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JLC41
The most similar-in-price Avalon, what seems to be the benchmark here, that I could find on Toyota's site is an Avalon XL, cloth interior, 6CD, 16" Alloys. I'm in a 35--- zip code.
MSRP
Base $27,945
Options $1,139
Manuf, Delv, Proc & Hndlg $775
Subtotal $29,859
Dealer Fees $416
Total $30,275
Plus, you have to be seen driving the thing. The Avalon arguably has the better powertrain, but the Taurus has it all over the Avalon with style. Does the average driver of these two particular vehicles care which is quicker to 60 and gets better mileage (even though that is so close its anybody's game to me), or which looks better? Feel free to answer!
Sorry, the pictures of the Avalon XL with the 16" wheels were tough to come by. These are the more expensive model's wheels.
Not only that, but the Hyundai Genesis, which has a base model option list that is way better than that of the Taurus, is a superior offering to the Taurus.
If Ford thinks exterior sheet metal styling alone is going to trump quality and true refinement of the competitors, I think they've underestimated the intelligence of buyers in this segment.
Also, the last gen Taurus actually has more interior room, a better ride, IMO, and the same motor and other important 'parts' as the "new" Taurus (both derived from the Volvo D3 platform) and is about 50% the price for a 18 month old, gently used one.
LOL!!!
What universe do you live in where a bread and butter family sedan is anything but expensive at 40k?
The 2010, completely redesigned Mercedes E-Class 350 can be had for 47k nicely equipped, and it's an outstanding car recalling MB solidity of the 80s, and there are plenty of cars as large and comfy as the Taurus for the low 20s.
For a true comparison you need to select the E550 4matic (AWD) and 382 hp. It STARTS at $60K.
And I wouldn't be surprised if the Taurus was bigger than the E class to boot.
Try comparing apples to apples next time.
Ford has a winner with the new Taurus but it is priced too high. Most nicely equipped offerings are $32K-$33K or about 10% above where they should be.
We all know that someone who plunks down $32K today for a well equipped SEL will have a $22K car 6 months from now. The Asian and European makes will depreciate half that much in the same timeframe.
I may be interested in a $19K 2010 Taurus with 10,000 miles on it next fall though.
They'll be plenty around for under $20K soon.
People who say the new Taurus is overpriced simply have no idea how much a new car costs or what the competition offers. The new Taurus isn't a bargain, but go compare it to imports of similar SIZE and features - it's priced competitively.
Or they want to buy one and can't.
A used 2010 Toyota Avalon will be worth $27K next year and the comparable Ford Taurus will be worth $19K.
Facts are facts. Your opinion that past depreciation doesn't predict future depreciation is what Detroit has been praying for for 25 years. It hasn't helped yet.
May be true, but not many of us buy a car one year and get rid of it the next. For those of us who keep a car for eight or ten years the depreciation is of little concern.
In fact I pay a property tax annually on the value of my vehicles. So, in this case, faster depreciation may be a plus.
I don't know what the resale value will be on a 2010 Taurus - and neither do you. We'll just have to wait and see.
Ford put a decent body on and interior in the 2010 Taurus. Everything "under the skin" is the same as 2009. Used 2009 Ford Taurus' with 15,000 miles on the clock are available for half of sticker price today. I'm glad I didn't buy one for $34K last year when I can get one today for $17K.
I've taken a bath on used Ford's I've traded in. Used Honda's were a much better story.
I understand Ford is trying to take the Taurus up-market but they went a bit too far. At the high end they are very close to Lincoln type pricing.
Maybe that's their goal. Eliminate Merc.
The Taurus Limited is a MUCH bigger car than the ES350 and has more features. Why shouldn't it be priced the same? What does the Lexus have that makes it worth $5K more than a Taurus Limited?
I'm so sick and tired of people saying that the Taurus is overpriced just because it's a Ford. Look at the car and not the badge.
I really wish Ford the best on this, as compared to Chrysler and GM, they're on a roll with good products in each market segment.
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Bingo! That Blue Oval is a tough sell when you move up-market. For decades Ford has been an entry level brand. That image will take time to change.
The new Fusion is a better buy than than the new Taurus. For $22K I can get an I4 Fusion with the options I want. Hard to justify a Taurus from my end but many others may have more means than myself.
The Avalon STARTS at $28,695. A fully loaded FWD model is $38,985.
The Taurus starts at $25,995. A fully loaded FWD model is $38,580.
Please explain to me how the Taurus is overpriced when it's cheaper and better than the Avalon?
Looks like the Ford salespeople and PR people have taken notice of this thread.
Instead of arguing, just pile on that incentive cash, nice and deep, like you know you're going to have to.
Ford always messes up initial pricing (maybe too big of egos in Dearborn) and ends up having to incentivize heavily which screws over the initial buyers. Wait 6 months on this one and you'll probably save a bundle. Someday Ford may learn how to market. They should be aggresively pricing these new vehicles like the new GM is doing against the import brand competition. Get people into the dealerships and cars first, then down the road they can price more closely.
I hope Detroit has improved on turbocharging. I remember Mopar getting into this in the 80's I believe. I had a few rentals with it and it sucked. Driving was like spooling up a jet engine but without the guts. Way too much lag time and too abrupt when it did kick in.
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FoMoCo is already offering $1,000 off the new Taurus in my area. By winter will it be $2,000? $3,000 off in the spring of 2010?
I believe the 2010 actual transaction prices for the Taurus will be 10% under sticker to get some of this BIG iron moved.
I congratulate Ford on going it alone (sans TARP funding) and they deserve a shot at our business. Three years ago when Ford was finalizing the design of this vehicle, it's weight was not a big concern. It is now. A base dry weight of over 4,000 pounds. An SHO at almost 4,400 pounds. 17 city mpg doesn't cut it. The car is 10% too heavy and 10% too expensive.
A new Avalon is on the horizon. If Ford can't get some people to switch to the Blue Oval quickly, the new Taurus will not turn the tide.
The Avalon STARTS at $28,695. A fully loaded FWD model is $38,985.
The Taurus starts at $25,995. A fully loaded FWD model is $38,580.
Please provide examples of similar and similarly equipped vehicles that are cheaper.
Yes - Clearly Ford is giving away the Taurus. It's worth thousands more and most people would gladly pay $40K to drive it.
Yes - The Chevy Impala is much cheaper, offers full-size room and gets better mileage.
I think Taurus has two issues:
1.From a marketing perspective, it doesn't really give you that much more than a mid sized car. A little extra "usable" interior space and a large trunk. For $35K + you can get more space all around in a Highlander or similar crossover and similar mileage. They are going to have to find a way to sell well equiped Taurus in the mid to high twenties, and that likely mean lots of incentives and deals down the road.
2. From a production and accounting standpoint you can't really compare it to Avalon. That car is just a modified (stretched) Camry made on the same production lines and plant, so Toyota doesn't need volume, just a few people that want a bit more car than a Camry and are willing to pay dearly for that. However, the Taurus (and sister MKS) have a dedicated plant and don't share much with other Fords, so they need more volume to cover the much higher fixed costs involved. They are not likely to get a big price premium, so again, look for lots of incentives and marketing offers down the road.
The sad thing is that Ford is probably scaring off potential buyers when the Taurus reviews all talk about pricing in the 30's. That's just too high for most family car shoppers when you see ads for cars like the Camry LE at under $20K, and they are well equipped too. When you get over $30K most families start looking at a CUV unfortunately and I think that's why Lucerne was a flop.
Wow - so much misinformation.
The Taurus and MKS share the D3 platform with the Ford Flex, Lincoln MKT and upcoming 2011 Ford Explorer. That is 5 vehicles, one plant. And the platform originally came from Volvo, so if there is any economy of scale/reuse in the platform the advantage goes to the Taurus.
You can get a nicely equipped Taurus for around $27K so stop throwing around the $40K figure.
It also has a lot of luxury features that the others do not - adaptive cruise, massaging seats, etc.
As for sales, we'll just have to wait and see, won't we?
It was already large enough to carry 5 adults comfortably with a huge trunk.
Why does the new Taurus cost $5K more. I didn't need a bigger, heavier car. 18" or 19 inch wheels are a costly addition (tires=>$200 each) which give a ropugher ride. I don't care about sync and massages and other stupid accessories (I'm over sixty y.o. and find the radio sufficient).
I am looking at the 2010 Subaru Legacy and find it fits better with my needs and has AWD thrown in. For 25K I can get a nicley equipped one (to my taste). I regard the value of my Sable to be exceptional. At present pricing I do not consider the Taurus to be a value. It may be cost competitive with other large cars but the taurus used to be a midsixed bargain. Now it is a large car priced like many other large cars.
I would [predict that many former Taurus/Sable owners are going to be looking at the Fusion (in house) and at lots of other larger midsized alternatives. The taurus has become Ford's avalon or Ford's buick. Why the obsession with larger size and so many gadgets the car weighs 4200#?
All of those cars together probably don't have the volume of Camry and its offshoots Venza and Avalon.
You can get a nicely equipped Taurus for around $27K so stop throwing around the $40K figure
I've been talking 30's not $40K. 40K is more like the SHO which is a low volume car.
I'm not putting down Ford products, just pointing to their apparent ineptitude at initial marketing and pricing. Seems to me they went through this same episode with the Edge when it first came out. I think Ford is making good progress on product, but marketing and pricing still lags. Their other challenge is the UAW/CAW. If they don't get the same concessions as GM, and adding the BK advantages GM got, I can see Studebaker all over again down the road. The union killed that company. Shorter term though, Ford looks strong.
In other words, you're looking for a bargain and Taurus ain't it. Too bad. Ford won't get profitable giving away cars. If you want a bargain go buy a Kia.
The Taurus looks to be the best car Ford has produced in a long time. It's not perfect but the complaints are minor at best. It is priced in line with similar vehicles from other manufacturers - period. They don't need to sell 200K a year either. Ford would rather have 4 vehicles on shared platforms that sell 100K than one that sells 400K. That's what got them into this mess - relying on one or two high volume models and ignoring the rest.
I'm sure Ford would rather sell 50K Tauri at a small profit than 200K at a loss.
Can the SHO get its own thread, it would clear up some confusion in this thread. I don't think some folks understand when you throw out the $40k figure you're talking the SHO variation of the Taurus.
Then, you get trolls who intentionally blur the difference between reg. Taurus and SHO version.
that's an easy one - despite that the current Av is coming up on 5 years old, there is still no Ford product that is even in the same state as the Av, never mind the same zip code. It all starts under the hood and goes from there. Your 'better' contention is typical Ford fanboy PR garbage. The 2010 Taurus is a nicely restyled 09 Taurus (which couldn't have been any worse) with nothing more than a crappy substandard engine that they had to turbo so that they could put too many HP where it doesn't belong..
Other than that, they're getting better, I suppose. Not difficult when you've been down so long ....
Ford is doing well in Europe,but won't send their best cars over here. :lemon:
The rarefied air that Ford is attempting to broach in one fell swoop is very tough in today's market. The game plan looked pretty good two years ago. Today it is a nearly impossible sell in most of the U.S. and that's not likely to change in the next 6 to 12 months.
There are Ford dealerships near me with Taurus Limiteds priced at $36K-$37K and SHOs at $42K-$43K. That is a sedan league Ford has NEVER been in and they're trying to get in under the worst possible economic conditions.
Personal preference notwithstanding - a very nice SEL is available for $28K but that's the low end of the range. Most new Taurus models fall between $30K-$34K MSRP as they sit today. The car may well be worth it but times are tough and Ford has not proven itself in this price range.
That said, I do expect to be able to locate a low mileage, used SEL next fall for $21K-$22K. At that price I'll be buying.
Don't give up on the Taurus people! Deals like bruneau's will be available!
Does it cut it in the Mazda 6? Or the even smaller Chevy Malibu? Its down 2 mpg on the best of the midsize cometition, yet offers more space and a WHOLE lot more power, not to mention AWD. Not nitpicking here, but let's get a little more serious. Both of those are excellent choices, are an entire step down in "class" yet get similar mileage.