Jeep Wrangler

dillondog · February 2002

I am planning on ordering a jeep and I am in the process of determining options. Does anyone know the advantages and disadvantages of anti-lock brakes with a wrangler? Thanks

tjray · February 2002

I want to put 31 inch tires on my TJ,and I was wondering how much clearance you have between the brake lines and inner fenders at full steering lock? Do your tires ever rub anywhere? By the way,I think I should warn you, going offroad, especially with other rabid Jeepers, is addictive!
TJRay

mkoirtyohann · February 2002

Jeep owners, a little assistance please. I plan to purchase a Wrangler as a 2nd vehicle for general entertainment and pulling a jon boat. I'm not concerned with cosmetic appearance, but want a mechanically sound engine. I'm looking at older Jeeps ranging from 1988-1995. Can anyone tell me when the transition was made from carbureted engines to fuel injected engines? Any other engine/transmission problems I should avoid? Thanks for you help!

madman390 · February 2002

First off, welcome to the board. This is a good place to ask those types of questions, and to get some good advice.

The first thing you must ask yourself is what do you want to do with your Jeep. Will this be your daily driver? Do you plan on doing some off-roading? If so, how much and how severe? How big do you want your tires/wheels to be? What is the weather like where you will be driving this?

All of this should drive what options you get on your Jeep. I ordered the factory ABS, and I am happy with it. But there are some things to keep in mind.

The factory ABS will preclude you from ordering the larger wheel package. This by itself is not a problem, because you can upgrade your tires and wheels later. I've spoken to a few other people, dealership included, and they all agree that getting bigger tires/wheels will not affect the ABS.

However, ordering the ABS package will also prevent you from getting the Dana44 axle. The Dana35 is what you'll get. This is a fine axle, but you should not go bigger than 33inch tires with this axle, as you are then putting extra strain on them which could cause failure. Don't get scared off the Dana35, though, for all on-pavement, and moderate (not extreme rock-crawling) off-roading, it will be just fine.

Finally, on every vehicle with ABS, the stopping distance is actually a little longer than without. This can be especially unnerving if you have to slam on your brakes on dirt, gravel, or snow. You will remain in control of the vehicle and not lock up your tires, but the stopping distance will be a little longer.

Sorry this is so long, and I hope this helps. Another linke to get some more ABS specific info is http://http://4x4abc.com/4WD101/ABS_offroad.html although that guy doesn't seem to be in favor of ABS on an off-road vehicle.

madman

PS--you should also get the TRAC-LOK feature, unless you plan on adding after-market lockers.

twylie · February 2002

'91 and up gets you fuel injection in the 6 cyl. I believe the 4cyl had it prior to that but don't know the cut off year if any. If you are going to be doing any towing, I'd recommend the 6 cyl. HTH.

-twylie

tsjay · February 2002

Heck if I know.

All I know is that I don't have a rub. I have never tried disconnecting the sway bars, so I can't tell you if the 31's would rub under that condition.

Sure can tell you that I love those BFG's, though. They are really nice on the highway, and I have only been offroading once, so I can't comment on how they are offroad compared to other tires. They seemed to do fine that one time that I was offroad with them. I have the All Terrains in the 31x10.50 size on the stock canyon wheels.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

buddy31 · February 2002

I am new to posting questions so here it goes. I am looking for all the good info on jeeps from 98-2002. All the things I should be looking at for a good used one for my primary vehicle. Full doors and soft top are a must. Any advice? E.

goducks1 · February 2002

IMHO, most options depend on what you want to use the Jeep for besides a daily driver. The door/top choice is usually the hardest one, but make sure you get A/C no matter what. I didn't (thinking it was a convertible) and later ended up having it retrofitted.

Get one with the 4.0L engine if you can at all afford it, there are no significant mileage gains with the 2.5L. Nobody who gets the 6 wished they had bought a 4-banger but a lot of people who get the 4 wish they had the 6.

Be aware the automatic is a primitive 3-speed with no overdrive that will suck gas and shorten the life of your engine since it runs at higher RPMS than the engine was designed for the highway. Stay with the stick.

Other nice amenities: a soundbar, cloth seats, the "convenience package" (full sized spare, tilt steering column, center console) and so on. Don't worry about the things you can easily upgrade yourself like the stereo, tires, and so on. Again, these are all personal lifestyle sorts of choices, and if you are looking at used Jeeps, then you are going to get some that you may or may not want.

tidester · February 2002

Welcome to the Town Hall! We're glad you decided to jump into the discussion and we're looking forward to hearing a lot more from you!

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2001wrangler · February 2002

Welcome to our group! goducks summed up everything pretty well, but one thing that I would look closely for on a used TJ is the underside of the Jeep. Is there a large amount of mud caked all over the frame or signs it has been abused off-road (scrapes, dents and the like on the oil pan or t-case)?

I definitely agree about the 6 cyl and 5 speed!

anonymous02 · February 2002

I was wondering about 4 vs. 6 cylinder, but from everything I read, they got close to the same gas mileage with way more power out of the 6.

I got a 1997. I would recommend the most basic unless you want AC (Texas, Florida, ...) or plan on heavy offroad driving, in which I'd recommend the Dana44.

The ABS is pretty optional, and the 1/2 doors are nice. I went all winter (so far) with cloth doors, no problemo.

Stereo and tires can be done at any time after the fact.

mtngal · February 2002

Some extra thoughts (I agree with all that has been said before, except I prefer the hard top - good for 3 feet of snow). If you live in a warm climate get the tinted windows. I have a black Wrangler with a black top and the tinted windows make it more bearable on hot days. Mine came with fog lights (which I didn't care about when I bought it) but when I moved to the mountains I found out how necessary they are in bad weather. The only thing I don't have, but wish I did is the sound bar.

twylie · February 2002

Welcome to the group. One thing not mentioned yet is that Wranglers hold their value pretty well. When we were looking last year, we found that 10k in miles and age may only be worth a couple thousand dollars. With the 7/100 powertrain and other incentives DC is offering, new vehicles are more attractive than ever. This gets compounded by the minimal depreciation hit a 1-2 year old Jeep will see. You may want to look at and drive as many Jeeps as possible to find out exactly what options you want. Once you narrow down the list, you can shop for "the one" to see how competitive a new vehicle is compared to a slightly used one. If you plan on keeping it for a while, the additional warranty alone may make it worth buying a new one.

As far as options, make sure you get the ones you can't change. An engine or tranny swap isn't an easy change, but with some patience and $, you can swap the top or doors if you found the "perfect" Jeep that happened to have the "wrong" doors or top. If you find one with a hard top, you'd be able to sell it to fund a soft top purchase with cash left over. It may take some manuevering and time, but if you get the engine, tranny, and color you want, just about everything else can be swapped out to suit your needs. Once you get it, you'll wonder (like many of the rest of us) why it took you so long to own one.

Keep posting additional ?'s as you shop. Lots of knowledge around buying cars on this board. Many of us are new to Jeeps, but are glad to share what we know.

-twylie

hype · February 2002

I have read the postings from time to time on this site and find the advice/opinions of great interest as I am a recent owner of 2002 Wrangler X; 6 cyl/5 speed. I have a quick question: I hear a very subtle and quiet clicking/tapping noise when I am accelerating in 1st and 2nd gears only-I do not hear this noise in any other gear. I am curious if anyone else hears this noise or knows what I am talking about? It is really a soft sound and may be normal-I don't know? Have there been any posts about something like this in the past? I am going to ask the dealer about it when I take it in for her first oil change-but I thought I would appeal to this panel of folks that seem to know Wranglers pretty well. Thanks!

markbuck · February 2002

Is the Off Road Edition real?

Trying to decide to buy now vs wait till early summer.

Thanks!

bamatazz · February 2002

Yes is is real...its called the Jeep Rubicon..
Will have 31" tires..D-44 front & real axles.
plus other neat offroad goodies..
I belive it will be MSRP around 28,5...
there are several web sites with pics..
looks very good..

bama

appstate88 · February 2002

That's what I enjoy about this site- Lots of good, common sense advice!

If you decide to buy new, now is a great time with the improvements, especially with the 4 ply top!

And unless you find a great deal on used, new may be the way to go. When I bought my wife's 98 Sahara we did a lot of research. And the drop in value was very small for new. We have only lost a few thousand in value over 4 years!

But we also plan on keeping it a long time. We have a 72 Super Beetle that my wife drove in College, (I won't tell you how long ago that was!)So we become attached to our vehicles.

But be aware of the rough side of a Wrangler. You will find Wrangler Owners love their Vehicles in spite of (Because of...?) it's faults.

Wranglers are loud on the highway and can be a bit drafty in the Winter. The back seats aren't very comfortable for anyone over the age of 10, and it has the aerodynamics of a brick.

It is what it is, and we wouldn't own anything else!

Good luck and we will look forward to more postings on your progress toward the Promised Land!

AppState88

anonymous02 · February 2002

"And unless you find a great deal on used, new may be the way to go."

I got a pretty good deal on a nice 1997 last August.

"Wranglers are loud on the highway"

Not too too bad, and that is with BFG AT tires. I'd imagine other tires would be much quieter.

"...and can be a bit drafty in the Winter."

Not bad so far up here in Massachusetts.

"...The back seats aren't very comfortable for anyone over the age of 10"

Actually, my parents rode in the back for an hour at Christmas, and didn't mind it one bit, and they are the type to let you know if there was a problem!

"It is what it is, and we wouldn't own anything else!"

Test drive one, and see for yourself. I was surprised that it rode as well as it does. I guess the coil springs made a difference.

ol_mari · February 2002

Hello all,
I am considering buying a Jeep Wrangler...I am so infatuateed by its legend,looks and reputation that I am looking for good reasons to buy it. Im not much of an offroader and I do a lot of long distance driving.

My concerns are about noise, handling,stability and comfort suring highway driving. Can the wrangler be used as a commuter vehicle??Would I be better of with a used one?Can i drive a soft top in the snowy winter?(cleveland). I'd appreciate any response.

oldjeepguy · February 2002

Hey guys and gals -- it's been a while since my last posting, but I've been keeping up with all your messages in the meantime. My 2000 Sahara and I just completed our first year -- almost 9000 fun and absolutely trouble-free miles together -- couldn't ask for more.
My question for all the Wrangler wheel and tire experts I know are out there: my Jeep has the five-spoke 16 x 7" aluminum wheels and P225/70R16 Michelin LTX/MS tires that were standard equipment on the 2000 Sahara. I love the look of the wheels, and don't want to change them, but I'd like to go with a somewhat bigger, more aggressive tire. I've been told that a switch to larger tires, particularly 30 inchers, isn't possible with my wheels due to hub offset limitations. My Wrangler is not lifted, and I do little, but some, mild off-roading.
Anybody have experience with fitting larger tires on those 2000/2001 stock five-spoke Sahara rims? I'd sure appreciate any advice/reccomendations, short of switching wheels.
Thanks everybody, and, yes, I hugged her this morning....

mac24 · February 2002

With 16 or 15 inch wheels, problems with the fitting of larger tires arise from an increase in width, rather than an increase in diameter.
This is normally felt on-road at full lock, and off-road at extreme flex. On-road this can be compensated for, within moderation, by putting washers behind the steering stops, thus decreasing the amount of lock available and preventing the tire from rubbing on the sway bar or chassis. It obviously also decreases the size of your turning circle.
From what you say, this minor modification should be applicable to your circumstances, and should allow you to go up to a tire that has an equivalent dimension to a 31 x 10.5.

tsjay · February 2002

Yes, a Jeep is OK for commuting, assuming you are really ready to give up cargo room, soft ride, cornering, stability in the wind, and gas mileage, and that you are willing to put up with some highway and wind noise.

What you get in return is FUN!

I owned my Thelma Jane (2001 Sport) for over a year before I ever took her offroading, and even on the pavement, she was the most enjoyable vehicle to drive that I have ever owned.

For the first seven months that I had her, I drove her to work every day, which is a round trip of 54 miles. I also have taken her on business trips of up to 300 miles one way. It was not a problem at all. To me, the fun of driving a Jeep made up for all those negatives that I listed in the first paragraph ten times over!

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

tidester · February 2002

It's good to see you back - I hope we don't have to wait another whole year to hear from you again!

tidester
Host
SUVs

geepers · February 2002

Hello all. I've had a Wrangler since '91 and when I wear it out I'm ready to buy another. The many people I've talked to tell me the 4.0 liter is gonna' last forever and so far it's proving them correct.

I'd have to say though, that the Wrangler is such a unique vehicle that any potential buyers with no previous experience might want to rent one for a weekend or so. They aren't for everyone.

Mine goes round trip to work 60+ miles every day and forest service roads when I get some hiking time. I can turn around in the smallest spaces when I find I have gone down the wrong logging road. It's gone up and down the west coast 4 round trips. Twice with two people and three large mutts. I put a piece of plywood over the wheel wells for the dogs to lay on and stored a little luggage under it. There was some snarling over dog space but all in all not too bad.

The ex also had a Wrangler, a four-cylinder. I wouldn't consider anything but the 4.0 liter after lots of time driving both. The 4.0 makes a fun vehicle a great deal more fun. I've only had the 5-speed manual although I test drove the automatic. I found it lacking but it was a short drive.

I suppose it sounds like a country western song, but the dogs and I are still riding around in the Jeep. The ex upon leaving promptly bought an Outback with leather this, electric that, and a heated bun warmer. I think I'm having more fun and the muddy dogs agree.

Gary

mtngal · February 2002

Noise? Well, mine has a hard top and I haven't tried the new soft tops, so I can't compare, but it is noisier than some of the other cars I've owned. It isn't that much noisier than the Tacoma.

Handling? As someone said above, it turns on a dime and gives you change. However, that also translates into touchy steering at freeway speeds.

Stability? It's as stable as any other vehicle, as long as you drive within it's capabilities. It is terrible in the wind. So I don't drive it much beyond 65-70 mph. Also it gets much better gas mileage when you keep it under 70, something to think about with that thirsty 4.0L engine.

Highway comfort/commuter vehicle? Highway comfort is excellent (from '98 on when they redid the suspension system) if you don't mind the bouncy ride. I chose to drive it on a long distance vacation over the better economy of the Taco because it has far more comfortable seats. I really do look for excuses to take it on our frequent Vegas trips (I have family there), though economy and a mild desire to try to keep the miles on it down usually win out.

I've used it as an only vehicle for about 6 months and would probably still be doing that except that I got worried about the miles I was putting on it and the cost of gas. It is still my winter commuter car (though we have had hardly any winter this year).

New or used? I'd go new, especially if you are going to have it as a primary car. The cost of used ones is pretty high in relation to new, in fact my '98 with all those miles (its now up to 94,000 - mild winter this year) is worth quite a bit - more than my 2000 Taco (which has 55,000 miles on it).

Final thought? I love my Wrangler and would definitely buy it again. I'll replace it with another Wrangler and have even toyed with the idea of buying another one to replace my hated Taco (though that doesn't make sense). So if you don't mind its many drawbacks, then get one - you won't regret it. Just don't expect it to be something its not.

jptj · February 2002

I agree with tsjay on commuting. I drive a total of 700 miles a week, 252 miles one way on Monday and Friday.
Soft Top in winter? All my Jeeps Have Soft Tops I just brush off the snow and go.

anonymous02 · February 2002

Well, the Jeep is not a real good commuter car, in fact, that is probably its worst application. They are noisier, less efficient, and slower.

That said, they are fun, the styling you already like, and they are an inexpensive convertible. You can drown noise with a stereo and lessen noise with highway tires. You can get some 255/70R15 tires in a "performance ish" tread which will probably be quieter and give some better braking and handling than the stock tires. Just don't try to corner too fast, it is a Jeep, not a car.

Your best bet is a used TJ. You can get a 97 for probably around 11-12 K dollars by now. These are the first year with the coil springs, and ride nicer than the leaf sprung, older ones.

Good luck in your quest.

anonymous02 · February 2002

When taking a "quick" right hand corner, it makes a power steering/hydraulic like noise. Any ideas?

Also, after offroading one time, it makes kind of a "grinding, dragging" noise in right rear. Could it be dirt in the brake drum?

Thanks.

Have a groovy weekend everybody!

tsjay · February 2002

Aren't we just a bunch of jabber jaws in here? Where IS everyone?

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

oceantoad · February 2002

I figured all you Jeep owners were out having fun in your Wranglers.

Us non-Jeep-owners are busy trimming hooves and dosing fire ant mounds. Plus had three new baby goats dropped today that needed to be checked on every so often (not sure how the new Great Pyrenees will treat the babies).

You figure all of the folks asking about buying Wranglers have already decided on what they are going to do?

I am still aiming for 15 April as my order date. Once again, how do you track the progress of the building of the vehicle and the shipping?

When are we going to see those pictures of you playing in the mud?

tsjay · February 2002

I still have the film in the camera from my trip to Turkey Bay and haven't shot the remaining frames yet. The link below is to my "guide's" pictures that he took that day with a digi. RodDawg was the experienced wheeler who was nice enough to meeet me at Turkey Bay and keep me out of trouble.

http://community.webshots.com/user/roddawg9

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

twylie · February 2002

Check out:

http://www.ewylie.com/jeep/ordering.htm

This was the info I compiled when ordering ours last year. One of the other posters here found that Union Pacific also has a rail car tracking system, but I haven't updated my page yet. That link is:

http://my.uprr.com/pet/

HTH

-twylie

markbuck · February 2002

I'm gonna wait on the better seats in the '03 and make a decision on rubicon vs sport based on price.

I'm assuming the front seat travel and back seat ease of removal will be across the line and not just on the Rubicon.

thebiggestbird · February 2002

Anybody know where I could order some short door holder straps? I know this topic was discussed in the past. As we all know, the factory straps are just too long, and cause those doors to swing out too far. I thought there was a company out on the net that has shorter ones? Thanks.

goducks1 · February 2002

I'm sure you could find them at www.quadratec.com or www.4wd.com, but beware, some little neuron is firing off in my brain right now and telling me they are a steel horse product and that someone here had trouble with them. An easier solution may just be to put a few twists in the ones you have, which would have the same effect.

cklausing · February 2002

You can indeed get them through quadratec, as I remember seeing them a couple of days ago when I was at wor^H^H^H home, drooling over all the great stuff that I can't afford at the moment.

As for the twist method, it works pretty well, though I occasionally have an issue with the straps popping off the bar. Not sure if it is annoying enough to justify spending money on something so trivial. Probably be easier all around to just rig something up, but well, I just haven't got around to it yet.

bamatazz · February 2002

try thinkjeep.com also...
I think they are about 10.00 for a pair..

Hello Jeepers... Bama is still here...
been sick past few days.....I'l be posting again soon..

Keep Jeepin
BT

anonymous02 · February 2002

I saw the smile on your face in all that mud.

I thought you said you'd never do it!!!???

anonymous02 · February 2002

Hey you guys.

Everyone here seems pretty gung ho on their SUV, right?

For fun and giggles, go over to "I don't like SUV's, why do you?" and post a few reasons why and hold on for some excitement.

tsjay · February 2002

I never thought I would either!

It sure was fun! I think I'm gonna swear off the mud, though. Lots of folks that I chat with in Gill's say that mud can cause long term damage by getting into places where you don't want it.

I will take the occsional mudhole that you just can't avoid sometimes when you are offroading, but I won't go out of my way to go through mudholes. Glad I did it once, but that's enough.

Guess Thelma will be happy today. Have to take a fairly short business trip, and I think I will drive her instead of the S-10. We have about an inch of snow, and there are places where the snow has melted an re-frozen, so the roads will be slick in places. It won't be a four wheel drive situation, but still she ought to do better with those All Terrains than that little S-10 with regular tires and no weight in the bed.

tsjay

Have you hugged your Jeep today?

tjx02 · February 2002

I haven't heard this noise in mine, same specs. I have noticed a strange noise when coasting in gear with the clutch in. Anyone else have that one?

tjx02 · February 2002

I bought my 02 X in September of last year at the ripe old age of 35. I had a 97 Mazda pickup. I LUV MY TJ. I test drove one just to get it out of my system. Half a mile from the dealership I was hooked. Life is short folks. If you want one and can afford it, get one. If you regret it, sell it.

tjx02 · February 2002

I gotta check in here more often! My .02 on a few topics.
Re: Anti-lock brakes. I don't have ABS, but did on my last vehicle. It is a strange feeling the first few times you really slam the brakes, but haven't had any problems so far.
Re: Tops/doors. unless you have a garage and lift, go for the soft top. Mine is quiet enough to hold a conversation at hiway speed and warms up quickly. Also have half doors. Thought the full metal looked a bit silly with the top off, plus I bought off the lot and they didn't have one in my color. The only downside is going thru drive thrus on wet days. Besides, don't you feel a bit sad for those Jeeps with hard tops on sunny afternoons? I can be topless and gone in under 15 minutes and still have some birds*%t protection while parked.
Re: me. just to save scrolling. My TJ is an '02X, silverstone/black top/agate interior, conv. pkg, sound package, wheel plus group and AC. And I'm a waver.
L8r,
Phillip

dadegraham · February 2002

Hey guys... I am new here and just wanted to say hello. I have been following the forum for a while and look forward to posting. I just got a 01 Sport in Solar Yellow. I got the 2001 because I got such a good deal and it still only has 27 miles on it. I got it for $19,000 with the 30" Canyon Tire and Wheel Group, Dana 44 Axle, Fog lamps and tow hooks, Tinted windows, air, cruise, CD player, sentry key, and side steps. I think it was a pretty good deal and I am very excited.

I used to have an SE but this time I just had to get the I-6 as the difference in power is noticable to me. It looks great in the garage! I can't wait until it warms up enough to get that top down. I am in Memphis and it is cold and wet here for a few days.... :-(

Michael

tidester · February 2002

We're glad you're here too and look forward to hearing a lot more from you! Congrats on your new Jeep.

tidester
Host
SUVs

tsjay · March 2002

CONGRATS! I know you will have a ball with that Jeep! I'm sure happy for you.

That does sound like a real deal that you got.

Be a frequent poster here. Welcome to the group.

tsjay

Have you huggeg your Jeep today?

dadegraham · March 2002

Hey guys.... I need some advice. The wrangler I just got has a CD player and the sound bar plus the standard 4x6 speakers up front. I think the sound bar speakers are decent but there is no bass at all. I don't want to let the neighborhood hear me but I am looking for a way to get some bass for listening pleasure. Do you all have any recommendations without spending alot of money? Also should I upgrade the factory speakers too?? Thanks so much!

Michael

mtngal · March 2002

Congrats on the new jeep! Let us know how things are going.

tsjay - I don't do much in the mud - there isn't any around here. In fact, we haven't seen more than a dusting since December! One can always hope...

anonymous02 · March 2002

Congratulations!

Sounds like a good deal to me!

Enjoy!

anonymous02 · March 2002

I am looking to upgrade stereo also.

The 1.5 DIN selection is limited, but I do like the Jensen 615X with the large buttons and display.

Otherwise, I am thinking of getting the Scoshe CJ1968 dash fit kit which has a little pocket which is good for cd's, wallet, gum, mints, cigs, what have you to use up the .5 DIN spot. I hate to see space wasted.

I have been looking and looking, and cannot find a decent stereo/CD receiver which has a knob for volume and one for tuning. I really dislike the digital pushbuttons. The closest I have found are the Nakamichi, but they are too costly for a Jeep.

hmmmmmmmm.

Jeep Wrangler

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