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Ford Five Hundred/Mercury Montego

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Comments

  • biscuit1941biscuit1941 Member Posts: 31
    I have been in several forums on this subject and have not recieved any advice. I AM and old man with limited back flexibility and mobility. I want a car like the 500 but do not want to buy a Ford.
    Does anyone know of any other sedans (NOT minivans or SUVs) that have the high seats and easy exit/egress of the 500. I will buy it! :confuse: :confuse:
  • samchinchsamchinch Member Posts: 47
    Volvo
  • Toyota Avalon.
  • pnewbypnewby Member Posts: 277
    Is it just Ford, or all Ford products? The Mercury Montego is the same as the 500.
  • biscuit1941biscuit1941 Member Posts: 31
    Thanks, folks. Volvo is owned by Ford, and yes it is the Ford corporation.
    I will look at the Avalon. Appreciate the input. :)
  • bruneau1bruneau1 Member Posts: 468
    The Buick Lucerne is pretty comforable. Most sedans sit too low, have limited headroom with a moonroof.
  • mschmalmschmal Member Posts: 1,757
    I don't want to go there again.

    Mark....
  • Karen_SKaren_S Member Posts: 5,092
    A large local newspaper is looking to interview consumers who have recently purchased a Ford Fusion, Milan, Five Hundred or waiting to purchase the Ford Edge. Please send an e-mail to ctalati@edmunds.com no later than Wednesday, September 6, 2006 by 5:30 PM PT/8:30 PM ET containing your daytime contact information.
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Member Posts: 792
    Does anyone know if there will be any improvements to the 2008 model interiors, (e.g. a telescoping steering wheel, nicer materials, a nicer and narrower console)?
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Member Posts: 792
    Although I have an Edge on order, I really would prefer a sedan, preferably one with an elevated seating position, and the cargo space of the Five Hundred and Montego is even better for my needs that that in a CUV / SUV. The combination of no telescoping steering wheel and the over-sized boxy console makes it impossible for me to sit comfortably in the current versions, the current interior is cheaply finished, and the current engine and CVT are far too noisy.

    We all know that the 2008 models coming out in early 2007 will be shown at the Detroit show, and will have the new 3.5 V6 and GM-Ford 6-speed automatic, and will have enhanced front and rear exterior styling. What about the interior? Bill Ford has mentioned something about a revised interior, but why haven't any photos been taken of the new interior, if there is one?

    In fact, why is Ford waiting? All of the vehicles which might compete with the Five Hundred are already on the market, or are so close to being on sale that photos and detailed specifications have been published. The only exception is the next Accord, although plenty of people would dispute that it and the Five Hundred / Montego compete. Therefore, what has Ford got to loose by ending the secrecy about the revised Five Hundred and Montego?

    The sales of the current models will not decrease, but Ford stands a good chance of causing people to delay purchases of vehicles if they have all of the information on the revised Five Hundred and Montego. Why not release photos, specifications, and show the new versions in Anaheim? If they are not finished by now, Ford is in far greater trouble than any of us imagined.
  • ANT14ANT14 Member Posts: 2,687
    No one has gotten close enough to take interior pictures of the mules.
  • And likely no one has cared enough to make the effort. (I'm not knocking its obvious good qualities, but even with the new front end, there are few cars on the road that are as anonymous as this one.)
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Member Posts: 792
    I have recently heard that the 2008 model will indeed have a new instrument panel (I sure hope that also means a new console), and that the Limited will also have a feature which some Cadillacs have....

    It will depend on the dealerships - if they order and promote the cars with the new styling / features and the new engine and transmission, they should finally sell very well.
  • frizz2112frizz2112 Member Posts: 84
    Here's a couple of shots of a 2008 500 test mule:

    http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=118930

    I was sort of hoping against logic that they'd do more than the usual Ford front and rear fascia band aids, but it looks like the 500 will remain a wall flower for now. Let's hope they take care of business with the interior.

    The new 3.5 should be a nice addition though.
  • Big whoop. Like that's going to tear up the sales charts now. BTW, these are the first posts since October.
  • jkinzeljkinzel Member Posts: 735
    Put a diesel in it and it will be on my list. Nice car, but lousy mileage, the 3.5L will make it a bigger looser. Put a 2.2L - 3.0L diesel in this car and you might have something.
  • frizz2112frizz2112 Member Posts: 84
    Lousy mileage? What are you basing this on? My father has a 500 AWD/ CVT and he's routinely getting into the high 20's on the highway. That's pretty darned good for a vehicle this size.

    I agree about the diesel option though, and in more Ford vehicles than just the 500.
  • jkinzeljkinzel Member Posts: 735
    It’s not bad mileage, however, (without getting on the soap box) when one considers all the environmental and political issues in today’s world, we (consumers, corporations and the Government) need to get more mileage out of a barrel of crude.

    I agree, the 500 with the 3.0L getting 29mpg highway is not bad, but, with a diesel getting 35 to 42mpg would be great.
  • evandroevandro Member Posts: 1,108
    Out of a barrel of crude one gets twice as much gas as Diesel. However, Diesel cars mileage is just about 30% to 50% better, which means that in the end more barrels of crude would have to be mined.

    This is no surprise, as Europe is experiencing this very issue, having to export gas cheaply to the US and importing huge amounts of refined Diesel fuel to keep 30% of its car fleet running.

    Not to mention the cost to clean the Diesel engine exhaust to American standards (Diesel engines are allowed to pollute more than gas engines in Europe) and the poor NVH relative to gas engines, even in modern Diesel engines.

    HTH
  • I'd like to see some data that shows you can actually get 2 gallons of liquid gasoline out of one gallon of crude. One thing I do know is that diesel fuel is much closer to crude in composition. Therefore, it takes less energy and expense to refine. So, no matter how you cut it, it is not a straighforward comparison between the two.
  • evandroevandro Member Posts: 1,108
    See for yourself: http://austingasprices.com/crude_products.aspx

    Now, if you only put enough energy to refine just Diesel out of crude, you'll have to throw away almost half of each barrel. Not very wise...

    HTH
  • Um, excuse me, I don't mean to be impertinent, but the stats in that link show how much gas, fuel oil, diesel, kerosene, etc., are MADE FROM EACH BARREL. It adds up to 42 gallons per barrel.

    That about 19 gallons of each barrel becomes gasoline and about 10 gallons of each barrel becomes diesel and fuel oil speaks to product demand, but says nothing about what energy it takes to refine either one--or even how many gallons of gas or diesel you would get if you used all 42 gallons of crude to make either one. I mean it's not like you really think it takes 42 gallons of crude to make 0.04 gallons of aviation fuel, do you?
  • evandroevandro Member Posts: 1,108
    It is not about the demand of different products, but about the yield form a barrel of crude. Here's another reference: http://www.energy.ca.gov/gasoline/whats_in_barrel_oil.html

    As I said, one can only extract so much Diesel fuel from a barrel of crude, and this amount in volume is much less than gas. Diesel fuel is made up by long HC chains and there is a limited amount in a typical barrel. This limit determines how much of each fuel type can be extracted from crude in factional distillation. The result is that the ratio of gas and Diesel cannot be set arbitrarily.

    Think of a barrel of crude as a solution of several fuels and the refining process just separates its components. Therefore, there's only so much gas and so much Diesel in a barrel of crude, roughly 2 to 1.
  • Sorry, your interpretation of what you are reading or presenting is not correct. (Even if your interpretation was correct, then should we use that amount of diesel that can be extracted from your conception of a barrel's constituents or not?...I think most people would agree it ought to be used in diesel cars and trucks rather than be discarded). But have it your way...this is not something you are willing to clear up in your mind, and not something that it is worth it to me to debate...but I do wonder how it is that you apparently think that California crude can produce only a fixed ratio of constituent products that differs significantly from the amounts shown on your previous link (aviation fuel difference for example). ;)
  • mschmalmschmal Member Posts: 1,757
    Am I on the wrong topic?

    Mark.
  • No, I am. I apologize for that. No more diesel comments!
  • bp027bp027 Member Posts: 5
    Any one know if the 08 will have stability control? After reading numerous articles, it has become a top priority in any future automotive purchase.
  • mschmalmschmal Member Posts: 1,757
    Ford stated they would have stability control fleet wide by the 2009 model year. Assume that the 08 refresh of the 500 will get it. Fed rules requires stability control in all new cars by 2012.

    Coincidently, Consumer reports rated Ford's AdvancTrac in the Explorer quite highly, especially compared to some other brands who have "standard" stability control.

    Mark.
  • walterquintwalterquint Member Posts: 89
    I'm convinced the 500 is superior to any mid-size sedan. It has so much room inside. Its only weakness is its 200hp Duratec. Ford should've offered the 250hp at inception. As usual, late to the party. Everyone, esp. auto journalists, have branded the 500 as "underpowered". Let's hope that changes, the 500 deserves better.
  • barnstormer64barnstormer64 Member Posts: 1,106
    I'd rather have the Five Hundred with the 3.0L Duratec and the CVT than with a 5-speed transmission and the 3.5L Duratec.

    I still maintain that the vast majority of those who brand the Five Hundred as "underpowered" wouldn't actually USE any more power than is available in the current engine if they had the 3.5L available. Instead, they simply want to get the same power, but at lower rpm.

    I'll take the higher rpm's along with a transmission that can get me there (and back) SMOOTHLY. And that's exactly what the CVT does.
  • Don't neglect another weakness...it is so plain that no one at all notices it.
  • barnstormer64barnstormer64 Member Posts: 1,106
    There's nothing wrong with being "plain" and "unnoticed". It has several very positive effects: it doesn't get stolen often, and you don't get pulled over very often.
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 19,250
    i doubt if i will ever get another vehicle without a moonroof. they are great, although not as good as a convertible. in the summer crack it open to let the excess heat out. if it is not too sunny, you can open a rear window too, and save using the a/c. in the winter let in some of that precious daylight. :)
    2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • fsmmcsifsmmcsi Member Posts: 792
    Wow! It seems that Ford has listened, as far, far more was changed on the 2008 model than just the engine, transmission, and front and rear styling. They re-did the interior and made significant changes to the suspension, body, and so forth. I look forward to driving one.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    They added lots of missing features, so now all the feature list boxes are checked.
    People who were on the fence and were waiting for more power, satellite radio, auxiliary audio input, stability control, Bluetooth or a nav system may buy it now, but the styling still is not that great to attract many new buyers. The new grill only looks good in the photos where you look straight-on at the car from very close up. At an angle and from further away where you can see the rest of the body of the car, it doesn't look very good. The grill doesn't work as well on this car as it does on the boxier Fusion.
    I wonder about the fuel economy and pricing.
    It should be a good choice for crash safety anyway.
    Not exciting even compared to the other conservative sedans it competes against, but is an improvement and should sell a few more than before unless pricing is too high.
  • ANT14ANT14 Member Posts: 2,687
    Click Here

    It's a very substantial update that addressed many, if not all the comments that many people had over the vehicle. Many of them, not expected.

    It's not about a new drivetrain, rather, all the other little things as well. My personal favorite is the FordSync system, which no one expected. And yes, stability control available as well, and favorite other high-tech gadgets.
  • barnstormer64barnstormer64 Member Posts: 1,106
    But how does that 6-speed compare to the CVT?

    I love my CVT . . the Freestyle is one of the reasons I got the Five Hundred, and so I made sure that I got one with a CVT in it.
  • frizz2112frizz2112 Member Posts: 84
    I have mixed feelings about this one. I like the fact that Ford really seemed to listen and take care of a lot of the options that people seem to want, and there seems to be lots of small improvements (and a big improvement under the hood) that might add up to something substantial. Unfortunately I don't think the exterior styling is much of an improvement; in fact, it looks to me like the standard Ford mid product cycle front and rear fascia band aids. I've always observed that Ford's original product releases tend to look better than when the products are refreshed a few years later, because the exterior changes on the refreshed products tend to look tacked on to the original design rather than truly integrated into it. The new 500 doesn't seem to be an exception. I like the idea of using the Fusion grille, but in this application it just seems very conservative and plain, while on the Fusion it looks modern and unique. I think part of this is that on the Fusion you have more interesting headlamp shapes and the 2 chrome strips under the grille. It also works better on the Edge because of the more interesting headlamp shapes. On the 500 the whole "face" of the vehicle comes off as one rectangular block. It reminds me a bit of some of the Crown Vic front ends over the past several years; not something bold and new.

    I think the 500 will stack up well on paper vs its competition, but it still looks like it will blend into traffic. I'd expect a modest bump in sales at most from the refresh, and I'm not sure this will be enough to keep this car selling for the next couple of years.

    As a side note, I have to say that I'm losing faith in J Mays in particular and in Ford's design team in general. I have been a big Mays fan over the years, but I'm just not seeing consistently good designs coming from Ford. He's been there long enough so that he can't say that these products were all in the pipeline when he got there as we heard for a while. They've done some great concept vehicles, but what actually makes it to the showroom is hit and miss, and no strong theme has emerged in their design other than a 3 bar grille that works for some vehicles and doesn't for others.
  • gene_vgene_v Member Posts: 235
    I really liked the old design better. The only critisms that I had was the underpowered engine and the width of the center console and the footspace. As I look at the new console pics it is still too wide. And I don't know if they fixed the footspace.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    The 2008 Five Hundred and a few other Ford models have a lot of cool new optional features.
    One that looks interesting is the new voice recognition system that you can synch with both your cell phone and portable music players.

    What do you think of this?

    http://www.syncmyride.com/
  • mschmalmschmal Member Posts: 1,757
    After driving the new Edge, the 6 speed is unbelieveablely smooth. Almost CVT smooth. And you don't have to pay for a fluid change every 60k

    Mark.
  • ANT14ANT14 Member Posts: 2,687
    The 6A was needed to handle the power/torque of the new D35. But aside from that, it's a very sophisticated and advance transmission engineered jointly with GM. What differs are the computer related modules which are programmed independently for specific use on certain vehicles depending on the nature the vehicle aims for.
  • slider7slider7 Member Posts: 33
    If you do away with all of the attention-deficit gizmo's that distract you from the reality you're really buying, the 2008 will be faster and perhaps smoother in the tranny/engine dept. The candy-striped rear tail lights look silly. The new rear wheels don't appear to have the wider visual stance that the current Limited design has. The front end looks like a cross between the 80's L T D stationwagon/Ford Topaz meets HID. The front looks high and econobox instead of low and sophisticated, and squarish for a rounded/circular body/wheelwell shape and kinda reminiscent of the 87 88 89 Escort GT. The rear valance has a cutout for two little exhaust pipes not even centered within, on the left side. The only interior that looks sporty and rich is the all black leather option. The pebble, gray, or two tone looks cheap and plasticky. The new albino instrument cluster lacks contrast and the tiny plastic accents on top of the steering wheel and shifter won't impress the Cadillac folks out on the road. The original Five Hundred that was put down, kicked, and laughed at by critics has remodeled itself into more muscles, skin-deep chrome flash, lots of mental jewelry, and multiple personality disorder to boot. I recommend you run out and grab that 2006-2007 black, red, blue, white or merlot Five Hundred Limited with moonroof and black leather. I just hope you can still get 0.0 and $1000 cash in your pocket before the dealers find out. Mine has 6690 miles and only one synthetic oil change from Jiffy Lube at 3148 miles. I won't drop it off at some dealer and risk secret remapping of the onboard computers in order to cause "service engine" lights or other "mechanic engineered" troubles under factory warranty. Happy New Year!
  • mschmalmschmal Member Posts: 1,757
  • barnstormer64barnstormer64 Member Posts: 1,106
    After driving the new Edge, the 6 speed is unbelieveablely smooth. Almost CVT smooth. And you don't have to pay for a fluid change every 60k

    Hard to believe it can be as smooth as a CVT.

    How often DO you have to change the transmission fluid? I can't imagine going more than 60k miles. I can't imagine even going THAT long, really.
  • americanamerican Member Posts: 16
    when will the 08's be available for a test drive?will it be that much better than the 07's?
  • samnoesamnoe Member Posts: 731
    I hate to criticize, but this time I am getting really upset. What's up with that boring dated interior Ford is already using for the last couple of years? Both, the stereo system and temperature controls, needs to be drastically revised. Can't they just copy their own upcoming Focus?

    Looking over the photos of the auto show, I couldn't help but thinking that maybe the critics are right? Just look at the Hyundai Veracruz, and see the interior. It's a pleasure to look at! And so are other vehicles.

    It's time to wake up, Ford!
  • frizz2112frizz2112 Member Posts: 84
    I have to agree. It's not just the 500 either; Ford is getting left behind in interior design and quality of materials all over the place. I just had the chance to see a Saturn Outlook interior (Saturn!), and I was stunned at the quality of design and materials; far and away better than the Edge. Ford supposedly tripled their investment in interior designs a while back, but other then the F-150 and maybe the new Expedition, they seem behind in every segment interior design-wise. I've heard excuses that those investments won't take hold right away for about 5 years now. I've also heard rumors that Ford is stuck in some contracts with sub standard suppliers, but whatever the reason, the current crop of Ford interiors isn't cutting it. I had a '98 VW Passat and the interior on that car is still better than any car Ford has out right now. It's too bad, because GM has woken up on interior design, and their new offerings have improved unbelievably in that regard.

    And please, let's not go off on the tangent of "who cares about the quality of materials?" If you don't that's great, but I assure you most people do. Just as an example, I have a sister in law who was dead set on the Freestyle, until she actually sat in one. She said "it just felt cheap and cheesy." Now she's looking at a Subaru Tribecca, mainly because it "looks so luxurious inside." Who would have thought a few years back that Ford would be losing sales to the Korean makes, Saturn, Subaru and others, because of the quality of their interiors?
  • mschmalmschmal Member Posts: 1,757
    The Edge interior looks better in person than in photos. Ford is moving away from the "brick" style interiors. Check out the new Escape and the new Focus.

    The MKX and MKZ have great looking interiors with real wood. The Fusion interior is very nice as well.

    (If i had to choose between a Top of Dash display and a storage compartment as in the Fusion, I would rather have the storage.)

    Mark.
  • ANT14ANT14 Member Posts: 2,687
    Let's take note, we are comparing a vehicle that was imagined in 2001, using 1990's/2000 administration decisions/mindset, to debut in 2004 as a 2005, and we are comparing it to a 2008 vehicle?

    IN this regard, every vehicle being introduced each and every year will start to outdo one another, as they are redesigned. And it's very unlikely that a manufacturer will improve certain materials on the 2-3 year refresh cycle.

    Suppliers build to spec that the manufacturer has, and within all that legalities the only leverage they might have is IF a vehicle is released, and people critic materials for example, the contract might NOT allow for a change till it's renewed 4-5 years after, unless a hefty penalty is paid. Those are the little things that can slow things up.

    Also, VW/Audi are known for having some of the best interior materials in the industry. They actually are rated as having the highest "Perceived quality" index, but reality is, it's one of the most unreliable brands out there.

    Having known 12 friends that HAD (and will never own) another VW, I can tell you how well (or lack thereof) those materials held up 4-5 years after the fact. The rubbery door interior grab handles which fade. The door surround felt trim pieces that sags. Airbag cover corners starting to lift. Cupholders that broke earlier on. Footwell panels that won't clip into place correctly and pop out with slight kick. Turn signal stalk which looses it's texture and fades. Headliner starting to drop.

    And my personal favorite "The A/C doesn't smell mildewy Sir, it's just the outside air", next to the "I dont understand why you think the Jettas interior smell like burnt crayons, they smell perfectly fine to us".

    But anyhow, moving on...that is a sore topic for me being I was USED each time they needed my help at the dealership ever other week.
This discussion has been closed.