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Rear Fog Light: A tricky subject
batman47
Member Posts: 606
Rear fog lights/lamp:
The Outlander comes with a multi-purpose switch lever assembly with a first rotary switch knob and a second rotary switch knob composed with a light switch for selectively switching a plurality of switch terminals and a fog light switch (rear or front) by selectively connecting switch terminals. The US model doesn’t have, the rear fog light activation rotary switch or it is just not visible on the lever knob.
Does someone know or have some knowledge of how I can devise a procedure to trigger a rear fog light, that will light permanently when activated (by rotating a switch) when the conditions so require, e.g. heavy fog, rain or snow. Generally, US models connect the European fog light wire to the brake circuit thereby giving the US model a third brake light.
I would need to buy a new conventional European composite switch lever that is mounted on the Outlander steering column to replace the original US switch lever. What I do not know is if the US harness will allow me to do that swap. Assuming that the harness is compatible (on the belief that Mitsubishi would not manufacture two harness, one for Europe and Asia and one for the America market), can it be connected by the Mitsubishi dealer, just like that, and bingo or the dealer needs to activate the new European switch lever by connecting it to their shop computer and telling the OBC that the fog lights and switch are there?
The final results if everything goes OK is that by rotating the switch a little, the rear fog light lights, and the rear fog light icon lights in the instrumentation panel.
I have seen a number of European car manufactures with plants in the USA, BMW (e.g. MINI), VW, etc that provides dealers with rear fog light kits to be ready when a customer requires this essential safety feature.
The Outlander comes with a multi-purpose switch lever assembly with a first rotary switch knob and a second rotary switch knob composed with a light switch for selectively switching a plurality of switch terminals and a fog light switch (rear or front) by selectively connecting switch terminals. The US model doesn’t have, the rear fog light activation rotary switch or it is just not visible on the lever knob.
Does someone know or have some knowledge of how I can devise a procedure to trigger a rear fog light, that will light permanently when activated (by rotating a switch) when the conditions so require, e.g. heavy fog, rain or snow. Generally, US models connect the European fog light wire to the brake circuit thereby giving the US model a third brake light.
I would need to buy a new conventional European composite switch lever that is mounted on the Outlander steering column to replace the original US switch lever. What I do not know is if the US harness will allow me to do that swap. Assuming that the harness is compatible (on the belief that Mitsubishi would not manufacture two harness, one for Europe and Asia and one for the America market), can it be connected by the Mitsubishi dealer, just like that, and bingo or the dealer needs to activate the new European switch lever by connecting it to their shop computer and telling the OBC that the fog lights and switch are there?
The final results if everything goes OK is that by rotating the switch a little, the rear fog light lights, and the rear fog light icon lights in the instrumentation panel.
I have seen a number of European car manufactures with plants in the USA, BMW (e.g. MINI), VW, etc that provides dealers with rear fog light kits to be ready when a customer requires this essential safety feature.
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Comments
According to the Outlander 2003 workshop it seems that there are only two switches shipped with the Outlander from Japan. A switch-1 and a switch-2. Switch-1 is composed of two switches, i.e. the front fog lamp switch and rear fog lamp switch which are in the same device. These switches are integrated in the lever/knob of the steering wheel that control the lights (i.e. dip/beam lights). The switch-2 is only rear fog lamp switch and this switch is compulsory in Europe although the front fog light is not. In other words, in Europe the front fog lamps are an option but not the rear fog light which is compulsory. In Europe if a customer wants a front fog light, the dealer just changes switch-2 for switch-1 and installs the front fog lamps kit. Switch-1 will activate the front and the rear fog lights/lamps. Because the harness for both fog lights is already there without undergoing any alteration, the procedure seems to be straightforward.
It appears to me that in the US the switch-1 harness is installed in all Outlander vehicles sold in the US with the exception of the front fog lamps assembly/kit itself. Option F3 is for the customers who wants a front fog lamps in the Outlander and it consists mainly of the front fog lights assembly/kit. Because the lever/knob set (steering wheel) of a US Outlander has not any visual information about the rear fog light (no icon/symbol); this feature (rear fog light manually operated) is purposely eliminated by disabling the rear fog light LED on the instrumentation panel and by using a modified stamp lever/knob device (no rear fog lamp icon/symbol) and the rear fog lamp wiring to the rear ‘fog’ lamps. Because the Outlander has two rear fogs lamp assemblies the harness/wiring of the rear fog lamps is connected to the brake harness/wiring and as a result the US Outlander has three braking lamps (or four).
Mitsubishi America, I think has resolved this situation by manufacturing two types of fog lamp switches as it has always been the case. One composed switch: front fog lights and rear fog lights in the same device. The second switch is only rear fog light. In Europe all cars comes with rear fog light, therefore this switch is mandatory. In the US fog lights are not mandatory, but the majority of US customers are keen to have front fog lights as an option. Mitsubishi has resolved this dilemma by installing the composed fog switch (switch-1 rear and front), in the US vehicles, deleting the rear fog light stamp/symbol from the European lever/knob, disabling the LED rear fog symbol light from the instrumentation panel, and bypassing the rear fog light wiring by activating them only when the brake pedal is depressed.
Originally I though this rear fog light is a very complicated procedure but after the analysis above everybody that will like to have a rear fog light need only to find a willing dealer to reverse the steps that have previously disabled the rear fog lights information that in my opinion all the US Outlander trims come with..
The adding of fog lights later is doable, by the owner, but it's not simply mount them from below and plug unto an existing harness. The kit comes with a harness, a relay to be added, and you must remove the front plastic bumper to install the lights and harness properly. Mitsubishi made the light switch overly complicated IMHO, the switch is a momentary on momentary off contact that activates via the "brain" and must be programmed in. The optional do it yourself programming instructions to open and close the door 5 times while standing on your head and facing east didn't work. Going back to the dealer I got them to program it for free since the official Mitsu kit instructions don't work. In the end I saved the labor cost of having the dealer do it and got the kit cheaper on EBAY, , but I sure wish I found an Outie LS with lights already installed (XLS does, but at higher package cost than I wanted to spend).
Your comments and procedure to install the front fog lights in your 2007 LS Outlander are paramount to the understanding of the rear fog lights layout. Mitsubishi calls it Smart Wiring System (SWS). Before I elaborate further may I ask you the following:
Did your Outlander came with a sort of stalk (I will call it LS stalk) and when you bought the front fog light kit, did the kit came with a XLS stalk? If this is ‘yes’, the Mitsubishi dealer just replaced the original “LS stalk” for the “XLS stalk” that came with the kit in addition, of course, to the harness and relay.
Another very important contribution of your comments is that the Mitsubishi dealer had to use his programmer device to instruct the On-Board-Computer (OBC) to recognize the new hardware addition in the same manner that a desktop/laptop recognizes addition of new hardware (e.g. CD/DVD player).
May I ask about the “cosmetic” differences between the LS stalk and XLS stalk? I mean the LS stalk has some symbols scribbled on it because it must function to operate the low/high front lights. When you received the XLS stalk/stem it should have symbols scribbled on it to indicate the functionality of the lights that now includes the front fog light activation switch.
If you see the Outlander rear body it has two lamps (left and right) about 10 inches below the corresponding brake lights (plus turning lights indicators, reverse lamps). Could you please depress the brake pedal and note if this action has activated one or two of these lamps (in Europe this lamp lights when the driver manually activates the stalk rear fog light switch by the steering column). If these lamps light then every time you depress the brakes the car responds by lighting the proper brake lights and one of two ‘rear fog’ lamps (Bulbs have the same watt as a brake bulb). If this happens then the European rear fog light circuit has been connected someway to the brake lines.
I am almost sure that if a European stalk multi-function switch can be bought (those that can be easily bought by the desk of a Mitsubishi dealer part department) the problem of installing a rear fog light assemblage can be done by a Mitsubishi dealer in the US. The stalk switch system, harness (i.e. harness protruding from the stalk) and relay can be ordered from Europe. The relay case and fuses in the Outlander may already have the hollows to insert relays and fuses. Mitsu dealers may provide the programmer device and the OBC wire/harness/link (if needed) to physically connect the European hardware to the OBC.
The Mitsu technician has to reverse the actions taken for neutralizing the rear fog lights and put them in the right order, i.e. disconnecting the fog light wire from the brake wiring. The OBC and the European multi-function switch will do the rest.
as side marker/running lights on my US LS outie. Looking through the colored lens there appears to be a spot for another bulb in the center of this light, but it is not illuminating when both my brake lights and fog lights illuminated. (the whole wraparound lens cover is red, with the outside as a marker/running light and the inside as a reflector, The center appears to have a Fresnel lens of sorts, but I see no bulb inside)
As for the steering stalk light switch. The one for fog lights has a ring the turns in one direction (momentary) to turn on the fog lights and rotates the other way (momentary) to turn them off. The stalk plugs into a connector block on the steering column (additional connections already present are used with the new stalk that contains this momentary rotating switch).
I guess I don't understand the term "rear fog lamp" as front fog lamps are mounted down low and have a wide narrow hight beam to illuminate the ground and not reflect back up into your eye or blind the driver in front, These rear lights are mounted too high and would surely not serve the same function (illuminate the ground). I can only think that they supplement the rear brake lights for visibility to cars following behind, but not really a "fog" light beam.
The car in the photo is a LHD 2008 Outlander with two sets of lights. One set 10 inches above the other set is responsible for the brake lights, turning side lights and reverse lights). The other set is responsible for the rear fog light. The reason why these two lights are there is that European (West, East and Russia) is LHD (left hand drive) and the UK, Australia, New Zealand and Singapore are RHD. The rear fog light is compulsory in almost all countries with the exception of Canada and US. If the vehicle is LHD then the one rear fog light that must light is the left rear fog light. In RHD the rear fog light lamp must light in the right rear side of the car. Car manufacturers just build one model and adapt the circuitry to the demands of the respective countries. Rear fog light is a safety requirement which is very important when the weather is foggy, snowy, rainy, and dusty. These are the Californian regulations:
CALIFORNIA CODES
VEHICLE CODE
SECTION 24602
24602. (a) Any vehicle may be equipped with not more than two red fog tail lamps mounted on the rear which may be lighted, in addition to the required tail lamps, only when atmospheric conditions, such as fog, rain, snow, smoke, or dust, reduce the daytime or nighttimes visibility of other vehicles to less than 500 feet.
EnjoY.
A long time has passed since your post about the rear fog light when you was in the process of find out ways to activate the ‘rear’ fog light.
I have seen a post from a member from Poland here in this forum that took his 2007 Outlander XLS to Poland (this model has already front fog lights) and he said he took his car to a Mitsubishi dealership in Europe, and the technician got an instrument and he could see on the screen of this device a computer menu where it was asking to the technician what does he want to do i.e. activate or deactivate the front, rear or both?
As I said somewhere in this Forum all the harness is already in the vehicle electrical system and only it need a willing Mitsubishi technician to operate the instrument (it has a proper name) to activate the rear fog light. I have posted to ‘lukarzkur’ the polish member and I am still waiting for its reply.
Thanks
EnjoY
The rear fog light switch button (part#MR190952) can be only bought from Europe/UK. The European stalk switch (part#: 8614A061) can only be bought from Europe/UK. The rear bulb holder that includes connector wire and bulb can be bought from Europe/UK-Peugeot dealer (Bulb holder (part#621563) + bulb (part#6216F1)) or part#6350EN (rear fog light assy left) or part#6351EK (rear fog light assy right).
If you want to avoid the Peugeot dealer route then you can order the left and right rear fog light lamps assy (part#8337A014 for the right rear fog lamp assy. Make some enquires for the left rear fog light assy part#). USA side-marker lamp is sold with the rear fog cavity sealed that needs to be opened. When this hole is made the lamp will accept the rear fog bulb in addition to the side marker bulb which is already there.
All of these parts can be ordered using the services of any UK dealer. They will accept payment using your credit card. Go to:
http://www.mitsubishi-cars.co.uk/
To find dealers in the UK: Go to Dealers then Select -> SELECT COUNTY and then click any of the counties. Example: Lancashire or London. Give then a Call and give the part number. Otherwise do a Google search for internet sellers specializing in getting genuine Japanese car parts. Also you may enquire at your local Mitsubishi dealer to see if they will provide or request the part for you. My local dealer doesn’t do this service. You also can visit Mitsubishi Motor Web page in Australia
Other countries like the UK or Australia has companies or individuals announcing their trade in Web pages and auto magazines for the installing of rear fog lights. The business has shown to be profitable. The majority of Japanese trade in their cars after 3-years for new ones and individuals buy cars in Japan for export at usually one-third their original price. Cars in Japan don’t have rear fog lights and therefore there is demand for this type of job in the UK or Australia. This is not the case in the USA.
I took both side-marker lamp assemblies from the 2009 Outlander XLS and by using a model hobby rotary tool kit I made a hole in each lamp carefully to plug the rear fog bulb holder on it. It fixes firmly just with a little click. The rear fog bulb holder comes also with its connector which is the same connector of the side-marker bulb holder connector. There are two ways of having rear fog lights + side-marker lights in an American model:
(1)- Method 1: Run a proper graded wire from the adapted or modified rear side-marker lamp connector (rear fog bulb holder) to the instrumentation cluster; install a proper switch button (part# MR190952), a relay (part# MR588567) and fuse (10A) when required. The switch button will be operated by the driver independently. This job in addition to the items above named need to disassembly and assembly the rear bumper face to gain access to the rear bumper wiring harness. The end product of this approach is (a) - rear fog light in both ends in the rear bumper controlled by the driver and (b)- side-marker light controlled by the ETACS-ECU as was always the case. There is no need to reprogram the ETACS-ECU. Some fastener may be broken when doing the job with the rear bumper. Broken fastener must be replaced by new ones.
(2)- Method 2: This is more sophisticated method that needs more technical skill and knowledge.
(a)- First of all the rear side-marker connector which is connected to the ETACS-ECU connector must be disconnected (unplugged) and the new adapted rear fog light (already in the side-marker lamp (it will occupy the center area of the lamp)) connector will take its place. If the ETACS-ECU is not reprogrammed then the rear fog light will function as a side-marker light all the time and this is what we don’t want.
(b)- Secondly to prevent that the rear fog light from working like a side-marker light the ETACS-ECU must be reprogrammed using a European stalk switch (I have already bought one, part# 8614A061) instead of the original stalk switch (the original stalk switch may be with or without the front fog light functionality).. When this is done the rear fog bulb will light only when the driver manipulates the European stalk switch appropriately otherwise it will be always off. Under this situation the side-marker light connector is orphan. Before reprogramming a relay (part# MR588567) must be installed appropriately in the relay box and a fuse (10A) installed if required.
(c)- To make the side-marker operative it needs that the orphan connector be connected to a live wire harness like for example the license plate light wiring that is always on when the side-marker light is also on. This task implies to work with the wiring harness located to the left (corner) of the rear bumper that conducts current up to the license plate light in the tailgate. If this is done properly the side-marker light will be on when the license plate light is on and the rear fog light will be on when the driver deliberately requests this function by using the European stalk switch.
(d)- Method 2 requires to disassembly and assembly the left corner bumper and the rear bumper face to gain access to the wiring harness. Some fastener may be broken when doing this job. Broken fastener must be replaced by new ones.
Note:
(I)- I know part (1) above works because I did it few years ago in another vehicle. I used the services of an auto electrician to do the job. I provide him with all the parts and told him what I wanted. He used his skill of soldering and identifying live wires and also identifying appropriate relay terminals for the switch button and working under the instrumentation cluster to identify power sources for the switch and relay which need the skills of a contortionist.
(II)- I haven’t done part (2) yet but I am convinced that it will work at least theoretically. I have a 2009 Outlander CD that gives a lot of information about wiring harness, location of connectors, disassembly and assembly of the rear bumper, uses of the MUT-III to reprogram the ETACS-ECU, electrical diagram for the side-marker lights and license plate lights. At the moment I am getting in touch with a local Mitsubishi dealer service department people to see if this people would like to do the job. The ideal approach to this problem could be that the dealership has an auto electrician on his staff and also that the dealership has on its staff somebody that does auto body shop work but I very much doubt this. I think that the only thing that the dealer service department could do is to manipulate the MUT-III system to reprogram the ETACS-ECU so the rear fog light may be energized by using the new stalk switch. I think doing method-2 ($200-$300) is much more expensive than method-1 ($50-$100). In other words I do not expect to tackle part (1) or part (2) on my own. Photos or video may need to wait for a few months.
I think an auto body shop could do the wiring job and disassembly and assembly the rear bumper and make the electrical connection. They are experts on mending smashed cars (panels) with broken electrical wire harnesses. They usually return the crashed car in good working conditions. They know people with auto electrical expertise.
The rear fog light functionality needs either a European/UK stalk switch that will also need the ETACS-ECU reprogrammed or a button rear fog switch. The European stalk switch comes with the front fog and rear fog functionality and the front fog icon and the rear fog icon scribbled on it. The way how this stalk switch operates is usually one turn forward connects the front fog light only. Two turns forward connects the rear fog light. When this is done the vehicle has front fog and rear fog illuminated. The side-marker light will be in operation regardless of the drive’s manipulation of the fog stalk. This approach has been explained in a previous contribution. The approach is clean and doesn’t need a switch button near the instrumentation cluster.
The other approach is to use a switch button connected to a wire that will run from the rear fog socket to the instrument cluster. This switch will illuminate with the rear fog icon when operated by the driver. If the Outlander is a XLS with Xenon its switch stalk will not have the front fog light functionality and it will have only the DRL which will switch off when the xenon is activated on. This approach (switch button) will work regardless if the car has front fog or DRL.
Mitsubishi Motors has implemented since 2000 the CAN-bus network wiring that allows to transmite signal send by ETACS-ECU using the same wire to talk to different devices in the car. It is better to use the services of a Mitsubishi dealer when working with the ETACS-ECU to recognize devices.
If you buy the front fog light option from a dealership usually the dealer does the reprogramming for free as you found out. However if this is not the case it is most probable that some cost is involved to do the reprogramming.
The European/UK stalk switch well implemented will render you’re a car with European standard, i.e. stalk switch front and rear fog functionality in addition to stable side-marker lights to comply with the country regulations. Rattles are unlikely to occur. All the work will happen in the rear bumper wiring harness. The rear fog relay will be housed in the standard relay box in the engine compartment. Mitsubishi dealers most probably will charge you for this service.
It is new for us who are usually plain owners of a Mitsubishi car to keep with the advance in electronic and networking in vehicles. In the same way you are able to access and transmit your messages in Edmunds.com using a giant worldwide network the automobile industry is implementing its own controlled area network (CAN) to be used exclusively by car manufacturers. This approach has allowed car manufacturers to reduce and simplify considerably the amount of wiring (and weight) to operate all the devices in the car from electrical windows to ABS. The ETACS-ECU is the brain of this network and directs signals usually using the same wire to instruct different devices to take action. This is the main reason for reprogramming the ECU as this is the way to access this brain to tell it that a new device has been incorporated or a new functionality is required. Although this may appear bizarre, it is what our kids are going to deal with and confront in the near future.
This is not true!. Checking the electrical circuit of the US Outlander the rear fog light relay is already in the ETACS-ECU box which is below the driver instrument dash (left wall).
Please visit: Rear fog light progress (no soldering, no cutting, and no drilling) at:
http://www.mitsubishiforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25038&highlight=batman&pag- e=4
I spent some time reading the electrical circuit of the ETACS-ECU of the European Outlander and the ETACS-ECU of the US Outlander as well as the Tailgate Control Circuit. I found out that that there are better ways to add rear fog light and side marker functionality to the US Outlander. The solution that I will explain fully with diagram rests in plugging and unplugging connectors into the “rear bumper harness” and “rear end wiring harness”. This approach is clever. This solution came about after studying carefully the electrical circuits that control the functionally of these lights in both models (European and US).
Waiting at the moment for some part# to arrive.
I would like to have your appreciation about this contribution.
I will write here the results of this experiment and I will try to take some photos
After disassembling the side and rear bumper to disclose connector F-17 and inspecting male connector F-17 it was found that there were no wires to energize wires in the female connector F-17 which will be responsible of lighting the rear fog light. In conclusion the floor harness from connector C-311 in the ETACS-ECU to male connector F-17 didn’t have pin# 1 and pin# 7 wired to conduct current to the rear fog light.
It took a lot of thinking to create an approach to wave this problem. Fortunately at the end after entering the appropriate code into the MUT-III and replacing the old stalk switch with the European one the rear fog light was successfully lit just with an extra turn of the stalk switch from front fog light to rear fog light. I am very happy with the final result. My original idea of how to install a rear fog light in the Outlander by using the rear bumper harnesses layout was a great achievement
I personally think that with the exception of the ETACS-ECU stuff, all the other things can be done by an amateur Outlander owner.
This photo shows the rear side marker ON. Rear Fog light is OFF
This photo shows the Rear Fog Light ON. The rear side marker light is also ON.