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An analogy of the 300M to the Lexus ES300 has no revelance in this discussion.
The early mock-ups resembled a 300M on stilts, which I thought looked good for early in the design process.
I took one look at the official introduction and thought "no way". It looks like a minivan that's been vertically compressed. I don't get it. The other pretend SUV's can, at least, pretend to look like SUV's. And the poor use of space in the interior doesn't help (2nd row buckets should be an option, like on the cutting-edge, minivan-based Buick...).
If you look at the XC90 & RX330 on the higher end, and the Pilot & Highlander in the mid-market, I just don't get the Pacifica's bloated-wagon/compressed-minivan look. I suspect the final design was done on the cheap, and that there was far less engineering done to transform the minivan platform than the Odyssey-Pilot work, for example. Nothing wrong with product development done on the cheap, so long as pricing is as well.
Having vented I'll say that if it meets your needs you'll probably be happy: I have 206,000 miles on my 1990 Chrysler and still going strong. Truly amazing endurance after nearly 14 years.
I never wanted a minivan; just don't want to feel like I'm driving a small delivery truck. I also don't want an SUV...again, truck driving isn't my thing.
For me and my family, its the perfect vehicle. Enough of a car for me, and sporty looking to boot. The feature I like the best (and the one that swayed me from the Pilot) is the 2nd row buckets, one so many seem to think is a waste.
I have 2 kids, and when our family travels it is not by plane but by car. The 2nd row buckets will make the drives we take far more comfortable for my kids. Paired with the DVD system and wireless headphones, my husband and I will find trips even more enjoyable than before. There's plenty of baggage space with the 3rd row folded.
Carpooling will be easier with the third seat, since it seems like we have always been one seat short when going out with others.
Maybe its not the 'perfect' vehicle, but its perfect for me. I've owned three Chryslers in the past 25 years and never had any major issues with quality. I look forward to the same with my new Pacifica...once I get it!
It should be illegal for anyone to post ignorant, negative, comments about the Pacifica unless they have actually DRIVEN one!
The Pacifica is NOT an SUV, never claimed to be. To directly compare it to an SUV, and point out that it is not like an SUV, makes no sense at all.
I took 3 test drives before buying, and have been very satisfied with my purchase.
I hate SUVs, but needed more space and utility than was afforded by my previous 2 300Ms.
As for Chrysler's "poor reliability", I say BS and 'ancient history'. I ran up 130,000 miles on my 2 300Ms, and NOTHING broke.
Read the other auto message boards, espesially those pricy German brands, and see what real problems are!
http://autoweek.com/search/search_display.mv?port_code=autoweek&a- mp;a- mp;cat_code=carboard&content_code=02696255&Search_Type=ST- - D&Search_ID=1299037&record=3
My '99 30M called for a fluid change, which I had done at 35,000 miles, and the lease was up at 69,000 miles ... no trans problems.
The '01 300M maintainance manual did not require a fluid change, and I drove it 73,000 miles with no problems. The only problem reported by 300M owners was a speed sensor failure which is easily, and inexpensively, fixed.
I believe the Chrysler trans problems were on earlier, pre '99, models.
Anyway, about that rebate.... is that the "loyalty" rebate for those that are moving on from a previous Chrysler lease? Or is just another rebate for everyone? I didn't see anything listed on the Chrysler webpage.
Thanks... Paul
As far as I am concerned, they couldn't make it much better!
Time period is "now through June 30th"
I'm ticked off about this because Chrysler sent a fax to their dealers saying they would not be offering rebates or incentives on the Pacifica. So much for honesty!
I used to drive a '99 Chrysler 300M. Drove it for 3 years and 36,000+ miles. No problems with transmission. No problems at all.
Regarding the new $1,000 rebate I was really annoyed that we missed out on this. I was told that Chrysler would not be offering incentives for at least one year.
I think the speaker cone was cracked.
To all early owners:
I contacted Chrysler about the rebate.
Here's what to do:
Send a letter to:
Daimler Chrysler
P.O. Box 5072
Troy, MI 48098
Enclose your VIN number, and a copy of your purchase or lease agreement.
State your case, possibly including:
1. Chrysler told the dealers they would not be offering rebates or incentives on the Pacifica.
2. Those of us who beleived that got screwed by buying early.
3. The early buyers are supporting Chrysler and the Pacifica on this venue.
Pacifica buyers unite!
The system is impressive. With the wireless earphones our son can watch a movie while we listen to a book on CD or tape.
Sound quality with the 5.1 upgrade rivals a good home system.
Revka
Host
Hatchbacks & Wagons Boards
The residual for a 36 month lease is 53%!
This is incredibly high for a domestic vehicle let alone a Chrysler. Remember higher resale equates to lower payments as you are really only paying for the depreciation in a lease while you have posession of the vehicle. I was talking to a GM at a local Chrysler dealership today and he was amazed at the rate. He said some previous Chrysler products for the same term had residuals of 26-39%. I don't know whether Chrysler is subsidizing this high resale, but who cares!
PS: I was quoted a money factor of .00165 which equates to 3.69% financing. Not bad
PPS: I test drove my first FWD Pacifica today. I have to say that it felt like it had much more power than the AWD.
Back in 1998, I lease a Chrysler 300M for 36 months. Chrysler Financial Corp was betting that the residual would be 49% after 36 months.
By current 2000 Audi A6 was leased for 39 months with a 59% residual.
My new Volvo XC90 (due next week) will be 39 months with a 61% residual.
The best was the 1990 Lexus LS400. This was Lexus' second year of existence, and they wanted to show luxury buyers that they could compete with MB, BMW, etc. We leased the car for 24 months with an 81% residual. Payment was hundreds less than the Mercedes 420SEL, for what amounted to a 2-year test drive. It obviously worked out perfectly for Lexus.
While 53% on the Pacifica may seem like a great number (compared to GM crap), it's nowhere near that of its competitors. Odyssey, Sienna, MDX, XC90, and almost every other competitor all have much higher residuals, thus lower lease payments.
I made no reference to foreign makes.
A comparably equipped XC90 would cost me $40,000 according to Edmunds TMV. If I get a Pacifica configured the way I want, it will run me $31,800.00 ($300.00 over invoice per my dealer). If you equate the $8,200.00 difference into a lease calculator (leaseguide.com) with the different residuals based on a money factor of .00165, here's what you come up with for a 36 month lease:
Volvo XC90: $494.08 per month
Pacifica: $413.00 per month
You are right that a higher residual is more desireable as it yields a lower monthly payment. However it is all relative to the price and configuration of vehicle you are looking for.
Good luck with your Volvo. Personaly I have had enough ('98 V70 XC & '01 V70 T5) of quirky unreliable Swedish engineering. Hopefully this time they got it right.
Line up Pacifica against Pilot, Odyssey, Highlander, Sienna, etc. and you'll see how poor a lease deal it is.
Of course, it probably is a better deal than any domestic model (and IMO the most desirable of all domestic SUV's or minivans).
Actually Chrysler is doing a lot better - the PT Cruiser is one of the more reliable cars according to Consumer Reports. Hopefully this will start to carry over to other models like the Pacifica.
Only 4800 Pacificas have been sold so far.
http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=6109&sid=17- 3&n=156
Here's the deal: I have not moved the car down in class. For $31,800.00 I can get a FWD Pacifica with leather, sunroof, power liftgate, 6 disc CD/DVD plalyer, adjustable pedals, power memory seats and mirrors, head curtain air bags for all 3 rows, knee airbags, trip conputer, dual A/C, 3 rows of seats & a 5-star safety rating.
For me, both the Pilot (boring) & the Highlander (no 3rd row) can't compete either with style or equipment levels or both. My DW (darling wife) says she won't be caught dead in a mommy van (even though I tend to agree with your point about the Ody & Sienna being strong competition to the Pacifica)
You see this vehicle as described competes perfectly with the XC90, MDX & RX330 etc. It just costs less based on the way I want it configured. If you try to move it down in class, it only gets stronger by comparison. Of course this formula might not work for everyone. That's why they make many flavors of ice cream.
No, the law has been around since the early days of automobiles, in the early 1900's. However, due to some recent high-profile lawsuits, where GMAC Leasing lost $30MM and Chase Auto Finance lost $20MM, the leasing companies have realized that it is a losing proposition to continue leasing in NYS as long as the potential to lose such huge lawsuits exists!
Both have recently pulled out, and more are to follow. The remaining leasing companies will be charging extra to lease (raising bank charges from $500-$1000, etc) to cover their added liability insurance costs.
You cannot get around it by leasing in CT or NJ, it is based on the fact that you reside in NYS and drive the car in NYS. The major leasing companies have said that if the law gets repealed, they will instantly start leasing in NYS again.
There are some smaller leasing cos that are still active. If your dealer doesn't offer anything besides their own or Chase, check with a local lease broker. They often have more leasing outlets, and they usually get fleet pricing so their deals are pretty fair compared to the dealerships.
I have had nothing but compliments on the styling of my Pacifica, but if everyone had the same taste, all cars would look alike.
I do agree with you, however,on the styling of most of Chrysler's recent show cars...awful!
Maybe BMW's Chris Bangle is moonlighting as a Chrysler stylist!
By the way, I like the way diesel locomotives look.
Ed
Though the Chrysler Pacifica was officially launched only a month ago, Chrysler is concerned about sticker shock. The company decided to first build fully loaded versions of the vehicle, meaning most of the ones now in the showrooms are priced over $40,000 compared to a base price of just over $31,000.
The Pacifica already has a $1,000 rebate. But Chrysler decided that wasn’t enough. So it’s going to come out with a de-contented version of the vehicle that will knock another $2,000 off the base price.
Chrysler claims it always planned to do this anyway. But at the media launch in February there was no mention of a cheaper version in the wings. And this goes to show just how tough it is out there in the market right now.
With Automotive Insight, I’m John McElroy, WWJ Newsradio 950.
Jmcelroy@blueskyproductions.tv
www.autolinedetroit.tv
Looking to move from Ford and appreciate reading all the Pacifica comments.
When you use the express open feature on the moonroof, it opens 3/4 of thr way to minimize drumming. Pressing the button again opens it all the way.