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sheesh dude,,,i feel for you..
I had a car stolen too..its a horrible feeling
i am paranoid if i can keep an eye on TAZZ
I beleive the best security is a sterring wheel lock.
or viper alarm with a proxcimity(spelling) alert.
where I work i can keep a an eye on TAZZ at all times.
We are with you ...
TOM
I think its a good idea you gotta a "work truck"
trucks are just good to have
Jeep Jeepin!
BT
I've decided to get a second car for our 4 member family. I've never owned a jeep, but am sure on getting a Wrangler with the sound bar. But there are a number of things I'm not sure about:
1. New or used?
2. 4 or 6 cylinders?
Also, is there anyway to put things on top of the roof for transport, like a kayak for example?
Any advice or recommendations are appreciated.
I didn't even notice it until I read about it on the board. I have no idea if my 97 had them, but I've experienced no seat comfort problems with either Jeep. Since so many have noticed it on so many Jeeps, it must be intentional for whatever reason, so the safety issues are moot unless you have it "fixed".
Therefore, let it go and just enjoy it - there's no such thing as a perfect world, otherwise the plastic windows wouldn't scratch!
tsjay - may try to get some pictures up in the next couple of weeks (by the way, she's stone white with canyon wheels like Thelma Jane).
BTW Dept: I was driving it the other day, and when turning, heard this awful popping - like the suspension was coming out from under it. It sounded like my 97 when the body mounts were bad, but much louder. I thought, "well this is a new record, only 200 miles and has to go in for service. At least my 97 made it to 997 miles before the transmission had to be rebuilt." To make a long story short, it was a golf ball loose rolling around behind the seats and hitting everything metal it could find. Now if I can just find that squeek...
This past Saturday, we took one canoe and one kayak leaning on its side against the canoe to the river--with out the adapters and bars as they are on back order. The Wilderness rack (basket rack) will run $450.
When I get the adapters, and attach my Yakima bars, both boats will sit side by side with plenty of room. I am resuing the yakima bars I took of my pickup truck.
Here is the web site for the rack manufacturer:
http://www.garvin-industries.com/
Hope this helps.
Mary Ann
It depends on what you want to use the Jeep for.
I hate 4 cyc. If you are only using it on trails and some city driving a 4 can be OK. I hate them on the highway though.
Used can be a good way to go. Jeeps retain their value real well so it can be tough to find a good deal.
The TJ is 97 and newer and the YJ is 87-95. The TJ rides signifcantly better and I would get a 91 or newer YJ so you have fuel injection.
See maryapruitt's post for a rack.
mtngal
If you are keeping Taco for couple of years and have such a long commute, why not look at getting new seats? Is that your only complaint about the vehicle? You could keep it longer. Since you like the TJ seats so much, see if they can mount in your truck.
So you are having lovely weather? Well I am sure you took the top off so you could really enjoy it.
LOL
jacorob
Aren't you in Austin? I bet you live in the south/southeast side. I hope it is not someone in your complex. I hope you get it back and it is in good condition. Must of been a joy rider if they stole a civic.
I have heard good things about the viper alarm.
I leave my doors open and I don't leave anything of value inside it. If you want to leave some stuff, get a tuffy security product.
Is the Wrangler with the hard top warm in the winter? (I live in Montana)
Is there any storage room?
As far as the Nissan pickup I had with 290,000 miles on it. We used just regular oil (10W30), not synthetic. We changed it every 3,000-5,000 miles or so. We had one oil leak fixed (a seal) and replaced the auto tranny twice (both times after we moved up to the mountains), within a year of each other. That's when we decided that manuals would be better for us. It seems like all the used vehicles up here (4,500 - 6,000 feet elevation) for sale either have new trannys or need tranny work!
I'm going to look at other seats for the Taco. If it weren't for the uncomfortable seats, it would be everything we need. One guy told me that you couldn't change the seats out any more because of government safety standards, but I think he just didn't do that type of thing. I know that you used to be able to do it, and from what I've seen here, it sounds like you can still do it. Guess it's time to look at aftermarket alternatives. I know it is a bit off topic, but does anyone have any suggestions?
And even though we are having such wonderful weather, I haven't gone topless. I have a hard top and no garage. And yes - this summer has been one of the times when I wish I did have a garage! On the other hand, the hard top sure came in handy this past weekend - we went to Vegas and it was too hot there for topless driving!
Certainly not open air- but has a similar feel and is a capable off-roader for not a ton of money.
I do miss the Wrangler though.
Have you looked for mice in the fenders?
http://www.dirtroad.com/proj97tj.htm
(not really related, but it is neat, and mentions jeep 4 bangers)
http://www.off-road.com/jeep/cherokee/2001/03_mar/flowmaster/flowmaster.html
I was posting here for a long time looking for info. I finally bought my 1997 Sport 2 weeks ago!!!
How could I have forgotten to mention you? The answer, obviuosly, is senility!
Hey, Alzheimer's isn't all bad... you get to meet new people every day!
tsjay
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
*shrug*
Bob
Your 4 cyl. vs. 6 cyl. question has come up many times in this group. It is almost unanimous that the 4 cyl is fine for local driving and for offroading. But, it is also most commonly believed that the power is not adequate for highway driving. I go along with that.
I test drove both an SE and a Sport, and this convinced me that, as much highway driving as I do (27 miles one way to work every day plus business trips occasionally of up to 300 miles one way), I needed the Sport with the 4.0 L I-6 engine.
You are getting this Jeep as a second family vehicle, so maybe you don't plan on taking trips in it, and, if this is the case, then the 4 cyl may be fine for your purposes.
Either way, you are definitely on the right track in considering a Jeep! They are a BLAST! I just wish that I had discovered the joy of Jeeps much earlier in my life. I was 51 last December when I got my first ever Wrangler.
Hope this helps, and please keep us posted on your progress in searching for a Jeep.
Check out my Jeep and my buying experience at my Thelma Jane's weg page....
http://www.members.aol.com/tjoh298765/thelma.html
Feel free to email me with any questions. I am NOT an expert on the technical stuff about Jeeps, but I can sure tell you about the fun they are to own!
tsjay
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
I just came back from a week long trip to New hampshire and Vermont with my jeep. Took the canoe along as well. I have one thing to say, nobody from New Hampshire or VT would wave to me. What is up with that??? Anyway, the real question here is:
How many out there with the 4.0 litre engine hear pinging all the time. I tried about 4 different brands of gas and they all ping. Not constantly or very loud, but enough that i notice it at 65-75 mph. in 4th and 5th gear. If anyone has encountered this and fixed it, I would appreciate advice...the engine has only 15k miles.
Thanks.
-pizzadude
Sounds like the timing is a little too advanced, and that is controlled by the computer now a days, I believe. Take it to your dealer, and have it checked out.
tsjay
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
Did you try a different grade of gas (i.e. Plus or Premium)? I used to have to run Plus in the summer (when they put in the enviro-addiditives) to prevent my Supra from pinging. I guess the computer could only adjust the timing so much. Switching from 87 to 89-91 octane did the trick for me. As tsjay mentioned, sounds like a dealer trip (arrrghhhhh) may be needed. HTH
-twylie
I would think seriously about what you want to do with your vehicle. First of all, there is NO storage room in a Wrangler, well okay, except for behind the rear seat which amounts to very little. If you want or need storage, go with a Cherokee. Secondly, the hard top is quite warm in the winter, mainly because the heater is so efficient, and it's a small vehicle. If you're considering a 4-Runner, you're already in a different class than the Wrangler. I've had a Wrangler for 2 years, and while it's a fun, year-round vehicle, it isn't the most comfortable ride. I wouldn't recommend a Wrangler as your primary vehicle. It's great on the weekends, but driving it every day wears on you. Good Luck.
Jeepboy: Ok first why would you need the Dana 44? The dana 35 is not as strong granted but are you looking to put larger tires in excess of 33 inches and wheeling it hard? The 35 is plenty strong for most people's needs. The difference between the 3.07 and 3.73 gears is the rpm's on your jeep. 3.07s have a lower rpm and should get better gas mileage than 3.73. 3.73 gears would be better if you are looking to get tires larger than 31s. Changing the rear to a 44 later can be very costy and cause a headache but it can be done. If the jeep your looking at comes with the 44 get it but if it doesn't don't worry about your not going to need the extra strenght of the 44 unless your going to wheel it hard.
The family of 4 thing I'm not sure about, it depend how big everyone is. A "family car" it is not. For two people it is perfect, if the "kids" are little it should work well. As they get bigger, I don't think it will be very comfortable for the "back seaters".
I must, respectfully, disagree with dfahy68. We have found the wrangler to be very comfortable, on logging roads, ruts or the highway. We wouldn't hesitate to take it long distance.
Putting things on top of it will effect you center of gravity. I am opting for a trailer instead. We can get more "stuff" in one (they do make some that can convert and pull a small boat or canoe) and if I don't want to lug it around (depending where we are) I can always rent, an insured, place to store it for a week or so.
If you can afford it, I would go with a new one, with duel tops and the I6.
I think Jeeps are reliable. If you drive it hard and beat it on the trails well that could be a problem. Jeeps can have all kinds of problems with leaks or electrical problems or what not. But you should not have any mechanical problems different from other vehicles.
I wouldn't buy a Jeep over a 4runner because of reliability.
There is some storage space. It depends on how much and how many passengers you have. The back seat can be removed or folded up.
jeepboy727
That sounds like a good price.
I am not sure if you can get the Dana44 without 30s. I think in most cases it won't have it.
This site shows you how to identify the axle.
http://www.nationwideparts.com/differentials.htm
The cost to switch out gears is around $700. That would include the new gears and labor to do it. If your foot is light enough the Dana35 can work.
jacorob
Thieves have been breaking in to cars left and right here lately. Basically if they see something that might be valuable or contain something of value, they steal it. You may want to keep the car a little cleaner unless it is just thrash.
If the thieves see any clothes or bags they smash the windows and steal it.
Twylie, have fun in Maine...beautiful country up there. We spent some time on Lake Umbagog...on the Maine, New Hampshire boarder.
I will be headed to the Finger Lakes in New York this weekend for some fishing derby fun with my father in-law.
have a good one!
Keep jeepin'
-pizzadude
I'll keep you posted.
Madman
Madman390
And, once again, thank you for serving our country and for the sacrifices you have made in doing so. Same goes for all of you service men and women out there.
Now, get that Jeep and have some fun!
tsjay
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
-twylie
Thanks.
And thanks for the warm welcome. It it really good to be back. I just have to finish this course, and then it's back to real work. But this is really a good break from work.
Tazz, does all of AL smell like this?
madman
Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards
you must be used to smelling sushi all the time..
Glad to see you back on American soil mad man..
Hope you have a great Jeep Experience...
BT
Hey Tom, what happened at the other site tonight? I can't seem to log on
Madman, glad to hear you're back. Now you have alot more opportunities to go wheelin' in that awesome jeep of yours.
Twylie, nice to see you're here too. Forgot about the chat Thursday night, it's been a really long and stressful week.
Saharagal, What do you do when you can't play tennis outside....table tennis
tex, how's the jeep handlin' these days?
Well if I've missed anyone, hope this note finds you well and happily boppin' along in those Jeeps.
Hug you Jeeps for me today
dwrangler
There must be a problem at the other site because I can't log in and it doesn't look like anyone else has been there either. Only 20 hits on the counter. Guess g is having problems again.
Hug your jeep for me today
dwrangler
As far as new or used I have talked to many Jeep owners on this site and others that have purchased both new and used, all are happy with their decisions. My personal preference would be for a new Jeep Sport with the 6 cylinder engine and soft top with full doors. I plan to get an automatic for the simple reason that I have problems every once and a while with my hip and have in the past had to deal with sprained ankles so the auto would be the best choice for me.
Good luck with your decision and let us know what you chose, oh and post the photo
dwrangler
You should easily be able to get a new Wrangler at dealer invoice. Dont worry about talking to salemen, just research what you want, and then call the fleet manager to see what's available on their lot. If they wont sell at or below invoice, go to the next dealer.
http://www.thecarplace.com/01jeep.htm
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
His good stuff/bad stuff is a complete joke. I can think of quite a few more good stuffs (e.g. - the fact that it's a convertible 4x4! DUH!), and would argue about a lot of his "bad stuff" as being simply wrong (e.g - everything's an option is good as he later explains) or too stupid to even list (aero like a brick).
But for those considering a wrangler...
I have no problems getting in to the jeep - i can lift my leg up more then 2 inches - in fact it's easier for me to get in my jeep then drop down to the ground to get in to my civic. I can steer and drive through water easily - which apparently he's simply incapable of. I havn't experienced any of the problems he claimed. It isn't even as close to being as loud as he trumps it up to be - cept with the top down which is a no brainer - but he wasn't referring to that. Comfort? Heck, the wrangler is comfortable for me, much more so then my civic. I took a month long, nearly 7000 mile trek across the eastern US and never got tired of driving or experienced discomfort - noise or interior wise. He had a wrangler for a week and never put the top down! I wonder what the longest trip he took in it was? And what's with like 6 paragraphs complaining about how the wrangler doesn't come with a GPS? HELLO!!!! Last time i checked most higher priced SUVs don't come with it either! If ya want one go to the store and buy one. It might be cool if it was an option (though not worth 6 paragraphs). Of course i wouldn't get it for fear of it getting stolen.
Now I'll be the first to say that the wrangler is IMO an impractical vehicle for a lot of people. There's not much storage space - though i have more then enough since it's just me. It gets abysmal gas mileage. It's pry not a good family car (at least not the sole family car), though i've fit friends in the backseat and they weren't too uncomfortable - they were smiling and loving the top down driving. It doesn't really have ANY kind of security unless you get the hardtop. From reports i've seen it doesn't have a very good repair record - though i havn't had any problems with mine. I'd think any serious review of the wrangler wouldat least mention these two things - maintenance and security. But i guess he was too busy ranting about it not having an option for a GPS or going on about his "safety" review of which the first paragraph was the only one which had any facts behind it.
*shrug* but everyone has their opinion. I havn't regretted buying my jeep for an instant, and getting in to it still brings a smile to my face. And i love passing by other wranglers, smiling and waving, getting a wave back, and knowing that we both "get it".
Bob
PS - sorry for the rant. just kept typing.
1. A big side impact near the door area could be disastrous.
2. Gas mileage is around 14 mpg
3. He just doesn't get it.
This guy seems to require all the refinements and ride quality that a luxury SUV offers, yet doesn't want to explore the jeep in its rightful place. If the Wrangler had all the appointments this guy would like, then what would you have? Another run of the mill SUV. Lets pretend I am a auto critic. I am going to rate an off road convertible like a Jeep Wrangler. But instead of using the criteria based on a off road vehicle, I use one based on a Lexus RX300 scale. Did he take it off road? NO. Did he take the top off? NO. Its clear why the "CAR PLACE" is not Motor Trend. I know what a Luxury SUV should be. Thats why I am ordering an Acura MDX for my wife. The Jeep does very well in the face of criticism like this. They consistantly sell 80,000 to 90,000 a year for just the same reasons this guy hates it.
Take Care,
John
At least the review concluded with the reason most of us buy Wranglers - for the fun! I bought mine because as a stock vehicle it could go places I wanted to go (off-road), where most other SUVs in my price range couldn't. I didn't get it for setting time records between home and work.
I would like to add a couple of other things - we find the seats MUCH more comfortable than the Tacoma's seats, and chose to drive it on a 3,000 mile (the approximate round trip mileage) trip from Southern California to northern British Columbia. The reasons? The seats are much more comfortable, and while it is louder than the Taco, it isn't that much louder. The ride isn't all that bad, and the seats make up for much of the stiffness (I have gas shocks and 30" wheels). The main reason I wanted to take it was because we were going in early spring, and we did run into snow. My wrangler has only gotten stuck once in the snow (and then we had 3 feet one night - even the snow plows were having a tough time). The Taco spent a couple of weeks sitting because my husband had just had surgery and I couldn't push it far enough to get it off the ice.
The fact that the wrangler is top heavy and a roll over risk shouldn't be ignored, but rather dealt with. I drive it slower up the Grapevine than I do the Taco (it also gets much better gas mileage at 60 than it does above 70). And that isn't such a bad thing. The drive is beautiful, and can be quite relaxing when I slow down to enjoy it. By the time I get home, I'm "de-compressed" from work. And if I've driven the Wrangler, I might even get off the I5 and take that dirt road that parallels it for a ways... Those people in their big SUVs and sports cars going 85 mph up here miss so much beauty, and probably would be much more likely to get in an accident than I will plugging along in one of the slower lanes!
The Wrangler isn't for everyone, as has been pointed out in previous posts. Until it gets better gas mileage I'll probably continue to own another commuter car. On the other hand, when I finally have to replace mine, I will definitely get another one. And I'll put up with the drawbacks just like I do now. I just hope that DC doesn't get caught up with all of this business that SUV's have to do everything for everyone, and try to copy other popular vehicles.
Hopefully more reviews like this will force DCX to redesign some of the things like the rear Pinto-like gas tank behind the rear bumper, as well as the thin side doors. That way, you can have fun and yet at least be safe at the same time. I'm not sure that I personally would like to be constantly worried about the threat of the rear tank leaking fuel in a rear end collision. I do admit that sometimes I've got to wonder how you guys enjoy yourself so much that you're willing to take the doors off completely! ;-) Then again, I don't even open my moonroof very much and my cabin air is electrostatically filter ;-) Good thing too or my pollen allergies would be worse than what they are.
I think what the author's point was that most people use these vehicles for on-road use and when compared to other vehicles in the same small SUV class (well, sort of), it's not very good in his view. Obviously you are free to agree or disagree with his opinions :-).
Bob, I did like how much the review talked about safety because at least consumers would read it and be aware of what they're getting into. It will be up to them to decide whether they're willing to give up certain safety features, etc. Those who view the glass as half empty may say that since it only takes one serious accident to kill you, the Wrangler would not be the vehicle he/she would want to be in.
Meanwhile, enjoy the ride!
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
footnote: He did give a nice review of your vehicle Drew, The Mercedes ML320.
How about some other autos with obvious flaws: Ferraris (EXPENSIVE to operate), Hummer (could just possibly be the hardest vehicle to live with anywhere outside of a desert), Viper (we dont need no stinkin top), Prowler (uh, where do I start?), etc. Still, each are wonderful in their own right and purpose.
We, the owners of these fun and capable vehicles get it, and thats all that matters to me. I dont feel the need for my choice of vehicles to be validated by others that dont get it. The author opines from a perspective that is very conservative - he probably has a fleet of Honda Accords. I cant believe he actually participated in a Gymboree [sic], much less in the Everglades.
I think that my chances of being involved in an accident are far lower in Thelma Jane than they would be in an ordinary vehicle. I realize that I am in a Jeep, and I slow down accordingly. Speed is just about the greatest factor in an accident.
By driving slower, I have the advantage of shorter stopping distance and more reaction time. I can avoid the sudden swerve that might throw a vehicle (any vehicle) out of control or even cause a roll over.
Also, I leave more space between me and the vehicle ahead of me, even though I have never been a tailgater anyway. If I have more space to work with between me and the car ahead, then I don't have to make an emergency application of the brakes when that guy stops suddenly, which means the car behind me isn't as likely to plow into the rear of my Jeep.
There are risks involved in anything we do. Simply using common sense can reduce the risks immensely. Maybe some vehicles are more forgiving when common sense is not used, but I don't want any major changes made to the Wrangler!
tsjay
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
tsjay
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
They had a maroon Liberty that I checked out. I wasn't crazy about the color, and I still think the Liberties are ugly (but they are growing on me a little), but they sure have a lot of equipment and features for the price.
I had a '99 Grand Cherokee Laredo 4x4 that didn't have any more features than that Liberty that I looked at this morning, but my GCL was stickered at $29,580, and this little Liberty was stickered at $23,515. Seems that the cargo room is the only thing that you would give up between the GCL and the Liberty. I guess the passenger room is probably less too, but without having test driven one, I can't say.
Those things ought to go over big, I would think. It's funny that the Liberty I looked at was stickered for about $300 less than what Thelma Jane was, and the Liberty gives you a V6, a four speed automatic, and a full time four wheel drive option.
Wouldn't trade even between the two, though! I would still much rather have Thelma!!!
tsjay
Have you hugged your Jeep today?
The Wrangler holds up pretty well in accidents, too. I came out much better than the guy in the pickup who moved into my lane without looking. We ended up hitting him and the freeway wall, and we drove away. He had to wait for a tow truck because his front end was toast! Definitely a tough little vehicle.
Drew,
I'm fine with safety reviews. I think they are extremely important. However, I prefer safety reviews that contain facts and expert knowledge rather then personal, unknowledgable conjectures. What was the basis for his claims that side impacts would be devastating and the rear gas tank is extremely dangerous? What are his qualifications to make such claims? Did he review past wrangler incidents before forming his opinion? Does he have any basis for his comparison of a pinto and a wrangler? Are there any cases of higher then normal (as to other placements of gas tanks) problems with the wrangler gas tank? Considering it's been around a long time I would assume a pattern would have developed by now. I'm not aware of any. Why was the proposal on placement of the gas tank rejected by lawamakers? These are much better questions to answer then spending it explaining why a GPS should be a standard or optional feature. Of course this is my UNEXPERT opinion that i have no real knowledge behind - much like the reviewer (unless i missed his qualifications somewhere though i doubt it). As i mentioned before the ONLY place he actually used facts as pertaining to the wrangler was the first paragraph. Everything else was unjustified supposition where the validity of the claims should be directly correlated with the knowledge and experience of the person writing it.
Personally i'm curious why _all_ vehicles don't get tested for side collisions by the NHTSA, especially the wrangler since a lot of owners take the doors off. Seems like it'd be a no brainer that a test should be run.
Bob