Mazda Protege5

mazdafun · April 2003

Must be a long trip, or you just luv your P5 a lot.

hurler4 · April 2003

I noticed in the Sunday paper that at least one dealer is selling all P5s with no options for $4050 off. This translates to about $13,000 for a P5! And the salesman said he can come close to that discount with loaded models. How can they do this? That is way below invoice.
I test drove a Vibe on Saturday and loved it; it felt more solid than the P5, was more quiet, had more room, and just "felt" safer. But for the options I want, the Vibe is about $17,000 after discounts. The P5 with the same options, more or less, is about $14,000. Is the Vibe really worth $3000 more? Any input would be helpful, as I've narrowed it down to these two (I went to test drive a brand new 2003 Focus Wagon this weekend, but the car wouldn't start! Ford quality...)

jas9297 · April 2003

See my post in the Vibes section.

$4k Off?! -- you're making me feel jealous. That's a great price. I bought the P5 over the Vibe to save less than $2000 and also because I fell in love with the handling. The P5 is very solid, especially new ones (I got a 2002.5 which seemed to have the kinks worked out). It handles incredibly well, with good visibility and great looks. The Vibe is also very solid and slight more useful. It rides a lot higher -- kind of like a mini-SUV, and if that is important to you, get the Vibe. I think the Vibe would be more useful if you have kids, or don't like sitting a bit lower in the car. The Vibe roof rack is pretty useless, though.

For $15k, I'd probably get a Vibe. But for $14K, if Vibes are more than $16k, the Vibe is not that much better. Vibe option packages are a bit different. The P5 comes pretty loaded, and I got a sunroof, ABS, and side bags. Those options are pretty cheap on the p5 -- but on the vibe you have to pay for the power package, alloy wheels, and other standard things on the p5. Gas mileage will be slightly better in the Vibe, especially for automatics. I wouldn't have bought a p5 automatic anyway. I usually get 28-29mpg mixed in my 5 spd - with 34mpg max and 25mpg worst.

eleets00 · April 2003

Hello everyone. I'm supposed to pick up my 03 Sunlight Silver P5 Autostick on Wednesday, buuuuut. I talked to the Internet Sales Mgr last night & he said the dealership they were getting it transferred from is making a deal on it. Problem is I signed the paper work already. I'm thinking why is my dealership letting another dealership sell my car? Can they do this? That was problem #1.
Now, I'm 2nd guessing the autostick. I don't know how to drive a 5spd, but I think I want one. The clutch seemed to be in a uncomfortable position for me. Felt like the clutch was right under the steering wheel. I test drove the Autostick & was pleased. Especially since this is a step down hp wise from my 02 V6 Accord that was totalled in a head on collision on 4/7/03. Any advice on my 5spd vs. autostick dilemma? Also, I have a at times achy left knee, so I considering that also. Sorry for the novel, just a little anxious & don't want to regret my decision. Any advice given will be greatly appreciated.
Chuck

boggse · April 2003

Problem #1: If you have signed the paperwork, then they owe you a vehicle with the VIN number that appears on the paperwork. The problem is, the deals made between dealers are often verbal, so there is no way to enforce them. I would tell your dealer they owe you a car identical to the one you originally agreed to buy in a short time frame or you are taking your business elsewhere.

Problem #2: This is a tricky one. The 5-speed will definitely get you more performance and less maintenance for your money. The downside is learning to drive one. I think pretty much anyone with a glimmer of coordination can handle it. Learning on a P5 should be relatively easy. I learned on a 1987 Suzuki Samarai which had a tendency for the clutch pedal effort to sharply increase at the friction point. The questions I would ask myself are, do I routinely get stuck in heavy traffic jams (i.e. do you live in Atlanta?), and how much is a little extra performance worth to me? My wife decided after I taught her to drive the standard shift, that she really could do without the extra performance for the convenience of the auto, so we had to get rid of our 2001 Protege ES 5-speed and get a 2003 Protege5 Auto. Also, sit in other vehicles with clutches and compare to the P5. I think the Protege & 5 have a very nice seating position and pedal placement, but that can vary a lot depending on your proportions.

hurler4 · April 2003

I appreciate all the info on the P5 and the Vibe. It looks like these are the prices I can get for the following cars with stick, sunroof, alloys, and power locks/windows:

P5: $14,000-14,500
Vibe: $16,000-16,500
Matrix: $17,000

I've test driven them all now, and like them all, but for different reasons. I'd say the ONLY sticking point right now is, the P5 has less cargo space than the other two. But is it worth the $2,000-3,000 extra? Maybe not. But I still have that goal of sleeping by the beach on a few warm summer nights in the cargo area! :-D

eleets00 · April 2003

For the advice. I do happen to live in the Atlanta area, but my hours for work are Noon to 8pm, so I miss the rush traffic most of the time. If this was a second car I don't think I would hesitate in my decision. My best friend basically said "Get the car, then you're forced to learn & should get it within a week". I don't know. I'm off Wednesday so I'll sit in some more.
They said they'll put me in a car until they find one with everything I want: Sunlight Silver, ABS, sunroof & deflector, 6Disc in dash, Auto, & no roof rack. This is good, because State Farm is only giving me the rental until Wednesday. I'm thinking of taking a 5spd if they drop the price some more, but again I don't know. Decisions, decisions.

eleets00 · April 2003

Is the stock head unit really that weak? (10watts RMS) I was looking at some MB Quart speakers to put in the P5, but now I don't know. Any suggestions?

Chuck

boggse · April 2003

My understanding is that the stock head unit is 60W RMS, 100W peak. With the old, 4 speaker setup this got you 15Wx4 channels. With the new 6 speaker setup, this gets you 10Wx6 channels. Not exactly spectacular. I find that just replacing the speakers seems to help a great deal with volume and clarity. I got Kenwood KFC-1668S for the rears from Crutchfield and Kenwood eXcelon KFC-X688C for the fronts from mazdastuff.com. I decided replacing the door mounted tweeters was probably pointless. Be careful with what you put in the rear doors, the fit is tight back there, so not a lot of speakers will fit.

The next step up from that would be adding an amp with speaker level inputs or replacing the head unit with an aftermarket one. If you replace the head unit, I suggest getting the filler panel with the cubby hole from a used parts store or a junk yard since Mazda sells that piece of plastic for about $90.

jas9297 · April 2003

Hey eleets00, can you tell me what the asking price is for the Protege5? Prices now should be below invoice, so you should be able to get a good deal.

Hurler, on the Vibe's utility: yeah, the Vibe is more versatile and has more cargo room. If you plan to keep it for a while and may need the cargo room down the road, or carry bikes, kayaks, etc., the vibe is better. For my many bikes, I'll use a roof rack and maybe hitch rack. But keep in mind you can remove the rear seat bottoms entirely in the P5 and create a little more room that way. If you get the vibe, you'll need the carpet as things will slide easily on the hard plastic. I want both cars!

fandsw · April 2003

boggse and eleets00: Speaking from experience, take Crutchfield's recommendations with a LARGE grain of salt in terms of receiver and rear door fit. I installed without mods an Alpine 7894 that they swore would not fit, and as for the rear doors there is at least 1.5" more room in terms of depth than they say. This has been discussed on other Protege forum websites in detail

boggse · April 2003

The rear door still seems a little tight to me, but I was fine with buying the Kenwoods since that is what I would have wanted anyway.

schmadam · April 2003

I'm thinking about picking up a new P5 tomorrow. From what I've read here, it seems that they're going at an incredible value. The dealer I'm looking at has two stick shifts (which is a must for me) in stock; one midnight blue with CD/Moonroof, ABS, and leather (sticker $19K); and one red with ABS and leather (sticker $18.3K). I'd really like the blue one with the CD changer, but I'd also like to be able to finance it at the current 3.9% for 60 deal. It looks like people have been getting about 2,000 off sticker lately. What should I say/not say tomorrow to make sure I get the right price, and how much should I expect to pay after all the haggling is over?

isseyvoo · April 2003

Well, it had to happen sooner or later. Discovered some inconsiderate a** apparently flung their door open in a parking lot next to me. Left the first ding in right rear door of our '03 Pro5 purchased in January. Whoever it was was lucky I wasn't around to see it!

jas9297 · April 2003

Tell them you won't buy a car unless it is under invoice, and unless they can give you all or part of the $4000 off MSRP being offered by many dealers, that you read about on Edmunds.com.

Tell them you did the research, and you know what these cars are going for. You are willing to buy today if they can match the deals of other dealers. If you can get somewhere halfway between $2000 off and $4000 off, you are doing very well. Shoot for $3000 off by starting the negotiating at $4000 of MSRP! Let us know how you do.

eleets00 · April 2003

I'm getting my P5 for $200 above invoice. I've already signed paper work, but luckily they don't have my down payment money. So how should I go about this now? If they can give me the car for less, then I want to do just that. Any advice from where to go since paper work has been signed, but no money has been exchanged will be greatly appreciated.

Chuck

jas9297 · April 2003

I thought they couldn't deliver on the vehicle? If so, you simply say deal's off. Then try to call a few other dealers to see if they can beat the price of the first dealer and even the prices you've seen here.

Even if not, since you haven't paid any money, I would not have a problem saying the deal's off anyway. What can they do? They can't force you to take the car and can't claim much injury since they'll sell it to someone else. And they probably won't bother suing you -- the damages, a few hundred $ if that for a lost sale, is not worth the court fees. What does the paperwork say? Although I'm a lawyer, and am NOT giving legal advice!!, I still don't know how much of a recourse they have against you. And besides, you can always claim the salesman talked you into the contract when you weren't ready -- name me a salesman who hasn't done that. My guy, for example, talked me into getting it a little sooner than I wanted to, but I talked myself into it as well.

If you still want the car, tell them straight up that you don't believe they've given you all the discounts you are entitled to or that other dealers are offering. Tell them you'd like to continue doing business with them now and in the future, but only if they are willing to be as good as other dealers. If they won't, then you unfortunately have to go somewhere else.

Do your homework and find out what prices are. This board and other protege discussion groups on the internet will be the best barometer. Try the regular protege topics for "Mazda Protege Owners: What did you pay?". I did a search for "mazda Protege discussion groups" or "mazda protege forums" on Google and found a few.

jas9297 · April 2003

BTW, I don't think you're getting screwed. The price is not all that bad. The only thing is the market is really good right now to get a new car (or used car for that matter). Most non-cult, non-trendy, and non-Hondas should be around invoice price right now.

eleets00 · April 2003

Hey everyone. I got my Protege5. I got Laser Blue Mica,instead of Sunlight Silver. I'm happy. Drives like it's on rails. Zoom, Zoom, Zoom... Going for ride!!! Be back soon!!! I think...

Thanks for advice & help...
Chuck...

meinrad · April 2003

Have fun.

revka · April 2003

We look forward to hearing all about your Protege5 experience.... ;-)

Revka
Host
Hatchbacks & Wagons Boards

mazdafun · April 2003

and condolences to isseyvoo. I symphasize, although at least my Pro is a '99 (got the ding about a month ago).

Anyhoo, the P5 is such a blast to drive. My wife is nice enough to let me have a turn at the wheel every now and then, and I'm always impressed by how much better it handles than my '99 Pro.

saku · April 2003

Hello all;

I am about to buy a 2003 MP5 next week and came across this discussion group while conducting research. I was wondering if anyone knows what the current rate off invoice one can expect in Vancouver, BC these days or can lead me to Canadian site that will.

Thanks and I look forward to joining the club!

stropro5 · April 2003

Has anyone purchased and used the MAZDA Bike Attachment and Brackets (PNs 0000-8L-G01 and 0000-8L-J01) on their Protege5 Factory Roof Rack?

Does the system work well? Do you recommend it? Thanks.

Protege5 Driver and Lover - 1 year, 3 months and counting

pciskowski · April 2003

The car drives like new! That was definitely the problem. I'm starting to remember why I like this car so much.

How many miles have the tires lasted on average? I have about 26,000 on them. The dealer said they should last about 30,000. The tread still looks good, and they are still pretty quiet and relatively smooth riding. In fact, they seem smoother now (although this could be due to my new infatuation with the car now that the clutch is fixed). I have rotated them every 5K.

jas9297 · April 2003

Can you tell me very briefly what you had done? I did a search and couldn't figure out what repair you had and what you told the dealer regarding the TSB. Can you also very briefly describe the problem you had again?

thanks and I'm glad its back to new.

P.S. Has anybody with a 2002.5 or newer experienced cluch chatter? What do I listen for?

pciskowski · April 2003

Here is a website for the TSB.

http://web2.airmail.net/emann/protegefaq/tsb/

It is MT000003848 - CLUTCH CHATTER DURING COLD TAKEOFF

Basically, when trying to shift into 1st the car would start shaking like it was in a bind. It was also grabbing when letting out the clutch in other gears. I had to take someone out in my car and drive around until it did it. I had it in three times before, and they couldn't duplicate the problem.

boggse · April 2003

The Dunlop SP Sport 5000m tires (identical tire & size as P5) on my 2001 ES lasted about 18,000 miles. I think this is pretty much the worst I have heard of. I can only imagine how few miles I would have gotten out of them had I autocrossed.

bballa · April 2003

Just got off the phone with a Mazda dealer who quoted me a price of $13,500 plus tax and license on a new P5 w/ no options. The dealer is not the closest ,80 miles away as opposed to 8 miles to the nearest dealer. It seems like a good deal and worth the drive. Any thoughts?

subyaudidude · April 2003

Find out if the dealer that is closer to you will match that. If so, you've just saved yourself 72 miles (144 round trip). If not, you've wasted what - thirty minutes?

bluong1 · April 2003

Mine worn out quite unevenly around 25k miles creating noises and vibrations on the steering wheel, even after balancing. I put the Michelin Pilot Exalto 205/45R16, which is much more quieter without compromising the handling. Having them for months, I'm very impressed. Minor and unimportant detail: I prefer the look of the Dunlops because the diameter is larger and fill out better the holes. Oh well...

Bruno

bballa · April 2003

I would like to be able to get the same deal at the Mazda dealer nearest to me. In searching the on-line inventory they don't have a white or silver man. trans. P5 with no options. Sticker is $17,155. The dealer that gave me the quote has two white one silver. I've been leaning towards white. $13,500 seems very tempting, about $14,700 OTD. I'm in no big hurry but I think the $1750 cash back ends at the end of the month.

mazdafun · April 2003

I did the first oil change on my wife's P5, so got to gander at the underside of the front suspension.

Geez, those are beefy support plates on the lower arms. No wonder the P5 is so flat through lateral transitions.

On the down side, those plates really obstruct access to the oil filter. I couldn't get enough leverage to loosen it (they seem to put them on very tightly at the factory; the first oil change I did on my Protege was also difficult), so I just added fresh oil for now. I'll let the dealer "deal" with the overtightened filter.

meinrad · April 2003

Finally have gotten fed up with the clutch chatter or whatever. It had been a once in a while type thing, but now it's anytime the car sits for a while. Overnight is the worst, especially if it's a cool, moist morning as these spring days usually are. I had been pretty much able to ignore it but it has really gotten worse.

pciskowski noted it took him 3 times to get his dealer to fix it, but I don't really have that kind of time as the dealer is a 1.5 hour drive away. I suppose I could use someone closer, but these guys have been great so far so I'd like to take there to fix it. But I need to be sure they will do it and have parts becuase this needs to be a one day thing.

I'm calling this morning, with TSB in hand, just in case.

Sporin · April 2003

I've got 34k miles on my car, with about 10k of that on snow tires.

3 of my 4 tires have no tread left on the center band. They are also noticeably louder then in the past. I will replace them next spring, probably with 255/45-16 Kumho ECSTA Supra 712's.

Anyone fit this size yet? A bit wider... same rim.

meinrad · April 2003

Called the dealer, spoke to 2 different people. The first girl was just taking appointments then I spoke to Frank, not sure who he was. Frank said if they can't duplicate it they can't fix it. I explained to him that after driving to the dealership it's not going to happen. He didn't know of the TSB, so I gave him the TSB number and he is supposed to get back to me.

I think he wanted to call Mazda or something. He's concerned if they do the repair and send the parts to Mazda that they might not cover it if they haven't duplicated the problem.

So we'll see. I told him I understood, but would have to switch dealers due to drive time if he wouldn't just agree to order the parts and fix it.

So we'll see what I hear.

meinrad · April 2003

Well, Frank called back, and he states that they must verify the problem. So that means leaving the car overnight and hoping it is affected the next morning. I'm sure it will be, but without me there to drive it with them, then who knows what they'll say.

I guess I'm just going to use closer dealership. It's only 30 minutes away. Still a pain in the rear. I understand why they would do it that way, just doesn't make it any easier to get it fixed.

Off to call dealer #2.

protege_fan · April 2003

Good luck w/ the clutch chatter. My Pro does it occasionally, but not frequently enough that they'd be able to duplicate it.

bluong1 · April 2003

are you sure about 255/45R16? My four new tires are Michelin Pilot Exalto 205/45R16, no problem what so ever.

Bruno

Sporin · April 2003

DOH! Sorry, typo,

I meant 225/45-16 which, according to www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html is only 1.2% off from the current 195/50-16 Dunlops.

meinrad · April 2003

The 29th I take it in. Mazda has authorized me a rental car so that I can leave the car overnight. Then I'm meeting the service guy at 6:45 AM, before they open, so we can go for a drive.

The service advisor asked if I was sure he would be able to detect it. I think so, as it has become more regular, but how can I be sure. So we'll be driving together and see what happens.

I wish I was close to a dealer that had already seen the problem. I would think they would be more capable of easily feeling the problem and agreeing to fix the car.

Hopefully it will be as bad as Saturday morning. I'm not really in the mood for a long process.

Funny thing about this is that my wife drove the car for most of it's initial life and when I asked if she ever noticed it she said yes, but that she thought it was just her driving and never bothered to tell me.

iamz · April 2003

I ran the numbers and it looks like the overall diameter would be about 1/4" wider than the stock Dunlops. Not bad. Are you sure 225's can be safely mounted to our stock rims?

reitrof · April 2003

How many miles do you have on your car? I'm thinking of taking mine in for the same thing.

Thanks.

meinrad · April 2003

Sporin · April 2003

iamz,

I can't see as how a 1/4" will hurt anything. I'm sure i read of people doing this on "another" forum, but thier search is down right now.

I'll post more when I find out.

Sporin · April 2003

OK. From my quick digging around, it seems the current fave upgrade is to go to a 205/50-16 on the stock rim. A tad wider, but not so much as to rub anything, and 1.33% more circumference. Small enough as to be unnoticeable, but visually, a bit more to fill the wheel well. Sounds perfect.

Lot's of choices in that size btw. $75 a piece for the Kumhos I like in that size.

bluong1 · April 2003

Yeah, it seems to me 205/50R16 would be a better choice: less roll, air resistances and rotational momentum.

pciskowski · April 2003

Would a 205 ride any smoother since it would have taller sidewall too? Also, would a 55 or 60 fit, or would that screw up the ride too much?

pciskowski · April 2003

Good luck on your clutch! Mine took about 30 minutes driving with the service advisor before it did it.

It drives like a dream now. Maybe after we all get them fixed they will do a recall.

iamz · April 2003

A 205/50 would be a little smoother. you wouldn't want to go to much larger on the side profile because your speedometer becomes less accurate.

tire,speedometer,actual speed
205/45,60,59
205/50,60,61
205/55,60,63
205/60,60,65

Mazda Protege5

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