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2011 Honda Odyssey Discussion

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Comments

  • cheapreadingcheapreading Member Posts: 32
    It does. Honda offers an accessory roof rack. See accessories on the Honda site. I'd buy a 2011 anyday over a 2010 - pricing is only about $1500 apart (driven by rebate on the 2010) and you'll make it up in residual when you come to sell it and have a lot nicer car in the interim.
  • cccompsoncccompson Member Posts: 2,382
    The street price spread is far larger than the $1500 that you suggest.

    Of course an '11 will be worth more than a '10 down the road - it's newer and costs more! However, the spread may not be as large as one might think because a '10 will, relatively speaking, be considered to have lower mileage for its year, boosting its resale a bit. This is one aspect of buying late in a model year that is little discussed.

    Whether an '11 is "...a lot nicer car..." is open to serious debate. It has few new features at the cost of the deletion of some desirable content.
  • gosaintsgosaints Member Posts: 18
    Has anyone seen a Touring Elite in person? Either they haven't been rolled out yet or they are extremely rare.
  • cheapreadingcheapreading Member Posts: 32
    Saw one at Kelly Honda in Lynn, MA (bad dealership) on Oct 2nd. I personally had a hard time justifying well over $2K for the wide screen tv, HID headlights, blindspot monitoring and enough power in the sound system to deafen all my kids :). Nice car but Touring is a better value.
  • babsmillerbabsmiller Member Posts: 20
    Haven't found one in So Cal yet. The dealers initially said they should have them by mid month but are now saying the end of the month. I wonder what the delay is.
  • otter8otter8 Member Posts: 3
    I have not owned an Odyssey so I can't compare it to previous versions. Just a couple of thoughts:

    1. Below around 40 mph, the van was very quiet. Driving around town was very nice. When stopped it's hard to tell if the engine is running.
    2. Above around 50 or so, it was louder than I expected. Mostly road noise. Not super loud or anything, but for comparison I have a 2010 Ford Fusion and both my wife and I thought the Odyssey was definitely louder at 70 mph. For a new model that costs over 30K I expected something quieter.
    3. Great handling, great brakes, very nice room.

    Overall, I plan on buying one when/if the prices come down some. The noise issue is not a deal killer and there are so many other positives. I'm waiting to drive the Touring to see if it's quieter. Some of the reviews out there say it is, some say the opposite. If anyone has test drove a touring and an EX-L I'd love to read what you think.
  • dodgehappydodgehappy Member Posts: 118
    We are finishing up a deal on a 2011 EX and the wife insists on having the roof rails for "the look" as she puts it. Dealer want4ed $365 installed for them and I got him down a little to $300 installed. Does this sound like a fair deal? The honda site shows suggested retail before install at $210. I noticed I can buy them online for about $155 plus ship or so, but looked at the install instructions and they seem like a good bit of work too modify the top rail to fit and install the bars.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    We own two Honda's including an older Ody. I've got to be honest, that road noise gets worse as the car ages and the seals start to wear. It starts to get on your nerves on long drives when you have to crank up ther stereo to hear the lyrics. We haven't just adjusted to it, rather over time our irritation with it has increased. Mechanically, the vehicles have been decent (knock on wood!), but I have been discouraged that the newer Honda's don't seem to have addressed the highway speed noise deficiency. We will probably not be repeat buyers because of the excessive highway noise. There are plenty of competitors out there that ride quietly on the interstate and are also reliable (and can often be purchased for less as well).
  • newtouringnewtouring Member Posts: 4
    $300 installed is fair; it is a lot of work. I agree with your wife that it adds a lot to the look of the van to have the roof rails. We got the body side moldings and splash guards as well. If possible negotiate it all with the purchase rather than after the fact. Good luck.
  • dodgehappydodgehappy Member Posts: 118
    Thanks we are now looking at the molding and flaps too. Unfortunately we worked out the final numbers on the van and a monthly payment before she decided she wanted all these other goodies added. The 300 is with financing it into the lease though.
    I would have loved to get all three options bumped in the overall deal to start with at a large discount but not sure it is going to be as easy now to get them at a super discount/free.
    I do feel comfortable installing the molding and flaps on my own so maybe I will do those two via an ebay or the such purchase to save some $- unless I can get the dealer to come down a nice bit on them.
  • newtouringnewtouring Member Posts: 4
    In my limited search I found Bernardi to have the best prices on original Honda accessories. I understand that they may soon be announcing a sale which may or may not reduce prices further. We also got the all season floor mats and cargo tray just from knowing how our kids are prone to snow and spills.

    One other thing - looking into the HondaCare and so far have not found a better price than hyannishonda.com.
    Not sure if you are looking but would be interested to know if anyone has seen a better offering.
  • siggie1siggie1 Member Posts: 56
    We have a 2008 Odyssey Touring. The lease on it expires on Nov. 17. I was expecting to get a new vehicle as I found many minor annoyances on the Odyssey which I have documented on this discussion thread. A couple of months ago I had to make a decision on replacing the original Michelin tires as all four had worn down. I didn't want to replace them with the lease expiring soon, but I felt I had no choice as it is our rainy season and the safety of my family was at stake. I was not going to expose them to unwarranted danger for a relatively small amount of money. I wanted the cheapest tires Costco stocks on the theory that Costco doesn't sell crap, any new tire is relatively safe, and that I didn't expect to use them for too long. Costco couldn't get the cheapest Bridgestone tires, but they could get the next level up, the Turanza. The new tires have transformed the Odyssey. The road noise is greatly reduced and the ride is substantially better. It's not just me. My wife did not know I changed the tires, but the next time she drove the van she asked me what I had done. She liked it. As a result, I expect that we will probably purchase the Odyssey next month as its residual value is well below what I can find a used 2008 Touring in our area and the cost is about $15K below what I could reasonably expect to pay for a 2011. We've already paid for the depreciation and now we get to benefit from it. For the substantial savings we'll live with all the minor annoyances especially since the most major annoyance, the road noise, has been greatly reduced.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    Be careful modifying a leased vehicle. Get the lessor's written permission or you may end up on the hook restoring the car back to its original condition, or paying a damage fee when you return it.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    I've only used Michelin's on mine, although I did switch to a different Michelin tire when I replaced the originals. A lot of our noises seem to emenate from the windshield area and the sliders though besides the road, but maybe you're on to something. I do like the handling of the Ody for a van, did you lose any of that when you switched tire brands?
  • manigopimanigopi Member Posts: 17
    I posted this topic on another related topic. Posting it here to see if this is the right one.......
    I see a lot of buying 2011 when there are still some 2010s left and may get a decent bargain (although the price diff is not much as i see it). I just want to pick your brains on why 2011 is a better choice (or the other way around)? I can wait to buy a Van as my wifey is not due until Jan with our second one. Any advice on which Odyssey to go for will be greatly appreciated.
    Thanks
    Mani
  • cheapreadingcheapreading Member Posts: 32
    edited October 2010
    Not sure why anyone would be a 2010 over a 2011. Price difference isn't that great, 2011 is a much improved vehicle (safety, features, economy) has a much better navigation system (which I'm assuming is important by the title of your post) and assuming you trade within 5 years you'll get the difference in purchase price of $1500 back at trade in.
  • lalexopouloslalexopoulos Member Posts: 9
    It all comes down to personal preference, but from experience, I can tell you that the 2011 Touring does not hold a candle to the 2010 Touring. In my opinion, you would be getting less of a vehicle in the 2011 EX-L then the 2010 Touring. You don't get anything more in the 2011 Touring vs the 2010 Touring unless you get the Elite. Then you have to wonder of the blind spot indicators, self leveling headlights and wide screen theatre sound entertainment system is worth the $4000 price increase.

    My wife and I bought a 2008 Touring brand new for our family of 8. Our 6th child came 2 weeks after we bought it. We fell in love with it instantly. It had beautiful lines, excellent comfort, it was Baltic Blue, the real deep blue color. It had 2 quirks and that was they did not provide cross bars and the center seat/console was and remained fixed into 2010.

    We got the dealer to install the cross bars.... I was annoyed that Honda provided the rails but not the cross bars. Now Honda won't even provide the rails! WTF?!
    We sold it in September (a little prematurely) because we knew Honda had improved that center seat/console by making it larger and more comfortable. They also allow it to slide forward increasing leg room for the 3rd row passengers. We sold our 2008 Touring with 40000 miles for $29000.

    I was invited to preview the 2011 Touring at Hagerstown Honda in Maryland. I could not believe my eyes! I didn't like it from the pictures but my wife thought we might like it better once we saw it in person. I actually disliked it more! We didn't like that there were no cross bars or rails, the back half of the van looks "quadraplegic" with body lines going all sorts of directions. The driver door looks like it has a bullet hole in it with that 1980's looking keyhole in the sheet metal. Honda opted to make moldings for the doors an accessory, something it needs very much! They replaced a lot of the leather finish with cheap plastic and eliminated the rear arm rest compartments which stored the kids crayons, pencils, IPODs and more, and moved the receptacle and A/V jacks putting them on the wall of the left passenger side where the holes are exposed for little ones to stick all sorts of pointy things into!

    What else.......

    the hood looks like someone dropped something onto it with that stupid body line running parallel to the grille. The only thing they did right in the 2011 Odyssey was improve the center row. They failed that part too by removing the inside arm rests of the captains seats. What are you going to do if you remove the seat/console out so that you can use that as a pass through and have two passengers in the captains seats? They will only have armrests for the outside arms! How pathetic is that? They didn't even think to design removable armrests for this very situation.

    How about those stupid wheels?! Look how pretty the 2008-2010 wheels are. It is such a beautiful van. It commands respect. The 2011 commands funny looks! The new Sienna has Honda beat on looks. Sienna will come back with a better interior in 2012 and blow Honda right out of the running for the status it has held above all over the last several years.

    Anyway, it was with great disappointment that we had to follow through with the sale of our 2008, but in the end we returned to a new 2010 Touring Polished Metal with black interior. 2 years newer plus a new warranty, the 2008 had already expired. We love the black interior. I miss the beautiful blue color though. Honda replaced our blue for what they call bali blue now. We ran to Pittsburgh for our 2010 and met with a car modifying company called RPM who will modify our center seat/console to slide forward and recline more then it does now. This will make it perfect.

    Sorry for all the details, but you asked. Don't believe what I tell you. Take what I shared with you and go compare both and I am convinced you will pick apart the things I mentioned above if you have a genuine appreciation for pretty cars.

    Above all, enjoy your baby! My wife and I have 3 boys and 3 girls, ages 2-14!

    Lease the 2010 and look at the 2013 or 2014 when they refresh this new model. You will see that they will return a lot of the things they took away from the perfect 2008-2010 model design. :)
  • lalexopouloslalexopoulos Member Posts: 9
    oh, I forgot to mention that the 2011 really does look like a hearse. :cry:
  • lalexopouloslalexopoulos Member Posts: 9
    edited October 2010
    The only thing good about the 2011 Nav is the screen and the sharp display, it really is beautiful.

    But, the 2008-2010 was touch screen and you could communicate with it very easily.

    On the 2011, the controls are all the way on the bottom of the cluster and the NAV is all the way up top! Unless you remember the dial and key positions, it is going to suck trying to key things in and your head moving up and down over a foot in distance trying to focus and refocus on the screen and than the control. With the 2008-2010 all you had to do was watch you fingers do the work and look at the screen the whole time.

    Check it out, you'll see just how annoying it really is. :mad:
  • kvn1kvn1 Member Posts: 52
    edited October 2010
    you are obsolutely right about those wrong things of new 2011.
    One more ugly thing is black spoiler and black side mirrors and black bottom bar even on EX-L. The picture on honda web site show this bottom is color keyed but the reality is not, only touring is.
    The no inner armrest on second row seat is stupid, many people have 2-3 kids and usually 2 kids in second row and the big kid on 3rd row, and they do want an open access to 3rd row all time so they have more space to do things inside the van such as change kids cloths when going to the beach, or no need to move second row outside chair for your kid to access 3rd row (all you need to do is press the slide door opened for your kids to get in) or momy move back and for from 3rd row..... Have you seen 3 todlers sitting in the same row for a long trip? Should have design removable armrests.
    The LX offer 7 seat, but guess what I just checked it out and the second row has 2 inner armrest, BUT does not have outer armrests any more on LX, WTF they are thinking? I asked the sale man that can they take 2 arm rests on LX and install on EX and he also laugh at the way Honda design this thing.
  • siggie1siggie1 Member Posts: 56
    "I do like the handling of the Ody for a van, did you lose any of that when you switched tire brands?"

    I have not noticed any difference in the handling, but the steering does seem to have lost some of its feel. The steering seems a little more disconnected from the road.
  • siggie1siggie1 Member Posts: 56
    I know this is probably off topic, but it involves shopping for a new minivan, so hopefully no one will object too strenuously.

    This past weekend we went looking at minivans to see how they compare to the 2008 Odyssey we have coming off lease and whether it would be worth getting a new one, or purchasing the Odyssey for its residual. When we went to the Toyota dealer to look at the Sienna the dealer had about 15 of them in stock. We wanted to test drive both an XLE and a Limited model. When we asked the saleswoman to test drive them she said that we could not test drive without an appointment, and that the appointment had to be during the week, not on a weekend. When we inquired why she said that they didn't have enough vans to go around. When we pointed out that there were 15 Siennas sitting in front of us she said that those were not available because someone had stolen their mufflers and they would make too much noise. When I looked underneath one of the vans, sure enough, I could see cut metal remnants. We decided to forgo the test drive and went home. When I thought about it I realized the thieves had not been after the mufflers, they probably stole the catalytic converters. Since the dealer had hundreds of new cars on the lot (it's a big dealership) I wondered how many other cars may have had their converters stolen, and would the dealership, when they fix the damage, tell their future owners that they had been damaged. If you're looking for a Sienna (or perhaps any other new car) in South Florida, I'd be careful and check out the underside for evidence of repairs before buying.
  • gene00gene00 Member Posts: 115
    The dealerships don't divulge when cars are damaged in transit from the factory (and repaired before sale), so I doubt they would let customers know about replacing the catalytic converters. Years ago I was at a porsche mechanic when a customer came in with a brand new (drove it straight over from the dealership) 911 and a list of about 75 things he wanted checked on the car, and he said he does this with every new car he buys. He said the inspection usually turns up about a dozen items he has either the dealer or the mechanic address. He obviously has plenty of money, so he could afford to do this, but it does show that you should not assume that the spankin' new car on the showroom floor is perfect.
  • robr2robr2 Member Posts: 8,805
    edited October 2010
    The dealerships don't divulge when cars are damaged in transit from the factory (and repaired before sale), so I doubt they would let customers know about replacing the catalytic converters.

    In reality, most states have laws that dictate a dollar threshold that triggers when the dealer has to disclose the damage. Something like a cat replacement would probably not trigger that. I'm suprised that cat thefts are rising again as the scrap industry has come under heavy scrutiny from cat and copper scrappers.

    Many cars arrive at the dealer with scratches, dings, et al that are typically repaired with nary a trace.
  • vt256vt256 Member Posts: 11
    Good news forn those looking for replacement headrest for the 2011 Honda Odyssey... Vizualogic source stated that OEM color matching underway, expecting production to begin in 3 weeks. Yeah !
  • clermontflclermontfl Member Posts: 108
    **HOLD THE LINE PEOPLE...!!"*** HERE'S THE LATEST NEWS ON LAST MONTHS CAR SALES.....AND THINGS TO COME.....**

    Don't let the SNEAKY DEALERSHIPS TRY TO CON YOU INTO THINKING THAT THESE VANS ARE MADE OF 24K GOLD AND THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO NEGOTIATE...!!!****

    READ BELOW----->>>>>>>

    Looking at sales figures, you would assume the new car market has begun to rebound.

    Comparing September 2010 sales to sales in September of 2009, GM saw its new vehicle sales in the U.S. increase 12% to 173,031.

    Ford saw its sales jump 46% to 160,375, and Chrysler sold 100,077 vehicles, up 61%.

    But it may not all be good news.

    Fleet sales - not retail sales - seems to be driving the market surge. (Fleet sales are vehicles that are sold to rental fleets and corporate clients).

    Collectively, General Motors, Ford, Toyota, Chrysler, Hyundai-Kia and Nissan sold 2.3 million units in the third quarter, up 1 percent.

    But combined retail sales fell 4 percent to 1.8 million.

    What does this mean for car shoppers? Fleet sales can only sustain the auto market for so long.

    To boost retail sales, automakers will have to offer greater discounts and incentives.

    Our recommendation is to consider waiting a few months before purchasing (unless you're considering a leftover model). You may end up saving thousands.
  • lev280lev280 Member Posts: 27
    Based on this when do you think would we find out the new rebates for 2010 ODYs?
  • clermontflclermontfl Member Posts: 108
    There should be rebates going on now since manufacturer to dealer rebates currently running end on November 1st. Check out American Express thru Zag.com

    Here's the link--->>> http://amexnetwork.zag.com/main.html
  • lev280lev280 Member Posts: 27
    i was thinking more aggressive rebates compared to the current ones in effect.
  • queenv1queenv1 Member Posts: 53
    I'd love to add my 2 cents that I am still driving 1995 Odyssey with 473,200 KM. It's been a phenomenal vehicle. Looking at the 2011 now.

    QV
  • runnur6913runnur6913 Member Posts: 16
    Thanks for the info., this will help alot.
  • gene00gene00 Member Posts: 115
    edited October 2010
    Looking at the $2500 price difference between the touring and the elite, and the relatively minor upgrades (more like wish list items than must-haves), I'm thinking that the elite is intended to be a high-profit model that won't see much in the way of discounts. For those buyers with lots of money who decide on a minivan and 'have to have the best' the elite fits the bill. Plus those types of buyers are less likely to negotiate hard on the price. Seeing that people are getting nice discounts on the touring (on the east coast at least, effectively making the price difference $5000), but not on the elite bears this out. I know there aren't many of them out there, but I'll bet they're planning on making a modest number of them to keep them scarce, desirable, and near msrp. Selling one elite at msrp makes as much profit as selling a dozen tourings at a discount. I'd be surprised to see any significant discounts on the elite before next summer, so waiting a few months may not help. imho.
  • rebeldukerebelduke Member Posts: 13
    I'm picking up my Elite tomorrow morning. $39,915 plus they gave me $21,000 trade for my '07 Touring. Not all dealers are asking MSRP.
  • ramssaranramssaran Member Posts: 36
    rebelduke, Which location and who is the dealer?
  • mikescmikesc Member Posts: 21
    Can you break that $39,915 down on the Elite and add doc fees, destination and whatever else there was? I'm thinking of getting a Touring, but that's not a bad price if I can get someone in the Dallas area to match. Thanks.
  • queenv1queenv1 Member Posts: 53
    It just happened. I thought I would just check things out and it's a good thing I had my car cost canada papers with me because we were able to get down to the nitty gritty. My current 1995 Odyssey is still running and I will keep it for as long as it will run. This Odyssey will serve me well as I venture across Canada as I have done with my 1995 at least 5 times. I was hoping for a red colour like my Burgundy 1985 but red is out for all trims in 2011. So light blue it was. Sometimes you just have to let go of the old to make room for the new. Picking it up Thursday.

    QV
  • queenv1queenv1 Member Posts: 53
    The black one does but not the light blue one which I just bought.
  • rebeldukerebelduke Member Posts: 13
    Trim: Touring Elite - Dark Cherry Pearl
    Vehicle Price: $39,915.00
    Destination: $770.00
    Doc Fees: $299.50
    Taxes: $300.00
    Tags: $35.00
    2007 Touring Trade (46,500 miles): $21,500

    Total OTD: $41,319.50
  • rebeldukerebelduke Member Posts: 13
    I picked up my Elite yesterday so I don't have a lot of driving time with it. However, I think the dial control for the Nav(and other functions) is a big plus. It's intuitive and I found I didn't have to look down to use the control. That coupled with the sharp display makes this system a significant improvement for me. On my 2007, the touch screen could be a pain at times to ensure selecting the correct alpha characters when entering addresses and performing other display functions. Quoting from above "With the 2008-2010 all you had to do was watch you fingers do the work and look at the screen the whole time". With the 2011 all you have to do is watch the screen the whole time. You don't have to watch your wrist do the work. Again, just my opinion based on limited experience with the system but it's a winner as far as I'm concerned..
  • rebeldukerebelduke Member Posts: 13
    Correction - The dealer gave me $21,500 in trade not $21,000 as in my original post.
  • rebeldukerebelduke Member Posts: 13
    Upstate South Carolina. I'll send you a PM if I can do that in this forum and if I can figure it out!
  • sinctsinct Member Posts: 2
    edited October 2010
    I just bought a 2011 Odyssey EX-L with RES for $35020 in MA. That is $1800 under MSRP. I traded in a 2002 Ody EX-L with RES and 140,000 for $4500. The '02 was in fair condition (small dents and scrapes among other things) but was also experiencing the dreaded early 2000's transmission problems (see Odyclub Forum). Kbb and Edmunds pegged the value at $3700-$3800 trade in so I took the deal. The price also included a lifetime warranty for the first owner on the powertrain and transmission. I told the wife its the only way I would buy the Honda because of how they left owners of the early 2000's hanging in the wind. The warranty is only offered by a few dealers and is not predicated on the fact of having maintenance done at that dealer. It can be done at any shop , anywhere, anytime. It is an insurance contract so the dealer can go out of business at anytime with the contract still remaining in force. We try to keep our cars for 10 years so we will see how this plays out. The fix on the '02 was between $3800- $4900. Fugetaboutit. The Ody is great , my wife loves it. Drives and handles better in my opinion that the two previous generations. Quieter below 50 mph also. The interior up front is better than the Sienna ( test driven also). The front of the Sienna looks a lot cheaper, again my opinion. Some things Honda missed the boat on- no rails(its a van, its supposed to carry things), black side mirrors, second row middle seatback needs to be recontoured so the chairs have inside armrests, and the back outlet should be covered. They should bring the rear side covered cubbyholds back. It looks better in person than in pictures, we got a dark color, Topaz, and I personally think that makes it look better also. Get addons (mudflaps, bodyside mouldings, rubber floor mats, etc) from Bernardi. Way cheaper and easy to put in or on. It came with the better Michelin tires as I have seen posts here about them being equipped with cheaper ones. The best price for the same 2010 Ody I could get around here in CT. was $32000 and not as much for the trade. It also would have been at another dealer without the lifetime warranty.
  • babsmillerbabsmiller Member Posts: 20
    Can you explain how the blind spot indicator works? Does it seem useful or annoying?
  • poryanporyan Member Posts: 3
    Due to the non-negotiable terms and unavailability of the 2011 Odyssey, my wife and I are considering the Sienna. I have never owned a car that is not a Honda but need a Van sooner than later.
    What are your opinions on the 2011 Sienna Vs the Odyssey?
  • rebeldukerebelduke Member Posts: 13
    Based on only a 25 mile ride from the dealer to my house, it seems to work very well. There are indicating lights on the front left and right pillars that light up when a car is in the blind spot. The system can be turned off. There was no audible indication such as a beep or buzz but this may be an adjustment or setting I haven't found yet. There are about 5 - 6 manuals to read. The owners manual alone is over 700 pages! It's going to take me a while
  • gene00gene00 Member Posts: 115
    You're right and I'm surprised, but your purchase price is closer to $42k than $39.9 when your trade is factored in. Still, that's $2k under MSRP, better than I would have thought.
  • gene00gene00 Member Posts: 115
    Have you tried emailing the internet sales managers at your 8-10 closest dealers with the exact specs & deal you want? Saves lots of legwork.
  • vrmvrm Member Posts: 310
    edited October 2010
    It is unacceptable that a vehicle (EX) costing $30,000 comes without factory installed roof rails.

    I would ask the dealer to install the roof rails as part of the deal. If the dealer says no, leave skid marks on the dealers carpet!

    Honda did not cut corners here. Honda took an ax and chopped off the corner.
  • cynic783cynic783 Member Posts: 30
    Sienna has a beam rear axle vs. independent in Odyssey. That's a significant difference as far as control, handling, and ride and enough for me to pass on the Toyota.
  • loucapriloucapri Member Posts: 214
    as a former 2004 sienna owner, I am also need a van due to a recent accident. Anyway, almost all buyers here has been comparing sienna and odyssey and I think it really denpends on what you want.

    We all agreed (I assumed) Honda has better stuffs inside but the look? either you like it or you don't. Sienna, look is ok, but can it be too common? Inside? CHEAP looking (my 04 has better look and feel compares to the new 2011).

    To me, I really like the 3rd row sunshade and windows that can be opened in the Sienna. Also they have both headphone jack and volume on both side in 3rd row (xle with DVD model). The dual screen is great. However, it is not easy to get into the 3rd row.

    Odyssey came in a little late so really, the price is still hight, good look and feel inside the dash. Like the cool box idea. Won't get 3rd sunshade unless you step up to touring. Also 3rd row windows has no vent. no dual screen unless touring elite

    Right now, I am pointing to Odyssey because of the 2nd row config, I can give up the smaller DVD, no 3rd sunshade and vent but it just feel more comfortable. The one thing holding me up is the price, I can get sienna for near invoice but not the odyssey up in seattle.

    that's a few thousand $ different. so I am waiting...
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