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Comments
It is an upgrade that is definitely worth the peace of mind it gives. I was becoming very reluctant to go "out of town" until I got the metal line.
At the present, the all metal replacement is merely an "upgrade" at the owner's expense if there is no leak from the existing hose. If there is a leak under warranty, either minor or catastropic, the dealer will replace the defective part with another rubber hose unless you purchase the all metal upgrade for him to install.
This will get to be (is) a real can of worms for the 2GR-FE (V-6) engines as folks drive them past the warranty mileage and experience oil line failures.
Thanks
I ordered the 15772-31030 all metal line for my 2007 Avalon and the dealer replaced it in about a couple of hours. I saw no reason to continue to drive with a rubber/metal line that was subject to failure at any time. The bad part, as you experienced, is that the failure may dump all the engine oil while you are driving down the road. Toyota has yet to acknowledge that this failure mode might damage an engine.
I think anyone driving a 2GR-FE V-6 engine would be foolish not to replace the rubber/metal VVTi line before it fails.
http://www.pressdemocrat.com/article/20091019/BUSINESS/910191027
Something everyone should in fact practice in an empty parking lot.
It is almost as if Toyota is following the Oldsmobile road map towards self destruction. Toyota's treatment of this rubber versus metal oil line issue is abysmal. It is as if it wasn't bad enough that they initially coupled the space age fuel efficient 2GR-FE V6 jetlike engine to a bad transmission in the 07 model year Camry -causing Consumer Reports to withdraw it from the "recommended" list - that they went on a suicide mission to create a real scandal with the rubber oil line.
The number of affected vehicles is over 1.5 to 2 million. Toyota just did a recall which they call a "Limited Service Bulletin" that applies only to 05 and 06 Avalons.and 06 Rav4's. It replaces one rubber hose with another. It states in pertinent part:
"To: All Toyota Dealer Principals, Service Managers, Parts Managers
Subject: Limited Service Campaign (LSC) – 90K
2005 – 2006 Avalon and 2006 RAV4 Vehicles Equipped with the V6 (2GR-FE) Engine - VVT-I Oil Hose Replacement
Toyota will initiate a Limited Service Campaign to replace the VVT-i oil hose in certain 2005 – 2006 model year Avalon and 2006 model year RAV4 vehicles with a 2GR-FE engine.
This Limited Service Campaign will be available at no charge to the vehicle owners until March 31, 2013. All terms of the affected vehicle’s Toyota Basic Warranty will remain intact regardless of whether or not the customer takes advantage of the Limited Service Campaign.
There are approximately 147,000 Avalon (2005 through 2006 model year), and 26,000 RAV4 (2006 model year) involved in the U.S.
Since this applies all to NorthAmerican built 2GR-FE engines built pre-April 2008 and some Japan built prior to 2007, it's pretty easy to get past the million vehicle marker.
Note: Not a single ES350 on the Internet has oil line failure because they are all built in Japan and have the metal pipe.
I was going to wait a few months, but so I can quit obsessing about this, I am taking my 09 LE V6 in to Molle Toyota and pay for the $275 fix. Olathe Toyota told me it would void the warranty but Molle says "we always use the metal pipe." It takes two hours of labor because, unlike the Avalon, they have to remove the power steering pump to do the fix.
My car is 19 months old. Pop the trunk and it still has new car smell and contains the following:
1) First aid kit
2) Premium Jumper Cables
and
3) a twelve pack.
No - the 12pak is not beer. It's a twelve bottle case of Pennzoil 5w30 oil in case the oil line ruptures.
Sorry for the rant. I didn't mind changing out mismatched Bridgestone 215/60/16 tires and wheels at 8500 miles for 17" 215/55/17 Avalon LTD wheels and Michelin tires at a cost of $1300 so I shouldn't mind doing this $275 fix.
As Paul3637 posts, Toyota is still dancing around a failure mode that could affect over a million 2GR-FE engines. Replacing one rubber hose with another is just a cheaper way out, and probably moves the next failure out 50000 miles or so, well past any warranty period.
No, we are not talking about congress or wall street exectives paying billion dollar bonus - It's Toytota management at work. I have seen several posts that predict fatalities will eventually occur over the oil line issue when engine seizes and driver loses control or gets stranded in the mountains out of cell phone range - and I agree.
It took the breaking news headline about the 4 fatalities in the now famous ES350 crash San Diego before the 3.4 million Toyota floormat recall scandal broke.
I accidentally ran into this post when I looked up ES350 car complaints to confirm what the Lexus dealer told me: No ES350 oil line leaks ever because the Japan built Lexus always used the metal pipe..
Look at this on the subject of floormats where a guy made a big deal about getting his $500 deductible back ........... and Toyota ignored him.
http://www.carcomplaints.com/Lexus/ES350/2007/accessories-interior/throttle_gets- - _stuck_under_floor_mat.shtml
2008
Apr 14
ES350 ES 3.2L V6
Automatic transmission
22,200 miles
While my wife was backing out of our garage, the throttle got stuck under the floor mat. The car traveled across the street at full throttle and end up on a 5 foot snow bank. Other than a sore back and neck the next morning, she had no other injuries.
She did not require medical help. She was extremely lucky that no other vehicle was coming by at the time nor was anyone walking by. Only the snow bank prevented her from hitting a garage that is directly across the street.
I had received a recall notice from Lexus in the fall of 2007 addressing a floor mat to throttle problem. In discussing this with my Lexus dealer, I was told the recall did not apply to my vehicle because I did not have all weather floor mats. I did not give it another though until my wife had this accident.
After the accident I stopped at the Lexus dealer to show them how easy it was for the throttle to get stuck under the floor mat.I had removed the floor mat and put it in the trunk. The Service Manager immediately noticed that the mat I had in hand should have been on the passenger side and not on the drivers side. This information stunned me because I had never removed the floor mats. This left two possibilities; either the car was delivered new to me that way or while in Myrtle Beach I had the car cleaned at a car wash and they switched the mats. In either case it doesn't matter.
This accident should not have happened. Floor mats should not be interchangeable. I showed the Sheriff that investigated the accident as well as the tow truck driver and the insurance adjuster how easy it was for the throttle and none of them picked up on the fact that the mats had been reversed.
The Lexus Owners Manual only talks about the retainer clips being properly attached and they were as indicated in the
sheriff's report. The Owners Manual does not mention the potential danger of the accelerator becoming stuck if the floor mat are inadvertently installed on the wrong side. THE FLOOR MATS SHOULD BE DESIGNED SO IT IS NOT POSSIBLE TO ATTACH THE FLOOR CLIPS TO THE MATS IF THEY ARE NOT INSTALLED ON THE RIGHT SIDE.
I have written to Lexus in Torrance, California twice and included the Sheriffs report, Insurance Adjusters report and the repair cost from the body shop in an attempt to recover my $500 deductible. My insurance payed the remaining repair cost. But Lexus has not acknowledged ether of my registered letters.
This may be my last Lexus if I don't get satisfaction or at least an acknowledgment of the problem from them.
Most dealers have taken the position that they will not replace the VVTi line with all metal unless the customer pays for it,( "customer upgrade"). The Avalon warranty stays intact.
If your dealer is saying that the metal line voids the warranty, I would find a new dealer. That establishment is being less than honest.
:http://sites.google.com/site/toyotav6oillinescandal/
The metal line was originally a Lexus part and can safely be used without voiding the warranty.
:
It is really hard to understand all the horror stories being posted about this problem. It seems that almost no one is clean, from dealers all the way to Toyota Corporate.
Hopefully this problem will continue to gain exposure, and Toyota will be forced, maybe by a class action lawsuit, to acknowledge and fix the problem permanently for their customers.
http://rav4world.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=20014&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&star- t=405&sid=1c1a8338372af02a525c88e237e29d93
Post #415
Worst case oil line failure can be sudden and catastrophic, resulting in loss of engine oil and almost certain engine damage if vehicle owners attempt further vehicle operation.
The site also addresses failure responses by dealers and Toyota USA, which have been less that stellar.
There is a proven fix for this problem, I'm not so sure we are there yet on the "unintended acceleration" issue..
I'm at a loss. Told the shop to drain the tank and try some known good stuff.
Any ideas?
How do you "prime" a car with fuel injection? If you mean hook it up to an outside fuel feed source, ok... it should run fine if the problem is the fuel in the tank and all else is well... if not, the problem is with the engine or the electronics.
Hope this helps, others may have more ideas.....
Diesel fuel stinks, so the garage should be able to spot that in 10 seconds.
I'm thinking this is an electronics problem, just on the face of it.
At this point, we can only guess blindly---sounds like you might have an alternator issue.
I'm having the same trouble. 1998 Avalon. Runs really rough only hot, intermittently. Starts to happen after a slow down going from high speed to lower speeds. Once it starts it normally keep happening until the car is shut off for 10 - 15 minutes. Sometimes I can take a 200 mile trip with no trouble, then later on it happens randomly on 5 or 30 mile trips. If it happens it always goes away after a 15 minute off period.
Thanks for any feedback.
I cleaned the MAF but the P0171 returns after a few starts
I just had to replace my engine after 35,000 miles, because of this issue and Toyota Canada will not stand behind their product claiming that there was no such "Limited Service Campaign".
Many thanks
Other high end manufacturers like Mercedes, BMW, Volvo deliberately make life difficult by asking huge sums of money pretending it to be some big deal and safety could be compromised.
In any case, after fighting with them numerous times, I discovered, Dep't of Transport will accept a printout of a cars history which clearly outlines what had been a recall and if it was fixed. What I do now if I am bringing a car from the U.S., I simply ask a dealership in the U.S. if they could give me the printout of the cars history. Toyota has everything on every vehicle and they make a point of checking that regardless of where you are...Mexico, U.S.A., Canada. It is a way for them to justify repairs if the vehicle has changed hands etc..
So, what I am saying is this. Try to go to a Toyota dealership and charm a service manager to print you the history of the car...they have it available online and ask if there were any recalls or any outstanding recalls. You might find the answer you are looking for.
Also, I would Google recalls on your Model Toyota and you might find it there since it is a mandatory issue if it involves safety.
I hope this helps??
https://sites.google.com/site/toyotav6oillinescandal/
Within that site are links to copies of both the Canadian version and the US version AND all the newspaper articles and press releases ....... this affected 1.6 million recalled vehicles.
Toyota Canada Recall(s): Shortly after the first Toyota USA campaign letters went out, Toyota Canada sent out a letter to affected vehicle owners dated November, 2009 describing a "customer satisfaction campaign" http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN019717220100301 " that was almost the polar opposite of the U.S. version as to what vehicles were covered. It covered all affected models and years: 05-09 Avalon, Rav4, Camry, Highlander, & Siennas (but like its USA counterpart not 100% of VIN numbers are covered), It does explain the possibility of engine damage and it does create a sense of urgency telling the recipients that upon receipt of this letter, contact any authorized Toyota dealer and make an appointment - the campaign is a limited time offer. Copies of the letter at http://rav4world.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=20014&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&star- t=405&sid=cddcab9df7b3dff5f107868b6a187506 post # 415 and http://rav4world.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=23527&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&star- t=15 post #17. The letter does not describe the replacement part, but it appears Toyota Canada is using the same cheap fix as Toyota USA http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/showthread.php?p=2981747&posted=1#post2981747 post #97.."So there you have it folks, the great Toyota fix, it's effectively useless long term, worth just enough to pacify the buyers and get you over the warranty period to a point where they have no accountability! Brilliant! Absolutely brilliant!!! So glad I did mine and replaced it with the complete steel pipe! best 150 bucks I have ever spent!" Yikes - update December 3: http://rav4world.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=20014&postdays=0&postorder=asc&&star- t=420 post #423 Canadian dealers refusing to install the all metal oil line. Update 2/14/10: Dated February, 2010, Toyota sent out the IDENTICAL recall letter it did last November but to more vehicles so that VIN #'s that were missed in the original mailing are now put on notice.
*******
I have copies of everything you might need if the links don't work. Email me at toyotadriver2009@live.com (it's listed in the website).
I am Paul3637 on all toyota forums. I suggest you going toyotanation which has lots of Canadian members, too. Post your problem in the gen6 camry forum.