I also hate sunroofs anyways - don't know why GM is not making it a separate option. Safety wins here and GM's lack of adding in the full airbag package on the CL1 -CL4 packages isn't going to go unnoticed with savvy buyers.

    Same site, CL5 option Regal is $29,600. Sans delivery to compare equally, we get the following:

    Base G37 minus delivery charge: $29427
    Regal CL5 minus delivery charge: $28950.

    The G37 actually is a whopping $477 more than the Regal if I want out today and compared both. The Base G25 will for sure end up 2-3K less that the base G37 so as not to hurt G37 sales. That puts it right in the middle of Buick's pricing range.

    Now, true, that price does include a $1000 cash incentive, but with the Regal being new(no incentives - MSRP only) and the 2011 G37s coming out in a couple of months, you really will see pricing like this for the next 5-6 months.

    It's clearly made as a smart marketing move to hit GM right between the eyes. Offer 1-2K in incentives during the summer and then 3-5K on new old stock models in the fall.

    Toyota might have said that they don't want GM to fail, but the other Japanese companies don't seem to care at all and are going for blood.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    First, the base Regal (CXL) has MORE equipment than the base G37. So I have no idea why you are comparing the CL5 Regal to the base G37 (well, I do have an idea...). If anything, it should be the base Regal to the G37 Journey--the least expensive trim to offer essentials such as heated seats (gotta have that with leather). And that still doesn't get you turn-by-turn navigation, 18" alloys, and other features that are on the base Regal.

    Second, the Regal isn't even available to buy yet, and is a 2011 model, and you are comparing it price-wise to the 2010 G37, which has been around in the same form for some time and thus has large discounts available. Obviously there won't be discounts available on a car that isn't even shipping to buyers yet. After the Regal hits the market, we'll have a better idea of the actual sale prices.
  • plektoplekto Member Posts: 3,738
    The base Regal has a LOT of missing content compared to the G37. Head over to GM's or better yet, Cars Direct's site and check it out. And the power, seats, and overall handling isn't even close. The G37 feels like a proper luxury sedan and the GM feels like a C class or Volvo - ie - nice, but not really there. The cheap GM leather is a major immediate difference. GM adds a lot of frills, but where it counts, the Regal is underpowered, has less safety equipment and substance, and just falls flat. You can tell that they are trying, but it feels like a second rate attempt.

    The Regal at Cars Direct that I can order NOW does not offer Nav other than with the CL6 option. The side rear airbags aren't an option except on the CL5 and CL6. If you look carefully, you see that it's a typical GM "package" trick and that no dealers are carrying the lower-end models. The local dealer near me has ONE base model and a couple of others, but 90% of the selection is CL5 and CL6s.

    On that point,

    I can buy a Regal now - they hit the dealers lots here in California this last week. Actual test-drive and comparison. And the GM just feels lacking. The ***146HP difference*** is immense and perhaps the biggest thing that sticks in your mind, though. Since they look visually similar and are about the same size(they will be cross-shopped!), it really feels as if you are comparing, say, a base E Class sedan the the AMG version. The power is jaw-dropping if you drive the G37 right after the Regal.

    Then you see the *this* close actual price. No red-blooded person who wants a luxury car won't spend the extra bit of money for that much more power. The model year on the sticker is moot as well - since what I can buy today is a Regal or a G37 (or a TSX - another nail-biter for GM's management)

    Sure, the Regal will have a ~30K GS out in a year, but that won't be more powerful than the G37 even then, and the G25 will be out in a couple of months by the look of it. That's the real nail in the coffin. It's also likely to eviscerate the Accord V6, IS250, and other similar 25-30K midsize sedan sales. Infiniti is pulling out its big guns now and there's going to be a lot of collateral damage in this segment. (note I'd have said Accura, but after their refresh recently, they also are coming with a full set of newly sharpened teeth)
  • dash5dash5 Member Posts: 421
    I have a similar list although add the new Kia Optima as well. I might like the styling on that more than the Sonata, we will see.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    edited May 2010
    Check your facts again. Every Regal has turn-by-turn navigation standard. Have you ever heard of OnStar? A great safety features. G37 doesn't have that, either.

    And the power, seats, and overall handling isn't even close. The G37 feels like a proper luxury sedan and the GM feels like a C class or Volvo - ie - nice, but not really there.

    So why are you comparing a V6 sports sedan to a mid-sized family car? As I said before, the Regal and G37 aren't natural competitors. I don't think many people (with a few exceptions, such as you) will cross-shop the Regal and G37. The Regal competes against the cars listed to the right. Against those, its power and features are very competitive.

    If you want a car with power and handling like the G37 has, go buy one--don't even THINK of a car like a Regal. Although consider, if the G37 is so great, why the huge discounts and incentives on it? :confuse:

    Edit: Also, a "proper luxury sedan" would offer heated seats with leather standard. An economy car, like my 2004 Elantra, might offer non-heated leather seats--which it has! But it only cost $13k new too. But it does have heated mirrors, which don't seem to be on the base G37 even at $20k more. :sick:
  • tenpin288tenpin288 Member Posts: 804
    Here's another site that does price comparisons but allows you to choose base models, maximize/minimize differences, etc. It does a good job of model comparisons.

    True Delta
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 19,253
    new Sonata's lately.
    Black is popular, the best color imo, plus silver too.
    silver doesn't work as well, especially the back view.
    considering it is not a design that immediately stands out, like a Prius, i am surprised to see so many. most vehicles seem to have to hit a 'critical mass' to start noticing them.
    2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    ...since delivery varies as well across the U.S.

    I am pretty sure all manufacturers have a flat rate across the US for delivery charge, it does not vary by location. The delivery charge should be included in price comparisons, not that it makes much of a difference.
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    Yeah, I forgot the Optima. In fact, because the styling on the Sonata is already wearing a little thin with me the Optima might just be a better choice as it has a more Europeon, classic look to it at least from the limited pictures I've seen. Of course, I loved the Sonata when I first saw the pictures too but am not liking it as well now that I've seen them on the road.
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    Exactly right. A car made down the street will still have the $700-$900 delivery charge as the one made in Japan or whereever. He may have been talking about the huge dealer fees that it seems are terrible in Georgia and Florida just to name a couple that I hear a lot about.
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    Right. The G37 is priced and a competitor to the Lexus350 and the Acura TL. The new G25 will go against the IS250 and the TSX. I believe Buick is trying to catch both ends of the market and time will tell if that is a good strategy. They appear to want the Regal to appeal to the midsize buyers at the right while at the same time I think they are trying to go against the TSX, IS and G25 at the upper end of the Regal price structure.

    From everything I came across on the new G25 it will be priced at about $29500 and will be pretty much(if not exactly) a base G37 with a smaller engine and probably the same option packages. Infinitis are great cars but have always suffered MPG wise. If they can capture both the luxury buyers that want a fairly sporty car without having to have 300+ hp and the associated low MPG I think they can have a winner with G25.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    Auto Pacific's Customer Satisfaction Award for 2010 along with the Lincoln MKT. Ford is for real and Suzuki just flat out hit the nail on the head with the Kizashi.

    What is Auto Pacific?
  • smarty666smarty666 Member Posts: 1,503
    True, but I have yet to ever see a base G37 on the lot for sale! The only time I see one of them is as a service loaner car by the Infiniti Service Department. All the G37's on my lots up here in NJ, all come with AWD and the premium package at the very least so your talking about $39 some thousand on the window!

    Can't wait to see the G25 when it comes out!
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