MINI Cooper

eman5 · February 2003

Will BMW ever put a six-speed automatic in a 200 hp S?

cuteeric17 · February 2003

Ahem. Get the manual.

dwabid · February 2003

I doubt they would ever put an automatic in the S. Kinda sucks the fun out of owning a supercharged engine. Personally I never really cared one way or another about what kind of transmission is in my car, but after test driving an S last week, I would have it no other way. But some people prefer an automatic but I doubt they would find enough demand...( Besides the 6 speed is a BLAST. MY fiancee was frightened by my maniacal laughing when we sped out onto the freeway. She returned the favor at her turn behind the wheel)

If all turns out as planned we will be plunking down some lettuce to purchase a forest green S with a premium and winter package this week. We do have a question for the group: With all the ASC and numerous other braking features is the DSC option worth the extra money?

stryder · February 2003

My prediction is BMW will put an SMG (there's a huge discussion about this somewhere in the past 63 pages) or sequential manual gearbox in the S at some point. I expect this will coincide with an update 200hp or more MINI as you've mentioned.

While I fully agree with the 'Get a Manual' idea, I'm sure market data will say that many people are buying cooper's soley to get the CVT and market drives everything. The idea of the CVT being unique (but unable to handle the torque so BMW says) ads a bunch of support to an SMG option.

DSC: I don't have DSC, but many people say its saved their butts. You can always turn it off, and if you get it in the sport package, isn't it cheaper anyway? (assuming you want the stuff in the sport package...) I would have gotten it on my car, but couldn't... and I suspect it'd only be intrusive when doing stupid stuff, which is when you can turn it off to do donuts. In general its a different animal from AST+C, and much closer to things like the CBC (cornering breaking control) which are out to prevent unwanted car rotation, AST just keeps you from spinning the tires mostly when starting.

hpulley4 · February 2003

Which does come in mostly when starting but under low traction situations, it comes on in all gears. When going down glare ice roads it even goes off in 5th gear, which is a hint to brake early!

It also works in downshifts, applying throttle to prevent engine braking from locking up the wheels.

In both acceleration and deceleration situations, it first individually applies brakes to the drive wheel which is spinning, a sort of poor man's LSD. If this is insufficient to stop the wheel from spinning then the throttle position is closed. If wheels are spinning hard then the throttle is closed hard which can even stall the car if the engine is cold.

DSC adds steering wheel and yaw sensors to the equation. If it detects a differential between the steering wheel position (intended car direction) and the yaw sensor's readin (actual direction), it applies brakes on individual wheels and/or throttle on the drive wheels to put the car back into the intended direction, or that's the intention anyways. Some people who are good at skid control themselves don't like DSC as they end up fighting with the computer. DSC also includes ASC+T and if you turn it off you turn off both of them, leaving you with just the special brakes (ABS, CBC and EBD).

I just have ASC+T and love it. I pull out of the skids myself, which is the way I like it. I usually leave the ASC+T on all the time. I only turn it off if I'm going uphill in ice and/or deep snow and can't keep up with the speed limit even after shifting up (it seems backward but shifting up yields less torque to the wheels at the same speed, which lets you accelerate with the ASC+T on, an old trick from pre-traction control days with manual trannies); turning it off doesn't always help, sometimes the wheels just spin and spin and you go nowhere until you back off completely or reengage the traction control, but other times, especially with proper snow tires, a bit of wheel spin is enough to keep up your speed.

In the dry it also hurts a bit as a small amount of wheelspin is good with performance tires but if the roads are slippery it is quite helpful in keeping the car from sitting in place, spinning the wheels and sliding sideways from a too hot start.

rsunico · February 2003

hpulley4 mentioned that there are now "deals" on Cooper 5-speeds. That sparked my curiosity? What kind of deals and where can I take advantage? The Mini dealer where I'm located is still sticking to MSRP. Thanks.

stryder · March 2003

So I noticed the latest update is now posted. Since my roommate is considering a Z or an RX-8 in the spring, I was surprised about the comparison of how much better a daily car the MINI is.

And I should point out Edmunds.com should have ordered the the multifunction steering wheel at least. Its incredibly easy to change the volume that way.

Ok, enough comments for this month, now I can wait until next month.

revka · March 2003

Hi Everyone- You'll now find a direct link to the 2002 Mini Cooper S Long Term Road Test, in the Helpful Links, on the left side of this page. This link will take you to the Introduction Page. Access other months (July 2002 - Feb. 2003) in the pull down menu there.

To stryder- Thanks for reminding me. ;-)

Happy motoring everyone!

Revka
Host
Hatchbacks & Wagons Boards

arkytect · March 2003

I agree with Stryder. The multifunction steering wheel is a peach! Also, being a biased MINI owner, I haven't found storage spaces to be a problem. MY sunglasses go in the sunglasses holder in the glove box with my manual, CD case, MINI journal and cell phone charger. My cell phone fits motionless in the front left cup holder leaving both door pockets, seatback net pouches and rear seat storage bins empty.

I've only got 5200 miles on my MINI, but I've had no problems except for one slightly weepy radiator coolant reservoir bottle. The entire package has exceeded my expectations!

stryder · March 2003

I am biased as well, and at a bit over 14,000 miles I agree with the space issues. I usually have mints of some sort in one of the cup holders (usually the MINI ones), my cell in the other front holder, which leaves the back for actual drinks. Everything else is either piled into the glovebox, or into the door pockets, which I always get stuff lost in, at least lost enough that I can't reach down and grab it (like the alcohol hand cleaner) without rummaging a lot. If I actually want to use the MINI mug, that takes up the front cupholder, which displaces stuff. We won't even talk about if I'm not driving alone, and my passenger wants to charge their phone or have a drink...

Anything I keep in the car just sits there, the atlas sits on the back seat, a roll of paper towels and ice scraper sit on the floor behind my seat. The iPod sits under the handbrake. I'm not sure there's a good solution for storage, but its a bit odd. Maybe an actual compartment under the toggle switches, and an armrest with some storage in it? Its not a huge problem, but stuff is always getting lost in my car.

eashley · March 2003

I am considering an S, but remember the comments made when I tried to sell my Probe GT turbocharged coupe, re reliability problems, big discount on turbo charged used cars, something to be avoided, etc. I realize that a supercharger is different from a turbo (altho I could not explain the difference), but am wondering if I should be concerned about long term reliability with the supercharged engine. I tend to keep vehicles at least 10 years, and my wife says if I get this, I will have to be meticulous and preserve it forever, since it belongs in MOMA. Any thoughts?
Ed

stryder · March 2003

Edmunds.com had somewhere a discussion on turbos and superchargers, I think it was a tech feature. You can dig it up. Anyway, the supercharger is relatively low pressure, and only adds 50hp, which isn't amazingly high. I personally wouldn't worry about it being a huge reliability problem, unless you expect to drive 200K miles in that 10 years. Personally, I would worry about other small problems like interior squeaks and rattles, but really those can easily get sorted out during the 4/50 warranty. GM's been supercharging cars recently and not had huge reliability issues, and I think the resale value of an S (or any MINI) should be reasonably high (though after 10 years, its anyone's guess).

there's plenty of 10 year old BMW's running around, though none (that I know) of them supercharged, but I don't see any reason after about a year of S' to think they'd be any different. The wear items like sparkplugs and the timing belt aren't a big issue, the timing belt is a chain, and doesn't need much at all, and plugs are a 100K mile item. Turbos are more prone to rust and failure then a supercharger since they're hanging off the exhaust.

crcoxe · March 2003

I recently saw that minimania.com was selling certer armrest/storage units for $159. I have yet to do any significant personal modifications to my MINI, but if/when I do, this might be the first thing. One thing I miss from other cars I've had (perhaps the only thing I miss) is the lack of a right arm rest. Anyone taken the plunge for the center console? My only concern is that it might not fit quite right, making it look cheap. If it fits the way I assume it's supposed to, then it should be a perfect compliment to the rest of the interior. Makes me wonder why they haven' t included the center armrest/console as factory standard.

Like everyone else here, I have found that there is plenty of storage in the door bins, cup holders and glove box. By the way, the ash tray makes a great place to keep loose change - it's covered so the opportunity crooks don't see any cash from the outside.

richjenkins · March 2003

eashley -

For info:

turbocharger = forced induction, pressure provided by exhaust gases spinning a turbine. One end of turbine connected to exhaust side, one end to air pump in intake side.

supercharger = forced induction, pressure provided mechanically off the drivetrain. One end of turbine connected (typically via a belt) to the drive train, one end to air pump in intake side.

Both serve to boost air pressure and thus increase air (and fuel) flow through the engine. If you think of an engine as basically an air pump, a turbo/super charger increases the density of the air, hence the air mass increases, hence the power increases.

The trade off with this power is that both incur some delays as pressure builds up; the turbo charger must wait for exhaust pressure to build up (leading to the oft quoted turbo lag) and the mechanical supercharger must wait for engine RPM to spool up.

Having driven the S I can attest to what many folks have said about that you do need to keep the revs up to keep the engine in the sweet spot of the torque curve...

The knock on forced air engines is thus the increased pressure in the intake system and cylinder head/block, and that if not maintained carefully could lend itself to problems as these are very high speed devices in terms of turn rate of the turbines...

Just my 0.02...Motor on...rich

lngtonge18 · March 2003

As rich said above, superchargers are literally air pumps driven by a belt. They are susceptible to wearing out just like any other engine driven accessory (water pump, alternator, AC compressor). I would expect to rebuild or replace the supercharger somewhere in the 100k-200k range, with most failing between 120-150k. In other words, you shouldn't encounter too much expense or reliability problems with a supercharged engine, but if you keep cars well into the 100k range, have $1000-2000 available to replace the supercharger.

ugly1 · March 2003

I'm sure this one's been asked before and winter is almost over but I'm seriously considering an S. Can some of you snow drivers relate some of your experiences. Also please include your options. Thanks John

hpulley4 · March 2003

If you read back a bit you'll see what I've posted about the MINI Cooper being great fun in the snow. I have 195/55R16H Dunlop SP WinterSport M3 DSST snow tires on X-lite wheels for the winter and they do a great job on snow and ice (and wet and dry roads too, though not as well on dry as performance summer tires).

I have a Cooper with the sports suspension and ASC+T which I leave on except occasionally I'll turn it off when it is bogging too much up a hill (usually works better with ASC+T turned on though, even when I think it would be better without it). Foglamps are also good for winter driving, and so are the winter heated seats, mirrors and washer nozzles.

The car is well balanced which means it handles well on all surfaces. On snow and ice if you push it hard in corners it understeers when you accelerate but as soon as you drop off the throttle it oversteers a bit to correct and then the wheels hook up allowing you to power out of the corner. I've run in on a couple of snow rallies and it does well. Haven't stuffed it in a snowbank yet but I do carry a shovel, traction aids, tow-rope and extra tow-eye just in case. The ABS, EBD and CBC braking work very well with snow tires.

Only minor problem in winter is that the washer resevoir is tiny! It only holds about a third of a jug of fluid so it needs to be refilled often. You should always keep a jug in the trunk.

dski · March 2003

I've been considering buying an S for a Toy Car. I've always wanted something just for fun and the Mini fits the bill it seems. A neighbor shopped one this week and ended up buying. I didn't realize there were Mini's on the lot available without a wait.

Now I just have to decide if I should spend the money. What kind of Insurance rates can I expect? I'm guessing it won't be Cheap.

Any thing else I should be thinking about in my decision process?

Drew

stryder · March 2003

this is a bit delayed (I was out of town...) but anyway, insurance rates shouldn't be too expensive really. The fact remains the cars just don't cost that much. And even with the supercharger, they don't have tons of HP. Both of those factors are huge players in the rates. Assuming you have another car as your driver, and you're in a low insurance rate anyway (accident/age/ticket wise) I wouldn't expect insurance cost to be a big issue. I don't want to make numerical estimates since insurance varies so much around the country, but you should be able to get an quote anywhere, the cars are in all the systems now, just ask before you test drive, since if you drive one that you can take home you may ignore the insurance problem because you're having too much fun.

stryder · March 2003

I was reading the volvo xc-70 link off the front page and it made me think of the rather useless response from MINI about the missing rear fogs (why there's a blank toggle on all US spec cars, check MINI2 for more info). You'd think if the 'competition' can be pointing out the usefulness of the feature to the press, MINIUSA wouldn't be intentionally disabiling it, and ignoring owner's requests to give it back.

Oh well, just felt like mentioning that. I don't think its come up here before, so this seemed like a good time. (I really liked the article from volvo though, neat idea and nice writeup)

rickrover · March 2003

My GTI (as most VW's) has a socket for the rear fog light in the tail light lens. A very popular VW mod is to buy a Euro spec VW headlight switch ($50) with the rear fog option and install it in the US Spec VW along with the bulb in the socket and you have the Euro spec rear fog light plus no daytime running light and the option of using parking lights. U.S. spec Audi's all have rear fogs.

I'll bet you'll see the same on the MINI in the future - some MINI aftermarket company will provide everything you need to have Euro spec rear fogs in your MINI.

hpulley4 · March 2003

Unfortunately, the MINI is too smart. There are actually bulbs in the rear foglamps in the taillight assembly (I had one replaced and have the extra assembly in my basement so it is easy to check). Getting the euro-spec switchbank is also easy but you have to get the dealer to program the computer to link up the two. I don't know if north american dealers even have the right software to do that. Sounds like we need a hacker to go in there looking for unused locations in the config or something.

Harry

dwabid · March 2003

We just signed (yesterday) the papers for a Mini S, English racing green, with all packages. Of course we had to get bonnet stripes as well. When I asked about the Rear fogs on our first test drive (several weeks ago) the dealer explained they were not "street legal" in the US.

stryder · March 2003

Congrats on your car, hope your wait is short.

With regard to the lights, your dealer is just plain wrong. MINIUSA was giving the same misinfo, until someone on MINI2 dug up a contact who is a consultant for automobile lighting, he quoted the exact regulations, and emailed MINIUSA to check, and the upshot was rear fogs are totally entirely legal given the setup on the MINI (they're not always legal, but the light cluster has the correct markings, etc on the cars). There's no real reason for them not working in the US besides MINI disabiling them, and as HPulley has said, they're un-enableable until someone hacks the computer that the switch interfaces with, or MINI provides the software to do it. (It'd also be useful if they sold the full toggle bank, so it didn't need to be imported)

dwabid · March 2003

The wait will be short. We were going to order and wait about eight weeks, but when I called the dealer in Milwaukee they actually had an exact model we were looking for on the way. We should take delivery in about 10 days. We really did not want the "sport package" but we just liked the idea of quick delivery.

As for the fog lamps...I kinda knew it wasn't true. I am no expert but found it ludicrous to believe that car lighting would be illegal, but I didn't think about it until picking up the thread in this forum. I figured I never heard of "rear fogs" so thus I really don't need them, but the gap in the dash board is a little annoying.

hpulley4 · March 2003

The only good thing about the missing switch is that it allows you to find the other switches without looking. Find the 'hole' with one finger and you know where the other switches sit so you don't disable traction control while trying to roll down a window.

stryder · March 2003

Car lighting can be illegal. For instance, if from the factory the fog lights stayed on when the high beams were on, or if the driving spots (if you get them) were on when low beams were on, that would be illegal. (I'm not sure if it violates federal or state laws though..)

Also, if you look on older cars, before the age of xenon, all headlights have three bumps on the front, so they can be aimed. That's entirely a US thing, just because of laws. Its the subtle differences, so it is possible. But ohh well.

I don't have traction control, so I avoid such problems, though recently my roommate has become amused by the fog toggle's light, so he plays with that while i'm driving, I don't know if that's worse or not.

tisbe3 · March 2003

So what's the deal with these run-flat's in the S? Looks like they cost around $200 a pop. Kind of expensive, no?

Test drove a MINI the other day, and was kind of disappointed. (The straightaway back-and-forth route probably didn't help much.) How much better is the S?

You think they will be selling these guys for below MSRP anytime soon?

stryder · March 2003

The 16" runflats from tire rack start at about $140, and the 17"'s are $200, I guess that's incentive to stick with the smaller tires. They are expensive, but some people think they're worth the extra money, others are willing to replace them with non-runflats (which is just a swap out) and carry a can of tire inflator. Its your option.

I assume you mean you drove a Cooper on the straightway, and you're asking about the performance of the Cooper S.

It depends what your previous car experience was, and your tastes. A Cooper will feel slow on straights, especially if you don't stomp on the gas and shift near redline. The extra HP of the S will get better passing + pure acceleration. If you're looking for pure sportscar type speed, they'll both feel pretty slow. Go find some curves, that's where the fun is.

MSRP, depends where you live, but it will probably happen eventually. I doubt it'll be anything like a 0/0/0 kind of sales, or with $3K rebates. My gut feeling is it'll end up like the TMV values for BMW's, 3 series' in OH (where I am now) are around $1K below MSRP. Even when that does happen, it'll probably be cars sitting on lots, not special orders, so you need to decide if you're willing to wait.

hpulley4 · March 2003

Runflats are expensive because few cars use them right now but all 2004 MY cars are supposed to have pressure monitors so they will become more common. Some Toyotas (e.g. Sienna 2004) come with them now, so the price will drop. 16" Dunlops are $140 and under and are good tires but 17" is more expensive. I like the runflats but if they aren't for you, replace them with standard tires when they wear out.

MSRP is what you pay around here for new cars. The last 2002's on the lots went for less with incentives on them but new cars still sell for MSRP.

The Cooper is not a great straight line acceleration car, it is a great handling and cornering car. The S is better for 0-60 dashes but still nowhere near a WRX or V8 Camaro. If you want straight-line acceleration, there are other cars better suited.

tisbe3 · March 2003

The only problem with using regular tires on the S is that the S has no spare! Unless you wanted to turn it into a two seater and keep one in the rear...

And what in heck is tire inflator in a can?

I realize the Cooper is not a straight-line performance car, I prefer curves - just looking for enough power to get up hills OK. I can't believe that dealer doesn't use a better route for letting their customers test drive their MINIs. Next time I'm going to scout the route first!

Another thing I forgot to mention, the brakes felt *really* sensitive - I barely touched into them and they grabbed hard. Is this normal on the MINI?

stryder · March 2003

The tire inflator was my solution to the lack of a spare on the S, (though I'll admit one of the reasons I like my Cooper is the spare). Its an aersol can that will inflate a flat tire, and shoots goop into it, which then seals any leaks. The downside is its a pain to get out of the tire, and isn't usually a permanant solution. Its available at all auto stores, and auto sections of mass-market retailers. Sometimes also it spells the death of a tire, but then that can happen too on a run-flat if you drive it the full milage under inflated (milage depends on the pressure).

If you're willing to downshift and stay in gears you'll have enough power for most situations. If you live somewhere like Colorado you might have problems, but I've driven around hills everywhere in the states from WI to CT and haven't had problems. I regularly pass in 3rd gear on highways, which ends up near redline (I think its 98 mph in 3rd). An S doesn't require the agressive gear usage, but I think that's the fun part of the car, and I don't end up thinking the car's wheezing going up hills. Its not really difficult to get the car from say 80 to 95 or so to pass someone, whereas I was driving a Neon 2 weeks ago that took eons and was pretty scary.

The brakes are really sensative according to most other cars. I've gotten used to it though, so now I complain the random rental cars I'll drive have crappy brakes. Certainly if you stomp on them ABS will engage really quickly, but you get used to not pressing to the floor in normal usage.

hpulley4 · March 2003

The base MINI Cooper is fine on hills but as Stryder said you have to be careful about the revs. It maxes torque at 4500 RPMs and HP at redline so as long as you downshift, there is power there. The car has a small engine which revs freely to 7000RPM and is meant to be used like that.

A full size spare fits in the trunk if you take the cargo shelf off (195mm wide tires on 6.5" or narrower wheels do anyways) so if you want to carry a full sized spare you can do so WITH 3 passengers. I know because some MINI S owners I rally with use non-runflats and they carry a spare wheel back there with the back seats up (I rally on runflats, secure knowing I can make it to the end of any leg on a flat).

The brakes are big and strong, 11" front vented and 10.5" rear solid discs. The car has ABS along with electronic brake-force distribution which adjusts brake force front to back and corner braking control which adjusts brake force side to side for maximum braking effectiveness. All this combines to stop the car quickly which is good but might feel touchy compared to cars with small front discs and fade-prone rear drums.

minime5 · March 2003

Hey bid -
I live in the Northern suburbs of Chicago and was trying to find a good MINI dealer. Where was your Milwaukee dealer and would you recommend them?
To the rest of the board - I saw one person comment of the driving in snow. What do the rest of you think? Can it handle a Chicago winter? I'm looking at a base Cooper with the premium package and cold weather package.
Thanks for the help!!

dwabid · April 2003

It's International Mini in West Allis. Southwest side of Milwaukee. They are off Interstate 894. See Mini.usa website for directions. As a dealer I would classify them as OK. Very easy going and were more than willing to allow a test drive. We actually were going to order a model but our sales person found a model that they were receiving in stock that had every thing we wanted. We purchased a Mini S with sport, premium and winter packages at sticker price. We really did not want the sport option, but because we would receive the car in about 2 weeks instead of eight we placed the order. They are very responsive to email queries as well. Oh, don't bother with their financing or leasing options. Our credit union was fantastic. 4.6% for virtually any term up to 60 months.

My only complaint is we were guaranteed delivery by the end of the month but the car is still sitting in New Jersey...that and my wife wants to place a cutsey Hula girl figurine on the dash...I think I will counter with reclining lady mud slaps on the VUE ;-)

stryder · April 2003

I'll quickly summarize snow performance, (its been discussed many times). I haven't ever experienced a Chicago winter. I have experienced winter storms in Rochester NY, Hudson Valley NY (60 miles north of nyc), Cleveland, Erie and Pittsburgh in the past year with my car.

The car's handling depends on its tires in a huge way. If you expect snow or ice, I'd very much reccomend snow tires, ideally on a set of extra rims. (You can get nice looking 15" alloys for $100/each, compared to the cost of changeovers each year, and much better looking then steel). If you get snow tires, the car's really predictable and simple to drive in the snow, but it can't get through snow much deeper then 5" because of low ground clearance. It just doesn't make a good plow, but short of that, you'll be fine.

If you don't get snow tires, I'd be very wary of driving in snow, depending on which tires you have, the grip will range from awful to barely adequate on stock tires.

Depending on your driving preferences, you may want to get the stability control option. I don't have it, and because of that, the car will regularly (and controllably) slide around in a few inches of snow. I just catch the skid and maybe spin a tire a bit and move on. If you're not entirely comfortable with that, you might want to invest the $500, but someone else will need to comment on stability's impact. Hpulley has traction control because of his canadian spec car, which would cut down on the small amount of wheelspin especially when starting that I get on heavy snow.

The snow tires I ended up getting are 195/60/15 Blizzak WS-50's on Borbet H wheels, they're around $700 from tire rack, and should last me 2-3 winters (I drive 15K Mi/yr)

minime5 · April 2003

Thanks for the advice guys - I really appreciate your help. Stryder, I have printed out your advice for the tires and will file until next November - it's 75 here today. I've taken the car out for two test drives - now I'm just looking for the right color and option combo. All I can say is, I never thought you can have this much fun in such a little car!

ozone1 · April 2003

I found one post on this board regarding the MINI and booster seats....has anyone put a stroller in along with a kid? We don't have kids now, but plan to in the near future, so this would obviously be important. And for those of you with kids, how secure do you feel driving amongst the Expeditions, H2s and other behemoths on the road with your kids in tow?

eman5 · April 2003

Anyone care to comment on the base Cooper with CVT and 16" run-flats as an urban daily driver? Ride quality ok? mpg? Major regrets?

stryder · April 2003

Ozone - I don't have kids, but I feel safe in the MINI, I've seen lots of pictures of crashes (front, rear, side, flipped, etc) with various things, and the car's been really solid. Sure it may get totalled, but the important stuff stays intact. Also, you forget really quickly how small the car is if its the only thing you drive, so you don't always go, uhh, That's huge compared to me for most things.

I have a Cooper, but not CVT, so I can't comment on that. Urban driving around Cleveland, the gas milage is usually in the mid to high 20's. Not great, not awful for average speeds never really exceeding 30 (trip computer info for both of those) I don't have sport suspension +, just SS, and after reading the edmunds review (especially since Cleveland roads are far worse then southern CA, I think this is a good thing. The ride quality on the 16" runflats is adequate. Its not the sportiest, but way firmer then most cars, and works out to a nice balance. I think its what you'd expect from a sports suspension. My kidneys stay intact over all but the most horrible bumps, including over brick roads, and I can take most corners. The tires start squealing usually before I worry body roll is annoying.

Urban life also makes you need to get really good at parallel parking. I don't do it more then once a week or so, but I somehow feel self conscious if its not nearly perfect as the car's so small.

My regrets are options related, My car's old, so things like the H/K sound system and the auto-dimming mirror and heated mirrors weren't available. I would have gotten all of them. That's about the extent of my regret. Oh, with parking I think I've curbed one or two of the wheels, which of course is my fault. I'd personally expect to do that, and I wonder if they'll be an issue when I move onto my next MINI as they're bound to be stupidly expensive to fix.

arkytect · April 2003

Ozone, I've got two girls, 5 and 7. The five year old still uses a car seat, but her sister is tall enough to wear the MINI seatbelt properly. They both sit in the back. I'm 6 feet tall, so the driver seat is pushed back a fair amount. The child that sits behind me gets less leg room, but I've not heard much complaint.

Having done my time with strollers and kid accessories, I think one baby plus accessories might be tolerable, though I have doubts that any stroller other than one of those umbrella-handled models could fit in the boot without folding one of the rear seats flat. Then you have the diaper bag and everything might get a little tight. We had a compact sedan during the baby/toddler years and we now use my wife's Protege5 (we like smaller cars) for big family trips to the beach, grocery shopping, etc. I'm usually in the MINI by myself (90%).

Regarding safety, I feel the safety features, in addition to the handling/power/visibility provided by the MINI will keep me safe, but I know I'm in a smaller car and I approach driving it somewhat defensively, especially when the girls are with me.

Having said that, my girls are aspiring motorheads and have begun to make their automotive preferences known. There has been an occasion or two where they have encouraged me to take a sweeping curve a little faster than the speed limit. Just don't tell their mom...

revka · April 2003

To hpulley, stryder, arkytect, and others here- Thanks for the great notes/feedback you've been providing in this discussion.

To all owners - Anyone interested in offering a vehicle update? For those interested, you can list your:

1. Model Year & Total miles to date.

2. MPG & Driving habits. Any differences in mpg since you first purchase?

3. Any additional accessories & mods?

4. Maintenance issues to date.

5. Any interesting trips or cargo experiences?

6. Overall impressions pro/cons of your Mini Cooper since you first purchased....

Share as much (or as little) information as you'd like. I'm sure others passing through here, would find the information quite interesting, if not helpful. Also, feel free to report back every 3-5k to update again.

Thanks for your participation! ;-)

Revka
Host
Hatchbacks & Wagons Boards

hpulley4 · April 2003

Our son is now two and we've had him in our MINI Cooper since he was one. He fits fine in his car seat. An umbrella style stroller fits in the trunk if you remove the cargo shelf and there is still room for a diaper bag, a small cooler for food and drinks, some toys and a little booster seat to use in lieu of a high chair. If you fold one seat down you can get a larger pram in. Two kids could be carried if only a single stroller was required. Getting him in and out is fairly easy as the door opens wide and the roof is high so you can stand up hunched over to buckle him in.

hpulley4 · April 2003

2002 MINI Cooper, built Feb/02, delivered 30April2002. 13000 miles so far in 11 months of ownership.

MPG varies depending on driving speed. At 50-70 MPH highway driving plus some easy city driving the mileage is around 33MPG or better but if you drive very fast (90-110MPH) on the highway and rip around town then it drops to 24MPG or so. Engine is more powerful now and gets better mileage, WHEN I drive it lightly.

I've added front mud flaps, a european warning triangle and a Blitzsafe AUX adapter to use my Nomad Jukebox MP3 player.

The driver's seat back trim came off; replaced. Gear linkage recall preventative fix done. Idle was a bit low in very cold mornings so software updated. Alignment was a bit off, with some wheel vibration; 4-wheel alignment and balance performed. Door lock is acting up right now (locks on its own, could be worse if the opposite was occuring), slated for fix soon. Only one oil change so far, as recommended by the computer; next one in another 10000 miles or so by the look of it.

I've run my car in some time-speed-distance rallies, including all nighters up north in the snow. Great fun!

I love the car, nothing else out there is like it. It does fit four adults, really! Only cons are it is so much fun to drive fast and hard that the tires are wearing out fast, I've already had an alignment done and I wonder how long the brakes are going to last; those things are my fault really but the car handles and drives so well that it is hard not to drive it like a race car.

Harry

ozone1 · April 2003

Thanks for the great feedback, at least I know it's doable. We're going to go test drive a Mini S tomorrow in San Francisco.

minime5 · April 2003

Question for you people - the crash tests on the car look very good. The only caveat is that there's no results on the rear seat side impact test. The dealer tells me that's because the seat's too small to fit the crash dummy into.
Two questions:
1) Is that true?
2) Do you all feel that it's safe there also?
One other thing..I'm probably going to order a Cooper, and they tell me 8 weeks. Has that been the timeframe that people have experienced?
Thanks again!!!!

stryder · April 2003

1. 2002 MINI Cooper, built March '02, Delivered April 23rd, 15,750 miles

2. As I said earlier a fair amount of my driving is around Cleveland, with average speed below 30, that usually gets mid 20's milage depending on how slow I am moving. Road trips, with cruise usually set in the mid 70's usually 31-32. I got a different kind of gas (Sheetz) on my last trip and got 34 on the second half. Go figure. My driving's running errands around Cleveland and road trips to visit friends.
3. I replaced the 3rd brakelight with the clear version, I replaced the front turn signals with silvered bubls (got rid of fried egg look) I've got a blitzsafe for my iPod. I bought a set of rubber mats for winter use. I've got mudflaps that I haven't installed yet. As I said above, I bought aftermarket alloys for snow tires. I also picked up an K&N filter.

4. One oil change, at about 9,000 Miles, as scheduled by computer. Had recalled shifter linkage, got new style seat handles, had A/C blower die, that got replaced. (Though disconnected all lights in process, so had to go back) Surging/stalling was fixed w/ updated computer software. Had shifter assembly start squeaking, got replaced. Had Airbag light go one. Wiring harness replaced for side airbag in driver's seat.

All of that was warranty stuff.

I came back to the car after a week's vaction, and noticed the windshield has cracked. Seems to be from a small rock hitting it right by the VIN, haven't fixed or checked into cost yet.

Someone backed into me, leaving a baseball sized dent by the headlight. Had hood and bumper painted and de-dented. Cost a bit over $1k. (Their insurance paid, no problems)

5. I bought the car when I was in Rochester NY, so drove around there a bit, then moved to Cleveland in May. I've gone from Cleveland to Rochester twice, Cleveland to Madison WI, Cleveland to Flint MI, and several trips to NY. I went to a MINI meet in Pittsburgh (in a snow storm, it was fun) and in Dayton at the Air Force museum. I tend to think I drive and corner much more aggresively then your average person. (I've found for instance its quite fun to rotate the car with the e-brake on empty roads to go around curves, still working on parallel parking with that) I had tons of fun driving the car around windy roads in WI and in NY. The more boring straight roads in the midwest are entertaining as people still ask me what kind of car it is. (Happened yesterday at a drive through). I still love days when its warm (like above freezing) since I'll put the heated seats on, and drive with the windows and sunroof open.

Interesting packing.. I've fit a 27" tv in the back, at the same time as a vacuum. I brought home a 5 1/2' table (took two trips, second one for the legs). Moved myself with like 10 MINI trips. Those are the most interesting things.

6. The car is awsome to drive. Its still really unique, and really just fun. I always smile when I see it. Almost everyone compliments it, and when they don't, its usually something inane, and they just don't understand not everyone needs 30 cu feet of space. I often time feel like I'm driving a BMW, but don't have the negative of it being an expensive 'Yuppie' car. Its not the most reliable thing ever, but I've never been stranded, and I'm sure many of the problems relate to my getting such an early production. I've dealt with 3 (really 4) dealers, they seem to vary. Often times I feel like I'm not amazingly important, because everyones BMW's are more expensive. The one dealer I went to that had separate MINI service was really nice. It horribly irritates me that MINI doesn't offer loaner cars for warranty work, sometimes dealers offer them if you purchased the car there. (I haven't gotten any service at the dealer I bought my car at, since I moved a month later) Recently, since my car's been problematic, the dealer seems to be coming up with loaners, though they're still things like Kias or Civics. I'd probably be happier if when I brought in my car for things that weren't my fault, they gave me a 3 series to drive. Somehow a Spectra just isn't the same.

I sorta regret not getting some of the more recent options as I've said, but I figure I can get them on my next MINI, I do like having the car so early. I think the paint's a bit soft, seems to have gotten rather pockmarked from sand and gravel if you look closey.

About it from off the top of my head. Yay MINI.

stryder · April 2003

Your dealer isn't lying, I can't remember where the info was, but the IIHS test here: http://www.iihs.org/vehicle_ratings/ce/html/0222.htm doesn't seem to say that, but it was said when the tests came out.

If you're actually ordering your car, 8 weeks seems about right. It takes about 4 weeks from once the car is made to go across the ocean (longer for the west coast) and it takes at least a week to make it. There was a backlog before, so actually you're probably close to as fast as possible.

hpulley4 · April 2003

I forgot, I got a set of rubber mats for winter too. Will be coming out soon but not this weekend as a storm's a'comin'.

The back seat really is too small for a crash test dummy and the sensors that go along with it. Look at others in the category and you'll see the Celica and other coupes also were too small to test the rear area. I think it is fine back there, the car is very strongly built and looking at pictures from some MINIs in horrible accidents the chassis holds up really well. I don't worry when my son is back there, especially since the MINI makes avoiding accidents easier than in bigger vehicles, being so maneuverable.

For some body work (hit'n'run by a cyclist if you can believe that) I got a Chrylser Sebring boat. This morning my lock problem got worse with the car thinking the driver's door was open so the window didn't want to stay up and it wouldn't lock. They took the car on short notice and gave me a Ford Taurus as a rental in case they aren't finished by tonight. Why do I always get boats for rentals? I'm not sure I'd prefer a Kia but these mid-sized cars really feel like river barges after driving my MINI (even our family Saturn LW200 wagon feels better, being based upon an Opel Vectra -- europeans know how a car should drive, IMO). Actually, they gave me another MINI Cooper once so I don't always get a boat. Hope they give me a Z4 demo some day

crcoxe · April 2003

'02 Mini Cooper, BRG/white color combo w/bonnet stripes (a must if you ask me). Got on the waiting list last February (pre-launch in the US) and took delivery mid-May. I now have just over 11,000 miles on it.

As for maintenance, the 10K mile service came due for me around 9500 miles, only had to wait around 2 hours for that. Also had the transmission linkage and seat lever recalls done at the same time. Recently, the airbag warning light came on, so I took it in and they fixed that as well as lubricating the sunroof mechanism that got some grit in it after a long winter of staying shut. All under warranty. The back of the driver's seat came loose on mine as well, but all it required was my own ingenuity - it snapped right back into place and hasn't come loose again.

The only "accident" I have had is when I put the first ding in the door at the gas station. Opened the door right into the concrete barrier around the pump. Oh well, it was bound to happen sooner or later, and my wife was relieved that I did it first. :-)

I also got the rubber floor mats and will likely spring for some carpet mats this summer as well. Couldn't resist buying a hat while I was in the spending mood also. That's the extent of my foray into the abyss of mods and aftermarket extras. I am curious about the center console/armrest, but don't want to sacrifice the rear cup holder in the process.

Saying I love this car is like saying Tiger Woods is a pretty good golfer. I have never had so much fun behind the wheel. Now that the warm weather is here (sorry hpulley4) the sunroof is open and I'm all over the twisties again!

As for packing, there is no doubt that this is a small car (ahem, it's called a MINI), but I am constantly amazed as to how much I can fit back there. I too brought home a 27" TV with room to spare. It's also fun to be the smallest car (some days the only non-truck) in the Home Depot parking lot while others watch me put things like 8' lengths of wood and a miter saw in the back, close the boot with ease, and drive off. Come August, I'll be able to report on baby seats, strollers, diaper bags, etc. I don't have any concerns about motoring among the SUVs, as the car feels quite solid on the road, which instills confidence. I was tailgated by an H2 the other day, however, and was quickly reminded how close the rear window is from the driver's seat. As others have said, though, the ability to avoid accidents is readily apparent when you are behind the wheel. Just requires being a tad more defensive in those situations.

As stryder said, the car just puts a smile on your face. Can't help it, it just does.

MINI Cooper

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