Mazda Protege5

jabba1900 · December 2005

Hi! I was on here briefly a couple of years ago, but I have since lurked around in silence enjoying the lively discussions and excellent advice!

Now, I was hoping that someone could help me out with a couple of things.

My '02 P5 is currently at 90,000 km. I've had no major problems (except for the infamous sliding pin on the rear brakes getting stuck...), and I soon plan to provide everyone with a longer report on my experience so far. I have recently ordered the Kumho Ecsta ASX (not available until mid December here in Toronto), and before they get installed I want to do a front suspension alignment. In addition I want to flush the automatic transmission.

First of all, has anyone else done an auto trans flush? Is there a filter that also needs to be replaced when this is done? Is this a costly procedure?

Secondly, I'm planning to get the alignment and flush done at a local Canadian Tire, since my mechanic doesn't have the necessary equipment. Is this something I should trust a 'generic' store like Canadian Tire to do properly? For anyone living in Toronto, do you have any other suggestions for where to get this done?

Thanks a lot!

Btw, I am still driving on my stock Dunlops that have been on the car since new. Yes, 90,000 km! Tells you a lot about my driving style, but it also tells you that these tires are a little beyond their best before date, and I can't wait for those Kumhos to arrive!

ripcord · December 2005

According to http://protege5.ugly.net/05-17.PDF there is not a filter in the transmission of the 02 protege5. I just completely flushed mine at home and refilled the transmission with synthetic Mobil 1 ATF. It works great and shifts much nicer.

Secondly, in my small town, I am not a big fan of the local Canadian Tire, therefore, I would not take my vehicle there for anything but a new set of tires and even then, I am leary.

Flushing the tranny in these vehicles is easy and doesn't take much time (one hour tops at home), therefore, it should not be too costly. As for the Kumho's, I have the same tires on my car and they are very nice. Good ride, good cornering, and not too bad in the snow. Drive Safe!

iamz · December 2005

Never, never, never do an alignment unless or until your tires show your vehicle to be out of alignment. Alignments are not preventative maintenance. If you got 90,000 kilometers out of your stock Dunlops, your alignment is fine. Chances are very good they will screw up your alignment and make it worse.

jabba1900 · December 2005

Thanks for the info. I would love to flush the tranny myself, but I think they frown upon that kind of thing being done in the underground garage of the high rise where I live...! That's (one of) the drawbacks of living in Toronto.

I did a LOT of research before I decided on the Kumhos. What won me over in the end was basically the price. From what I've heard they perform just as well or even better than Toyo and Pirelli (both of which I considered), but they are much cheaper. Can't wait! Hopefully they arrive before Christmas otherwise I'll have to rent a car for our drive to Ottawa. My current tires just aren't safe for a long drive like that.

jabba1900 · December 2005

Thanks! That's an excellent point. When I get my new tires installed I will ask them to inspect the old ones carefully for any sign of misalignemnt. The shop doesn't do alignments, so I think I can trust them on the subject! Although, as you say, if I got 90,000 km out of my Dunlops I'm probably fine.

Last time I was in for servicing, I checked the tires while they were up in the air, and what I noticed was that they were a lot more worn in the middle. I believe this would be an indication that tire pressure is too high. I'm quite careful about checking tire pressure on a regular basis, always keeping it around 32-33, so I was quite surprised about this. Maybe I need to get a new gauge...!

autonomous · December 2005

90K km on the stock Dunlops works out to close to 55K miles which is excellent for that tire.

Getting an alignment done shouldn't be traumatic if it's done in a shop with the right equipment and software.

Regarding gauges I'd avoid the cheapos with the pop-up pressure measure. Stocking stuffer time!

jabba1900 · December 2005

I actually have a pretty expensive digital gauge, but I should probably try a different one just to see if there's a discrepancy in the reading.

Now, another question! Does anyone have experience with fuel additives for fuel injection cleaning? Is it worth it, and are there certain brands I should look at more closely?

autonomous · December 2005

I've heard contradictory things about this.

One side says that using this helps clean the injectors to postpone having to go into the shop for a fuel injector service.

The other side says that the regular additives in modern gasolines have a detergent effect and that if you really need to get your injectors cleaned you have to bring it in to do the service professionally rather than through the dinky bottles.

As some have mentioned here, if you are not experiencing a problem (sluggish starts, reduced fuel economy) why spend money creating one?

isseyvoo · December 2005

Well, we had 10 in. of snow yesterday, but still managed to get to work in one piece. HOWEVER, the plow jockey doing the driveway at work got careless and slid into my parked car - driving the plow blade into the front left quarterpanel. (Missed the wheel by only an inch or so.) Grrrrrr. Now I have to find a good body shop to heal baby's wounds. I hope it's only what the eye can see and didn't do mechanical damage. Didn't notice any shimmy on the way home. Sigh...

autonomous · December 2005

slid into my parked car - driving the plow blade into the front left quarterpanel.

Sounds familiar. The cowboys doing our lot weave in and out with something approaching reckless abandon; I say a prayer that their trucks are well maintained or we're all sitting ducks. There's a strategic science in parking: avoiding wide door coupes, parking close to a pole, guaging the turns at corners ...

Are they replacing the quarter panel?

autonomous · December 2005

Having to replace a burnt out bulb in my Protege5 was a bit of a learning experience. In case you haven't done so yet here are some lessons learned.

1. there are two separate bulbs, one for the low beam another for the high beam
2. the low beams are found on the edges of the car; the high beams are in the centre
3. to test them simply turn on the lows and then the highs
4. the bulbs are pricey; the low beams (model no. H755) go for over C$20
5. buy a replacement before a bulb fails; you'll avoid being stuck without one at night or away from home
6. the instructions in the manual (page 8-33) can be improved with some additional information:
- The procedure takes about 10 minutes the first time, the next time it should take half that.
- In steps 3 and 4: the electrical connector is white, the sealing cover is black rubber.
- In step 5: Gently pull down to unhook the bulb retaining spring.
- Step 6 is the trickiest part because the retaining spring (think paper clip)is quite flimsy so be gentle. Also they forgot to mention that there is an adapter that the bulb plugs into; pull off the old bulb and attach the new one to the adapter
- In steps 7 and 8 add: Wear gloves and avoid touching the glass surface of halogen bulbs.

Once you've done it you'll feel proud!

thel · December 2005

Funny, I just replaced my low-beam bulb this weekend as well. Getting it out was simple, putting it back in and figuring out that retainer spring did take some time though...

It took me less time to replace my spark plugs than it did to figure out that stupid spring.

erics6 · December 2005

Ah yes. The retaining pin (like a paper-clip). Mine popped out after I unscrewed the housing. Trying to get it back on was a major pain!!! Lesson. Be careful when popping the bulb out of the pin, and don't unscrew the housing.

BTW, I've noticed the low beam bulb on the P5 doesn't last as long as many cars I've owned. I had to replace the right side twice and left side once in the two years I've owned it.

autonomous · December 2005

You're right about getting the bulb out being simpler than getting the new one in and it's all because of that retainer spring. Basically, that spring is like a latch that you have to press down so that it can be released or hooked onto this small catch. A friend who was helping me could not believe the gizmo; something almost high school project about it but it does work!

mdaffron · December 2005

BTW, I've noticed the low beam bulb on the P5 doesn't last as long as many cars I've owned. I had to replace the right side twice and left side once in the two years I've owned it.

Do you see any water or condensation inside your headlight? I ask because your comment was surprising to me. My wife's 2002 Protege5, which we purchased new in January 2002 (it'll be four years old next month), has never had a blown bulb of any kind -- from headlights to dome lights.

Meade

isseyvoo · December 2005

I've noticed this as well. I've replaced each of the low beam bulbs twice on my '03.

isseyvoo · December 2005

Supposedly. I have to take it in for an estimate and then the guy will decide whether he wants to pay it out of pocket or have insurance take care of it. (I guess it was the owner's son who did it. Don't even know if he is officially on the company policy, but I guess that's not my problem.)

iamz · December 2005

Do you and your wife always turn the headlights on (even during the day) while you drive? That may be the difference. I've replaced my low-beams multiple times but I always have them on. I have 88K miles on my car also.

PF_Flyer · December 2005

It's Tuesday, and that means Mazda chat!

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The Mazda Club Chat is on tonight. The chat room opens at 8:45PM ET Hope to see YOU there! Check out the schedule

erics6 · December 2005

No water in light housing... and I don't do that much night driving.

mdaffron · December 2005

Nope, we're not a DRL state. The only time I burn my headlights during the daytime is when it's raining (which is a state law but also a very intelligent thing to do if you want to be seen!).

Meade

ripcord · December 2005

I need to buy some ice tires for my 02 P5. Does anyone have any recommendations on the best tires for ice traction, good dry pavement performance including low noise. I have found lots of info that suggests the Kumho KW11 is a good tire and reasonably priced. Also the Nordic Icetracs are equally good and priced well. These two tires seem to win out better over the higher priced tires. Anyone else?

autonomous · December 2005

Kumho KW11 is a good tire and reasonably priced. Also the Nordic Icetracs are equally good and priced well. These two tires seem to win out better over the higher priced tires

The BF Goodrich Winter Slaloms are another good value. Some are S rated (110mph/160kmph) to retain some performance capability (but I'm not into ice racing!). Canadian Tire offers them with free flat repairs. This will be their fourth winter on my 2002P5 and they feel as good as new.

jabba1900 · December 2005

I was considering doing a trans flush on my '02 P5 with 90,000 kms. However, after having done some research on the Internet and had an interesting talk with the service manager of a local Mazda dealership I have decided against it.

No need to go into details, but it seems that a flush might end up doing more harm than good by loosening old residue and dirt that might be stuck in certain recesses of the transmission. When this gets mixed up in the new fluid they flow around all parts of the transmission, potentially messing it up.

Also, when doing a flush, you still do not change all the fluid. The service manager confirmed this, telling me that their machine generally manages to flush out about 90-95% of the old fluid. Since there is still old fluid left, this tells me that you're just as well off doing the old drain and refill on a regular basis. The service manager told me that they generally recommend owners do this once a year. He said it was up to me if I wanted to do the flush ($140 CAD + tax), but he didn't seem to indicate any particular benefit in doing so. He even told me it was a good thing I had 10,000 kms left on my warranty in case there was a trans failure after the flush! That was kind of the final straw for me...!

Does anyone else have experience with trans flushing?

Btw, as a sidenote, I'm off to change a lightbulb (front passenger side - the tricky one...) today. Again! I don't know how many lightbulbs I've changed since the car was new, but it's easily half a dozen. I've never had a car where the lightbulb burns out so easily. Obvious design flaw.

autonomous · December 2005

Interesting. My favorite TV auto host, Kirk Robinson from Autoline, says something similar about old cars that have not had their trannies flushed. As you note the flush in effect stirs things up to the point of creating a bigger problem than it was intended to solve. Kirk recommends Ace Transmission in Toronto; they have a 1-800 number that you may want to call for some free phone advice.

I'm off to change a lightbulb (front passenger side - the tricky one...) today. Again! I don't know how many lightbulbs I've changed since the car was new, but it's easily half a dozen.
Wow! Were the bulbs all for the front passenger side?

nobody88 · December 2005

I had my lightbulb replaced twice by dealer and they burnt out in 1-2 months. Then I replaced them myself and are still working after 15 months. The trick is "Did you hold the lightbulb with bare hand?" Someone told me before that grease of hands makes halogen bulbs burnt quickly. I used a piece of paper towel in replacing the bulbs. I guess disposable gloves may do the same job.

erics6 · December 2005

I think a transmission flush with 90k kilometers (about 56k miles) would be fine. Where you run into problems is on higher mileage cars, where the transmission fluid has not been changed on a regular basis. On most cars a transmission fluid change about every 30,000 miles or 2 years is fine. If you want to spend the $$$ on a flush, it shouldn't hurt.

jabba1900 · December 2005

Yeah, I've also come to the conclusion that a flush would probably do no damage to my transmission. However, the question then becomes whether it's necessary in the first place? From what I understand, changing the oil the regular way about once a year will work just as well as preventative maintenance, and it's cheaper. That might be the route I'll choose to take going forward.

Now, regarding the lightbulbs. The ones I've changed over the years have been on both sides, and I've been very careful not to touch them with my bare hands. Funnily enough, this time I bought two bulbs just in case. Wanted one in reserve. The day after I changed the bulb on the passenger side, the bulb on the driver side burnt out...! At least having one in reserve saved me another trip to Canadian Tire!

kronogoose · January 2006

Another thing to look at is the type and/or brand of bulbs. My factory/OEM bulbs had lasted nearly four years before the first one burned out. I thought it would be really cool to get the Sylvania Silverstar bulbs (I think that's the right name) that are brighter and whiter than "normal" halogen bulbs. I noticed an immediate difference, which I should have, because at $30 USD a piece, they were more than double the price of normal headlight bulbs! BTW, I am assuming that you are referring to the headlight bulbs and not a turn indicator.

Anyway, I ended up replacing both the left and right Silverstar bulbs twice over the course of about six months. I began to think there was an electrical problem until I went back to the "regular" halogen bulbs a few months ago. I have not had a problem since then.

I also try to be very careful handling the halogen bulbs during replacement, and with this most recent change, I wore latex gloves.

Good luck!

Greg

autonomous · January 2006

Anyone interested in comparing notes on car care?

1. How often do you wash and how often do you wax your car?
2. How often do you clean / detail the interior including your CD unit?
3. How often do you check the following: a) oil; b) other fluids; c) tire pressure?
4. Do you do anything special regarding winter care? For example, do you use a) winter tires; b) gasline antifreeze, or c) block heater?
5. How long do the following typically last: a) wipers; b) battery; c) thermostat; d) tires; e) brake pads; f) brake rotors?

erics6 · January 2006

Anyone interested in comparing notes on car care?
2002 P5 w/64k.
1. How often do you wash and how often do you wax your car?
Weekly
2. How often do you clean / detail the interior including your CD unit?
Weekly. Don't clean the CD unit.
3. How often do you check the following: a) oil; b) other fluids; c) tire pressure?
Not often enough. Probably every couple of weeks.
4. Do you do anything special regarding winter care? For example, do you use a) winter tires; b) gasline antifreeze, or c) block heater?
No
5. How long do the following typically last:
a) wipers;
Twice a year.
b) battery;
Original replaced last month at around 60k.
c) thermostat;
Original I think. Might have been replaced at 60k service.
d) tires;
Originals replaced last summer at around 50k. Don't ask me why the Dunlops lasted so long.
e) brake pads;
Originals are still good. Will need to replace them probably within the next 10k or so.
f) brake rotors?
Orignals, but fronts will probably need to be replaced when the pads are done. The fronts have already been resurfaced once.

Conclusion. A great car. Very reliable. Would recommend the P5 to anyone.

flipmack · January 2006

2002.5 P5 with 65K miles. it's my daily-driver for a 90+ mile round trip daily commute.

1. How often do you wash and how often do you wax your car?

once a month, if that. basically, whenever I can't see out of the side windows due to dust buildup, I'll wash the car.

2. How often do you clean / detail the interior including your CD unit?

see reply to #1.

3. How often do you check the following: a) oil; b) other fluids; c) tire pressure?

oil: every other fillup
fluids: hardly
tire pressure: constantly

4. Do you do anything special regarding winter care? For example, do you use a) winter tires; b) gasline antifreeze, or c) block heater?

what's winter? (I live in Southern California)

5. How long do the following typically last: a) wipers; b) battery; c) thermostat; d) tires; e) brake pads; f) brake rotors?

wipers: replaced all ONCE
battery: still on original
thermostat: still on original
tires: swapped Dunlops with Bridgestone RE750's at @18K miles
brake pads: still on original
brake rotors: still on original

with the exception of my front door locks 'sticking' intermittently, the car has been trouble-free and in all honesty, drives better than before.

autonomous · January 2006

Interesting comments. Here are some for my 2002 P5 (65K km / 40K miles)

1. How often do you wash and how often do you wax your car?
- Monthly for the wash; every second month for the waxing.

2. How often do you clean / detail the interior including your CD unit?
- Monthly. Don't clean the CD unit. My New Year's Resolution is to figure out how to clean the CD unit.

3. How often do you check the following:
a) oil: Hardly ever
b) other fluids: Hardly ever
c) tire pressure: Biweekly.
My New Year's Resolution is to do all these biweekly.

4. Do you do anything special regarding winter care? For example, do you use
a) winter tires: yes
b) gasline antifreeze: yes
c) block heater: no

5. How long do the following typically last:
a) wipers: 18 to 24 months
b) battery: using original with 40K miles (65K km); plan to replace at 50K miles
c) thermostat: using original with 40K miles (65K km)
d) tires: replaced with BF Goodrich at 28K miles (45K km)
e) brake pads: using original with 40K miles (65K km); hope to last for another 10K miles or more
f) brake rotors: using original with 40K miles (65K km); hope to last for another 10K miles or more

So far the P5 has been a reliable fun-to-drive wonder.

erics6 · January 2006

Forgot the wax part. Probably every 3 months or so.

ripcord · January 2006

I installed Silverstars on my 02 P5 and the first one blew out in 3 months. I had the receipt and took it back to take advantage of the one year warranty at Canadian Tire. I have my fingers crossed but after looking at a few posts, I am concerned.

ripcord · January 2006

Thanks, I opted for the Nordic Icetrac's. On both my P5's, I have Icetrac's on the front, and Firestone Winterfires on the back. What a difference having the ice tires on the car. No ABS coming on at each stop sign, I love them for handling too. Now all we need is some snow in good ole Bruce County (where the snow blows horizontal)

Sporin · January 2006

I've gone through quite a few low beam bulbs on my P5 in it's 94k miles. I'm on my 3rd D-side and my 2nd P-side if I remember correctly, it might actually be more.

No moisture in housing. Still on the OE high beams. No DRL's here either.

Sporin · January 2006

My P5 is nearing 100k and just about paid off. I'm due for a timing belt change, my front struts are leaking and the back seems a bit saggy. (We're larger then average folks and frequently have the car loaded right up for camping and traveling.) The brakes are sure to be due again soon as it's been nearly 50k since I did the backs, and 30k since I did the fronts.

My issue is that I don't know if I want to dump a big chunk of money into her if I'm not going to keep it. Our family has outgrown it and we think we'd like to move up to something a bit bigger like the new RAV4, upcoming Mazda CX-7, Mazda6 Wagon, or perhaps a midsize sedan or wagon.

Thoughts? I did the brakes myself and it cost less then $100 per end with new rotors. How much have folks paid for the Tbelt change?? What am I looking at for struts all around?

jabba1900 · January 2006

Yes, definitely talking about headlight bulbs - not indicators. Since I was a kid my dad would always tell me to never touch the glass of a halogen bulb, so I'm very careful about that. Also, I just use the cheapest bulbs Canadian Tire can offer - nothing fancy. Considering how many other people have complained about this issue I would say that the Protege5 has a clear weakness in this area.

jabba1900 · January 2006

2002 Protege5 - 92,000 kms

1. How often do you wash and how often do you wax your car?
Wash once every two weeks or so (DIY drive-in). Wax a couple of times a year - spring and fall

2. How often do you clean / detail the interior including your CD unit?
Once a year.

3. How often do you check the following: a) oil; b) other fluids; c) tire pressure?
Oil - Once in a while, especially before going on a longer road trip.

Other fluids - same

Tire pressure - almost every day - I'm religious about my tires!

4. Do you do anything special regarding winter care? For example, do you use a) winter tires; b) gasline antifreeze, or c) block heater?
No on all counts. Have a block heater, but currently don't need it since I live in high-rise with underground parking.

5. How long do the following typically last: a) wipers; b) battery; c) thermostat; d) tires; e) brake pads; f) brake rotors?
Wipers - 1-2 years. Typically change driver's side more often.
Battery - still on original - no problems.
Thermostat - same
Tires - Just changed to new all-seasons. Original Dunlops lasted 90,000 kms.
Brake pads and rotors - Original front pads and rotors lasted almost 90,000 kms. Changed two months ago. Rears were changed at around 20,000 kms after rear calipers got stuck. Bloody Ford parts! Only serious issue with the Protege5.

Resolution? Wash inside of car more often and change trans oil at least once a year. This car will last forever - I'll never sell it!

erics6 · January 2006

Ummm... just paid it off and you want another car payment?

Don't think you're going to find many p5 owners who have changed the timing belt or struts yet. Mazda parts are kind of expensive. Check with your independent mechanic for a ballpark (parts and labor).

Ask Terry on Edmunds Real World Trade in Values what your car is worth. Maybe $7.5 - $8k private sale.

Personally, I'd put some $$ into maintenance, and keep the car for at least another 50k or so. P5 should last for another 100k or so, with no big issues. We are talking about a VERY reliable car here. I've got two teenage daughters, and the four of us do fine. Bought a Yakima Loadwarrior for the rack. Plastic bins on top. Works great on trips.

isseyvoo · January 2006

I believe the timing belt change ran about $600 and change for us as part of a so-called 60K mi. service that totaled over $1,000.

Sporin · January 2006

The P5 has been great, but my boy's feet are firmly planted in my seatback and he'll be in a car seat for a few more years. More importantly, we are at a point with the grandparents that we HAVE to have room in the back for 2 adults PLUS the kid seat on a very regular basis. That just doesn't work in the P5.

If neither of those factors existed, we'd be HAPPY to spend whatever and keep it for a while longer, but I just can't see dumping a grand or more into it when it really doesn't fit our needs anymore.

erics6 · January 2006

Non-dealer prices will be a LOT less. Struts will be expensive though. Other maintenance is pretty straight-forward.

Trade will be low, with the things you've mentioned. Lot's of reconditioning for the dealer. Better to sell it private party.

Might want to take a look at the new Mazda 5. Seen the base stick going for about $15k.

Sporin · January 2006

Thanks for the basic maintenance numbers. I'll hit up my repair guy for more spcifics. I don't want to clutter this topic with "What next car for me" posts.

camarillobrill · January 2006

with all the money you have invested in the car, you should spend the xtra $$ and have it maintained correctly at a dealer.....dont take chances with outside independents

erics6 · January 2006

Interesting perspective. Never heard that one before.

I like things DONE RIGHT, the 1st time. My trusted independent hasn't screwed up like the dealer has, + they only do what NEEDS DOING and don't add profit fluff. I have NEVER had a good experience at a dealer, except oil changes. I don't like to waste $$$, so I'll stick with my trusted independent.

camarillobrill · January 2006

thats nice that you have a trusted independent. No need for the sarcasm though. It is my experience though, that certain independents occasionally are unable to do certain jobs corrrectly, and the owner pays twice after bringing the car to me to have it fixed right. Dealerhip experiences can be frustrating, but not all dealers are out to steal your money. I personally have a large base of loyal customers that come ONLY to me to have their cars fixed. Sorry that you cant find the same at your local. When Joe Public brings his protege5 in for a routine oil change at independent, did that ind notice that the A/C light didnt stay on all the time on fan speed 2 and replace the control head under warranty even after the car was out of the 3-4/50 warranty? Just an example of what I do for my customers. On behalf of Mazda North America, I apologize that you have NEVER had a good experience at the dealership.

jabba1900 · January 2006

Sorry to say this, Eric, but you're one in a million. In my experience, most dealerships are run like ruthless businesses. They have no interest in doing warranty repairs - certainly not AFTER the warranty has expired! If you leave your car with them for five minutes you can rest assured that you will end up with a nice long (and expensive!) laundry list of items that they recommend you repair. Also, do not expect them to get the job done right.

I paid more than $300 to have my rear brakes replaced after less than a year. The brakes had overheated after hanging because of buildup of dirt. Not covered by warranty. This is a well known Protege5 weakness. When I had my independent look at it, he pointed out to me that the dealership had not lubricated the sliding pins. Most likely I would have had to go back there the year after to have my brakes replaced again. I guess this is how they retain their customers - get things to break so that they will keep coming back again and again and again...!

Eric, I'm sure you are an exception, but to me there is an inherent conflict of interest in letting a dealership take care of maintenance. They will lose money by pointing out needed warranty repairs (Mazda pays them less than what they can charge a customer), so many of them wait until the warranty has expired. Some have understood that customer retention can not be built this way, but I am not making the gamble that I might have found such a dealer. Instead I take it to my trusted indie who charges less and has never recommended unnedded repairs.

camarillobrill · January 2006

not sure whom you are addressing, but I think it was my post and I am not eric. My name is Dan and I am a mazda tech of 18+ years. As far as dealer that would not warranty a known brake failure and blame it on "dirt buildup" is a shame. My own personal protege5 that I recently purchased with over 200k miles had the same issue you are referring to with the rear brakes. When I looked at the warranty history in my computer, mazda had taken care of the problem while the car had OVER 100k on it. I am not saying it is typical, but one shouldnt be so closeminded about dealerships. My goal is never to sell something that is not needed, but to repair correctly what is needed. Not expecting the dealer to get the job done right is a little harsh, and the human element is present at ALL places of business.

Mazda Protege5

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