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Comments
So is the due diligence to find out why there have been so many fuel pump failures in such a short time. Overnight? According to the NHTSA's website, the investigation began on or about July 17th, over 2 weeks ago. The point is I would expect that such a safety issue would be fast-tracked and the fix be evident by now!
van
http://www.aboutautomobile.com/complaint/2008/HYUNDAI/ELANTRA
I now have 1185 miles on my car. I just hope if it goes it happens in my town.
van
I'm debating on whether to wait this out, or just look for another vehicle. I am not necessarily worried that the SE will run out, I know a few dealers have called me saying they have SE automatics in stock.
van
Nope, can't find it anyplace. I found the air bag warning on the drivers side. I found the tire label and all that stuff on the post where I was told to look. But for the life of me I have looked all over that car in the cracks and all the doors and can't find anything with a date. I remember my Toyota Tacoma have a little black lable with silver writing and I know what I am looking for. You don't suppose someone removed it do you?
Their diagnosis was a bad oxygen sensor which they didn't have in stock. They said it would be ok to drive the car until the new sensor arrived. It ran fine and 3 days later I took it in to have the sensor replaced. They ran diagnostics again and said the sensor was ok and needn't be replaced. They said maybe it was bad gas or vapor lock and sent me on my way.
The car ran fine until this afternoon when it began hesitating (1436 mi) on the freeway and once again I took the first exit and limped home, unable to exceed 25 mph, bucking all the way. My wife followed me to the dealer but we never made it as the Elantra shut down completely in rush hour traffic and I had to get out and push into a nearby parking lot. I called HRA and had the car trucked to the dealer, only about 4 blocks away. It was interesting to note the expressions of the show room customers and salesman as the almost new Elantra arrived and was dumped in the parking lot.
I don't know if it is a bad fuel pump or something else. All I know for sure is that I have an unreliable car that my wife refuses to ride in. I really like the car when it is running well, but until a definitive diagnosis and repair is done I can't trust this car beyond short grocery runs.
I think my Elantra was built in February 08 (can't verfiy as car is at dealer).
Were you given a loaner?
Good luck and please post your outcome!
http://nhthqnwws112.odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/acms/docservlet/Artemis/Public/Pursuits/20- 08/PE/INOA-PE08044-61690.pdf
The customer service rep did encourage me to ask everyone who has a failure to call ASAP. They consider this "early" in the typical investigation timeframe. Great. They're waiting for more "real world" failures to see what to do next!
About a bad fuel pump causing an accident- that's a little of a stretch for me. Cars die out all the time on the road- even on expressways traveling at high speeds. Hopefully cars following are aware enough to stop and not swerve uncontrollably. I think the reason there are accidents (most of the times) is because people are driving too fast and aren't allowing enough space between cars. Now if the fuel pump going out causes the brakes to lock up immediately, that would be another issue.
I just hope this isn't a wide spread issue and if it is, hopefully hyundai puts out the proper recall and it's taken care of appropriately.
Sorry to those who are having issues- good luck!
eric
It is not just an inconvenience, it is a SAFETY HAZARD. If your car loses power/stalls on a major highway, like mine did on I-95 with people travelling at high speeds - People could get hurt or die. Maybe if you live in "hickville" you have drivers who are practicing safe driving but in areas like DC/VA/MD/NJ/PA/NY and a host of others, the probability of an accident increases exponentially. It is that type of ignorance/cavalier attitude about an issue like this that will get someone seriously hurt. Companies shouldn't wait for the worse to happen to take action.
There are some components which are designed NOT to fail during a normal operation. Things like Steering, Brakes, and, FUEL system. These are supposed to be designed with very high Factor of Safety. The fact that fuel pumps are failing is alarming because that means that either design is bad or manufacturing is bad. These are NOT supposed to fail during normal operation.
Are these 24 reports on a message forum or to the NTSB? I still only see 4 reports to the NTSB, which is the only place that will matter.
Well, lets see. I didn't even know about this website until it was posted a few days ago and our report to the NTSB is number 18. And if you go thru each one you will see they are reports done thru the NTSB. I NEVER posted anything here. That means the NTSB posted it.
http://www.aboutautomobile.com/complaint/2008/HYUNDAI/ELANTRA
If that 18 wheeler and SUV and car hit my husband (3 lane highway in NJ) do you think Hyundai would have enough money for a lawsuit for my husband getting killed due to their defective fuel pump. Evidently you need to talk to a REAL mechanic or maybe a State troooper to see just how many cars/trucks with problems cause accidents. :mad:
I know mine does and he is my 3rd. So, that said, the 3 threes stand for Dead, Divorced, but not desparate on the last one. He is the best.
it would be nice for companies to act when just handful of issues arise; however, it just doesn't make financial sense. i know i know, money isn't everything and safety is more important, but would it make sense to recall 100s of thousands of cars if it only is affecting less than 2% of the cars? i say no, but can appreciate others' opinions.
would i like to see them recall all 2008 elantras? yes, but i just don't think it's realistic until it's proven there's a bigger issue out there.
maybe i just jinxed myself with my elantra
have a good one.
eric
i used to work on the tollway in chicago and saw many accidents and fatal ones all the time- i know car problems can cause accidents; however, a large percentage can be avoided. i'm not trying to minimize your husband's situation- sorry that happened. i just don't think hyundai will do anything about this issue until more are brought to their attention. i wish they would but don't see it happening anytime soon.
take care.
eric
And I had been posting over there in that forum and when hubby's car had the problem I found this forum. Now considering that forum was posting for 8 months before Toyota did anything.....well... I wouldn't doubt Hyundai is trying to narrow down vin #s to send letters out to. My truck was actually bought off me at 150% of the KBB value of what a dealer would sell it for in excellant condition so Toyota could take it back and crush it. Their letter read 183,000 trucks affected.
So, I bought my Elantra with the check from Toyota. I know there is a problem, I know hubby almost got killed. But I just want to see anyone with a fuel pump get it fixed before someone gets killed. I love my Elantra. I am very happy with the mileage, the room and the price.
Kinda crappy that I lost my truck that never had a engine problem and bought something I have to worry about. But after being thru a recall where I lost my paid off vehicle of 11 yrs, this fuel pump thing is an annoying factor because I have to worry everytime I go someplace am I going to break down.
I think Hyunda should have enough data by now to know approx. what vehicles are affected to have them brought in to the dealer and checked.
As to how much data Hyundai has and whether it's enough for them and the NHTSA to announce the action plan... well, I wouldn't presume to know more than they do at this point. They probably have info you and I are not privy to.
I am also wondering when the new Elantras are coming out and if they are going to do deep discounts on the 08's. The problem is, I need one now.
Consumer Reports highly recommends the Elantra, but it seems like the Toyota lines have been steady through the years.
Help! Any ideas/suggestions/tips?
As to how much data Hyundai has and whether it's enough for them and the NHTSA to announce the action plan... well, I wouldn't presume to know more than they do at this point. They probably have info you and I are not privy to.
As I posted before, I believe it is up to the 2008 Elantra owners to call Hyundai to express their concern about the faulty fuel pump, even if you don't have a problem now. Tell them "do you know how disconcerting it is to be driving a vehicle with a known safety investigation open, with the potential failure of my vehicle being raw data for said investigation?" If we express our concerns appropriately it will hopefully do some good, at least letting Hyundai know that it's customers are paying attention.
Can we do a roll call of who called and experiences with the corporate office?
Drive safely and keep a lookout for the check engine light!
Me.... I have a case number due to my car being sluggish under 25 miles an hour. And they gave me the case number, told me to keep it and have the car hooked up to the diagnostics at the dealer who of course said....nothing wrong. I don't believe them. And like you said before.... I think they recalbirated it too now as it was fine for almost a week after I took it to the dealer and now it is starting in again.
One big advantage the Elantra (SE only) and Corolla have over the Fit IMO is that electronic stability control is available (standard on the SE). VSA will be available on the highest-level trim of the 2009 Fit (Sport with nav), if you don't mind paying close to $19k + T&L for a Fit.
The Corolla with leather will probably cost more than $19k + T&L. A fairly spartan LE is over $18k, and big discounts are hard to come by due to $4 a gallon gas.
If you are looking for a good all-around car at the lowest price, and you don't need a hatchback or ESC, then the 2008 Elantra GLS would be your best bet. Some dealers (e.g. Towne Hyundai) are selling automatics with PEP for around $13k + T&L with the $1500 rebate. If you can find an SE with leather for around $16k + T&L, I think that is a good deal at this time, considering how popular the SEs are.
Have you driven all these cars yet? You might be able to decide just from a long test drive in each car. The Elantra and Corolla have some similarities in ride, but the Fit is much different.
the fit is a total different type of a car. they are nice; however, pricier- my friend bought one 3 weeks ago and no dealer in the chicagoland area would go under sticker price since they're a hot commodity. my friend also owns a new nissan versa and he likes that better than the fit- says it is more comfortable and drives better.
Hmm...that's a biggie question...three pretty good cars, but Hundyai is still new to being considered with Honda and Toyota--yes consumer reports came out with the glowing report....
but so much of what goes into this also depends on who you are and what you want.
Some of my friends still warn to stay clear of the Hundyai, but I'm uncertain myself.
When you say now, do you mean like "yesterday"? Cause I believe the new Honda Fit's are due out end of Sept (?) and the new Elantra's I don't know when...
I'd recommend to read the various forums--great info..
If you go over to the Elantra '08 forum, you will find many fuel pump problems are arising from the 08's...this is not to say yours would have this, of course--but they are happening at an alarming rate and to date no recall issued--a true safety concern. Yes, it has a long warranty, but maybe that's cause you'll need it! (?)
I think Honda Fit (go to that forum too) is awesome if you can deal with no armrest and no seat height adjustment. The "09 will be even better and with armrest but no height adjustment..If you are short, the Fit actually 'fits' better than if you are tall, IMO--and you can just toss in a comfy cushion to raise you higher.
But if you are tall, or anticipate tall people driving, this could be a problem.
I just love hatchbacks, to throw all my stuff in-- and Honda is a great solid company. But that's me--maybe not you at all.
But you need to ask yourself what is most important to you?
Safety? Price? Resale? Comfort? Hatchback? Color choices?
MPG: they all are around the same, I think--but you can research this at
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/ratings2008.shtml
click on "Find and compare cars"
And you need to test drive all three carefully--pay attention to comfort and
other things and try to imagine if you would be comfortable with the car for the
next 3-5 years...
I found the 'O9 Corolla overpriced and lackluster, frankly. It did not live up to it's hype, but it was fine enough--and as a Toyota, I'm sure it's also going to do well by you and if you like it, that's all that matters...
Here's another tip:
Don't tell salespeople you need a car NOW--they love desperate and eager customers. Stick to a price somewhere between invoice and MSRP that seems fair and tell them this is what you are willing to pay. Be willing to walk out-there are many other dealers out there who will give you what you want.
Don't forget--They are eager to move the '08's off the lot, as they need room for the next batch coming in....
Best of luck--when in doubt, don't do it--there is no cooling off period, so if you need to sleep on it, than tell them you are tired and will come back the next day. Or maybe go for a long lunch and call some friends for advice...You are the buyer and they want your business.
Finally, remember--there is NO PERFECT CHOICE--they all have pros and cons, and all will please and disappoint no doubt to some degree or another...
Good luck--hopefully others will also chime in--I am no expert, but this is just from my last couple of months' experience!
I could talk about my nine total years of Elantra ownership experience (two cars) with the most serious problem that was the fault of the car being a bad O2 sensor on my 2001 Elantra (fixed in less than an hour). But that's only one data point. Here's what CR says about the reliability of the Elantra, Fit, and 2009 Corolla:
Elantra: Much better than average
Fit: Much better than average
Corolla: Too new to predict reliability
but I sense (and hear from others) the Hyundai still has a stigma to live down--CR folks live in the lab, and they like to pull out underdogs...which is good (I love CR)--but folks take a while to catch up to this sort of thing...I know a lot of people who won't touch a Korean made car (even though I think this is stigma and stereotype for the most part).
I bet dollar for dollar, the Hondas will bring in better re-sale--especially the civic v. the elantra....Honda has been voted the Greenest company overall with all their efforts to bring on new hybrids and low emissions cars (Civic).....
But the Corolla? No, because it's too much to begin with...and it's still the same boring look (albeit, much better safety now).
I've been calling Hyundai of America periodically to get updates on the investigation and ask when Hyundai plans to respond. I get the same party line every time I call: "as of now, Hyundai has not yet received any notification from the NHTSA. It is hard to predict if and when any action will take place. Keep in mind you have a 10-year warranty, so if your car starts to have a problem, just bring it in to your dealer for service."
http://usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/cars-trucks/rankings/Affordable-Small-Cars/-
Your comment about CR liking underdogs is interesting, because for many years there were charges that CR discriminated against Korean cars in their rankings. Now that Korean cars like the Elantra are getting kudos from CR, there's talk of their pulling for underdogs. LOL. Could it be that the Elantra is simply a good car? Nah.
I expect that a Civic would command a higher price on resale than an Elantra--because the Civic costs thousands more up front than an Elantra, comparably equipped. Naturally the Elantra will sell for less used. How much less? My '04 Elantra has depreciated less than $5000 from my purchase price for a private-party sale in 4.5 years, according to Edmunds.com and KBB. That's less than $100/month depreciation. I'll take that kind of depreciation anytime. But I didn't buy my Elantra because it costs thousands less than the Civic. I bought it because I liked it better than the Civic (also the Corolla), and it offered features (hatchback, leather, traction control etc.) that at the time could not be found on ANY Civic.
As for low emissions, the Elantra is available as a PZEV. Is the non-hybrid Civic available as a PZEV?
You sound defensive. I'm not wanting to get into an right/wrong power struggle with you.
I should have known better to say I prefer Honda on a Hyundai forum! (Although I see you too are considering a Honda Fit as per your bio ), and you've said positive things about the civic as well (???)
I was just trying to help the poster with what is ultimately a very private and personal decision by letting them know what I know and giving them some pointers.
The best expert is you--the person buying the car, provided you've done some adequate research, you know what you want, you know your budget, you know what you will feel good driving for the next 3-5 years...
Btw, by saying Consumer Reports likes to occasionally redeem themselves by bringing out underdogs does not mean that they are also not telling the truth. I never said that--that's your addition/distortion to what I said. I don't think they'd risk giving a car a high rating if it really wasn't good--that would be idiotic of them and open up huge liability. AND they do like to bring out underdogs when they find them--especially after being accused of being biased...
Look, this decision is not about right/wrong...they're all decent enough cars-- as I said none are perfect--they all have their pros and cons. The key is to find the one that is most perfect for who you are and what your needs are right now, IMHO.
In the final analysis, it just comes down to personal preference and gut instincts after you've done some good basic research from places like Edmunds and CR and from test driving and from reading some of these forums re: problems people are honest and humble enough to admit to after purchasing their car.
I notice some folks have genuine regrets, and I respect these folks for speaking their truth to help future buyers--rather than feeling the need to be right about what they bought above all else.
Best of luck to you and everyone making such an individual decision as this!
I do happen to think the Elantra is a good choice in the small car field (especially the SE), and I have quite a bit of personal experience owning Gen 3 Elantras so I can speak to that. But since you've read my profile you know I've owned lots of cars of different brands. I don't play favorites on brands. I buy whatever best fits my needs at that time. I like the Fit too--except I really want ESC on my next car, and I don't want to spend $19k on a Fit to get that feature. And I think the Civic is a good car also, but not worth the price premium over the Elantra. Corolla? A decent car with great fuel economy and a smooth quiet ride, but again not a car that I prefer over alternatives like the Elantra.
Please don't mistake a difference of opinion with a "power struggle." But this is a discussion forum, and I reserve the right to disagree with posts from you and others. Just as you can disagree with me. Fair enough?
P.S. If your statement about some folks feeling the need to be right about what they bought above all else was directed at me, then you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about.
OK.....Hooorarry!!!!!!!!!!! I looked where you said and I must have been blind not to see this big black box. I was looking inside the door by the hinges. I didn't look here.
My car has a date of Feb. 13, 2008.
Thanks you for the more explicit details to look. Hubby is going to look at his in about an hour as he just got up and I didn't feel like going outside and getting a whiff of cigarette smoke opening his door to look.
Re:
"But I think it would be more helpful to prospective buyers to talk about the merits (or demerits) of the cars themselves rather than opinions about whether lots of people would never touch a Korean car and whether CR roots for underdogs or not. Personally I don't find those kinds of comments particularly useful to someone trying to decide between different cars."
Well, I respectfully disagree. We all contribute different things when such a broad question is tossed out, depending on who we are, what our style is, what we value to include in the decision making process of acquiring a new car...
So not all responses are going to focus ONLY on concrete data--and if they did, that would be rather limiting in my view--you can go to Edmunds or CR for that--it's all there in Black and White...
What makes responses fuller and more interesting on a forum like this IMO are personal testimonies (both positive and negative) -- as well those little tidbits of info you might not find so readily elsewhere--this only enriches the conversation, in my view.
So I disagree with your suggestion that we should ignore something like a stigma outright (could be important info. for re-sale and maybe there is even a grain of truth to the stigma).
And
I don't think data such as what motivates CR (an organization which I subscribe to and love, btw) should be censored out either.
These are relevant and very real (albeit periphery and not as central) issues, and IMO they only enrich the decision making process by providing important context.
Why not let the buyer ultimately decide herself/himself what to toss out and what to consider?
And BTW, If you look at all my posts re: this very big sort of question, I did include concrete pros and cons replete with referrals and suggestions re: the cars themselves-- including the new alarming fuel pump issue, which should be duly noted, IMO.
On a personal note, I think the stigma is a sad thing, and hopefully it will slowly erode-- whether or not it is fully deserved (likely not) is an entirely different issue.
In any case, I think it's great your personal experience with Hyundai has been so positive--the Elantra sounds like it's really served you well, and it's been a good fit for your needs-- and maybe it will be just the ticket for Clemence too! There sure are many happy Elantra owners out there, and it sounds like Clemence stumbled upon a good offer (surprising to hear at this late stage of 08 with so few SE Automatics left on the lot...)
(Clemence--hope our responses helped in some small way and hope you let us know what you went with!
I'm truly sorry for the misunderstanding, backy. Fwiw, I harbor no hard feelings...respectful disagreements and debate is very healthy--I agree with you there!