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They also said that going uphill was, umm, stressful. I am curious about what year it was, but I want to say mid to late 60's.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Passat_NMS#Engines
"Mazda has a long motorsports history, and one that is peppered with fascinating cars. The latest chapter in Mazda's racing story has just been written, as Joel Miller and Andrew Carbonell have driven the Visit Florida Racing Mazda6 Skyactiv-D to the car's first ever victory at the Rolex Grand-Am GX race at Road Atlanta. The win marks the first ever for Mazda's diesel-burning, production-car based Skyactiv-D racer, and the first win for a diesel-powered car in a Grand-Am event.
In fact, it was a particularly good day for the Mazda Motorsports team, as a Mazda6 also picked up the third finishing spot at Road Atlanta. Director of Mazda Motorsports, John M. Doonan, said of the racecar, "We've always said that the best street cars make the best racecars, and, with more than half of the components in the race engine being shared with the street engine, this program is a solid proof-point."
'17 Chevy Volt Premiere
That's a shame, what motor do you have in your Fusion? What is the EPA rating? My Mazda 6 has been getting 32-34 with mixed driving and has only 800 miles on it.
My 2013 Accord CVT has been going up in mpg, perhaps as the engine and transmission are broken in. We drive about 60% city and c. 40% short hwy.
1st tank 27 mpg
2nd tank 29 mpg
3rd tank (so far) 30 mpg
The Mazda SkyActiv is outstanding for mpg, and may perhaps be tops right now. Hard to say.
I went to lunch today with a friend that has a 2011 Hyundai Elantra Limited, and he received a check for $150 from Hyundai/Kia yesterday. He seemed to think he was going to keep getting one every year. His friend has a Sonata GLS (2.4) and complained about sub 24 mpg results.
My Optima rarely (pretty much never) gets over 25. Even when I reset the MPG computer, just as I am entering the highway, it barely tops 26. This is on a car that is rated 24/35 by the EPA, with an average rating of 28? Most of the time my actual MPG is more like 21.6
Here is an official guide: http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/bymodel/2012_Kia_Optima.shtml
The only model of Optima/Sonata that were "overstated" were the Hybrid models.
I don't understand how they are getting away the 2.4 model's, as I have not been able to get anywhere near the stated MPG on the label, and neither have a lot of members on http://www.optimaforums.com/forum/ . You guys know I love my car, but the stated MPG figures that are on the EPA sticker are overstated. I cannot replicate them even when I coast down hills and drive 5 mph below limits with all electronics off on the highway. Where is MY check KIA?
Next fastest was in my red, '87 Chevy Z24. 115 mph with the 5 speed. It was goverened due to tire rating. It had 225/60/R-14 BFG's. Can you believe it had 14's as the "performance"tires? Lol.
Maybe try slowing down?
Just took my wife's 2013 Sonata on its first long trip, i.e. over ~10 miles. 180 miles, mostly highway, a little in-town. Got 36.5 mpg overall, and 38.5 mpg on the trip to my destination (that was under near-ideal weather conditions, albeit a little cool, mid-30s). Driving all short trips around town for the last five months, I've had no trouble getting mid-20s even in winter in MN. My wife doesn't do quite as well, but she never has on any car--she has a Lead Foot.
I have no doubt the Sonata (and Optima, same powertrain) 2.4L can meet or exceed its EPA ratings when driven moderately. The problem is, a lot of folks don't drive that way (e.g. all the people who passed me as I was on my trip this weekend, driving at or a bit above the 65 mph speed limit), or don't have driving patterns that are anywhere close to how the EPA tests cars.
Perhaps it is due to the area being hilly? I don't know, but the last thing you said was "or don't have driving patterns that are anywhere close to how the EPA test cars".
There is truth in that statement. Perhaps the EPA needs to adjust their testing procedures to more accurately represent...wait for it.....reality!!! :shades:
My wife drives like a granny... but a granny with a lead foot. She doesn't do the little but important things to maximize fuel economy.
It's possible to meet or exceed EPA ratings... I didn't say it was EASY.
Edmunds.com (I think, could have been another automotive publication) published a story recently on how EPA testing doesn't mirror reality for most people. Of course, it's easier to blame the auto manufacturer when a car doesn't achieve its EPA ratings. Harder to sue the Federal government!
Here are a few unadjusted numbers - all highway.
Accord I4 CVT 51 mpg.
Sonata I4 auto 49 mpg
Altima I4 CVT 56.1
BTW when the government says that EPA standards are being raised to 50 mpg by year 20xx, they are talking about the unadjusted numbers.
Link below has all the numbers - download the excel data files.
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/download.shtml
I know that is a mouthful, but for instance my mom's 2010 Forte' has an ECO button that lights up when driving 'economically". Does it mean it is EPA economical? It lights up fairly easily, and my mother IS a granny (74), and I assure you she is trying her best to get the best MPG, but she can't get there either.
I just went out to my car and found that my average speed is 29 mph since I filled her up on Friday.I have been driving in mixed city/highway, so it should be getting between 24 and 28, but my car insists that it is getting 21.8.
Well, whatever the case may be I still love the car and that makes up for it quite a bit.
I have been driving in mixed city/highway, so it should be getting between 24 and 28, but my car insists that it is getting 21.8.
You admit you drive in "congested" conditions. I've found FE sucks in such conditions. I only get the good FE I do because I usually don't have to drive on congested roads. I avoid them like the plague whenever possible. One thing the EPA tests are poor at is allowing for a lot of stops/starts, as you will get on congested roads. They also don't allow enough time for stoplights.
Please EPA tell me where I can get the 35 mpg I was promised? No? Well, I would sue but because I don't have a flat level commute at 50 mph, 2000 ft above sea level at 65 degrees ambient temperature then the auto makers and the government are not liable. Because the reality is that even in EPA magic land the government is still 16 Trillion in debt and "good luck with that lawsuit dude".
ARRRRRRGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!
It's a 2.0 ecoboost and the combined rating is 26 mpg.
I think I've driven it over 20 miles one way once.
If I go by myself this weekend, I'll probably take the Fiesta, otherwise the Fusion.
Last year I took half the trip in the Fiesta, 40 mpg on the way out and 44 mpg on the return.
Was it on magic road? Did you see a red Optima at the end? LMAOOOOOO
Just kidding. Take the Fusion. The Fiesta is more of a city car with a shorter wheelbase so the ride will not be as comfortable or as quiet.
I know one place you can get it: Minneapolis to Rochester, MN on US-52. Set the cruise to 65-66 (limit is 65) and unless it's really cold or you have a very strong headwind, you'll get your 35 mpg, likely better than that. I did.
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As for reliability, VW has stepped up to the plate lately. For years, their TDI models have been more reliable than their gassers. If you want a Passat but are hesitant, get a TDI.
If your handle were gregg_chevy, would you think differently?
The Passat is inoffensive now, and it will be inoffensive in 12 years. So will the Camry and Accord. The Fusion and Mazda6 are gorgeous now, and I think they'll hold up over time styling-wise. (Consider, how well do Aston-Martins hold up, styling wise, over time? Pretty darn well.) Probably the Optima will hold up also. The Sonata might be considered boring in 12 years, who knows?
I live about 5 miles from a VW dealer and I've only seen 3 or 4 of the current model.
I live about 5 miles from a VW dealer and I've only seen 3 or 4 of the current model."
I do see them around Louisville here and there, but not a whole lot compared to Fusions, Sonatas, etc., let alone Accord, Camry, and Altima.
VW can make c. 170,000 Passats a year at its TN factory, which is a bit more than 14,000 a month. That seems like a reasonable sales goal, and even 6 months ago it seemed like they were heading toward it. But competition is intense, and VW's lackluster base engine and transmission have hurt it. Passat sales, based on last month, are probably going to be closer to 120,000 for the year. That might mean that 50,000 Passats that VW had planned to have in US driveways are not going to be there.
Even though Accord came in 3rd, the monthly sales rate is probably *above* what the Honda factory in Ohio can make. Flat out, I think I read that they can make about 400,000 Accords a year, which comes to about 33,000 a month. When Honda dealers sold 36,504 last month, they were drawing down their inventories. I was shopping for an Accord around then, and I have seen this happen. A couple of months ago one of the dealers I was considering buying from had about 100 Accords in stock of various models, and now they are down to about 40.
Ford has the same problem with the Fusion—they can't make enough of them. The 30,284 Fusions they sold last month is more than they can make in that factory in Mexico a month. And so when this month's sales figures come out Fusion and Accord sales might even decline slightly—just because there aren't quite enough to go around.
The Altima and Camry are not constrained in that way. Nissan and Toyota could probably make half a million of their model if they really tried. But demand is not at that level even if they give them away, which is almost what they've been doing.
In about 6 months Ford will be in the almost same boat, because the Flat Rock MI plant will be able to make the Fusion too, raising their total Fusion production capacity to about 450,000 during calendar year 2014. Could they really make and sell that many? Maybe. And if they did that might make a Ford midsize #1 in sales for the first time since about 1992. There was an epic battle that year that some may recall between the Taurus and the Accord. The Taurus actually won iirc.
March midsize sales
Altima 37,763 -8%
Camry 37,663 -8.2%
Accord 36,504 +41.4%
Fusion 30,284 +6%
Malibu 18,539 -22.4%
Sonata 18,031
200 16,593 +11%
Optima 14,366
Avenger 12,439 +33%
Passat 9,521 -5.1%
6 6,102 -22.3%
Legacy 4,400 -18.3%
Big plus is it runs fine on regular (87) gas.
Not being an EPA mileage expert...they don't promise anything. They don't really insinuate that you could get that mileage...they even give a wide variance.
From what I recall...they (usually the manufacturer) performs the mileage test on a dyno "simulating" a driving experience (city, highway, AC, etc). They analyze the emissions and calculate how much fuel must have been used. Then they fudge the numbers a bit to make it more real-world
But the number isn't supposed to be attainable in all circumstances. It's supposed to be used to compare against other vehicles. So if your vehicle (vehicle A) achieves 10% better mileage than an Accord V6...if you then drove an accord the mileage percentage should a little worse than you are receiving...and it too should be below their 'estimate'.
I find I usually get a little bit worse mileage in a turbo...I find the 'surge' tempting and eventually tap into it. Other cars that are more lethargic are worse for me too; I get frustrated and end up driving the snot out of them...wrecking the mileage.
I get your point, but I don't think so. The Impala was designed to be rental/fleet fodder, as well as appeal to older people who want something simple, GM and relatively cheap. The details, the things that delight people, are not there. The new Impala (2014) is light years better.
I put the vw behind my name years ago, when I owned a very faithful and frugal TDI. I am more a Volvo or Jaguar type customer now, but I continue to marvel at how long it has taken other manufacturers to install the type of quality interior materials that VW marketed since at least the late 90s. I also was disappointed to see VW cheapen its interior ambiance with the latest Jetta...though running changes have considerably improved it, just as Honda has done with the 2012 hard plastic Civic interior.
That said, I don't understand the criticism of Passat sales numbers. If you look at the previous Passat, it wasn't even a player, selling in very small numbers. The huge jump in sales with the latest Passat is remarkable, but to expect those numbers to begin to be comparable to Camry/Accord or Fusion is not realistic.
Look how many years it has taken Fusion to nudge up against some of the heavyweights. Look at the remarkable job Kia has done with the Optima in boosting sales. Still, Optima's big leap is not enough to threaten the top dogs. In order for Optima or Passat or Mazda6 to become true heavyweights, Altima or Camry or Accord or Fusion would have to be knocked way down...it is a limited market after all. That is unlikely, given they are all good machines with good reputations and customer satisfaction.
It is great to have so many choices, especially when each choice is so good by itself. The new Chrysler 200 is supposed to be a nice machine. A new Legacy is probably not that far away.
Competition improves the lot. The Malibu will be significantly improved later this year. It's all good.
"The five suffices to move the Jetta around, but it's relentlessly grumpy about doing so. Our test car was sticky on throttle tip-in, causing pause-then-jerk-away starts however velvetly the right foot probed, and, once wound to its early-to-bed 5800-rpm redline, you'll be tempted to put a bullet through the firewall to still the racket. At redline, the five sings an unearthly moan, sounding like a duet of hoarse-throated ghosts."
But look at how Camry sells like hotcakes anyway, even though it has one of the weakest and uninteresting 4's out there right now. Most people who buy midsize sedans don't care, as long as it motivates the thing better than a smart car, and doesn't moan too loud at each throttle stab. Camry drivers are not car people, but they do recognize that their car is still light years better than 4 cylinder mid-sizers of 20 years ago.
I rode in a new Ford Escape this week for half a day with a rep that rented it. It was loaded, had a weird powered window shade type cover for the sun roof that seemed it would fail in no time. The "touch" ford controls on the dash were a absolute cluster F. We could not even figure out how to turn the heat down and drove with the windows cracked. Passenger side floor plan caused me to point my feet inward. Weak, moaning motor. What a P.O.S.
I think part of the problem is people try to manually control the automatic climate control instead of just changing the temp up or down like you would control your home hvac.
Maybe I'm just cantankerous with yet another 8" snowfall here on May 19th
I have dual-zone climate controls, a step up from the base Mazda 6's classic 3 knob design, and I have never once needed the manual to operate it. The is a knob for the driver, and another for the passenger. Just press "Auto" and turn the knob to desired temp. The same goes for the radio. Even with Bluetooth, Satellite, 2 different Aux inputs, USB, I pod, and a phone menu, I have never needed to consult the manual.
Car and Driver has confirmed my thoughts on this. In a 5 car comparo, even against the Sonata SE, they said "We prefer our Sonata in Optima clothing" they meant inside and out. As a result, the Optima beat the Sonata in that comparo.
My car was deigned by Peter Shreyer, who was a senior designer for Audi. It is no mistake that the car can be easily mistaken for an entry level luxury sport sedan. Just another reason that sealed the deal when I said "I'll take it".
OTOH if you are a MyFordTouch owner you will appreciate having a familiar interface with the automation.
Can't please everyone. I always take time to figure out all the necessary controls before I pull out of the space.
They work just the way I want them to.
I have a mile+ long hill about a mile from my house.
The car doesn't like to downshift when going about 50 mph up the hill, but I don't like lugging the engine.
Dropped it into 5th and it held it until I up shifted it near the top. Didn't have to use Sport Mode to do it.
Not to wax too nostalgic about the '80s, but does anyone recall the GM HVAC controls from the decade? What genius: an easy to use finger slide for each of the temperature and air direction controls and one simple knob for blower speed. When I was just starting to drive, I never had to take my eyes off the road to adjust the controls in either of my parents' vehicles. Their 85 Chevrolet and 88 Oldsmobile had identical control panels. On top of that, the Delco head units were a near perfect match as well (I recall the Olds having an additional search button for the cassette player - totally awesome).
Can you imagine operating MFT without taking your eyes off the road at all [even if you've owned the car for an extended period of time]? I guess you can talk to the thing if you wanted to (my current Ford's voice recognition software works... kind of).
While I'm no Luddite (I do not miss cassette players; carrying a collection of tapes into and out of the car everywhere you went to avoid the inevitable heat damage to your music collection was a hassle and a half) and enjoy many of the modern entertainment features available on newer cars (e.g., satellite radio, USB and media inputs, etc.), I'm very irritated by needless complexity - especially when it comes to HVAC controls.
Somehow someway Mazda has figured out how to add content without creating a buttonpalooza on the dash. At least on the 6 Sport, it's entirely possible to operate the HVAC and radio controls w/out the driver ever taking his eyes off the road. Brilliant.
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Yep. Do it every day. With MFT you get auto climate control. I use the right hand screen in the gauge cluster to adjust the temperature. I never ever touch the controls on the MFT screen or below it. You don't need to. I use steering wheel controls for everything except changing media sources (one button press) and turning heated seats on and off.
It's not nearly as bad as people try to make it because they didn't spend 5 minutes to see how it's supposed to work.
Its funny because I'm the exact opposite. I couldn't stand 80's and 90's GM interiors. Just looking at the controls would make me cringe and I'd wonder "Who likes this? They probably just bought the car because they got a good price"...I never thought anybody would actively seek them out
OTOH...Every Ford MyTouch interior I've driven I really liked and thought was intuitive, nicely laid out, and easy to use. I don't own one so I don't live with it everyday so maybe I'd change my mind during the daily "grind"
Fusion:
88 Cutlass:
<img src="http://carphotos.cardomain.com/ride_images/3/1681/4721/29202360024_large.jpg"
I loved the looks and ride of the Taurus. But without an Owner's Manual, I was flying blind on MyFordTouch! I quickly learned to despise it!
My best friend just got a 2013 Fusion SE as his company car and it also has MyFordTouch....he wants his 2012 Fusion SEL back(even though it had the transmission 'self-destruct' issue)!
What I also meant to say was WOW; look how far we've come! Also, if you look at the IP, it is a "digi-dash, with LED speedometer, coolant, fuel and oil pressure gauges. I also noted that the ash tray has been torn out of this poor old Old's.
How did we ever think that this was acceptable quality? These new cars are just soooo much better. I am grateful for that!!
a) with cars that let you get recirculate by going to Max A/C, but does it using the Mode control, if it's winter, still ends up blowing hot air in your face because the only mode it works in is Vent. This may suck, but not nearly as bad as the ones set up as:
b) recirculate controlled by the Temp control... the ONLY way you can get recirculate is to slide the temp control to full cold called Max A/C. What a hopelessly negligently designed HVAC control setup. There may be others, but Chrysler had this ridiculous set-up on all their Tragic Wagons and K Cars, LeBarons etc.
IOW's, if you get stuck in stop and go in your Tragic Wagon and the Tragic Wagon in front of you has an old Mitsubishi 2.6 sputtering so much burnt oil out at you, there are wet drops on your windshield, in the dead of winter, if you don't want to inhale all that, you must freeze your butts off and even lose defrost ability if it's storming to boot..
So that said, recently I was looking at the gallery pics of something brand new this year (I forget what it was off hand but think it was....well I really do forget) and saw HVAC controls, that clearly had gone back to Max A/C control as being the only way to get recirculate. At least it was done with the Mode control as opposed to the Temp control.. but in seeing that, I just shook my head and ruled that car out on that alone. If they are THAT stupid in that regard, just think of all the other potential areas they could have and probably did, screw up..
How long did you spend testing it to see how it worked? Or did you just drive off and try to figure it out while driving? Shouldn't have taken more than a few minutes to figure out basic operations.