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NY Times Article
This is the town my wife works in. What she's told me is that she knows of many families who are either:
A) Trading in the truck or SUV for a smaller car
Buying a smaller car and leaving the truck or SUV at home
C) Swapping cars with the spouse so as to decrease fuel usage
There are lots of ranches out there and they all seem to have large diesel tanks, so there are a lot of VW diesels being bought. Another popular model is the Suzuki SX4 - the small wagon that gets decent mileage but still has the AWD for those days when the weather gets really nasty.
We had a discussion in another forum about a dealer who incorporated this reasoning in their advertising. Sounds odd at first, but if the numbers are there it can make a lot of sense. Certainly more sense than taking a big hit on trade when upside down.
Beside, trucks and SUV's were originally conceived as special purpose vehicles. They just became popular general purpose vehicles.
OK, that covers this year. And then...?
I do agree though that someone who could afford an Escalade should now be able to afford to just park it except for occasional duty and buy a small gas-sipper for daily tasks. As someone else stated, people seem to have forgotten that the very purpose of SUVs originally was special duty, not daily commuting and errands. I would think in the Escalade woman's case, it would pencil out to keep the Escalade in the driveway for the occasional trip to the mountains, and buy a small car for driving around town and stuff. And when I say pencil out, I mean within five years if she buys new, maybe 3-4 years if she buys used-but-young, she will break even on the gas savings alone vs the Guzzle-lade. Depends a lot on the number of miles she drives per year, of course. If she was"desperate", I am assuming that number is fairly high.
2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)
Did you believe him? Is it possible he is trying to drum up more Federal money from a Congress that make chimpanzees look like rocket scientists?
Hey, you can skip the snide remarks, sir. Equating the Congress of the United States of America to a bunch of chimpanzees is completely unfair..... to CHIMPS! Primates are sensitive, intelligent beings.
"our schools have not taught people common sense economics. We are spawning generations of economic idiots."
... which makes it much easier for Congress to engage in the economic fraud it perpetrates on us. The latest is the $300 billion suckers bailout for people who bought houses with scam mortgages and now can't make the payments.
You and I get to subsidize new loans for them so they can keep living better than we do. And the only "debate" is whether to set the loan limit at $600,000 or $700,000.
The average homeowner in the United States has a $200,000 house. This, of course, begs the question of who is really getting bailed out?
We'd all be better off with 435 chimps in the House and Senate. Aside from the predictable banana subsidies, they'd be much more fiscally responsible.
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My dad has a diesel Excursion. He used to drive a bit more, but when I visited him a couple of weeks ago he mentioned that now it doesn't get driven unless there are more than 4 people who will ride. It had been driven about 100 miles in the last 2 months. He has another truck available for hauling purposes. He has a 300 he uses for most of his driving. He just bought a Prius for running around. He can pay cash for his cars and he can afford the gas, he just doesn't warm up to just throwing money away. Certainly not everyone will have the financial wherewithal to own a personal fleet of 4 or 5 cars. I just bet that there are a bunch who could swing two and come out ahead on a monthly basis.
I am never surprised anymore what comes out of our Congress. The home mortgage bailout being no exception. I know 3 people personally that have lost their homes. One is related to my wife. They sat across from us at our table 3 years ago trying to get us involved in their scheme. Well it went sour and they are filing for bankruptcy. They are also camping in our home that we moved out of. We are not pushing it until the market turns around. I cannot see losing a lot of equity if we do not have to. My wife and I are both very frugal so buying a car just because the price of fuel goes up, makes no economic sense to either of us. I may buy a small diesel VW Sportwagon if we like them when they hit our shores.
When you sign a "Promissary Note" & grant the loan company a mortage, you are legally obligated to satisfy the agreement. Why trust a divorcee who walked away from her marriage, when things got tough, her mortage, when things got tough, and her car payments, when things got tough? Where is the committment to promises these days?
And, why should frugal conservatives be taxed to bail out the reckless liberals? :mad:
Please take your illiterate and credential-free political slop elsewhere.
The mismanaged disaster of Puget Sound or the inbred methland of SW WA...decisions, decisions
I agree w/ the person who remarked that if you can afford a 'slade, you can afford to pick up another car and leave the Escalade in the garage most of the time.
And who said you had to buy new? There are plenty of used Ford Focuses, Honda Civics, Mazda Proteges, and Toyota Corollas available on the used market... I would imagine that if you drive an Escalade, even getting a CR-V or Escape as a daily driver would ease up on the gas consumption quite a bit... (stick with the 4-cyl. Escape though)
Better to just pick up another car than take a bath on trade-in..
tidester, host
SUVs and Smart Shopper
What's a decent hooptie cost these days? Maybe $4K-$5K? I paid a lot less for my Park Ave. Trouble is, a lot of people don't even have the little bit of money to put toward a hooptie. Sad.
I would not recommend a Sequoia for someone needing a commuter for work. As you say there are a lot of 3-5 year old cars that are a lot less money and get decent mileage. Find a friend that is trading in their low mileage CamCord on a new one. You can offer them more than the dealer will give them and still buy it under BB trade-in value.
Oh, and frugal conservatives and reckless liberals are about as sad a stereotype as I've heard. You'll find as many frugals and reckless folks on either side of the fence.
an 06 Ram 1500 Regular Cab
an 07 VW Passat Wagon
Passat was purchased for my wife and I had the truck. Late last year she decides she wants to quit working and be a housewife. Fine by me, luckily we could swing this financially.
So, I start driving the Passat to work and the truck would stay idle for weeks at a time. I swore I would never get rid of it since it is paid for and we do use the "truck" functionality from time to time. Plus, I'd rather park that at the airport when I travel rather than the nicer Passat.
Now, I have never been a car driving type of guy. Always driven a truck or SUV except for a brief lease on an Accord. I enjoy the functionality and ride height of the trucks and SUV's. So this past weekend we're bored and hit a few car dealers. We happen upon a Chrysler T&C mini van. Wow! What a nice ride. I had driven a Grand Caravan recently as a rental and was pleased with the ride, mileage etc. So we begin talking about it and last night go to take a closer look. With the Stow and Go feature there is still plenty of room for cargo. On the few occasions when we haul the dirty landscaping type supplies we figure and old sheet will give us plenty of protection.
So our plan is to go to the dealer this weekend and trade the Ram and Passat for the T&C and a used PT Cruiser. If my numbers are met we will actually be paying less on the car note in this situation.
I'll drive the van everyday and the PT will serve my wife well for quick trips around town. I'll use it as my airport vehicle as well to cut down on the risk of parking lot dings.
While neither of the "new" vehicles will get as good of MPG as the Passat, we're getting 2 vehicles that are more useful and functional for our lifestyle now.
My wife did not mind driving the Ram, but it is not the most sensible choice for quick trips to the grocery store. I believe the mini van is more than adequate for the Home Depot runs and should be an absolute pleasure on road trips.
2021 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4xe Granite Crystal over Saddle
2024 Audi Q5 Premium Plus Daytona Gray over Beige
2017 BMW X1 Jet Black over Mocha
I know you are right. In fact all three of the folks I know losing their homes are conservative Republicans. Conservative can mean so many things. Same as Liberal.
When I think of Liberal car buyers I think of a Yugo. When really a fiscal Conservative should probably be buying the Yugo.
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No response yet, but I hope they follow up.
They have a top 10 list of cars with the highest residual value. No hybrids listed, and the highest of the 10 is the Mini Cooper with about 60% after 5 years / 60K miles. But I know that used Priuses are retaining more than that, and I suspect that used Insights are, as well.
Used '06 and '07 Civic Hybrids are selling for almost full MSRP. I did a search on autotrader.com, and I had to click "500 mile radius" just to find some. Only found six for sale, and they range in price from $23,000 to $18,000.
The $18,000 one is a 2006 with 48,000 miles. Now, how many cars could you drive for 2 years and 48K miles, then sell for 80% of their retail prices? Plus, have the federal gov't pay you $2,100 for buying them in the first place?
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I'm pretty sure the less well off Escalade drivers are on leases that they can't get out of..
Only more reason to find a clean, old Honda or Toyota to use as a daily driver and finish out the Escalade lease..
On the flip side, my neighbor just traded a QX56 for a Sequoia.. They're small business owners, though, and probably write a little bit of the cost off for the cars, and they don't seem to mind the extra in gas.. (their other car is a GX470.. I sometimes wonder why they think they "need" 2 SUVs for 2 small kids)
Of course if fuel costs rise to that ridiculous level, I don't think you'd have to worry about commuting to work as you most likely will be unemployed as the oil barons and speculators ran the economy off a cliff. :sick:
You will never pay less when you trade in, for two vehicles you are taking a hit of 4-5 grand - that is enough gas to driver Ram for a year.
It seems like a strange swap. Keep us posted how you make out at the dealer.
I guess people will just have to budget more for gasoline- either that, or move closer to where they do most of the stuff. Lifestyle changes will be the next move...
And not everybody is downsizing straight into the Versas and Civics of the world. You see a lot of people making a milder jump from a Suburban down into say, an Enclave or Highlander, and the Highlander drivers jumping to Accords and RAV4s, and those drivers jumping down into the Civics and Versas. I doubt very many people are jumping directly from a Suburban into a Nissan Versa.
Like you said, people are downsizing from mega-SUVs to smaller ones, not all the way to compact cars.
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I don't know if they're still building it, but there used to be a long wheelbase version of the Crown Vic that was built for taxi service They added about 5-6" of wheelbase to it, all of it in the back seat area. Must have made for a roomy car. Shame it wasn't offered to the general public. There was also a lengthened version of the Town Car, but I don't think they're still building it. The Town Car's extra length was also all in the back seat area. However, I think with the Town Car, they made the B-pillar thicker, but used normal sized window glass for the back doors, whereas the Crown Vic had a normal B-pillar and a longer roll-down rear window.
I wonder how long they'll keep these things in production? They're really not that popular with the general public any more, but are still a favorite among taxi drivers and police officers. The FWD competitors just can't take the beating that the Ford Panther body can, and even when the Panthers do break, they're usually not that expensive to fix.
I just thought they were discontinued since the local Lincoln-Mercury dealer stopped running screamer ads for deals on brand new Grand Marquis and Town Cars.
They've switched to the MKS for their screamer bargains... :surprise:
I will say, though, that the Extended Town Car had quite a bit of legroom...