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2009 Toyota Venza Crossover

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Comments

  • odinalaodinala Member Posts: 6
    We're in North Alabama, wife was ready to get rid of 07 Mitsubishi Outlander XLS. The Outlander was the right size, however, the comfort amenities are lacking. She has been looking for the last two months and last Saturday was ready to pull the trigger on a 2010 Mercedes GLK with a MSRP of $39K, I guess the German in her was ready for a Vaterland vehicle. What finally changed her mind was not the 16mpg in town, but the fact it also required Premium Gas.

    Monday she says she needs to drive a Camry Hybrid, so on Wednesday we go to local Toyota dealer and drive the Camry; everything's good to go until we look at trunk space. Hybrid trunk with battery way too small for us since we have two grandkids that are with us a lot, especially on vacations. Then she drove an Avalon, she liked the ride of the Camry better, but Avalon had very good size trunk. We had not researched a Venza and really didn't know it existed until we saw one at the dealer that day. Dealer had an I4 in show room so we checked it out. Long story short, she drove a loaded (MSRP $38,600) V6. Got a price from dealer of $36,636 OTD (included Tax, Title, etc.). My wife, being the good German, said OK, we'll be back Saturday, we have to sleep on purchases of this magnitude. Salesman of course wants to know what they can do to make it happen now. He's obviously not dealt with a frugal German and we leave after being introduced to Sales Manager and some more arm twisting to buy now.

    Thursday we call two other Toyota dealerships in neighboring city's to get pricing on 4 cylinder version configured with Premium #2, Navigation, and Sunroof. All dealers say same thing, can't get one until late April/May in that configuration and her color choice (Gray, White, Red in that order), possibly even later.

    Call local dealer, tell them she wants 4 cyl, they say same thing and ask what if we could sell you a V6 at price of a 4 cyl? I ask wife she says what's the bottom line? I'm on Edmunds and talking to dealer and tell him you've got a red V6, 2WD on the lot with Premium #2, Nav, Sunroof, Tow Package, Pin Stripes, and Carpets that we would take if we can get a price of $35,500 OTD. The MSRP is $37,295, Edmunds TMV is $33,700. Our price was $34 something and tax title got it to $35,500. They accepted and I knew I could have gone lower, oh well. We were happy with the price, didn't pay sticker, didn't pay invoice, but believe we got a decent price. I haven't driven and probably won't be allowed for some time. My only dislike are the 20" alloy wheels; as someone on this board said, they look like something that should be on a Pimped Out Escalade; the 19" are more to my liking.

    I'll report back after I've been given permission to drive her car. But other than the wheels I'm impressed with the car. I'm in my late 50's and have gone through literally dozens of vehicles, so I like to think I know a little about cars, but then again that's only my opinion.
  • deepsouthdeepsouth Member Posts: 30
    I think she will enjoy the Venza. It may be a bit on the small side when traveling on trips. Thats a great price I got mine for $35175 OTD and got Pac 2, Pana Roof, Nav, Mats and trunk mat, Extra tint, Toyo gaurd plus, Came with Good Year Eagle tires, First tank avg 19.8 MPG mostly city driving
    Keep me posted on how well it works out.
    Also I have the extended warranty 7 yrs 100000 miles paid about 1000.00
  • ecotrklvrecotrklvr Member Posts: 519
    Venza is 4.5" lower! Even so, the width of the Venza is the most noticeable difference. Parked side-by-side it wasn't noticeable, but the drive showed the lowering and the widening. Just did the Edmund Spec hunt, and here's the tally:

    Metric Highlander Venza
    WB 106.9 109..3
    Length 184.6 189.0
    Width 71.9 75.0
    Height 67.9 63.4
    G Clearance 6.9 8.1
    Weight 3516 3760

    I may wait until the 2010 model comes out - reputed to be 0.5 to 0.75 inches lower. This would sacrifice a little ground clearance for better cornering. Still better ground clearance than I have now...
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    We got bugs - sometimes they have to put out "caution - slippery" signs when the Mormon crickets migrate across the roads (link).

    Wax or no wax, you still have to wash the bugs off. I like washing with a clay bar myself, leaves the paint nice and smooth.

    btw, did anyone check their manual about washing and or waxing?
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    And if the 2010 model doesn't get DFI for both engines then I will be VERY disappointed in Toyota.
  • ecotrklvrecotrklvr Member Posts: 519
    wwest, is DFI ready to be considered mainstream technology? It seems to be able to develop more power - does it have significant FE upside as well? Surely there must be a logical reason why Toyota and most other manufacturers are not offering DFI on Venza or very many cars at all. I love the idea of DFI, and want to see it developed and its use expanded. However, VW seems to be the one manufacturer to put it into high-volume cars. Anyone know what are the downsides to DFI, other than the added cost? Is reliability a concern? I know that standard Fuel Injectors, operating at much lower pressures and at lower temperatures, suffer from build-up of varnish-like deposits. Perhaps DFI is affected more so?

    Apart from DFI, I've read that Toyota has invested heavily in Dual VVT-i and Valvematic technologies for cam phasing and lift control. I'd be more inclined to believe that the next engine improvement for Venza is Valvematic. I'd welcome that upgrade.

    I've gone over to Engine and Fuel forums to check this out. Not much there....
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    Congratulations on the purchase. I got a similar deal on my Venza (AWD) -- didn't pay MSRP, didn't pay invoice, but a good overall value. Price is what you pay. Value is what you receive, and that's what counts. :)

    My only dislike are the 20" alloy wheels; as someone on this board said, they look like something that should be on a Pimped Out Escalade; the 19" are more to my liking.

    I really like the way the 20" wheels look -- it makes the 19" wheels on the 4-cyl seem small. Two practical advantages of the 20" wheels: 1) the 5-spokes are easier to clean; and 2) the 20" tire is used on several other vehicles including the CX-9 and Edge, so there are several good options for replacements when that time comes.

    If you look on the Highlander boards, many are finding the 19" replacements to be few and far between (and expensive, given the limited supply).

    Be thankful: to really maximize the "pimped out Escalade" look, Toyota could have used a chrome finish like the 20" wheels on the Ford Edge.
  • LSP972LSP972 Member Posts: 20
    I like the 20" wheels (and their "look") too.

    Just rolled over a thousand miles on mine. I am VERY happy with this ride; its the first time I've had a vehicle with all the "comfort" goodies. Mine has every option except the moon roof, towing, and rear DVD package.

    I'm getting between 22 and 24 mpg (six cylinder FWD).

    Another gripe (aside from the non-extendable visor deal) is that, for me, visibility out the right rear quadrant is somewhat inhibited by the head rest on the passenger seat. Just noticed this since the wife has ridden with me a few times, so I'll need to play with moving the seat back and forth.

    BTW, steve, thanks for the reminder re the clay bar. Saw that in Auto Zone, wondered "What the hell is THAT for?", and did some research. Amazing... guess I need to get out more, eh?

    I'm assuming it will also do fine on that huge plastic fairing under the grille? THAT puppy is gonna be a bug-smashing king...

    .
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    thanks for the reminder re the clay bar

    Careful, or I'll mention Zaino and ruin you for life. :D
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Member Posts: 4,116
    west, is DFI ready to be considered mainstream technology? It seems to be able to develop more power - does it have significant FE upside as well? Surely there must be a logical reason why Toyota and most other manufacturers are not offering DFI on Venza or very many cars at all. I love the idea of DFI, and want to see it developed and its use expanded. However, VW seems to be the one manufacturer to put it into high-volume cars. Anyone know what are the downsides to DFI, other than the added cost? Is reliability a concern? I know that standard Fuel Injectors, operating at much lower pressures and at lower temperatures, suffer from build-up of varnish-like deposits. Perhaps DFI is affected more so?

    VW was one of the first DFI manufacturers in N/A but a lot of vehicles use that technology in Europe. That technological marvel General Motors is using it in many models as is Ford...it is a big part of how they can effectively turbo charge smaller motors in their eco-boost strategy.

    I think you acessed things correctly, Honda and Toyota are making advancements in valve timing technology while some other manufacturers are looking at direct injection. Just when you think the internal combustion engine is out of tricks, along comes a new way to use technology on it.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    I suspect that with the advent of reliable and cost effective high pressure fuel injectors having become available in the marketplace if DFI isn't yet mainstream it soon will be. Any technology that offers this significant a level of FE improvement, 10% or more, will/should soon be widely adopted.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    "..it(DFI) is a big part of how they can effectively turbo charge smaller motors...."

    Well, yes, and NO...!

    Prior to DFI availability a turbocharged engine would often have a "native" cylinder CR, compression ratio, of 8:1 or less in order to allow for the effective compression ratio to rise to, and possibly above, the non-boost standard CR of 10:1. All DFI has accomplished is to move the non-boost CR from 8:1 to 9.5:1.

    99% of the time, relatively constant speed cruising, a turbocharged engine runs in derated/detuned mode. Which is why the Mazda CX-7's FE is so abysmal.
  • LSP972LSP972 Member Posts: 20
    Well, a buddy has been trying to turn me on to those products. He makes it sound like the stuff applies and removes itself...
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    My cars are happy if they get washed once a year. :D

    This is kind of cool, if you like dance:

    Alvin Ailey(R) American Dance Theater Partners With Toyota VENZA During 50th Anniversary Celebration
  • lmacmillmacmil Member Posts: 1,758
    We have a 2004 Highlander V6 and drove a 4 cyl Venza today while my Camry was getting an oil change. My first impression was that it was larger than the Highlander, maybe because of the deep minivan-ish dash and sloping hood that made the front end invisible. It rode nicely and the 4 seemed to have decent power. Nicely appointed inside, even without a premium package, and lots of nice creature comforts. My wife complained about the visibility out back. A nice vehicle but not sure it will be right for us when it comes time to replace the Highlander.
  • normvenza09normvenza09 Member Posts: 36
    I love my Venza so it was cool to see who came up with the design...
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_DYUMG8aM4Q
  • deepsouthdeepsouth Member Posts: 30
    Thats cool the way he draws it.
  • linnettlinnett Member Posts: 19
    I have a V6 Venza for an overnight test drive. I am really pleased with everything about this car....except for the actual comfort of the ride. I expected to feel more cushioned from road bumps and railroad tracks and old infrastructure lumps and bumps. I like the steering perfectly well. There's a lot to love.

    How comfy is the "ride" for the rest of you?????????????? :confuse:
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    You'd be surprised at how much ride improvement can be had with a set of 17X8 wheels with a nice and quiet and comfortably riding set of summer use only tires.
  • david_k1david_k1 Member Posts: 39
    We ordered a red FWD V6, prem 2. JBL, pano roof yesterday and are rather excited about it!! We drove the 4 cyl on Friday and while it was a fine ride, the 6 just plain felt better. I also liked the fact that the 3.5 is Toyotas equivalent of the Chevy 350, with many thousands running around w/o too many problems. The 2 MPG difference in "city" ratings was not enough to push us to the I4 as this car will average 20MPH over a good percentage of its life...

    Hey, does anyone have a lead for a tubular "dog guard" for the rear end of this thing?? I don't think Toyota offers it yet...

    Thanks
  • linnettlinnett Member Posts: 19
    WWest, Thank you! That is exactly the kind of thing I wanted to hear!

    Of course, I haven't a clue what 17 x 8 tires are but I can always learn!

    Looks like a new set of tires for me right away!
  • maximafanmaximafan Member Posts: 592
    I've been perusing the Toyota website looking over information on the Venza. So far I like what the Venza has to offer as far as the various options and goodies that I like, such as push button start, dual exhaust tips, xenon lights, panoramic sunroof, back-up camera without the need for the navigation and so on.
    But.... I'm not seeing memory seats offered on any of the packages. This would probably be a dealbreaker for me, as I love
    having memory seats in my current car!!! :confuse:

    Does this vehicle not offer memory seats??
  • md_outbackmd_outback Member Posts: 185
    Hold on a second there linnett and wwest. Dropping down from 20" wheels to 17" wheels is a pretty big change and can lead to all kinds of conversion issues such as brake rotor and caliper clearance, assuming it is even possible. And to buy 4 new wheels and tires will require a minimum investment of at least $1000 to $1500 assuming you can find a compatible wheel. And a minus-3 conversion (from 20" to 17") will probably void your warranty. My suggestion is to drive a Venza V6 with Goodyear tires and then drive another with Michelin tires (those are the two brands of tire Toyota is currently using on Venza V6s) and see if you prefer one ride vs. the other. Then try to negtiate getting your new Venza with the preferred tire brand.
  • md_outbackmd_outback Member Posts: 185
    No memory seats are available in any Venza package. Simple solution - don't let anyone else drive it. ;)
  • linnettlinnett Member Posts: 19
    Oh, shoot, I hoped he meant a new tire not a smaller wheel! I am not brave enough to mess around with that! :)

    Ah, so see which tires are on the test drive vehicle in my driveway and ask if the other Venza in stock has the opposite tire! Thank you! I'll do that!
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    No memory seats are available in any Venza package. Simple solution - don't let anyone else drive it.

    That's my solution. :)

    If my seat settings are changed (i.e. when I take my car into service, it's almost guaranteed the seat is moved when I pick it up), I just take a few extra minutes to readjust. Not a big deal, especially with power seats.

    I can see it being important for a car that's shared on a day-to-day basis, though.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    I was at the Toyota dealer this weekend having some routine service done. I looked at the Venza and Highlander. Seems to me the Venza doesn't get much better mileage than the Highlander, is more cramped and there is little difference in price out the door because you get a much better deal on the Highlander. So unless you like the Venza looks or size better, you ought to look at both of them thoroughly before you buy.
  • linnettlinnett Member Posts: 19
    You mention appropriate points! I looked at Highlanders two years ago and determined that I actually did not enjoy getting into it. I'm a 5'2" tall woman. I'll be the only driver of this vehicle. I tote cats more often than other people.

    Getting into the Venza truly is a different and more comfortable experience for me. It doesn't feel too tall. I very much like the smooth curvy feminine lines of the exterior of the Venza.

    For those with more critical cargo needs than mine the Highlander has a flatter cargo area when the back seats are down. I was surprised that that was not duplicated in the Venza but it really isn't critical to me.

    Has anybody seen Tropical Sea Metallic?
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    So unless you like the Venza looks or size better, you ought to look at both of them thoroughly before you buy.

    Different needs for different people. That's why Toyota offers both vehicles.

    Need to seat 7 occasionally or haul bulky items? Enter the Highlander.

    Looking for something that rides higher than a Camry, carries a maximum of 5, and has more cargo room than a sedan but less than a box-shaped SUV? Enter the Venza.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    Is that the new blue color on Venza? If so, it was rather good looking IMO at least.
  • lal_cltlal_clt Member Posts: 29
    I saw the Tropical Sea Metallic about a month ago. Really liked it and when it came time to order my car, that was the color I chose. Now I can't recall what it looks like so tomorrow after work I'm going to drive by a dealer in Charlotte who has one on the lot and refresh my memory.
  • linnettlinnett Member Posts: 19
    Yes, it is some sort of medium blue. The still photo on the Toyota website looks screaming turquoise on my monitor while the 360 degree photos look dull mid tone blue. That left me uncertain. I expect this to be the sleeper color since you can't be sure what it is from their web site. So....I looked at the YouTube channel Toyota.com and wrote a note asking about the color. I said my sister had suggested that if I could find a color sensitive woman at the production plant perhaps she could tell me if this blue is aqua, periwinkle, powder or whatever. I didn't receive an offer of a phone call like that but I did receive an offer to photograph a Tropical Sea Venza at the plant. The results make me hope for a periwinkle aspect to this blue. It will not have the lovely twinkles that are seen in Blizzard Pearl.

    How can I share a photo with you here?

    This is useful too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPy7efXZyxo
  • mikeecfpmikeecfp Member Posts: 5
    I'm interested in understanding why Toyota seems so intent on using 20" rims on the V6 AWD Venza when all I'm hearing is that the ride is much rougher with the bigger rims and that stability in harsh winter conditions is hampered by the bigger rims. Besides the tires on 20 inch rims will wear out much quicker, so I told. And, they will much much more expensive to replace than 17" rims. (mikeecfp)
  • md_outbackmd_outback Member Posts: 185
    It seems that Toyota and other manufacturers have decided that big wheels make a big styling statement. They also help a bit when you are trying to increase ground clearance. The wheel size itself does not result in a rougher ride, it's the 50 series tires that have a shorter sidewall that cannot absorb bumps as well as a taller sidewall. But the short sidewalls are needed with the large wheels or the car will start to look like it's all tire (sorta like those pickup trucks with the giant wheels and tires). It's true that winter driving is better on narrower tires, but if you have a good tread pattern (such as the Venza's Michelins - not the Goodyears), they should handle well enough in winter conditions. You can always get dedicated winter tires if you live in a colder climate. I don't believe 20" tires will wear out any quicker than a smaller tire - if anything they should last longer due to fewer revolutions per mile. Tread wear is based mostly on the tire tread and compound, the weight and weight distribution of the vehicle and the biggest factors are driving conditions and driver style and following routine maintenance (inflation, rotation, alignment and balance). The tirerack has Venza tires ranging from $93 to $268, so the pricing is not that much different than smaller tires. At least the Venza V6 has several replacement tires to choose from; the Nissan Murano LE 20" tires have an odd size that is only made by Toyo, so you have no other choices unless you change tire size.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    Yes as md outback noted it's for styling purposes. The design of the Venza is somewhat 'over the top' as Toyotas go so adding very noticeable rims goes along with that concept. However ride quality does suffer if you're more used to softish Toyota rides. That's intentional it seems.

    The 19" rims on the I4 ride much more 'toyota-like'. I also think that the 2.7L I4 is perfectly sufficient. But to put this in perspective I've been driving 4c Camry's, 4c Civics, 4c Escorts and the 4c Prius since the 80's. I've never seen the need for a V6 for my personal ride. OTOH my wife prefers only V6s. The US market in a microcosm.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    AS a general rule wheel size will have very little to do with the number of revolutions per mile.

    Do you suppose perhaps the extra metal in the wheels is less costly than the rubber in the tires and the beancounters have taken "control"....??

    Larger wheels do look better, up to a point.......

    Additionally, larger wheels, lower sidewalls, will result in less CSA for road contact/traction, not exactly what one might want in an "SUV" crossover.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    To be accurate it's not an SUV crossover. It's a car with a bigger body. IMO it's a lot closer to a Camry/Avalon than to a Highlander; height to width ratio.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    "...not an SUV crossover..."

    Maybe so, but the I4 Venza with the new F/awd sure appeals to me if/when it's time to replace my '01 F/awd RX300. In point of fact if the I4 were equipped with DFI it WOULD be time to replace my RX.
  • feltfelt Member Posts: 105
    wwest - you have often mentioned "DFI" .... I assume that is "Direct Fuel Injection?" I have been reading elsewhere about Ford's soon to be produced "Eco Boost Engine." I assume that is a DFI? From what I have read, it sure seems that is the way of the future.

    Back in 2001, you and I exchanged severeral messages re Toyota's AWD system on the Highlander. The Venza system is different, is it not? You seem to like this sytem ... will you explain a bit more about the differences, and why you like this system?
  • md_outbackmd_outback Member Posts: 185
    AS a general rule wheel size will have very little to do with the number of revolutions per mile.

    Sorry, I didn't fully explain my answer there. I was responding to a general statement that tires on 20" wheels don't last as long as tires on smaller wheels. IF you do not adjust tire width and aspect to maintain the same overall tire circumference, then my answer is accurate. For example, a 245-50x17 tire will require about 9% more rolling revolutions per mile than a 245-50x20 tire - thus the 20" tire should last longer, assuming all other conditions are equal. Of course if you did such a conversion on any car, you would screw up the speedometer, odometer and countless other meters and sensors that rely on wheel revs equating to an expected distance covered. BUT, if one did adjust tire width and aspect properly to maintain circumference when changing to a different wheel size then, yes, there is little difference in revolutions per mile.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    It would be unusual in the extreme for someone to NOT adjust the tire size in accordance with a change in wheel diameter. Besides which the speedometer and odometer would need recalibration.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    I have become so disinterested in Ford products that I have no idea what "ecoboost" means for them.

    The current HL and Sienna F/awd system is a simple ONE wheel drive with the exception that TC, Traction Control, is used to sustain a high level of engine torque when wheelspin/slip develops. TC will moderately brake a slipping wheel or wheels in order to maintain engine torque at a failrly high level. Regretably if this happens to be a F/awd vehicle then traction MUST be regained quickly so engine dethrottling is just as instantaneous as the braking.

    Loss of traction at the front (driven) wheels can too quickly result in loss of directional control.

    With the new Venze and 2010 RX350 F/awd system the first action ( I hope.) upon wheelspin/slip, FRONT wheelspin/slip, detection will undoubtedly be to engage the rear driveline in order to distribute the available engine torque over a greater tire contact patch CSA.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Member Posts: 4,116
    I have become so disinterested in Ford products that I have no idea what "ecoboost" means for them.

    Ecoboost is direct injection and in some cases, turbo charging (think MazdaSpeed3 and MazdaSpeed6). The 3.6l motor from GM (Cadillac CTS) is also direct injection.

    Does Toyota have a DI motor? They seem to have tuning down for excellent fuel economy, so maybe they don't need to use a technology like that...I know the components are more expensive to withstand combustion pressures and temps.
  • dbostondriverdbostondriver Member Posts: 559
    Did Toyota really need to make the Venza? The Camry does fine and if you need a station wagon you can get the Highlander with seating for seven.
    This seems like a GM move to me. Create un-needed cars and fake demand.
  • linnettlinnett Member Posts: 19
    Did Toyota need to create the Venza? I read an article that made me smile today. It said that about 50% of us consider our pets when buying a vehicle. Yea, that includes me. I'd prefer a little more cargo flexibility than the Camry or Avalon provide. It said the Venza was likely to attract baby boomers who don't need a big people mover or big SUV. I'm 57. I tote cats more often than other people. It suggested that Toyota expected women to purchase many of the Venzas but was surprised that the first ones went to men. I'm a 5'2" tall woman and the Highlander is not the vehicle I want to get into every day. The east of entry into the Venza is a positive thing for me. The soft, fluid, feminine cures of the Venza are pleasing to me.

    Oh, :blush: I learned about the lumbar button today. This should help a bit on comfort for me.
  • qs933qs933 Member Posts: 302
    Create un-needed cars and fake demand.

    I'm curious -- what is "fake demand?"

    Given the relatively low volume of the Venza, I'm guessing the economics make sense even if Toyota produces the Venza to meet a very specific demographic: customers who want the versatility of a station wagon, the driving experience of a sedan, and the ride-height of a crossover.

    They don't need to seat 7 and are OK with sacrificing some cargo room for a sleek exterior. Styling is important -- hence the big grill and 20" wheels.

    If Toyota didn't have the Venza, would I have bought a Highlander? Maybe. But I was also seriously considering the Murano, which "fit" better with what I was looking for.
  • bbestbbest Member Posts: 1
    The Venza appears to fit my needs better than any other vehicle on the market. I want to be able to tow a 2500 lb trailer and carry a canoe on the roof. The Highlander is tall for lifting a canoe onto, and the Camry can't tow more than 1000 lbs. If there is a more suitable vehicle out there I would like to hear about it.
  • dbostondriverdbostondriver Member Posts: 559
    Hey, I'm a fan of Toyota. I'm just saying it might dilute their product offerings and decrease economies of scale.
    Maybe the Subaru Outback is more suitable? Nissan Rogue?
  • typesixtypesix Member Posts: 321
    The Venza is basically a taller than normal hatchback.
  • wwestwwest Member Posts: 10,706
    Making the HL heavier and longer in order to have a "reasonable" third seat capability moved it into a different market segment. The Venza is simple a "drop in" replacement in that market segment vacated by the HL.

    Also note that while the Venza can be purchased with the new I4 AND F/awd the HL cannot.
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