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BTW, the Sonata's is only 35.8 ft.
The 4 cyl and the 6 cyl might use different steering racks, like in the Accords (the 4cyl has a tighter turning circle than the V6 prior to 2008).
I think the VW Vanagon and the Toyota Van of the 80s, where the front wheels were under the driver's tushie, seemed to have pretty incredible turning circles if the front overhang cleared the curb.
The Car Connection specs put it at 40.4' also.
New Car Test Drive also shows 40.4'.
I pulled up the 4cyl each time. Don't know if the 6cyl stats are different.
Anyway, I think it's a good example of how things work in the review world. A reviewer just happens to pick up on something and everyone else just apes it. Similarly, if the first few reviewers don't really notice something, it may go unreported entirely.
I remember test driving a Sonata and the salesman pointed out the tight turning radius and I was impressed with it. I don't mind the turning radius(38.7') on my Mazda6 but all the reviewers sure did. It just seemed strange that they all thought it was too large on the 6 but never mention it on the Malibu. This among other things has proven to me that all these "professional" reviews must really be taken with a grain of salt and the only test drive that really matters is your own.
My last car, an Infiniti G20t, had a h u g e turning radius... Annoying when parking, but I assume was also part of the reason the CV joints & axles lasted over 250k miles.
I sure wouldn't let that one spec keep me from buying a car I liked.
Nor I. I like to do the pluses and minuses and that's just one of the minuses. Like I said, it sure didn't stop me from buying the M6 even though the reviewers had problems with it. Slight adjustment is all when parking mostly.
The G20T was a nice looking little car. Wish Infiniti had not stopped making it. It was ahead of it's time and with gas prices what they are people would probably be willing to pay for the luxury in a small package. Although the Cimmaron didn't do well in the 70s when we had the last gas crisis. The G20T and the Cimmaron are obviously different cars; quality and looks especially.
Add me to that list.
While my 2005 Mazda6 has some short comings, I still love it, and I am not looking to replace it.
Make/May 08 Sales/% Change from May 07/YTD 2008 Sales/% Change from 2007 YTD
Toyota Camry/ 51,291/ 2.3%/ 198,309/ 2.3%
Honda Accord/ 43,728/ 37%/ 166,158/ 8.3%
Chevy Impala/ 23,803/ (33.3%)/ 122,281/ (15.4%)
Ford Fusion/ 18,088/ 26.7%/ 73,197/ 10.5%
Chevy Malibu/ 15,634/ 51.3%/ 73,760/ 40%
From the above it is clear that the Camry and Accord sales more than 3 times that of the Malibu. With such low volume sales it does not appear that GM’s $100 million advertising campaign for Malibu is working effectively.
The figures above include Hybrid sales for the Accord and Camry. By the way, neither the Sonata nor the Altima made it in the top 20.
The purpose of advertising is to increase sales. GM has done what with the Malibu. BTW, The Accord is only selling little more then 2 times more then Malibu.
And Accord/Camry won't lose all of those customers overnight, just like the others won't gain them that quickly.
1. Chevy Malibu
2. Mitsubishi Galant (WHOA SURPRISE!)
3. Ford Fusion
Interesting that the top 3 has no Honda or Toyota, instead we have the two big american makers and a surprise japanese brand with a terrible rep. Discuss!
I remember the old Sonata winning this award a time or two, myself.
Just curious...
There is NO way for you to know that. You're just making wild, biased guesses that can't be proven or dis proven. No pickup driver who uses their truck would trade it for a car. Neither will most SUV drivers. Large pickups might be replaced by smaller pickups (ranger sales were up recently) and SUVs might be replaced by CUVs (I just traded a V8 Aviator for a V6 Edge). Large/midsized cars might be replaced by smaller cars.
Incidentally, focus retail sales are DOUBLE (103%) what they were last year and had it's best sales month ever in May. Convenient that you left it out of the list.
There are also a lot of suburban owners of pick-ups that only use them as pick-ups occassionaly. I have a couple of neighbors that are looking to trade for cars.
I agree that somebody who really needs a large vehicle or a truck will not go to car--they can't.
Also, to be fair, Focus sales would be about 1/2 of what they are if it were not for SYNC. Even Ford dealers will tell you that. It's a really hot item that fits into the Focus's demographics. However, it is what is for whatever reason and should be noted as you say.
Many of these people do not use their vehicle for anything that a car can not do. I just read an article last weekend where a local dealer said: The trend that we're seeing that's interesting now is people with full-size SUVs and pickups going into economy cars
He also goes on to say:
Many are families who own two large vehicles and are keeping one to use on the weekend to haul a boat, but they're buying a small car for commuting. and that the dealership typically has 40 Focuses in stock but it's tough to build up more than five right now and the Fusions are in low stock as well.
http://www.jsonline.com/story/index.aspx?id=757105
So people not buying trucks are making many different choices.
That's not what I said. The trade-in value of a truck is not good right now.
Say there's this guy "Joe Blow".
He needs his full size truck for hauling a boat or camper on the weekends, but also uses it for commuting 70 miles 5 days a week (hauling nothing but himself). Don't you think Joe would decide to keep the old truck for hauling the boat on weekends, and buy a new car, instead of a new truck, for commuting. The money saved on gas, could pay for the car in some cases.
I've always been skeptical of JD Power's owners' surveys (ever since Buicks were scoring higher than their GM stablemates).
Is there a chance that the owner of a new $40k Buick is perhaps easier to satisfy than the owner of a new $40k Acura (who I'd assume more likely cross-shopped at Lexus, Infiniti, BMW & Mercedes before buying)????
Granted, I don't think the Malibu, Fusion or Galant are junk, but....perhaps it reveals their owners' expectation levels. :confuse:
This article noted that the automakers see this trend as permanent, not some fad. So we'll be seeing small to medium sized cars top the sales charts in the future. Hopefully we'll also see more choice in roomy but fuel-efficient cars--like cars that have mid-sized interiors but compact exteriors, such as the Elantra, Prius, Sentra, and Versa.
Yes. There is obviously a disconnect between surveys and sales. If the surveys in fact really were statistically accurate, sales would follow. After all why would anybody buy something that's at the bottom of the barrel?
I want to develop a product that people to buy it again and again and again because their brainwashed.
I'm one of those brainwashed people, and you know what when you give me my next Malibu I'll drive it, until then I'll spend my money on the car of my choice and buy it for my own reasons. And it's none of your business if I view the Accord as a status symbol, if that is even possible. :confuse
Wrong, wrong, wrong. You assume that the primary factor for purchasing a vehicle is reliability/quality and that is simply not true. For a lot of people, price is the major factor. For others it's features or interior or exterior styling. Some people are loyal to a brand or model regardless of anything else. Some people want a status symbol. Do you really think a BMW buyer cares whether BMW is at the top, middle or bottom?
If those were the only two factors, the 2009 Hyundia Sonata would be the hands down top seller. It's too bad the brand has such a stigma attached to it. They should have changed the name, like Datsun did long ago.
Yes. If BMW was at the bottom of the heap, nobody would buy an overpriced piece of junk and sales would suffer.
IMO BMW buyers are picker than Buick buyers. Given a BMW and Buick the same flaw on a BMW would send it lower in ratings than a Buick.
I think you might be right there. The Fusion and Malibu are 10 times better then what they replaced, therefore the people who have bought them now think they are the greatest thing since sliced bread, while Honda and Toyota have not made any significant advance in quality.
It's all about perception.
Look at the reviews for the 09 Mazda6. They are bashing the old one, when Edmunds.com editors said it was their favorite. It was also touted as having good build quality, and now it's trashed in favor of the new one. Once again, it's about perception.
BMW 7 series' have always had crappy quality, but that didn't stop people from buying them.
3-4 years ago Mercedes was at the bottom, but people didn't stop buying them.
We're only talking about one half of one service visit between the top and bottom. It's not the difference between a mid 90's Accord and a Yugo.
How many people are influenced in car buying here over the fact that tons of people and friends will automatically recommend a toyota or honda because of "reliability"? And yes they do, I've seen it myself plenty.
My friend who loves fancy cars will immediately be like "oh you want a cheap car, uh get a honda or toyota because they're reliable" And of course I went the other direction and got a hyundai because it's reliable and less expensive But I gotta say, NOT A SINGLE PERSON I KNEW RECOMMENDED A HYUNDAI TO ME. This was back in 2003. Hopefully things have changed...but I for one will recommend whatever is best for a person, I hate brands. Since after I got mine, a number of other people I know now own or have looked at hyundais. This is certainly a difference from the past. Anyways it'll take many many years for all the [non-permissible content removed] influences in the market to ever be changed.
Yean, like the Lexus GX430 or whatever it was. BMW has fixed the issues, have you driving a 750? If not take it for a test drive.
3-4 years ago Mercedes was at the bottom, but people didn't stop buying them.
True dat, people also bought the Aztec, Yugo and Pinto. But Mercedes sales were down.
I've seen it also, along with plenty of reliable Hondas and plenty of unreliable Hyundias. Yeah, that is why it will take years and years for a switch, if it ever happens.
I hate brands
Aren't all cars part of a brand?
Speaking as a BMW owner...Yes, I do care whether BMW is at the top, middle or bottom. If I felt it was unreliable, I would buy a competitor's product.
Did anyone notice whether Mazda has said ESC will be standard across the line on the 2009 Mazda6? I don't recall seeing that.
These awards shouldn't go out until almost a full year goes by and this goes for any model.
JD Power already does a 3 yr dependability survey - unfortunately you have to wait 3 years to get results (funny how that works).
Pity, isn't it?
bwia, "2008 Chevrolet Malibu" #830, 3 Apr 2008 6:43 am
The 3 year dependability survey is for long term reliability/quality. You can certainly look at that and compare cars too...a new one should be out in a few months.