MINI Cooper

rmorin2 · May 2002

I've just learned that supply of xenons and sport package components is causing quite a stir. May and June build cars are probably going to be built without these options or at least be delayed. I am still trying to figure out what this means to me. I have a Cooper on order, build date 5/24. I ordered Xenons. Not sure if my car will be built without them or delayed. This is a real bummer, but, then again at least I am in the queque. Motor On!

revka · May 2002

here's some Mini Cooper News that you may find interesting: Mini speeds BMW on road to sales record. (This is not a permanent link.) Happy motoring!

Revka
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tollag · May 2002

Still a kid, ohh, 35 years ago, my father who had served in the second world war, told me that Germany was as he put it, "An unstoppable force..." I'm just now starting to understand... Everything they touch turns to gold... Especially the mini

fledge · May 2002

I got a phone call this afternoon from my dealer. They had an S with similar options to what I wanted, and at MSRP. I was stunned, and it took me a few seconds to respond (hell yes).
I'd heard of this happening to a few other people, but... I'm going to be driving my S this summer after all.

Anyway, went out and got a couple bottles of red wine... feeling pretty good right now.
Sometime in early July. >8=/

rickrover · May 2002

I had my choice of 3 in stock S' last week. Red, Electric Blue and Silver all with sport and premium packages with leatherette - I passed, checked back in on Saturday (didn't go out of my way, I was in the neighborhood) - after 4 days the red and blue were still there but sold, the silver one was unsold on the showroom floor. I'm going in today or tomorrow to get my $1k deposit back. My particular dealer has alienated a lot of their potential customers what with the $1,500 market adjustment on the S and $1k mandatory accessories requirement on the Cooper. The blue one mentioned above had $3k in accessories on it for a total of a hair under $27k - not worth it. Actually, the gouging isn't my biggest issue with them, it's their attitude - you'd think they were selling rare Ferrari's - Luckily this dealer is seeing their waiting lists evaporate.

silver_bullet · May 2002

I've read that Ferrari is trying to get buyers of their rarer cars (as if any Ferrari is common) to sign a binding agreement stipulating that the dealer has the right of first refusal if the buyer chooses to sell the car within a set time frame. MINI owners from Canada have said BMW is doing this in their country, to prevent speculators from immediately reselling their cars to Americans. I wonder how many folks who are now grousing about dealer gouging are really just miffed that they won't be able to flip their cars for as big a profit as they planned? Whatever happened to buying a car just because you want it - and keeping it?

hpulley4 · May 2002

Limited numbers of MINI dealers can make things tough. I'm glad mine is 100% upfront and reasonable here. I considered a base, base Cooper at first and was told one was coming in if I wanted to put my name on it but didn't like the base wheels so I went for the sports package and a person who had a deposit on one in my colour (dark Indie blue) got a 3-series instead so I was in luck right on the lot. They have no markups, no mandatory options. The cars are selling themselves so there is no reason to play games.

Minimum $1000-1500 options sounds like pure greed to me. The cars come well equipped as they are and the invoice gives them lots of profit right at MSRP. You should complain to MINI international about their behaviour as they likely don't want a bad rep.

revka · May 2002

Have you experienced any problems with your Mini Cooper, please share your solutions in this new new discussion: Mini Cooper - Problems & Solutions.

For future reference, look for a direct link to this discussion in the Helpful Links (left side). You'll also find a direct link back to this area from that discussion. Hope this is helpful.

Revka
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coznefx · May 2002

My "reputable" BMW dealer here in L.A. is greedily tacking $5000 (!!!) onto the sticker. Perhaps that's why they have over 10 sitting on their lot.

rickrover · May 2002

I was planning to flip my first MINI - can't say I'm upset over that plan not working out, no big deal. Nothing wrong with trying to subsidize my car addiction. Actually, the fact that demand for the MINI has fizzled so early in it's launch makes me want one that much more.

I've been at my dealer 3 times in the past two weeks deciding if I want an S now or not. I got a call two weeks ago this Monday telling me they had an electric blue S available now - I'm supposedly 14 on their S list. They had a blue, silver and red S's sitting there unsold and available to the first buyer. There were 7 or 8 Coopers there with sold signs as well. Went in last weekend and the red and blue were sitting there with sold signs on them along with most of the same "sold" Coopers Went down yesterday with a friend that got on the list when I did and saw the red an blue still sitting there with sold signs on them - the silver S still hasn't been sold (all have premium and sport) and 5 of the same "sold" Coopers still there. I asked the sales manager why they haven't delivered the sold S's and all the Coopers that haven't been delivered either - he said the people that bought them are "out of town and will pick them up when they return" - what's up with that, did they take a slow boat to China? two weeks? I seriously get the feeling they are creating demand with sold signs.

Anyway to make a long story short - I asked for my deposit back and so did my friend - we plan to get one from another dealer, maybe Flow in North Carolina - they are fantastic to do business with - I have an M Coupe in my garage from them - I bought an X5 from this Orlando BMW dealer last year - that will be the last time I do any business with these jokers.

I'm not in a huge hurry for the S anyway - I have a highly modified 2002 turbo GTI for a track car that suits me just fine for now. It will be replaced by an S. This will give me some time to research performance mods for the S as they become available - I hear Dinan is comming out with a bunch of go fast stuff for the S - it's all good -

richardjenkins · May 2002

Rick - At what dealership exactly are you seeing the sold signs on the Minis?

rich

gildlb · May 2002

Now that's interesting. I stopped by the local Mini dealer in Orlando Florida a few weeks ago, and they also had many "sold" Minis at their location. About 5 or 6 outside and at least 7 inside their main show room. There were no actual sold signs on them, but I was told all but one of them was sold.

I asked why all these sold vehicles were still there, and I was told people were taking there time to pick them up. I never did check back to see if any of them still might be there, but now I'm wondering if rickrover may be onto something with dealers trying to create a demand with sold signs.

hpulley4 · May 2002

That's how it was here too but if I wanted a different colour (including one on the lot with a sold sign) then I was told I'd have to order. I find it hard to believe they'd keep a pile sitting on the lot just for 'excitement'. I came in 3 times to look and once more to pick up my car and they were delivering some during that time. Along with those deliveries I must say it snowed a few times, up until even the week when I bought my car and all the ones on the lot, like mine, have summer tires so maybe they were waiting for winter to finally end (doesn't explain things in Florida though). Maybe I'm just gullible?

Some people have had deposits on them since last year or early this year, especially the Canadian Launch Editions which 'sold out' in January. I don't know how long they can wait to pick them up but I wonder if the excitement has worn off for some of those people and they are getting cold feet now after such a long wait? How long can a person usually hold a car with a deposit? My car was available only, supposedly, because someone backed out of a deposit and got a 3-series Beemer instead.

aerostar45 · May 2002

I just received an email from my Mini dealer that the Xenon light is not available for my June 7 production Mini Cooper. :-( I was very disappointed when they told me that the auto-dimming rear-view mirror was not available, I ordered the car anyway cause I think I can live with that. However, if the Xenon light is out too then they took away too much fun of the car. By the way, my order was a CVT. I test-droved it last weekend. It was not very impressive.

I canceled my order, but I may re-order it when those goodies are available.

rickrover · May 2002

That's where all the "sold" MINI's are and where I cancelled my place on the waiting list after a year and a half.

m37steve · May 2002

I ordered a Cooper w/ CVT and Xenons, hoping for a July build. My dealer doesn't have a CVT demo unit yet, so I'd like to hear more about the unimpressiveness of the CVT. Unimpressive compared to a Cooper with manual? Unimpressive compared to another car? More info, please?

richardjenkins · May 2002

Hi Rick - thanks for the info. I had assumed that was the case since you were in Central Fla based on your other posts.

I drove a yellow Cooper 5 speed on Saturday at Downtown Mini, and am going back to drive an S next weekend. Like you I was a little surprised at the lack of grunt in the Cooper, but then again I was not winding it out too much. I was just hoping such a small car would get off the line a bit peppier. Mind you driving on I-4 in the left lane it seemed like plenty of power if you downshifted into 4th...

We own a "real" '67 S, so it will be interesting to see the differences between the two cars...I don't know if other folks would be interested in a comparison of the two. I would have thought most folks buying a "new" Mini in the USA would never have driven one of the original? I could be wrong...

By the way I am not an autocrosser/racer, just like to drive small fast cars. When we lived in the UK I drove a Rover Cooper as a daily driver and the S on the weekends to shows and such. I always enjoyed driving it. Here in the states Mom has a Minivan and I have a 4D auto sedan besides the Mini at the mo. Would really like to get into one of these. Here's what I wrote down as a first impression:

o Sunroof too bright - does anyone know if there is a solid shade vs. the fabric?

o Its been real hot (+92F) here in Orlando and the car did not get very cold -- even with auto AC set to 60 ..?

o Car could use more grunt

o Brakes great

o handling and roadholding very communicative as far as road feel goes

o steering great

o no squeaks or rattles

o car pulled to the left on the highway at 70+ (!)

o Back seat seemed bigger than I thought it would be

o clutch/brake were hard to heel and toe - I am 5'6" with small feet and I could not do it

o turn signal lever trim/lettering seemed like it would not last/wear off quickly

o hard to see speedo in middle of dash - not because of location but because of grey gauge face and orange needle. Perhaps this is better at night. Well anyway I drive on the tach. (I liked the fact the tach was right "there"; on my S I have a genuine period 60's accesory mounting for my Smith's 0-8000 RPM tach which I plan to move onto the steering wheel one of these days:)

o Passenger seat on the test car had a broken latch

Sum up: A pretty cool little car.

All the best...rich

jr47 · May 2002

Hi,
Does anyone have any feedback on the Base Cooper with the sport pkg vs without it? I've driven one without it and am wondering how much different the sport pkg feels. Is it much stiffer? Is there much difference in the seats? How much more bumpy is the ride?

Thanks!

hpulley4 · May 2002

I've driven MINI Coopers with and without sport seats but otherwise the same (same suspension, same 16" 195/55R16 tires) and much prefer the sport seats -- they are much more supportive and have side bolstering so you can really corner fast without sliding out of your place. I don't know how the ride with 15" wheels would compare.

nyccarguy · May 2002

"Car could use more grunt"

I think that's why they have the Supercharged Mini Cooper S;)

hpulley4 · May 2002

Or wind it up. I'm babying my new Cooper (well, trying my best ;-) ) but the test car was a hoot to drive. The dealer told me to wind it up, not to bother downshifting from 5th to 4th on the freeway for passing, said to skip down to 3rd instead and keep it up near 6000RPM. As long as you keep the engine spooling well, it pulls just fine.

For fast starts you need to dump into the clutch just a little but you can chirp the tires and get the ASC+T light to come on easily if you try. That light coming on means you are clutching and gassing right in the zone and need to back off a smidge. With a manual tranny you can get any car to move well at the expense of gas mileage and clutch life.

Same with cornering under hard acceleration: you can get the "remember buddy, you're only human" light to come on there too.

If it bothers you, it can be turned off but I find it to be a good retroactive traction control meaning it just brakes the wheels a little if you are barely on the edge. Some traction controls kill the engine at the slightest hint of wheelspin which I find to be dangerous (it can leave you sitting in the middle of the intersection with no engine power and oncoming traffic). I have yet to see my MINI actually retard the engine timing or anything that severe.

jr47 · May 2002

Hopefully the dealer will have one with a sport pkg for me to drive next time I'm there. Great to hear about the sport seats, I was extremely impressed with the stock seats as it was!

seminole_kev · May 2002

say...an integra?

wishnhigh1 · May 2002

shifty, do us a favor and delete his username too...check out the rest of his sexist and racist comments over in news and views, etc.

kev,

actually I was thinking more along the lines of Metro

revka · May 2002

because they were not appropriate discussion for this board. It's best to ignore trolls and not let disrupt the discussion. Okay? Also, feel free to send me an email if you come across any more problems in this discussion.

And now, back to the subject of the Mini Cooper! Thanks for your participation.

Revka
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seminole_kev · May 2002

thanks for pulling my response as well. It would have looked kind of silly sitting by itself ;-)

759397 · May 2002

with the Mini to date. What are the performance numbers on the "S"....just curious.

Thanks

hpulley4 · May 2002

I'm trying to remember which magazine pulled a 6.9 out of an S in its test. As usual, it depends on how hard you launch the car, how much you dump into the clutch, etc.

I've seen 8.5 or better out of the base Cooper too which is good considering its power:weight.

759397 · May 2002

with the Mini to date. What are the performance numbers on the "S"....just curious.

Thanks

revka · May 2002

To seminole- You're welcome. ;-)

To 759397- You'll find detailed performance specs on the Mini Cooper S in Edmunds' New Vehicle Guide. Also, look for a direct link to the Mini Cooper New Vehicle information in the Helpful Links on the left side of the page. Good luck.

Revka
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aerostar45 · May 2002

You may or may not read my previous post stated that when I test-drove the manual MINI Cooper, I felt that the first gear was kind of sluggish. I thought it might be the case that I was not a good manual driver and the CVT might help. However, the CVT just felt the same way if not worse. In a word, it doesn't surprise you. However, it does give you a smooth shifting cause it is not really "shifting", like all other automatic do. The tiptronic feature is horrible, but again, it might be that I am not familiar with it. It will really "Choke" you when "shifting".

My dealer told me today that the Xenon will be available on July's production(Lucky you! :-)). Since I am buying a car for my wife and she doesn't mind to wait another month, I kept my order. I must give my dealer a hard time yesterday. I hope they will relay it to the manufacture though.

Happy motoring!

tollag · May 2002

In response to jr47, when I drove a regular cooper, without the sports package, the ride was very comfortable. The only problem was that when it filled up with 4 adults (all about 170 pounds), the soft suspension kept bottoming out on sharp corners, or large pot-holes in Boston. When I tested almost the identical car, with the stiffer sports suspension, and the 16" tires, the problem was no more! My only complaint was that you could feel every single little crack in the road... (but that keeps you alert

Now then, talking about grunt...
A lot of people say the base cooper is lacking, but I'll repeat the same thing many people have said before... rev. it to 3-4000 rpm's, and drop the clutch! If that doesn't work for you, then get the Cooper S... That should eliminate any question you have about the power of the MINI!

Motor on

richardjenkins · May 2002

759397 - See this month's Car and Driver for short two page article on Mini Cooper S version...may have what you're looking for?

nyc - Yes, I am looking forward to driving the "S" on Saturday. I think I'll try and wind it out a bit.

*Sigh*

I guess I am just trying to transfer my current "real" S driving experience onto the new Mini, and I shouldn't do that. On my "S", driving on the interstate at 70 MPH you can just floor it and the car will overtake most anything around. This is very scary when things get past 85 or so; the fastest I've had it up to on a motorway has been about 90-95 (I could not see the speedo, things were vibrating too much:).

I seem to recall an old road test that said the original "S" was quicker from 40-70 than a 911 Carrerra...but I digress.

OK, what I meant about the grunt was that in order to overtake on the highway I had to pretty much row the gearbox down to 3rd then step smartly through the gears in order to keep the engine on the boil.

Now that I think about it, I don't recall seeing anyone put the engine on a dyno and generate a torque curve. I wonder if its as peaky as it seems...?

Long live Mr Bridger!

richard

rickrover · May 2002

This months European Car magazine has an electric blue S on the cover with a test. I'm looking forward tests comparing it with other hot hatches.

gotenks243 · May 2002

The last time I was at my local dealer (Columbus, OH) there were quite a few Minis in the back lot, including Coopers with xenons listed on the sticker and Cooper Ss with Sport Package (comes with Xenons). It wouldn't say on the sticker that they had Xenons if they didn't, so I'm confused why you all are getting info that the Xenons are delayed. Did they just run out at the factory or something?

Mike

tetonman · May 2002

Read in today's Chicago Tribune that Toyota has entered into a contract with BMW to provide a diesel engine for the MINI division. No further details were given... probably for the European market.

doctord · May 2002

Hey everyone-new to the discussion, altho I've been following it for sometime. I'm really excited about the new Mini and have plunked down my deposit for one in Atlanta-I'm stuck at about #90 on that list so who knows when my number will come up?!

I was real impressed with the car at my test drive-quality materials, good road manners (not darty like I expected) and alot of fun for the $. However...

Here is my question: Does anyone have any comlaints about the build and/or material quality? I went to the Atlanta auto show and the Cooper S that they had was absolutely falling apart. The leather on the drivers seat was wearing thin, the mesh sunroof shade had come completely of its track and didn't work and the black molding around the wheel wells was all scratched up!! Of course, the salewoman response was," well, there's been 600,000 butts in and out of this car." Well, my response is that the Mini was the only car I saw all day long with any wear and tear, and it wasn't the only show stopper there.

Any of you new owners lucky enough to be driving one have any gripes?? Thanx for any thoughts

hpulley4 · May 2002

Only quality issue I've found so far is it seems I've already scuffed up the driver's seat vinyl a bit from where I rub it every time while getting in with my leather jacket and/or belt and jeans -- I've been meaning to get some Armorall wipes or something to try and buff it up before I complain about it. Haven't heard anyone else mention this so maybe it was on the seat at first and I didn't notice. If I can't just clean it away then I'll mention it to my retailer.

There was a slight dash rattle for the first week and a half or so but it has gone away. It showed up again recently so I tried to show it to the dealer but it was silent while the tech. was driving it and hasn't shown up since.

Overall it seems to be well put together.

only1harry · May 2002

There was one auto-x racing with us last Saturday. Wasn't impressed at all with its handling and performance (it even looked slow accelerating). It understeered a lot. Its owner also has an S2000 he's been racing so it wasn't like it was his first time auto-xing. It was his 2nd or 3yr doing it. The factory tires seemed to be the #1 problem. They really have to be replaced. I was expecting to see the car 3-wheeling or something (like Sentra SE-Rs, VW Golfs/GTIs and other "similar" cars) but it didn't. Just kept pushing and going wide on the turns with lots of understeer. Was kind of disappointed but then again, auto-x racing is different than driving on the street. In auto-x you push the car's suspension and tire adhesion to its limits. The car may drive and handle beautifully on the street with some spirited driving. I liked it it, inside and out, but it was almost the slowest car around the course that day

and there were other cars there with less hp..
With a bigger rear sway bar this car should handle much better with more neutral characteristics and slight oversteer. I 'm sure it's fun to drive on the street as is though.
Watch out when aftermarket parts come out for it! It could become a handling demon..

hpulley4 · May 2002

Strange that your friend couldn't drive it that fast. Base MINI Coopers (non-S) took 1st and 2nd in their class (H stock) recently, results at http://www.scca.org/amateur/solo2/prosolo/2002/atwater/results.html. I've never auto-x'd or solo'd so I don't know anything about it, I just thought I'd post the results. BTW, base Cooper S comes with all-season runflat tires so they may well not be the best for the track. I don't know how the MINIs were prepped in Cali.

S2000 is RWD, right? Maybe your friend isn't used to FWD?

hpulley4 · May 2002

http://www.sedivsolo2.com/ft%20myers/green.pdf

H Stock again.

revka · May 2002

Edmunds' road test of the Mini Cooper is now available. Here's a direct link to 2002 Mini Cooper - Rating a 10 on the Smile-o-Meter, by Liz Kim. Let us know what you think.

Thanks for your comments!

Revka
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the_big_h · May 2002

it won the HS class on the May 5th event.

here's the result:
May 5th results

those things stick like it's on rails when they run through the cones.

maybe it's because oldharry's friend isn't used to autox in a FWD car? FWD and RWD cars are completely different beasts in terms of driving style

hpulley4 · May 2002

Too bad the test vehicle didn't have sport seats. I find they are preferable to the standard seats.

Also too bad they didn't have a broken-in engine. The engine revs much more freely once you start to break it in.

only1harry · May 2002

In H Stock the base Mini Cooper shood kick a*s! BTW, HS is the slowest class there is in autocross in case anyone didn't know. Its competition would be Ford Escort GTs, Sentras, base Civics and base Golfs. Undoubtedly the Mini should be very competitive in this auto-x class.
I think the S is in G stock (GS) and I can see it having a hard time in that class. We 'll see. I hope it's not in DS! It 'll get killed by Type-Rs, MR2s and Audi S4s! I 'll go look it up.
Anyone got any auto-x results to show us with an S model besides the base model in HS?
The auto-x I went to, was by a BMW club so they only had 5-6 classes which wasn't too fair. I hope that guy just couldn't drive, because I thought the S would hanlde better than what I observed. Those crappy stock tires gotta go for sure. I need them to be more competitive. Makes me faster when I 'm auto-xing

Sunday I 'm racing with my local SCCA club. We 'll see if any Minis show up..

tollag · May 2002

Basically I was wondering if and when Mini will be returning to the FIA WRC... I know it won't be this year, because it's nearly half over, but if anyone has any info on it, it would be much appreciated. Thanks

jr47 · May 2002

seminole_kev · May 2002

as a WRC fan, I'd love to see the MINI return to rallying. Especially love to see red, with white stripes, MINI's at the rally of Monte Carlo.

tollag · May 2002

There seems to also be the SCCA, but that is never broadcast... And yes, i too would love a Monte Carlo victory

someblondeguy · May 2002

2003 Mini production starts this September.

MINI Cooper

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