Mazda Protege5

barresa62 · June 2001

Okay, here goes some heresy from someone who lives, eats, breathes Subarus. If I was in the market for either the TS or P5, I would probably go w/the P5 unless I absolutely needed the AWD of the Subaru for all the reasons listed in post#548. Conversely, if I had between 18k to 21k to spend I would buy the OBS w/o a second thought(ok, maybe half of a thought) The OBS is well equipped and gives me the added versatility that I like. Fortunately, I own a WRX wagon so my decision was E.Z.!! :-)

Stephen

5635 · June 2001

Ive only seen the P5 once in person. I saw the front of it out of the corner of my eye while driving by a dealership. My question to you P5 owners, and others who have seen the P5 in person is:
When you look at the P5, what do you think of first? Hatchback or Wagon?

tocan · June 2001

I think it is a hatchback. To me, to be a wagon, there needs to be more overhang behind the rear wheels. It's not just a straight end, because I don't think that the back of the Taurus wagon is any more vertical than the P5. If it doesn't hang out a reasonable distance at the back it is a hatchback.

My personal opinion anyway.

Nomi

autio55 · June 2001

Mazdafun, thanks for the input on the speakers. I think the P5's sound quality is mediocre at best. That's the first (and probably only) upgrade after I get over the new car euphoria. As for cargo space, I'm a hatchback bigot. I was pleasantly surprised that golf clubs easily fit widthwise in back. Loads with no effort because of the hatch. Couldn't even do that in our old 900 Saab, but the Saab has it all over in total volume. Radio reception with the trolley car antenna has been excellent. Picked up Chicago stations over 100 miles out and in town reception is clear with little hash. It's also really flexible at a point near the base. You might be able to get away with flattening it with your load, but why risk it since it's easily detachable. Rear washer reservoir... Can't find it. Owners manual only refers to the one under the hood. A loooong tube to the back? Couldn't be. Another question for the dealer.

Onboost91, where'd you find the info about not going through an automatic car wash with the rack? I couldn't even find any references to the roof rack in the owners manual, which is probably why there's so much mystery over removing the cross-bars.

Mpgman, We've had our P5 for two weeks. Manual, sunroof/ABS. Put over 800 miles on it, mostly highway. For what it's worth, averaging over 30 mpg on the highway. Last tankfull was 27 mpg with a 70/30 highway/city split. However that's with no AC on (it's been unseasonably cool here). But on the other hand that's using summertime reformulated gas which I've observed has really made major drops in mileage before. I'm anticipating low 20's unfortunately during the dog days of summer in the city. Remember YMMV.

The only other disappointment aside from the stereo has been the noise at speed. There should be a 6th gear or higher overdrive 5th. At 65mph you're spinning 3200 rpm and it's buzzy, (and it get's more bee-like with each increase in mph.)

I too was looking at Subie TS and OBS. Equipment level wise, the OBS seemed to me to be the better comparison to the P5, but a slightly different animal due to the AWD and 'heavy duty' raised suspension. The Subie had better throttle response (torque), was quieter and felt more substantial (heavier), however I'm finding as the suspension is wearing in, the P5's becoming nicely compliant over the wonderful Chicago potholed roads. AWD was a big attraction, but when it came down to it, I needed a mpg commuter car and if it was fun to drive as a big plus. The P5 is definitely more fun in the handling department (although the Subie's AWD was near impossible to break loose). Quick steering, flat cornering. The OEM tires (Dunlop sp5000's) may be part of the equation. I'm really impressed with the wet and dry handling and they're supposed to be liveable in the white stuff. Add to the equation excellent interior details, fit and finish, looks, a dealer who started $500 under MSRP with no negotiation on my part and 1.9% financing closed the deal. To go back in time to an old Mazda slogan, it's a great little car. Zoom Zoom.

Oh, and if it matters, Vivid Yellow.

csuftitans · June 2001

Protege5 in other parts of the world is called a 323 Astina or 323 Lantis. Before this new model that look like a wagon, the previous model is definitely a hatchback. So since this is the newer version of the the Astina/Lantis, then to me it's still a hatchback.

Some pics of the older Protege5/Astina/Lantis, including the one I used to owned when I was in Sydney Australia, a 1989 Astina SP

http://photos.yahoo.com/indopirate

tocan · June 2001

Here is a links to a very positive review of the P5. It is from Autonet.ca

http://autonet.ca/AutonetStories/stories.cfm?storyID=2386

There is also a very positive review in the Wheels section of today's Toronto Star, but the URL is too long to post. Go to www.thestar.com, pick the Weekly Sections tab, select Wheels at the left, and the first article is about the P5.

I pick up my car in just over an hour!!

Nomi

rdr001 · June 2001

Tocan, I guess that you are located near Toronto. What kind of deal you have with your Mazda dealer? I am in the market for a new car and the PRO5 is at the top of my list.

Thanks in advice.

rdeschene · June 2001

Saw my first Protege 5 while in Montreal on Monday morning. Glossy yellow paint with chromed, 5-spokle wheels. A very handsome car indeed, but the amount of storage behind the rear seats seems a little limited to me. Definitely a hatchback rather than a wagon in this respect.

theritz2 · June 2001

Well, after using the instructions from previous chat about the rails I attempted to take them off. NOT as easy as it sounds! And, the little metal retainers under the plastic clamshells on each side will certainly break off from the plastic that holds them there after two or three times in/out of the rack line. After I asked about them, the local Mazda Service rep called me up and basically said he thought they were a poor design, being as breakable as they are. So, my rack is staying put for a l-o-n-g time...

tocan · June 2001

Yes, I am in Toronto. I bought my P5 at Gyro Mazda using the X-plan. Basically, I ended up with about $850 off MSRP. The deal is slightly better than the suggested APA deal (they have negotiated prices with certain dealerships; Gyro is one of them), but if you are a good negotiator you might get a better deal yourself. For details of the X-plan calculations see my posting 2298 in the Protege discussion on the sedan board. (Note that I was the first one to use X-plan there, so we didn't really know what we were doing.)

Gyro say they have been selling about 4 cars a week. I must say, in the short time since they first came in, I have seen lots of them come and go from their lot. They say demand is high, and getting anything other than a fully loaded car is difficult. (I did not want moonroof.)

Good luck in your search and negotiations.

Nomi

tocan · June 2001

I checked with my dealer when I took possession this morning. There isn't one. It uses the same reservoir as the front windshield washer fluid. Makes sense to me.

Nomi

himiler · June 2001

Definately a 5-door hatch.

Tocan: I also would prefer not to have the moonroof (or even the noisy roof rack, for that matter), but remember: no moonroof=no ABS or side Airbags. Sad, but true.

5635 · June 2001

were i can see a pic of the P5 with another car in the background. This is because my mazda dealer only got 8 P5 and by the time i went to the delearship they were out. For the past few weeks i have kept calling them and everyday its the same thing, "The P5? Sure we will be getting are second shipment anyday now. Due to this i have yet to see the P5 in person and in all the pics ive seen, there is nothing to compare the P5 to in terms of scale.

tocan · June 2001

True in the U.S. but not in Canada. Here ABS is standard (although we don't get side air bags) so I could get ABS without moonroof.

Nomi

tocan · June 2001

I took my bicycle out today in the new beastie. I have a touring bike with a long wheelbase, racks and fenders. I had no problem getting the bike in the hatch without removing the front wheel. I had to turn the front wheel, but I didn't feel that it intruded on the view. (Actually, the headrests intrude more on the view when the seats are up than the wheel does when the seats are down.) So I am fine as long as there is only me and my bike.

I could probably put a second bike in for a day trip, but there wouldn't be room for 2 bikes and luggage.

Since roof racks aren't standard here in Canada, I am trying to decide whether to go with a trailer hitch mount or a roof rack with accessories. I have a trailer hitch mount that I have used for years, but I don't know whether I can open the hatch if it is in place, since the hatch opens out, while the trunk of my Sentra of course didn't. Does anyone know how far out the hatch is at its farthest point?

I think that I would prefer to go with the trailer hitch mount (or maybe I will have to buy a new one that is hinged) because it lets me put the bike(s) on the car the night before I have to go somewhere and still put the car in the garage, something that I couldn't do with a roof rack.

Does anyone have any suggestions?

Nomi

P.S. It was a lot of fun to drive. This was the first time that I had it on the highway. Even though I was trying to vary my speed, I loved the way it handled.

deliveryguy · June 2001

To #476, protegextwo, the paramedics are on the way!!! HA, HA, HA

To #474, rsparrow, right on, mustang v6 vs P5...apples to oranges!!!! If you want to talk about Mustangs go to the Coupe board!!!!

To #472, atatu, Amen, P5 is Mazda/Japan!!! Had an 83 Mercury Lynx station wagon with the famous timing belt failure at 47,000 miles, as well as the ignition module failure before that!!! End of Fords for me!!!! From the problems with the Focus it does not seem like much has changed at Ford in 20 years to change my mind.........

Have been looking at the P5 of late, local dealer had 7, black and silver, but all automatics. Looking to replace an 87 323 "station wagon" (300,000 miles!) that I finally wrecked about 6 months ago. Thanks all for the info, glad to hear some are getting good deals under MSRP...

onboost91 · June 2001

>Onboost91, where'd you find the info about not >going through an automatic car wash with the >rack? I couldn't even find any references to the >roof rack in the owners manual, which is >probably why there's so much mystery over >removing the cross-bars.

I believe the roof-rack warning I mentioned was on the rack instruction sheet which came with my car (I found it in the glove compart). It sounds like not everyone received this additional documentation. It has diagrams which show how to install and remove the rack.
-Mark
p.s. did mazda come out with a P5 accessory book yet?

onboost91 · June 2001

I also took advantage of the no haggle S-plan pricing when I purchased my P5 and they cut about US$1300 off the MSRP on my car (auto & sunroof). The sales manager was not happy, especially since mine was the first one they sold.
BTW, last week I got a message from someone in Washington D.C. and the dealer they called was trying to charge $2k OVER MSRP. Ridiculous!
-Mark
p.s. I believe X-plan is for Fords and S-plan is for Mazda's.

majorthomecho · June 2001

I saw a P5 at our local Mazda/Hyundai/VW mega dealer.

It was the same yellow color as in the photo posted at the start of this discussion.

My first thought when I saw it? Wagon.

rdr001 · June 2001

Tocan, how does one join the X-plan? Did you manage to order your PRO5 without moonroof?

Thanks.

bonefish2 · June 2001

I am extremely interested in buying a P5 but require some time to save for a down payment. At the dealership a salesman told me that the P5 will be produced in limited numbers and that I might not want to wait to purchase. Is this true and, if it is, how long will it be before this years' production run is exhausted?

hkchan · June 2001

1. The Protege5 is a 2002 model.
2. It's not produced in limited numbers (The MP3 is). In fact, selection and price should be better if you wait awhile.
3. "Every" salesperson wants you to buy now. You may change your mind three months from now (by running into an even pushier salesperson for example).

Sporin · June 2001

My info supports hkchan's as well.

I am waiting until Dec. or Jan. to get mine. I figure that by then, there will be plenty of stock and since those are two of the slowest months of the year, I will most likely get my best deal and trade-in amount.

There is also the rumor of Mazda bringing the 170hp-Turbo motor over that is available on this car in other markets. Hopefully, by Dec. or Jan., these rumors will be clearer as well.

aardvark_mark · June 2001

mazda expects to sell 12,000 Pro-5's this year, and 17,000 annually after that..

source: http://www.alaskanautos.com/mazdaprotege5.html

l8r

vjoe_udo · June 2001

I went to see the rose parade last Sat. and Pontiac is the official car. They had one Pontiac vibe in the parade, it's pretty ugly (to me.) The roof slopes too much from front to back. It looks bigger in real life.

On another note, I'm saving up for a down payment and starting to look at used cars as well as the P5. My wife likes the BMW Z3 ('97, 4 banger), which can be had for about the same price as a new P5. True it wouldn't be able to carry as much stuff, but we already have a van.....

tocan · June 2001

The X-plan (sort of like the S-plan in the States) is a partnership recognition program for Ford and Ford affiliated cars. If you already work for a Ford supplier, you should already have access. If not, it is a membership benefit of the EAA. Go to http://www.eaa.org/communications/eaanews/ford_partner.html for information on the plan. Basically, you join over the web (US$40), and within a few days (next day for me) they will send you an email with your membership number and information on logging on to the members only section of the site. Once you have this information, you can request a PIN to be used for a purchase. Just follow all the instructions on the site, and make sure that you select the correct country and company. Take the PIN with you when you shop, and a copy of the email giving your membership number (or wait until you get the membership card in the mail) and the pricing is as follows:

You pay dealer's net invoice price plus 4%, no more than $300 for PDI (since freight is already included in the net invoice price), $25 for admin fee, and a full tank of gas is included. For dealer installed accessories, you pay 85% of the MSRP, plus the dealer's installation charge. Of course, you pay for all taxes and licence fees.

The dealer has to be willing to accept X-plan pricing. Call around first and make sure, before you join the EAA (unless you are also interested in recreational aviation). Mazda Canada thinks that most dealers will accept it. The first dealer I called said sure, so I don't have information on any of the others.

I think that I mentioned in another post that the price was slightly better than the APA arranged pricing.

Yes, I did manage to order (and get) a P5 without a moonroof. I bought on Saturday of the Victoria Day weekend, and when I called Mazda Canada on the following Wednesday to check on the X-plan pricing (since this was the first one the dealer had done and we didn't have an actual invoice to work from) I was told that there were 3 cars with the right colour and options in Vancouver. When I talked to the salesman on the Thursday, one of those had already been assigned to me. From the date they sent in the request it was 2 weeks until it arrived at the dealer's. But remember, the car was already in Vancouver. (Any dealer should be able to check on availability of any particular vehicle.)

One further note, if you are interested in red make sure that they don't try charging you for the metallic paint. The red is the only colour that doesn't cost extra here in Canada.

Hope this helps.

Nomi

ajacat · June 2001

Sporin, do you have a link where you found that rumor? Or did you hear it at a dealership? Or does anyone else know anything about this? I'd be willing to pay more if they could bring the Japanese model over. My husband would flip to own a Mazda hatch/liftback (whichever it was called) again (had a beloved 323 he sold when leaving LA back in '95).

I just want more power than the current version here seems to have.

Thanks,
ajacat

rdr001 · June 2001

Thanks for the info. Wish you all the best with your PRO5.

5635 · June 2001

I was on my way home from work with my friend in his car and we happened to pass a mazda dealer. I asked him to pull over and i went and checked a P5. The dealer saw me and offered me a test drive, then a couple hours later i drove it home.

To answer my own question, the car is definatly a hatchback, not a wagon.

Sporin · June 2001

I heard it here (Town Hall) not sure where it came from originally though.

newcar31 · June 2001

I read it in the magazine "SportCompactCar" One of the writers for that magazine did an article about the MP3. The author mentioned that someone inside Mazda said that next year there will be more power, and it will come from something that "whistles". Well, as you know, Mazda already has a more powerful version of the Protoge in Japan, and the whistling comes from it's turbo.

chiangj · June 2001

Does anyone know the current invoice price for the Protege5 in Toronto, Canada? Yesterday, I went to the dealer and he said this car come out in half a month and they sold them all in total MSRP.

tocan · June 2001

Joseph

From the APA here are the invoice prices.

Base Manual $18,477
Base Automatic $19,406
Options:
Sunroof $557
Air conditioning $929
Metallic Paint (all colours but red) $85

I got about $850 off MSRP using X-plan. See my note(s) to rdr001 over the last few days.

Nomi

tocan · June 2001

Here is another great review of the P5. It comes from the Toronto Sun's Driver Source section

http://autonet.ca/DriverSource/Stories.cfm?StoryID=2392

He describes the P5 as the "must-have" car of the year.

Nomi

razhael · June 2001

well, this is my first post here, and im one young mazda miata owner that finally wants to change to something bigger, but still sporty, so, in the last few weeks i have been going to some mazda dealers and fell in love with the p5.

But as some of the people here have expressed, theres some lack of power for some tastes, who wouldnt like to add that extra power that the mp3 will deliver and still have the room the p5 offers? so i was checking out the racing beat website, and found that they are taking under consideration making protege performance parts, so it would be worth a try to send them some e-mail so that they can see that theres demand (they doubt about that)

the url is: http://www.racingbeat.com/FRprotege.htm

they comment it at the bottom of the page

ajacat · June 2001

thanks y'all--I too found some vague refs to 'rumor' on other sites (review on kbb, somewhere else too). Hope they materialize soon, although you know what they say about a watched pot--it never whistles

Will be checking w/Mazda dealerships nonetheless, and sending an e-mail begging for more power for this little hatchback...

ajacat

iamz · June 2001

I like your story. Sometimes an impulse decision is the right decision. You made an excellent choice.

What options/color?

-Terry

5635 · June 2001

Everything but a auto box. And its yellow.

chiangj · June 2001

Nomi,

According to your information, the MSRP will be around $20977. The dealer quote me at $22495. If I do not use X-plan, that means the most the dealer should charge is $21827 which is still $668 less than what North Toronto Mazda quote me.

Joseph

tocan · June 2001

MSRP is $19,895 for the base manual
Automatic is $1,000
Air conditioning is $1,000
Moonroof is $600
All colours but red are $105 extra

Without X-plan, this means that the MSRP for a fully loaded automatic (as most of them are) other than red is $22,600. The MSRP for a fully loaded manual other than red is $21,600. Then they tack on freight and PDI ($820) and there is a $100 air conditioning tax, and a $75 fuel tax. There is also an administration fee that might be as much as $149 (or more; that was Gyro's figure) and they also charge for a tank of gas. If the figure they quoted was total before tax and licenses it might be a good price.

Nomi

chiangj · June 2001

Nomi,

You are right that the figure they quoted is before freight and PI, air conditioning tax, fuel tax and also the administration fee. They all added up to around $1200. That means I am looking at around a little bit more than 27k for total.

Thanks so much for the info. Wish you all the best with your Protege5.

Joseph

zhenya · June 2001

Everyone here on Edmunds mentions numbers voer or under invoice / M.S.R.P. or some sort of plan, BUT NO ONE Actually posted either invoice or whathave you. I really would like to know price for P5 whether its invoice or M.S.R.P. or just a good deal.

Please share any knowledge regardless this information.

tocan · June 2001

Both MSRP and invoice prices are available here on the Edmunds web site. Go to NEW on the top menu, select Mazda and go from there. You can also get to the information by clicking on the topic on the left side of this screen.

MSRP and other information are also available on Mazda's web site www.mazdausa.com

Nomi

tocan · June 2001

Have a look at the First Drive article here on Edmunds. It is listed on the left pane of the Protege Owner's group, but I'm sure that you can get to it in other ways.

Nomi

pocahontas · June 2001

Tocan is correct. You'll find invoice and other information for the 2002 Mazda Protege5 in Edmunds.com's New Vehicles guide. You'll also find a direct link to this information in the Additional Resources box on the left side of this page. Hope this is helpful.

Happy Motoring. ;-)

Pocahontas
Host
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byronski · June 2001

Hello all. I bought my black P5 three weeks ago and I am so pleased. I traded in my grand Cherokee gas hog and this is my first Japanese car. I know a lot of people are concerned about power so here is my 2 cents. I have driven V8 cars since 1993 so I am definitely a power lover. But, now that I am settled in to my P5 its power suites me great. Acceleration is peppy and passing power is there if you need it. But best of all I grin every time I go to the pump.
I was just wondering if anyone else was getting a bad whistling sound at speeds of 70 mph or greater with the roof rack attached. I had to remove mine because it drove me crazy. Can this bee fixed? I went to my dealer and they said that all roof racks create turbulence and the only way to get rid of the sound was to take it off. Its a small town dealership so I don't know if they are reliable.

byronski · June 2001

Any bike riders in the group? I have never had a roof mounted bike rack before. What is the best way to get 2 bikes on a roof. Can I use the factory rack or should I go with a Yakima/Thule system? Do after market components attach to factory racks or do you have to get the whole system from Yakima. I know this post should probably should go to the after market posts, but I think this car will be very popular to bicyclist everywhere because it will look sharp with a rack on top.

tocan · June 2001

We have a shop called Rack Attack here in Toronto, that happens to be right across the street from the dealer where I bought my P5. I asked them and they said that they can usually add attachments to existing racks, although I didn't have an example to show them at the time. You shouldn't need to get a full after market system. However, the roof rack isn't standard here in Canada, so I'm trying to decide whether to go roof rack or hitch mount rack.

By the way, if you read my post from earlier in the week, I had no problems getting a large touring bike in the hatch without taking the front wheel off. 2 bikes should fit if you take the front wheels off, but there isn't room for luggage too. It depends what you want.

Nomi

mazdafun · June 2001

The factor rack takes the place of what aftermarket mfrs. call "towers" and "load bars."

The actual mechanisms (mounts) that hold bicycles (and other gear) clip onto or slide into their load bars. However, most (Yakima, Thule, Saris, Mondial etc.) make clamps that fasten onto factory roof rack cross bars (the ones that go from side to side). The clamps allow you to fasten the bike-holder to your factory rack.

I use the Mondial system. It goes between my 323 and my Protege sedan. Both Bike Nashbar and Performance sell it (Performance under its own Xsport brand), for those who shop catalogues (I would've bought at a retail store, but they stock only Saris, Thule and Yakima). I like it for its lower cost, more integrated look (load bars are integrated with the towers so the ends don't stick out beyond the towers) and integrated locks in their towers. Construction consists of aluminum, acetal (Delrin) and stainless steel for the rack. Some galvanized or painted steel is used in their bike mounts though. The only drawback to the Mondial system is that the integrated tower/load bars are fixed in width. That means you can't take them off your Pro and move them to a vehicle whose roof width is different by more than a few inches.

byronski · June 2001

Putting my bike in my P5 is out of the question. I have an XL frame plus I don't want rubber tires and mud gumming up my new interior. I think I am going to go with a full Yakima rack system since my factory rack whistles so bad at 70 mph. I like the racks where you clamp the fork into a mount for that aerodynamic look. Only problem is that the P5 is so new that Yakima does not have a rack precisely fit to my car.

Mazda Protege5

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