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The Current State of the US Auto Market
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Comments
Low blow, man. You know I thought we were talking about the Spark.
Ironically the Sonic *is* also built in Korea, just not the ones sold in the USA.
People make honest mistakes, like when you said CR had never put ranked a GM car at the top of its class while the Corvette indeed was.
I think I remember that. IIRC, they didn't have a completely different entry for a car versus an automatic, versus one with a stick, but would rather list the manual, and the automatic transmission in with other things like the engine, a/c, body, paint, interior, electrical, and so on.
I remember they used to break out 6-cyl versus V-8, but that could be a bit misleading, especially during those times where there were often several different V-8's offered. For instance, a 1978 Catalina came standard with a Buick 231 V-6, and that was the only V-6 offered. But with V-8's, there was the Pontiac 301, Buick 350 (Pontiac's 350 was gone after 1977 I believe), Pontiac 400, and if you bought in CA/high altitude areas you got the Olds 350 or 403.
In fact, that might be one reason why big Pontiacs tended to be rated a bit low in those years, compared to an equivalent Olds or Buick. Pontiacs relied heavily on the 301, with the bigger engines being a bit less common. The LeSabre offered the 301 from something like '77-79, but I think California models got a Chevy 305. And the 350 and 403 were more popular engines in the LeSabre than they were the Catalina and Bonneville. I think the Delta 88 tried out the 301 in 1977, but for 1978 offered only the 260, 350, or 403, all Oldsmobile engines, and all pretty durable.
Sorry to use your one example, but sheesh, there's been so much of that type of thing here over time.
Don't shoot the messenger.
If a Corvette hadn't been tested in a while, yet CR let it remain at the top of the ratings, that's pretty generous towards GM, don't you agree?
May not be practical, though. There may not a big enough sample for manuals, given the low take rate.
If you see a black dot the best thing to do is ask on these boards. Good example: the 1991-1995 Mazda 626 4 banger auto was lousy, but the V6 auto was fine. The manual trans was fine for both engines.
I knew someone who had a 1993 Ford Probe 4-cyl/auto, which I think used the same drivetrain? Anyway, his transmission was shot around 30,000 miles, and again around 80,000 I believe.
Some people replaced them twice.
"Toyota’s Series of Recalls of Late"
"In Jul 2013, Toyota announced that it would recall 185,000 units of some subcompact car models globally due to a problem with their electric power steering system. The glitch was making the steering heavier. The recalled vehicles include Yaris (know as Vitz in Japan) and Verso-S (aka Lactis in Japan) subcompact models. The recalled Yaris vehicles were manufactured between Nov 2010 to Mar 2012 while Vero-S vehicles were made between Aug 2010 and Aug 2011.
In Aug 2013, Toyota recalled around 342,000 Tacoma midsize pickup trucks to fix faulty front seat belts. The recall involved car models from 2004-2011.
In early Sep 2013, one year after Toyota recalled 780K vehicles to fix a problem in the rear tie rod, the company recalled the vehicles again after reports that the problem remained, reported The New York Times. The company had recalled 18K 2010 Lexus HS 250h autos and 760K Toyota RAV4 SUV of model years 2006 to 2011 in Aug 2012, following several complaints.
Again in Sep, the automaker recalled 369,000 vehicles worldwide, including about 235,000 in the U.S., roughly 74,000 in Japan and 37,500 in Europe. This included 200,000 Highlander Hybrid models manufactured from 2006 to 2010 and Lexus RX 400h vehicles developed during 2006 to 2008 to fix a hybrid-system problem. Toyota also recalled another 169,000 vehicles including Lexus IS 350, IS 350C and GS 350 made between 2006 and 2011. Toyota recalled these vehicles to repair an engine bolt defect."
"Other than Toyota, many other players in the automobile market are witnessing a series of recalls. In Aug 2013, Dongfeng Honda Automobile Co., the Chinese arm of Honda Motor Co., Ltd. (HMC), announced that it is recalling all Siwei CR-V vehicles manufactured from Mar 2, 2010, to Aug 30, 2012 to fix a defective front shock absorber piston rod. Honda recalled almost 408,000 SUVs.
Ford Motor Co. (F) and General Motors Company (GM) also announced multiple vehicle recalls to fix various issues."
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/toyota-shares-drop-vehicle-recall-154003739.html
To add here, most rational people know that CR doesn't have an agenda (other than perhaps efficiency over driving dynamics). Of course their process isn't perfect, but MOST of their findings are generally correct, which means MOST of the vehicles they rate highly are good, and MOST of the vehicles they say aren't that reliable are in fact that way.
Those who complain are just using their brand biases to combat the facts on which models and makes are better versus others. And most of the people know that inside, whether they want to admit it publicly or not.
Heck, I had a VW Jetta that went 143K miles with almost no problems, but I don't have a problem admitting that VW hasn't been that reliable, regardless of my own experiences.
If only some would be as balanced as you....;)
Oh, wait! You can't be balanced if you stick with one brand despite the worst drop in market share in U.S. history!
"Critical acclaim for the redesigned 2014 Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra suggests that GM nailed the first part of that strategy. But as the new trucks hit the heart of their launch cycle, the pricing part appears to be running up against cold market realities.
Many Chevy and GMC dealers say sales of the 2014 pickups have been disappointing since the June launch, stymied by stiff price competition from heavily discounted Fords and Rams.
Silverados are "selling very poorly" at Dimmitt Chevrolet in Clearwater, Fla., General Manager Sam Pilato says. The dealership, which typically sells 10 to 25 of the full-sized pickups a month, didn't notch its first Silverado sale this month until Oct. 16."
http://www.autonews.com/article/20131021/RETAIL07/310219846/price-gap-riles-gm-d- - ealers
Embarrassing!
"It looked like we're finally going to get into the game," says Rox Covert, dealer principal at two Chevrolet dealerships and two Buick-GMC stores in the Austin, Texas, area. The stores, which have a 120-day supply, compared with the typical 90 days, sell more than 3,000 Silverados and Sierras annually.
"Then they raise the prices," Covert says. "It's like it kicks you in the head."
The problem isn't the pricing - the problem is that they should have launched in September.
If only some would be as balanced as you....
Oh, wait! You can't be balanced if you stick with one brand despite the worst drop in market share in U.S. history!"
Do you mean that if you wanted another VW, you'd let a drop in market share keep you from one when you had good experiences? Rather shallow and "me too". I disdain "me too" thinking, personally.
P.S. Read my posting about the 2010 Equinox from yesterday.
P.P.S. I reiterate: Gee, per CR, a 2010 Camaro has the same overall reliability as the same-year Kia Optima. We know that has to be gospel.
P.P.P.S. Another factual error of recent times: "Look at the huge list of TSB's for the car." Half were from before the car was introduced. LOL
Well, that's balance to me. To others, balance is....something different!
Not sure whether this was addressed to Circle or myself... I think you're conflating two different posts...
Only here, is a 803K recall post considered "happy for the recall", but only I make a comment about another poster's response of an earlier recall for far-fewer vehicles. Only here are there crickets chirping about the NACOTY selections, mostly from GM. Boy, there's some balance for ya.
I just think balance in product usage comes from exploring different brands...not just from one brand that failed miserably in the marketplace....but that's just me!
Over the years, when I've had rentals of much-ballyhooed-cars, I almost always come away with 'what's the big deal about that?'.
Au contraire, mon ami! I decide the best product for my needs. All 3 of my current fleet are better than the domestics that fit the formula.
The marketplace is a reflection on good manufactures and not so good manufacturers. The bad ones are the ones that loose market share. When I needed my new vehicles, the domestics were producing not so good products.
The domestics are improving but so is the competition.
The pickup segment is very conservative, so it may take a while for those buyers to recognize that benefit. Look at what that did for Hyundai and Kia. They went from "good....for the price" to just plain "good".
CR put the Silverado at the top of the pickup class, Dodge a little behind, and Ford's now aged F150 in 3rd place, with the import brands well behind.
I'd say GM did a good job with the update, even though I'm not a fan of them cosmetically speaking.
The pickup segment is very conservative, so it may take a while for those buyers to recognize that benefit."
What's the benefit? The DI 5.3 has 40 less HP and 22 less ft-lbs of torque vs a Hemi and only offers an additional 1 mpg. Also consider the new Silverado weighs a few hundred pounds less and uses a tall 3.08 rear axle ratio for FE ratings.
Same with the Ecoboost. It will walk all over a 5.3 Silverado while giving up only 1 MPG. The F150 is heavier too and doesn't offer an axle ratio taller than 3.31 on a 4x4.
So I really don't see that DI is a huge advantage on a normally aspirated engine.
Overall I think the GM trucks are nice. They definitely are as good and likely better than the competition in some areas. I just couldn't get past the boring styling inside and out.
More performance under load, better efficiency sounds like a win to me.
I bet it pollutes less, too, given the fine atomization of the fuel.
The CR review used a Silverado with 3.42 axle and the Ram had the standard 3.21. Yet still CR found the Hemi to feel more powerful and the 0-60 non towing was better in the Ram and basically a draw towing 5k lbs.
As for gas mileage, 1 mpg isn't a big enough deal to me to choose one vehicle over another.
"Our 5.3 delivers ample power, but it lacks the thrust of the 5.7-liter V8s in the Ram 1500 and Toyota Tundra. The transmission upshifts smoothly and quickly, but it’s reluctant to downshift, making the truck feel underpowered. It also takes a prod on the throttle to get the truck going."
Reluctance to downshift drives me nuts and is one thing I do really like about the 8 speed in the Ram. It is quick to downshift and is very smooth overall.
All this said, there really isn't anything wrong with the Silverado. I didn't buy one mainly because of the styling inside and out. I also liked the F150 alot, but I liked the interior the best in the Ram, plus the Hemi simply sounds way better than the Ecoboost v6. The Ecoboost is definitely stronger, but the Ram is plenty fast and I certainly didn't buy a truck to go racing;) Though some don't feel that way.
When I pull you to younger guys in a F150 or Silverado, seems they always want to race. It's like I'm driving a Challenger or something and they think they're in Mustangs and Camaros. Crazy!
The EPA estimate was still listed at 14/20, regardless. I would think the taller axle might make some degree of difference, though? Maybe slightly better on the highway cycle, but slightly worse in the city, because it would rely more on the lower gears? But with the way they round off, maybe the laboratory numbers ARE different, but they would both round off to 14/20?
http://autos.aol.com/article/consumer-reports-lexus-is-250-infiniti-qx50/?icid=m- - - aing-grid7%7Cmain5%7Cdl14%7Csec1_lnk3%26pLid%3D395106
Note that not "recommended" is not the same as their "Not Recommended". I had to point this out here last year in their test of midsize sedans.
CR, and their reporting, reminds me of life's pendulum.
Plus, it's evident that no successful business can escape the temptation of media pawns.
2013 Lexus CT 200h right side 300x199 imageNow into its eighth year, the Motorist Choice Awards recognize vehicles with high consumer satisfaction ratings and lower-than-average ownerships costs. Awards are split across 13 vehicle categories and are divided between “Popular” and “Premium” options. AutoPacific and IntelliChoice determine the winners after surveying more than 50,000 new car buyers on satisfaction with their 2013-model-year purchase, while also surveying and monitoring various cost of ownership metrics.
The segments are also based on lifestyle categories instead of vehicle segments, five of which were won by Toyota and Lexus
Sure that's not from "Town and Country"?
What errors did you find?
http://www.autopacific.com/index/news-app/story.117/title.intellichoice-and-auto- pacific-announce-the-2012-motorist-choice-awards
If his job is a paid position, then yes! Who is he...family??
I have learned to be careful criticizing typos or grammatical errors. I find that I make some in posts and someone will point them out later.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
Just more proof that this is not the case.
Almost everybody on this board is way more literate than the average person in this country.... even the people with whom I don't agree.....
There's a law that says that whenever you point out a grammatical error, your post will have one as well.
Okay, so here's the State of the US Auto Market in black and white. (Detroit News)
Quote from the article. Now that's a job description I would have loved to work toward. They could never prove I had been ineffective at achieving my goal.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I know that. Last year, while the '13 Malibu tested fairly well, a poster here posted "'13 Malibu Not Recommended" ! (exclamation point mine).
It was the same scenario that you were pointing out, however.
There goes the resale value, lol.
it would be bad form for anyone to criticize CR as bias or corrupt when it praises a foreign car, and then later on laud it for praising a domestic one, don't you think?