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Mazda5 Engine Stumble Service Bulletin
There is a new Mazda Service Bulletin, #01-008/08 dated Feb 13, 2008 which applies to all 2006-07 Mazda5s, manual and automatic, all of USA and Mexico (also Canada if they get "Fed Spec" too). The title is "Engine Stumble While Driving with Light Acceleration at 1500-2500 rpm". I have just had the procedure done to our 2006 Touring 5MT, and it is a definite improvement.
The most dramatic symptom this SB addresses has for us been a very rare one, but a very noticeable and annoying one when it does happen. This was, approx 1/2 second after applying pressure to the gas pedal from a state of coasting, in the 1500-2500 rmp range, getting one (only one) sudden, brief, complete loss of power. This was felt as a big jerk, something all passengers would notice. The power loss would always be over with in a split second and the engine would begin to pull normally. I have no experience with automatic transmission 5s but I would guess that if the same symptom were to occur it would be more damped out by the torque converter and possibly more subtle.
So far so good on the new SB stopping the above obnoxious behavior -- but it will be months before I'm really convinced it's totally gone.
However, I think there's another much more frequent, much more subtle behavior that is also affected by the SB in a good way. I always used to think our 5 had poor throttle response compared to our other car, and Acura Integra. I don't mean absolute amount of power -- I mean instantaneousness of response to small applications of throttle. The Integra's engine always responds immediately, no waiting, to a nudge of the pedal. The Mazda always seemed to hesitate for a split second before starting to pull. I am pretty sure this has now changed for the better with the SB and I like it a lot.
It's important to note the date of the SB -- the solution to the problem was not invented until 6 weeks ago. I've been trying to complain to Mazda since almost Day One when we bought our car in March 2006. The first dealer service call that year produced no effective result at all. They didn't know what I was talking about and I don't think they did anything to the car except check it over. Then last year sometime we tried again, and at that time there had been published an official Mazda Service Bulletin (not the same one as the one I cite above), and we got a download of new PCM ("Power Control Module"? I think??) software. This fix in 2007 was an improvement but did not make the problem totally go away.
Being a compulsive and geeky car nut, I had all along been hoping to hear more scuttlebutt, and I finally struck paydirt last week at the Kirkland WA Mazda dealer (not my regular service spot). Although the Service Advisor did not have any new knowledge at first, I was persistent enough and he was patient enough, that he finally discovered that SB 01-008/08 now exists. I had the work done at Everett (WA) Mazda day before yesterday, and once I was able to cite the SB # they were totally ready and it was easy. (The work allocation time is only 20 minutes to do the new software download).
Anyway, my recommendation is to do this SB on your 2006-07 Mazda5, whether or not you realize your car has the symptoms I described here, or not, and whether or not you've tried complaining prior to Feb 2008 or not. The software engineers in Hiroshima (or wherever) have been at work and have something good for you. You'll like the feel you get -- and what the heck, I bet it even improves gas mileage (but I can't say it's any more than 0.01 mpg).
The most dramatic symptom this SB addresses has for us been a very rare one, but a very noticeable and annoying one when it does happen. This was, approx 1/2 second after applying pressure to the gas pedal from a state of coasting, in the 1500-2500 rmp range, getting one (only one) sudden, brief, complete loss of power. This was felt as a big jerk, something all passengers would notice. The power loss would always be over with in a split second and the engine would begin to pull normally. I have no experience with automatic transmission 5s but I would guess that if the same symptom were to occur it would be more damped out by the torque converter and possibly more subtle.
So far so good on the new SB stopping the above obnoxious behavior -- but it will be months before I'm really convinced it's totally gone.
However, I think there's another much more frequent, much more subtle behavior that is also affected by the SB in a good way. I always used to think our 5 had poor throttle response compared to our other car, and Acura Integra. I don't mean absolute amount of power -- I mean instantaneousness of response to small applications of throttle. The Integra's engine always responds immediately, no waiting, to a nudge of the pedal. The Mazda always seemed to hesitate for a split second before starting to pull. I am pretty sure this has now changed for the better with the SB and I like it a lot.
It's important to note the date of the SB -- the solution to the problem was not invented until 6 weeks ago. I've been trying to complain to Mazda since almost Day One when we bought our car in March 2006. The first dealer service call that year produced no effective result at all. They didn't know what I was talking about and I don't think they did anything to the car except check it over. Then last year sometime we tried again, and at that time there had been published an official Mazda Service Bulletin (not the same one as the one I cite above), and we got a download of new PCM ("Power Control Module"? I think??) software. This fix in 2007 was an improvement but did not make the problem totally go away.
Being a compulsive and geeky car nut, I had all along been hoping to hear more scuttlebutt, and I finally struck paydirt last week at the Kirkland WA Mazda dealer (not my regular service spot). Although the Service Advisor did not have any new knowledge at first, I was persistent enough and he was patient enough, that he finally discovered that SB 01-008/08 now exists. I had the work done at Everett (WA) Mazda day before yesterday, and once I was able to cite the SB # they were totally ready and it was easy. (The work allocation time is only 20 minutes to do the new software download).
Anyway, my recommendation is to do this SB on your 2006-07 Mazda5, whether or not you realize your car has the symptoms I described here, or not, and whether or not you've tried complaining prior to Feb 2008 or not. The software engineers in Hiroshima (or wherever) have been at work and have something good for you. You'll like the feel you get -- and what the heck, I bet it even improves gas mileage (but I can't say it's any more than 0.01 mpg).
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Comments
On a side note, I have not noted any change in throttle from the 06 to the 08, except that subtle non-uniform accel while very cold on the 06, which no longer happens on the 08, but that is a different thing I guess :confuse:
I have experienced something similar with my GT automatic. There is a slight hesitation from a stop and a vibration as well from the engine, which gives me a mild vibration massage while idling. I also experienced an "almost stall" when switching from idle to a go. The vehicle has never stalled but it gives me a start when it happens. I also found that after washing the car or driving in wet weather, the hesitation is more pronounced.
Further searching has produced a few TSBs related to the hesitation and the vibrations - both will be addressed this week at servicing.
Secondly I used to find the service bulletins on a dealer web site but they stopped showing them. Where can I find them?
It is certainly clear to me that Mazda skimped on software development and testing back during the time the US model 5 was being readied.
Re Service Bulletins in general, I also don't know for sure. I got my copy of the Feb08 SB on paper from a dealer, but persisting in a conversation with a Service Advisor. I mean, persisting in describing just exactly how my car had a problem that past work had not eliminated. I was only fishing for a SB, I didn't yet know whether or not any new SB had been published. If I were you, I would directly ask for this SB by number at a dealer. It would be pretty sleazy of them not to give you a copy. It would only take them 5 seconds on a computer and a dime's worth of paper.
It is funny that Mazda treats us as idiots in a lot of respects like 'oh not there is not issue we have heard about with the suspension' It just goes to show how far behind the times the higher ups at mazda are living in the past. Do they not realise that this is the age of information. It takes only seconds to find out issues with thing and someone having a similar item.
Mazda i know was only interested in making as much profit in the last few years but that is very short sited.
I have also experienced cold acceleration issues that may be unrelated to the engine stumble TSB. It feels to me like I am driving a carbureted car instead of a fuel-injected car for about the first five minutes after starting the car when the engine is not hot. Acceleration is rough and slow at low RPMs and then abruptly kicks in smoother and more powerful (feels like a turbo kicking in after winding up) at around ~3000 RPM. This is a problem in both winter and summer driving. Once the engine is warmed up, the acceleration problem goes away.
Has anyone else experienced these cold acceleration issues? Is there a known fix? Does having the engine stumble TSB fix (reprogramming the PCM) done on the car also fix this issue?
Thanks for your help.
Remember of course, the SB is zero cost, and takes almost no time to install. Just go do it!!
When driving around 60mph a shudder happens and a sort-of feeling of a very temporary loss of power, almost as if it is being held at that speed for a second despite trying to accelerate.
Is this just like the engine stumble or could it be the Turbo kicking in??
The car is going in for a service recall tomorrow, so could someone offer an opinion rather quick, please.
Thanks.
The dealer here in North London has made several attempts to fix a problem I have been having with the rear parking sensors - all to no avail - so are trying another attempt at fix, today. I fear I am in danger of becoming a "serial complainer" - but this is the first new car (demo with less than 1k on clock) and there have been several things that I have been unhappy with. Most were addressed quickly.
But get this one - took the car in for its first service recently to be presented with a bill for nearly £1000.00!!!! All the tyres were bald or near bald - ther service manager told me the alignment was wrong at the time of production (and Mazda clearly knew this) and were offering to fix the alignment for free and a "contribution" towards new tyres - very generous!!!!! I got £200.00 back but still had to pay a huge sum that I was in no way counting on.
Ever heard ot this in N.A.????
I live in Toronto Canada, so far I am very happy with my 5, except for the engine stumble. There are more and more Mazda 5 on the road nowadys.
I have a 06 Mazda5 GT Manual, and I just went to a local dealer to explain to them the situation. I brought along the TSB#01-008/08, insist to update the PCM. The service guy is ok and finally update the latest PCM. But the code is F0010XFX.3. I do not really know what the code is, but since he told me the PCM code is updated, I hope the problem is gone. Does anyone know if this is the right code?
Since I brought the car to another dealer earlier this year, but was told that there was no update to the onboard computer, and now there is an update. Hope this update can cure the issue. Will keep update to post if it really work.
I own a 2006 and a 2008 Mazda5s (US, Sport, 5MT)