Cadillac CTS/CTS-V

sonjaab · March 2003

I love Black ! No drive thru or brush washes
here! I use a soft mitt with plenty of water.
Its a pain to keep nice tho. As is any dark color.
My last 4 trucks have been black. My Caddy is
white (ball and chains choice..LOL). That one
I run thru the automatic. White shows nothing!

sevenfeet0 · March 2003

blckthree is right. It's not that black cars are more prone to scratches, but they reveal imperfections much more easily that other colors. The big problem with automatic washes (and bad hand washes) are "spider-web" and "swirl" looking scratches. If you go to any parking lot and start looking at the hoods of cars, you will see them in many cars, especially those that have been taken to automatic washers. Basically they are tiny scratch lines in the clearcoat that are caused by hard brushes, or in some cases, rubbing hard dirt back into a finish with a dirty hand cloth.

You can avoid it by using clean 100% cotten terry cloth towels or appropiate safe synthetic equivelent when washing or drying. Lambs wool mitts work very well when washing too, which is what I use. And make sure you make lots of trips back to the bucket. If your car is really dirty, you may want to wash part of it, empty out the bucket, refill, and continue.

But you also need a good protective wax to protect the clearcoat finish. I use Meguire's although everyone has their favorite. Once you've done this step, you are less likely to have problems with these kinds of scratches.

b4z · March 2003

Nope. I keep water on the sponge and water on the car at all times. No spider web scratches on my navy blue impala.

I am a Mother's man. I started using the 3 step process on my freshly repaintd Camaro in '93.
A shine so deep and glossy you have to wear sun glasses to look at it.

Also after years of doing it by hand I bought a buffer. Lots faster and no swirl marks. but the wax gets in every nook and cranny.

mannytranny · March 2003

I have a black CTS and I always use a car wash. I really don't care what system they use , brushes or cloths. I like the swirl patterns that I get from them because since I rarely wax my car- the swirl marks add a bit of gloss reflection to the finish that is truly hard to match.
     If I hand wash my car which is even rarer than actually car washes I use whatever car soap that is cheap and on sale at Pep Boys or the supermarket. I only use one bucket and don't care how dirty the water gets. It will add more fine scratches and luster to the finish. Sponges are also great because you can see the swirls developing and control thier direction as you go. To rinse I use fresh water most of the time but as minimal as I can get.
     For drying the car(I sometimes don't because then I can always say that I just got caught in a shower and that's what the spots are from) I use old fabric remnants. I just let the cloth fibers get lost in the wind. Never use a chamois cloth because I wouldn't use a dead animal part and synthetic ones are just that... synthetic dead animal parts?
     For a wax finish which I do try to do at least once a year, again wax is wax, so whatever is cheap and on sale. It lets the neighbors see that I do wax my car and they're never close enough to see the wax bottle anyway. Sometimes the soapy film left on from a car wash or when I don't rinse good enough, adds some drama and mystery to the finish and gets people to get closer to see what is on the car surface.
     I just don't understand what all the fuss is concerning a black color on a CTS anyway!

akirby · March 2003

Then you're either very good or very lucky, or both. Wool mitts are much safer than sponges. But hey - it's your car.

I have a friend who believes the layer of dirt that he's built up on his car by not washing it is a protective layer. And he's only half joking.

b4z · March 2003

Funny you should say that.
On my '87 IROC the wheels are painted argent silver with a clearcoat over them.
Of course the front wheels get a lot of brake dust, while the back wheels get almost none.
Guess which wheels are not faded out and dull looking?
The front ones! I guess the brake dust protected the wheels from sun damage.
(IROC's have different front and rear offsets so the wheels are not rotated with the tires.)

wwhite2 · March 2003

I always seem to buy black cars except this time I traded my black Eldorado ETC for a garnet red CTS . I am happy ! I still think black is the best color especially for the CTS but I DO NOT miss trying to keep a black car shiny> Now I need to get another color Ram automatic washes are really risky propositions and I only use in the dead of winter I use a wool mitt and one of those california squeegees

b4z · March 2003

Post some some pics of how your black beauty looks now so we can compare them to your original pics.
Would like to see if the scratches show up. LOL.

jemiller · March 2003

Never again. I've had a number of them. Never again.

Not only is it near-impossible to keep them looking clean - because the car gets hotter, and retains more heat, the interior, all the trim, etc. all ages faster if you park outdoors in the sun at all.

cjs2002 · March 2003

well I was going to get an 03 Altima... but my faterh pesterd me to go look at the CTS... he said with the money I want to spend on the Altima, I could easily get a CTS... well we went to the cleveland auto show this past weekened and I sat in a CTS.. I instantly fell in love with it... I love everything from the outside to the inside of this car... unfortunatly I'm one of those people who can't drive stick shift to well so I need to get one with an auto in it... I'm hopin to get into a CTS soon... I really like them...

wwhite2 · March 2003

go for it you wont be sorry they are great automobiles .

scottc8 · March 2003

The best thing you can do, assuming you're ordering your car, is to tell the dealer to do NOTHING in the way of prep to it. No waxing, and especially NO BUFFING. Most of the swirls you see in new cars were inflicted by the ham-handed "professionals" dealers hire to wash & wax new cars before delivery. Tell 'em to hose off the dirt, then take it home and do it right yourself.

b4z · March 2003

Interesting spelling of the word father in post #2198. Are any relation to Goldmember?

cu95 · March 2003

Thanks, for all the feedback on the black paint question. Definitely food for thought. Alas, I may have to pass on the black paint and go with a more forgiving color.

richw5 · March 2003

Pick whatever color you like. It's going to be your car not ours.

I have one black car and one white. While the black car shows dirt and dust more easily, it has a deep shine that's beyond compare, when it's clean and freshly waxed.

As for waxing, I use the same Meguire's wax process as sevenfeet0. This year I'm going to try something new, Mother's California Gold Claybar process. It has a claybar that is used to remove paint contaminants before a coat wax is applied. It's going to be labor intensive so it may be a one time trial.

Rich

calicadi · March 2003

I use the Meguiars claybar. It is more labor but worth doing a couple of times a year at least, especially before waxing and buffing. Otherwise you're pushing those particles into the coat. You may want to use it each time before waxing if the car spends anytime outdoors in an area of high polution. Not just talking about industrial polution either. We have some trees around here that put out spores about the size of a pin point that are covered in resin, stick like glue to any surface and won't come off by washing alone. I've found I only really need to use it on horizontal surfaces (trunk, roof, hood). You'll be amazed how much gunk it picks up. First wash and rinse the area. Then put more suds on the area to be "barred". You have to use some kind of lubricant other than water or the clay sticks and then you have to rub like crazy to get the clay off. Then rinse and dry and on to the next area.

oldsman01 · March 2003

My black Intrigue has only seen automatic car washes which are completely brushless(the high pressure water type) and I seldomly use these as they are expensive and still don't clean the car all that well.

wwhite2 · March 2003

something has to touch the surface to remove the dirt and thats the problem . Allowing the soap to "float " the dirt particles away is a good concept I just dont think it really happens with out something having to contact the paint surface before the floating occurs

eaton53 · March 2003

Called RaceGlaze. Provides a long lasting finish and is the least labor intensive polish I've used on my black Contour SVT.

Great stuff, much better than Zymol.

cu95 · March 2003

Have the CTS's had another price hike? I've noticed some stickers (using the GM Buying Power search of dealer inventory) that have base prices before destination charge of $29,900.

thebug · March 2003

jemiller: In the desert in the summer, it really doesn't make much difference what color the car is. I have white and black cars, and in the summers months the inside car thermometer registers the same regardless of the color, HOT (about 155 degrees, and sometimes higher). They also cool off at about the same rate after inside with the ac on.

I think dark colors repel heat and light colors reflect light which in turn causes more heat, but don't quote me on that one, because I've been wrong before, and know people that will testify to that fact.

In this part of the country, it rarely rains (maybe once or twice a year) so it's easy to keep a car clean using a California car mop every morning. I also get the car washed one or two times a week at a hand car wash (we have several here) for only fifteen dollars a pop. Image is everything when your car is your office.

thebug...

thebug · March 2003

The last price I saw was right at 30K dc included. that's up about 400-500 dollars, I think.

thebug...

cjs2002 · March 2003

Just wondering if any of ya'll don't mind saying what you paid... and my second question is did the dealerships haggle prices or deal at all or was it one of those as is things... thanx

thebug · March 2003

I purchased my black on black CTS in Nov of 02, before the little price hike. Took the lux package, bose system, auto tranny, and polished wheels. Didn't take any extended warranties (free warranty is plenty,learned that the hard way) Didn't want the sun roof (don't like them), didn't need stbl tract. Total cost with assessed taxes $38,749, w/o $36,249.

They threw in the window tint ($270) for free, and gave me $1,920 off the sticker without haggling. I paid all the taxes up front (it's required because I registered in my home state Ohio instead of Nevada), and financed $34,600 @ 3.9%/5yrs.

Overall, I think I got a pretty good deal. Only took 45 days from order to pick up. They promised that I would have it on my birthday, and they delivered. They also gave me two very well constructed Cadillac lawn chairs.

I looked at many other cars (ie; BMW'5s, MB's, Lexis 300s and the G35) before I made my decision. The toss up was between the G35 and the CTS. The looks (inside & out), price per pound, color choices, computer gadgets, standard features, and overall comfort and feel while driving won the CTS over. The service and attention that I received at the Cadillac dealership (as opposed to the others) was also a contributing factor.

I've had my CTS for 4 months (5600 miles), and I love this car. If you decide to purchase one, you won't be disapponited. The CTS rocks!!!

thebug...

necros · March 2003

Passed 10,000 miles the other day. Absolutely no problems other than a small rattle in the passenger door that the dealer fixed. I have been very impressed, and I use the car pretty hard.

mannytranny · March 2003

I got the BLACK CTS with manual trans, sun roof, luxury package and polished wheels. I bought it in June 2002 and now have 6200 miles on it. The dealer didn't hesitate to give $2500. off the price and I bought it right off the lot. I still think it's the greatest purchase I've ever made.

cjs2002 · March 2003

cool.... unfortunatly I relly don't want the lux pacage... the CTS comes with leather already.. I think... and the only thing I need is the Auto transmition, cause I'm not smart enough to learn manual tranies... I'd like the sunroof but I don't know if it will still be affordable...

thebug · March 2003

Before you omit options consider this. Per $1,000 of the total cost on a 60 month loan, your payment will increase by $18.40 @ 3.9%, $18.83 @ 4.9%, and $19.27 @ 5.9%. So ask yourself, can I afford an extra $20 per month for the sunroof?

In my situation, I actually got the auto tranny and wheels free. So it's worth trying to cut a deal with the salesperson. People I have talked to are getting really deals on new auto purchases. This includes cost of loan and auto.

thebug...

fjk57702 · March 2003

The sunroof requires the lux package, so the actual price is 1200 + 2300 = 3500.

thebug · March 2003

fjk57702: You'er right, forgot about that. Options are very limited with the standard package. So cjs2002 will have to increase his monthly payment by about $65, or he can talk them down by 2K, and only increase the payment by $27. I think it's worth a shot. Asking for 2K off the sticker is a good bet. That seems to be the average deal, in this area that is.

thebug...

alokin · March 2003

anyone have steering shutter or any steering problems

cjs2002 · March 2003

thanx for the info and I'll take that into consideration...yet I really hate how car options are grouped together... the last car I got they did something like that too, but my father is really good at getting them to drop the charge for the ex options I don't care for... plus he can typically get a few more $ knocked off the price....

calicadi · March 2003

Use the Go To Msg # box at the bottom of the screen and read message 515. The Intermediate Steering Shaft was fingered as a suspect in one or two complaints of rough or bumpy feel but never confirmed as the source.

sevenfeet0 · March 2003

I'm at 10,500 miles now with only 5.5 months of ownership. So far, no problems, other than the spare tire rattle which I need to get fixed. I still have a blast while driving it. I have to remind myself to use the Valentine every time I get into the car less I get nailed again for speeding!

dlsj · March 2003

You may want to check with your service advisor, I was informed today when I spoke with mine...my car is in the shop all the time...that there is a recall relating to the steering on some CTS models. I've noticed a clicking sound when turning the steering wheel hard to the right but no shaking. I'm glad to see that most are not having the problems I have had.

thebug · March 2003

alokin: On the day of pick up,(with 10 miles) leaving the lot the steering was very sluggish, but this was detected as a power steering fluid line air pocket which corrected without incident or much intervention and hasn't happened since. They figured that the line had not bled through completely.

cjs2002: I guess that's the way to give options one could do without, or those that are not so popular a free ride. Always a catch. Good luck on your purchase.

thebug...

b4z · March 2003

Could you please itemize the problems you have had with your CTS.
Most here have had few if any probs.

thebug · March 2003

Sorry to here about all the problems. My CTS has been essentially problem free @5700 miles. What problems are you having?

thebug...

richw5 · March 2003

We just passed the 10,000 mile mark on our CTS, on Monday. I did get a "Check Stability System" on the DIC. It's the second time it happened, but cleared when I hit "reset" and didn't come back.

I bought the CTS just after Mother's day last year, so she's about 10 months old. Just like sevenfeet0, we think the CTS is a blast to drive.

We're beginning to see CTS's everywhere. Last Saturday it was at the local Chinese restaurant and Sunday at a grocery store (both White Sport Lux's). In between, we've seen several on the road. The most prevalent colors are black and white, with an occasional silver or gold. I wave, and my wife tells me that the people in the other CTS are going to think that I'm crazy. I guess she's right.

Rich

dlsj · March 2003

Let's see, I have had it in the shop three times for a coolant leak( the 1st time was some sort of gasket problem and it was supposedly fixed, 2nd time was a leak elsewhere in the system, 3rd time they stated it was just "air" in the system from all the times they had worked on it and have not had problems with the coolant system for about a month and a half. I had the problem with my car losing power and the message center display stated "engine powering down" and dying in the middle of an intersection. Today it died on me on the way to my daughter's school and had to be towed to the dealership for repair. Also the steering wheel clicks, the dome light cover in the rear roof kept falling off - requiring them to have to order a new unit. Also the sunroof has had problems with it's programing a couple of times but is fine now. This was a dealer installed option so it may not count (I didn't want to have to buy the whole luxury package thing) It pretty much meets or exceeds the requirement for our state's Lemon law...that is where we are heading at this time. I do want to state that, aside from all the problems and headaches, it is an awesome car. That is when it's not in the shop and I can drive it, it's a blast. We got the getrag manual 5sp and I don't regret that a bit. Even more fun than the BMW's we have had. If I can get a new one that actually runs I will be very pleased. We shall see. By the way, I bought the car new in June of 2002. If I can think of any other problems I've had I'll update. Thanks.

oldsman01 · March 2003

What is the build date of yours? Your the first person who has reported numerous problems such as these. While certainly not a good thing for you, it does bode well for this car that most others have been problem free. I know your probably under a time frame when pursuing lemom law litigation, but if you can hold off a few months, you'll be able to enjoy a 2004 CTS with the more powerful engine.

loyaltogm1 · March 2003

I've had mine since Feb. 22, 2003 and so far the only problems I'm having are the "Service Air Bag" message in the DIC and the indicator on the dash comes on about once a day. Taking it in on Thurs. to get fixed, hopefully. Have also noticed a little pulling to the right when I had to put on the brakes suddenly. Anyone else experiencing these problems? I was able to purchase my CTS on the employee program, dad is retired from AC Delco, but I'm a little miffed because if I had owned another brand of vehicle on Feb. 22, "Ford, Toyota, etc., I could have gotten an additional 1,500 off the price. Then 7 days later they came out with the GM owner loyalty for current GM owners which was 1,000 rebate. Then today in the mail I receive a $500 coupon to use in addition to my GM card earnings. So I missed out on between 1,500 and 2,000 off the price of my car. I GUESS THAT'S WHAT I GET FOR BEING A LOYAL GM CUSTOMER FOR "FOREVER"!!!!!!!!!! NEVER OWNED ANYTHING ELSE!!!! Even owning 4 GM vehicles right now didn't help, ranging in years from 1939 - 2003. Anyway, I still love the car!!!!!!!

b4z · March 2003

If your engine is shutting off in intersections it sounds like either a crankshaft sensor or the ignition needs to be replaced.

Do your keys have a lot of weight on them? ie, al lot of keys or heavy key fobs?

This can sometimes cause ignition poroblems.

thebug · March 2003

From time to time I read the reviews of those who purchased one of the listed competing vehicles (as Edmonds sees it), and in this case it's the G35, you know, the one with the 260HP engine. I think more horses seems to be what most everybody wants on the CTS.

Well, the G35 did in fact get more horses, but if you look at the remarks in the suggested improvements, from most respondents, the increase in hp opened a new can of worms. I guess the auto manufactures just can't win. People are just "sooo" hard to please. In other words, if "A" happens, then "B" is bound to happen.

In my view (per their own complaints), those who purchased the G35 probably should have looked at, or test driven the CTS. I couldn't help but notice that most of their chief complaints (of missing features), are standard items on the CTS for a similar price.

Cadillac produced an excellent blend and balance of power (not too much, nor too little, just so), comfort, convenience, handling and styling with the CTS. If you would take the time to compare and contrast the competeing vehicles (per the owners view), our (CTS owners) peeves are petty in comparison. Cadillac seems to have covered most all the bases. And in that, you will find that the CTS is the better choice.

But I think we all know that. Hindsight "is" an exact science, ya know.

Happy motoring ~(8o)

thebug...

jemiller · March 2003

I think the CTS has a good feature/price balance.

I also think GM cut a few corners on material quality to get there, but then Nissan definitely did so on the G35, and the G35's interior design and layout leaves quite a bit to be desired.

I'll never think the CTS shape is attractive - it's tolerable in light colors, but that's as far as I'll take it. I'm just hanging around to see if the CTS-V's performance overcomes my distaste for the shape. The G35 is decent-looking, nothing special (the IS300 is a much better shape than either the G35 or CTS.) The G35 coupe is flat gorgeous - I'd love to see a G35 sedan with the fatter coupe fenders.

By the way, pedal parking brakes in manual-transmission cars suck donkey parts. You either need a manual handle (preferred, as you can then use it to bring your speed down without activating brake lights as some cop merges onto the freeway) or electric/ electrohydraulic toggle switch e.g. 2003 Jag S-Type. Regardless, it's got to be hand-controlled. Otherwise, you WILL someday find yourself nosed up to a traffic light with a full load of passengers, on some hill steep enough that there are steps cut into the sidewalk, and some delivery van will stop a foot off your rear bumper...

trichard2 · March 2003

I received my insurance renewal notice yesterday and to my dismay, a 25% increase. Having made no claims I called customer service for an explanation, I was told that the symbal rating on the CTS had been raised to 18 from, I think, 14 or some low rating. The higher the symbal rating the higher the premiums. The symbal rating reflects the insurance company's payout experience with any particular car. Symbal rating for Corvette is 19. So,from this information I conclude we have some careless CTS drivers among us.

My insurance company is GMAC Insurance(GM employee). I expect that other insurance companies experience is similar.

Interested in knowing if I'm alone in this.

wwhite2 · March 2003

I agree a hand brake would be better for those rare situations where your on a hill and some stops a foot behind you . Also you need to declutch, go to neutral,apply the brake, clutch again ,then shift back into a gear then shut off the engine to shut down . Seems like to many extra steps . Other than that this car is great

thebug · March 2003

jemiller: I like both the CTS and G35 (in looks that is), but the CTS covered all the bases in my personal situation. The G35's option groups forces you to get a sunroof if you want a premium sound system, that just doesn't make sense to me.

In the case of CTS looks, each to his own, but it's pretty obvious by now that many do like the looks and style of the CTS.

It may not be long before other auto manufactures adopt this cutting edege style to get away from the routine and bland jelly bean look.

In regards to cutting corners, I think this has become the norm, rather than the exception with the auto industry, because it's all about money.

Manufctures of any merchandise seem to refer to it "as keeping the cost down", (but mostly for them). And as I said in a post way back when, if you keep looking at the CTS, it will grow on you. So be careful, wouldn't want you to buy a car you didn't like, LOL.

And I believe everyone agrees, the foot operated parking brake really sucks. What were they thinking?

thebug...

thebug · March 2003

Boy I hope the other insurance companies aren't going to adopt this. I would really hate to take a hit for somebody elses bad driving. I just renewd at the beginning of March and didn't get an increase. So maybe I'm safe.

thebug...

pat · March 2003

Join us tonight, 6-7pm PT/9-10pm ET for another
round of automotive trivia and member-to-member chat.
Test your skills (or multiple choice guessing ability)
against other Town Hall members.

http://www.edmunds.com/townhall/chat/townhallchat.html

Hope to see you there!

Cadillac CTS/CTS-V

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