Edmunds dealer partner, Bayway Leasing, is now offering transparent lease deals via these forums. Click here to see the latest vehicles!

Midsize Sedans 2.0

1…133134136138139…544

Comments

  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    I don't see a major price advantage on Malibu actually. It is priced in the same price range as the Accord.
  • venus537venus537 Member Posts: 1,443
    There's now a lot of good choices in this segment even if you would just limit yourself to the domestic name plates. With only Chrysler being left out of the party in my humble opinion. And even then it's not like you're being punished for getting a Sebring.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    - Malibu LS I4 AT, $19,995 including destination charge.
    - Accord LX I4 AT, $21,795 including destination charge.

    I don't know about you, but $1800 is a significant chunk of change to me.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I would feel punished if I had to drive a Sebring every day. :sick:
  • tedebeartedebear Member Posts: 832
    You apparently have not driven the redesigned 07 or 08 Sebring with the 3.5L 6-speed autostick and all the options lately.

    It's a joy to drive. I usually go out during my lunch break just to sit in it and play. I never knew I could drive to Disneyworld from St. Louis without using any freeways until now.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I am glad you enjoy your car. Personally I don't buy a car to use its electronics to find out that I could drive from St. Louis to Disneyland without using any freeways, but as I've noted before, each of us has his/her own criteria for buying a car. If I had to look at the exterior and interior of the Sebring every day, I would not have a good feeling. A car I own has to be one for which I could live with its looks for a long time. The Sebring isn't one of those cars for me.
  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Member Posts: 7,704
    map out a trip to Wallyworld just like Clark Griswald took in National Lampoon's Vacation. Only you're not gonna be starting from Chicago you'll start from St.Louis. Remember to stop at the Grand Canyon(it really is not to be missed...Clark dissed it in the movie).

    Would the Chrysler Sebring be comfortable all the way to Los Angeles from St.Louis?

    I like the new '08 Bu from Chevrolet, as far as looks go anyways. I was looking at it on the net back at the beginning of this year but was turned off when Chevy announced that they would not sell any with manual tranny's.

    Then I bought a 2008 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS with a CVT automatic anyway! Really, the '08 Bu is a tad big for my tastes. The Lancer GTS is just right for my wife and I.

    2021 Kia Soul LX 6-speed stick

  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    That's the sound of the last almost full-page of posts disappearing. Let me suggest to all participants that if you want to continue to be a part of this conversation that you keep your posts on topic. Posts about other participants are out of bounds period. Posts about minivans, SUVs, manufacturers in general, etc., do not belong here.

    We are here to discuss midsize sedans and that's all.

    Every one of you who has had a post removed just now knows those things so let's stop and think a minute before making an inappropriate post. If you feel like a post is out of line, you have two choices - ignore it or email me and ask me to look at it. Jumping on the poster is not one of your options.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    It won't be, if you consider that you don't get a few things in the Malibu that you do in Accord. You did make a point about 6AT earlier, so why doesn't Accord have an edge on Malibu until that happens? This, besides the fact that you have to move up to LT trim to get stability control. Both are points that you often use to compare "value".

    And we are not talking long term ownership costs here, right?
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Which trim lines of the Accord offer OnStar as standard equipment? Or if not standard, what is the cost of the OnStar option?

    If you require stability control on a car to consider it a good value, how about this:

    Malibu LT I4 AT with moonroof: $21,755
    Accord EX I4 AT (least expensive Accord with a moonroof): $24,495

    Until early next year, the Accord has one more cog in its AT that comes with the I4. But then the Malibu will take the lead there with its 6AT.
  • tncarmantncarman Member Posts: 82
    Accord's don't have OnStar as that is a GM service. But if you meant the Mailbu, it's standard from LS on up.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    No, I meant the Accord. There was a comment that the Accord has features the Malibu doesn't have. It seems that is true the other way around also.
  • elroy5elroy5 Member Posts: 3,735
    I read the Edmunds.com review of the 08 Malibu. These are just a few of the areas where the reviewer said the Malibu came up a little short, when compared to the Accord (and some other competitors). Power (I4 and V6), fuel economy, interior, and steering feel. Not huge advantages, but advantages none the less. A couple I would have mentioned are the likelyhood of better reliability and resale value.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    It would be helpful to avoid the sarcasm and just make the point directly.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Excuse me, but my post was not intended as sarcasm. I am sorry you saw it that way. It was, however, an indirect way of noting that the Malibu has features that the Accord does not.
  • tedebeartedebear Member Posts: 832
    I am glad you enjoy your car. Personally I don't buy a car to use its electronics to find out that I could drive from St. Louis to Disneyland without using any freeways

    Oh, I think you already knew that was just one of many examples of the entertaining things it can do. Besides, it was DisneyWORLD. ;)

    I had a choice of vehicles to take to work today. There was Scarlett the red Sebring, Shirley the blue/black Trek bicycle (I ride a lot) and Elvira the black Viper. I know many people would not give up a chance to drive a Viper around but Scarlett the Sebring got the call. She's just so much darn fun in her own way.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    Since fantasy comparisons are fine and dandy in these forums, now that you couldn't make a point against Accord LX, you want to add moonroof, eh?

    I don't know about you, but I have seen this as a cyclical process. The debate pops up every five years. Malibu started with a bang ten years ago, even louder five years ago. And now, there is yet another.

    The way you see value is not the way everybody else does. If I were to bet on value, my pick would on Accord LX/LX-P over Malibu LS/LT. There is a whole lot to cars than trying to find a feature or two that might be missing in one. One of the points you have made is with the assumption that Malibu will have 6AT (if I asked you, what advantage it afforded, we will be going back to a discussion that you couldn't digest earlier). So, why are you ignoring that it has 4AT right now? And if GM is indeed planning to put 6AT in couple of months which will drastically transform the car, as you seem to believe, then shouldn't we pity anybody who buys the Malibu today?

    The only thing we could agree upon, perhaps, is that you can't prove anything until tested against time. Give them 2-3 years, and we might be discussion "upgrades" necessary with next generation.
  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    Backy...you didnt really drive from St Louis to DW using back roads...did you?
    So how do you like Sebring?Good mileage?
  • alamocityalamocity Member Posts: 680
    There's a pretty good review of the 08 Malibu on the 2008 Chevy Malibu forum, message 545 for those who might be interested. Looks like the LTZ model on the four cylinder will be the first to get the six speed auto, with the other trim levels to follow thereafter.
  • patpat Member Posts: 10,421
    Actually, "value" is as subjective of an opinion as is "color" - everyone is entitled to his or her own definition which includes you, backy and everyone else here. No need for us all to agree, otherwise why would so many choices be available?! :)
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    I agree with your opinion. :D

    And didn't think challenging another's was the point but that what one sees as value isn't that for another.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    So, why are you ignoring that it has 4AT right now? And if GM is indeed planning to put 6AT in couple of months which will drastically transform the car, as you seem to believe, then shouldn't we pity anybody who buys the Malibu today?

    I didn't ignore that the Malibu has a 4AT on the I4 right now--I was very clear that it has one, and actually mentioned it more than once in this discussion. And I never said that a 6AT will "drastically transform the car." We can have a much better dialogue about these cars if we don't put words on each other's fingers and not take (inaccruate) stabs at what other people say. Agreed?
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    Its not taking stabs, I'm expecting consistency in arguments. It got worse because instead of sticking with the original argument (LS versus LX), you changed it to now compare LT w/moonroof to EX. I could have just as well taken it further, and we get nowhere.

    If you can make a case for value based on initial price versus features with one trim, you should be able to do so without having to change the argument.
  • tedebeartedebear Member Posts: 832
    So how do you like Sebring?Good mileage?

    Well, you can see from my replies to Backy how much I like it.

    The mileage is a little low but it's within tolerable limits. The two times I've actually checked it I calculated 20.7 and 20.8 mpg combined city/highway. The in-dash display shows it to be about 1 mpg less than that but I like to figure it the old fashioned way.

    I'm looking forward to testing it on a long highway cruise someday. Maybe I'll drive down to DisneyWORLD, although I only know how to get there by not taking the freeway. :D
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    Do you also have average mph display to go with average mpg? If you do, could you post that as well when you do reset the trip computer?

    Based on my experience, average mph is a big factor in determining observed fuel economy. My previous experience with Chrysler 3.5/V6 was in 2007 300, that I had as a rental in Arizona. It got a decent 26-27 mpg (90% highway) in that car.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    It got worse because instead of sticking with the original argument (LS versus LX), you changed it to now compare LT w/moonroof to EX.

    Uh, you were the one who asked to change the comparison. You noted that the Malibu LS doesn't have stability control and the Accord LX does. Even though the Malibu has features the Accord doesn't, I went ahead and took your suggestion to compare a Malibu with stability control to the Accord. But I noticed the Malibu LT has 17" wheels, which is what the Accord EX has. So to make the price comparison more fair to the Accord, I added a moonroof to the Malibu. So, what is the big deal with that?
  • autokritikerautokritiker Member Posts: 65
    It's funny how passionate some people are about their FWD family sedans. I'm not knocking everyone who posts here; I just find it amusing how some people can actually be Family Sedan Snobs.

    If you want to be a car snob, at least buy a pre-owned BMW or something comparable.

    Fact is: family sedans are appliances. For those who are unbiased and willing to test drive all of them, you will find very little difference between Brand X and Brand Y.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    It might be interesting to re-visit discussion from the beginning of time. Your original post on the topic:

    “Yes, I agree. Unless... they do one of those "what can you get for $XXk" comparos again and it happens to be a Malibu LT I4 with the 6-speed AT vs. the Accord LX. That could get interesting.”

    To which I responded:
    “I don't see a major price advantage on Malibu actually. It is priced in the same price range as the Accord.”

    This is where hell broke loose. You had started with LT, went back to LS to quote the lowest price possible then went back to LT w/moon roof option added to ensure you weren’t getting left behind in feature list. Regardless of where you go, my point still stands... Malibu is pretty close in pricing to Accord.

    To be more realistic, let us leave it to the market to decide “value”, shall we?

    PS. It is interesting that you put greater value to 17” rims. Give me 16” rims, unless it happens to be a sport tuned model that demands a lower profile tire. Otherwise, those things are not only going to add to the cost of tires during every replacement but also add about 40 lb to the unsprung weight of the car. I have argued about this endlessly in some Accord related forums. I've went far enough to say that Honda has gone overboard with wheel sizes even in Civic LX which uses the same size wheels as the much more heavier, performance oriented and powerful BMW 3-series. Now one can get a Civic Si with rim size that is larger than was ever offered in Acura NSX.

    There are a lot more ways to appreciate “value” than the initial price tag.
  • urnewsurnews Member Posts: 668
    Fact is: family sedans are appliances. For those who are unbiased and willing to test drive all of them, you will find very little difference between Brand X and Brand Y.

    Your comments, Autokritiker, are sure to rankle some posters on this thread but I for one happen to agree with you. My wife and I enjoy our 2007 SEL AWD Ford Fusion immensely but it is, after all, a four-door sedan, albeit it a very nice one.

    The four-door sedan has come a long way in the last half century but mostly all manufacturers these days offer competitive products: There is not a great deal of difference between Brand X and Brand Y, in my book.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I agree there are is more to value than original price tag. But I don't know why you seem to be so upset at my attempts to compare prices of like-trim Malibus and Accords, in reply to your statement, "It is priced in the same price range as the Accord."

    First, I compared the price of the base trim Malibu with AT to the base trim Accord with AT. You objected because the base Malibu doesn't have stability control and the base Accord does. So to accomodate your complaint, I compared the up-level Malibu LT, which has stability control, to the up-level Accord EX. And I added a moonroof to the Malibu since that is something the Accord EX has. I guess you didn't like that either. Is it that you don't like the fact that the new Malibu is significantly less expensive than the Accord? If you want to think of a difference of $1800-$2800 as "close to", that's fine with me. We'll just have to disagree on that. As we do on the value of larger rims/tires. Or the value of a 60/40 split rear seat, which is standard on the Malibu but not available on the Accord. Or the value of OnStar, which is standard on the Malibu but not available on the Accord.

    You define value the way you want, but others may disagree.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    You define value the way you want, but others may disagree.

    You stole my words from a previous post. :)

    I don't know why you seem to be so upset at my attempts to compare prices of like-trim Malibus and Accords, in reply to your statement, "It is priced in the same price range as the Accord."

    I don't know about you, but when someone responds to my post, as long as it doesn't include "you" in it (addressed to me), I see no reason for anything personal but a discussion around the topic on hand. A response isn't an indicator of being upset with someone.

    If you want to think of a difference of $1800-$2800 as "close to", that's fine with me.

    Ok... :confuse:

    When I got my Accord, I was able to negotiate the price to about $1800 below MSRP, basically getting a $23K Accord for a little over $21K while having a $25K budget. Would that be possible if $1800 weren't "close"? If automakers are capable of giving up to $4K-5K off MSRP, you're questioning "closeness" of about half that amount here!
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,146
    > $1800 below MSRP, basically getting a $23K Accord for a little over $21K
    $4K-5K off MSRP,

    Wow. :) We've come a long way from the 03 Accord era when some people 'informed' :sick: me that Honda never had to have discounts, incentives, rebates, etc. ;)

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I'm not sure what your experience at getting a discount off MSRP on an Accord (not a 2008, right?) has to do with what we were discussing. Do you think that Chevy doesn't discount the Malibu? IMO, I think big discounts on both the 2008 Accord and Malibu will be hard to come by for awhile. But they'll come. The market is too competitive for anyone to sell a mid-sized family sedan at MSRP in any volume, for any length of time.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Member Posts: 5,525
    The idea is to provide a perspective on how big (or small) the price difference is. Prices haven't changed much over last ten years, so the argument about old versus new is mute.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Member Posts: 9,731
    A changing market calls for changing business practices, no?

    With Toyota flooding the market with incentive-laden Camrys (Camries?), Honda had to do something to keep its share of the market from its closest competitor, what is quickly beomcing the McDonald's of the car industry, Toyota.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Did you mean "moot"?

    Since people will be buying 2008 models as new cars now, I think it's appropriate to focus on those when comparing prices of the mid-sized sedans, not models from 10 years ago.

    I think we've established the MSRP price difference between the Accord and Malibu is roughly $2000-3000, at least for the I4 models. I haven't looked at the V6 pricing yet; I'll leave that to you or someone else to do the comparison. Personally, I think the Malibu is priced right where it needs to be--still near the lower end of the market, but more than the old Malibu--now called the "Malibu Classic". Want a burger and fries with that? ;)
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,146
    I was through the local Honda dealer's lot Sunday browsing the used cars. There were hoards of Accords; very few used cars.

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • prosource1prosource1 Member Posts: 234
    With upgraded 2.4 177hp) and 3.3 V6 cylinder(260hp) engines with enhanced fuel economy, revised suspension, standard 5 and 6 speed trannies and improved interior, Hyundai is addressing flat Sonata sales. I'm not sure the exterior is as crisp and clean. The new design, both interior and exterior has that 'Lexus knock-off' look. Interior is much improved! These figures come from infor from the Hyundai Dealer Convention.

    http://forums.subdriven.com/zerothread?id=3522630&page=2

    http://forums.subdriven.com/zerothread?id=3522630&page=1
  • prosource1prosource1 Member Posts: 234
    New Sonata Video just released displaying enhancements to the 2009 Sonata.

    http://www.hyundai-motor.com/index.html
  • exshomanexshoman Member Posts: 109
    Sorry, my Korean is a bit rusty. Do you have a direct link?
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    Hmm. The exterior looks worse IMO. I liked the way it looked before.

    As for the interior, MUCH better IMO. But only with the nav. The non-nav interior pick has something that looks out of place under the main CP where the radio is however. Anyone know what that is and why they put it in such a place? I don't like things that look tacked on like that at all.

    That being said, the exterior alone would probably keep me from buying one now. Add the tacked on looking thing under the CP, because I wouldn't want a nav system, and Hyundai would have a hard time selling me one of these. I'll reserve final judgement until I see one though.
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    Story here.

    40+ mpg? Very impressive!

    Being that we're now an SUV/CUV family I'd really like to see what Honda puts in their's for 2009 as that's when we'll need a new one.
  • colloquorcolloquor Member Posts: 482
    If that's the same photo that has been floating around the net, the DIN-sized electronics device lower in the center stack that looks out of place is a taxi meter. This is a shot of a Korean taxi version.

    I agree on the exterior - not as clean as the original. Give me the current exterior, and the new interior.
  • zzzoom6zzzoom6 Member Posts: 425
    I completely agree with backy on this... the Malibu seems to be a very good buy compared to the Accord and will likely be available for several thousands less than an Accord. Personally, I'm happy midsized sedans continue to improve as if offers consumers more choices. In years past, I doubt I would have considered anything from ford, saturn, or chevy, but now I'd have to agree with others on this forum that they are making some very good cars. I've owned 2 Accords in the past and they served me well... now that most cars in this segment are very reliable, it's refreshing that I'm not married to a brand anymore and am willing to consider other options.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Keep in mind these are photos of the Korean market Sonata. The exterior, including grille and wheels, of the current home market Sonata are different than what we have here (interior is pretty much the same, except they have nav already). That is clear from the video posted above. So it's possible what we are seeing in these photos is not quite what we'll get here next spring. I hope we get the new interior but not the new grille and wheels--a little too fussy for my taste.
  • joe97joe97 Member Posts: 2,248
    Nice!! 2.4L I4 177; 3.3L V6 260 and with improved fuel economy, that's getting efficient.

    The interior is fantastic; the exterior will take a bit of time to get used to but concurring with Backy, let's see if we'd get a different one for the NA spec.

    This perhaps is a better angle:

    image

    Thumbs up on the interior:

    image
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Maybe my problem with the new face is that there's nothing special about it. It looks to me like a cross between the previous-generation Passat, the Elantra, and the Sebring. At least the old face had some edginess to it, and was honest in its simplicity. And the wheels look just like the vent on my (rather cheap) Coleman outdoor grill. "Dislike" is too mild for those, IMO--"detest" is closer. :P

    BTW, got a '07 Sonata SE rental tonight--silver with those slick 5-spoke alloys. Very tasteful. And a toasty heater--needed that tonight, with flurries in the air and a 40 mph north wind. Car was very stable and quiet in those conditions though.
  • captain2captain2 Member Posts: 3,971
    this is the future (maybe the reason why Honda discontinued the Accord Hybrid) with oil approaching $100.00 but this is going to be one slow car. Maybe 10 sec. 0-60 based on the 150hp, but also something that will feel quicker than it is (because of the torque). It kinda surprises me in that Honda didn't diesel a V6 and get something like MB does with their 3.2 6 cylinder, 200+hp and 400 lb. ft., a car that really does pretty well both in the drag races and at the fuel pump. 40 mpg? It should!
  • mickeyrommickeyrom Member Posts: 936
    Since the Accord hybrid would get better mileage than the regular Accord,why would they discontinue the hybrid? I dont understand your justification for that.I submit that they should make all Honda's hybrids.At perhaps $4.00 per gallon approaching,who cares about acceleration? :confuse:
  • pmerk28pmerk28 Member Posts: 121
    That a midlevel Hyundai has a better interior than just about any of the American nameplates. I don't know why the domestics cannot make an interior like this.
Sign In or Register to comment.

Helpful Tools

Most popular vehicles