Ford Expedition

explorerx4 · October 2003

where i live, we have to pay property tax annually, based on the value of the vehicle.
i think it is based on the nada book.
it's cheaper to have a 'loaded' up xlt than a 'base' bauer.
for example i had a '00 expy xlt(base 33k, msrp 38k). my first bill was about $450. wife has an '01 saab (base 39k, msrp 41k). first tax bill $720, and my town has a low mil rate.

sk_glsinc · October 2003

I own a 98 Expedition with 91K miles. So far, I don't have any major problem with the car. But, recently, the Check Engine Light came on and I had to reset it twice by taking it to the autoshop. The mechanic mentioned that it may require a "big $$$" to fix the problem. According to him, it is due to oxygen level of the gas. did anyone experiece similar problems?

Your thoughts are appreciated...

jrc346 · October 2003

Hmm, at 91,000 miles I wouldn't doubt that your oxygen sensors are becoming lazy. These measure the amount of oxygen in the exhaust gases. Do you have the exact code that was given? Most oxygen sensors when they become lazy start to indicate a Rich condition all of the time causing your check engine light to illuminate. These can be expensive depending on your budjet. They range from about $60-90 a piece and in your Expy, there may be as many as 4, but they may not all be bad. Get back to us and let us know of the code that was set if you have it. I don't have the code book with me right now, but if you put the code in google or some other search engine, you will probably get a hit as to what that code means. Goodluck with it!

bulldog86 · December 2003

Has anyone had any experience with the Ford Security System installed by the dealer? I am getting a "System 4" added to my '04 Expedition Eddie Bauer next week and am curious if anyone has any experience with these things. My last Ford security system (installed by the dealer on a 1990 F-250) failed two months after the warranty expired and the truck had to be towed to the dealer, where the system was unceremoniously yanked from under the dash and placed in the trash. I hesitated to buy another system from Ford, but I park my truck in a park and ride lot here in northern Virginia and thought that the ignition disable feature of the system 4 was attractive. Am also considering lo-jack as a backup. Thanks

davant · December 2003

Bulldog,

No experience with the Ford system but I had several different aftermarket ones in vehicles prior to our '03 EB. I'm fond of Clifford and a local shop put in ignition disable in a Honda. Added bonuses included remote starting, programmable window up, vent, and down features and cost me about $850 installed (helped protect $4K in stereo gear). Not sure how good the Ford one is but don't expect anything beyond enhanced security. The more obscure and unique the install schema, the less likely a thief can defeat them, pro crooks can beat them all.

Point is, there are so many on the market worthy of investigation and avoiding mainstream systems may payoff. Risk is that going with something other than Ford could result in warranty issues or at least problems with the dealer as nothing is simple any more. Are you considering Ford's system strictly because of a warranty? Others do that too...

bulldog86 · December 2003

Davant,
Thanks for the reply. My primary concern was helping prevent "snatch and grab" of the factory DVD and audiophile stereo. Rip-offs like this seem to be the biggest problem in the commmuter lots I use....but since all car alarms seem to be universally ignored in public spaces, the enhanced security may be somewhat illusory. Am less concerned about the truck being stolen, and I really want ease of use--i.e., don't want the thing going off in the garage if I open the door to retrieve a coffee cup, for example. USAA reduces my insurance premium thanks to the System 4 so it will pay for itself ($299) over time. Just don't want the truck towed to the dealer when the alarm fails and cuts the ignition....so am hoping for greater reliability than the 1991 version I owned.

s852 · December 2003

You say that the insurance discount will pay for the alarm.
The discounts I've seen have been minimal and only apply to certain types of alarms (usually only to ones that arm automatically without having to remember to press the key fob).
How long will it it take for you to recoup the $299 cost based on the insurance discount?

watchdog3 · January 2004

I live in Minnesota: Used Loaded 2003 Program (employee) Expy's are being sold here for $28,500. They all have about 15K miles. The BEST I can find an 03 Sequoia Limited is about $38,500. I love the Toyota but $10K Delta may be just TOO geat a difference.

However, 01 Sequoias are ALL going for MORE than $30K, unless they have TONS of miles. I have not researched the Fords. But I gotta believe in 2 more years an 03 EXPY with under 40K will still be worth more than $20K.

Sounds like about the same operating costs but less upfront.

blockislandguy · January 2004

Watchdog3, while I agree with your conclusion, I think you compared apples to oranges to get there. I think you compared XLTs to Sequoia Limiteds. Used Eddie Bauers (the comparable to a Limited) are still well over 31K. So the price difference is a lot less. HOWEVER, you can pick up an EB with a lot more features (climate controlled seats, etc.) than you get in a Limited and your running costs will be lower. For example, any 03 Sequoia Limited at 38K or so will have high mileage and worn sneakers. The EB you can find with relatively new sneakers and only 15,000 miles. Good sneakers will cost $600.

bulldog86 · January 2004

S852-
My insurance company applies a 10% savings with the security system installed, or about $60 a year--so 5 years to the break even point. I keep my vehicles 7-8 years, so if the alarm requires no repairs over the period I own the truck, it seems advantageous.

s852 · January 2004

Generally, insurance companies only give any applicable discount on the comprehensive portion of the premium, not the entire premium.

bulldog86 · January 2004

You are probably correct, I need to review the policy...but the point is moot, as the truck is at the dealer now for alarm installation and some warranty body work (small imperfections in the rain gutters on the driver's side roof, and no paint on the tail gate hinges)
So--will see how long this alarm lasts and how it performs.

tourguide · January 2004

I would like to be able to get into a new Expy when the lease runs out on our van. The more I am reading about Ford customer service though, the more I am questioning that choice. There are numerous reports of LIMITS to the number of times you can take a vehicle to the dealer for a selected problem (such as alignment) even (and especially) during the bumper to bumper warranty period. When I lay out a large sum of money for a vehicle I expect ANY problem to be covered under the warranty period REGARDLESS of the number of return trips to the dealer it requires. Placing a cap on the number of times a given repair will be covered under the warranty period is HORRIFIC customer service. I am stunned and shocked to read reports of this on these boards from folks who are new vehicle owners. Ford's "recovery" will not be sustained with these practices and I'll be voting with my cash based on the company I believe will treat me best.

I buy my vehicles for the long term and I don't want to be hassled IF I have a problem.

So what about it new Ford owners, have you been treated right?

alwaysfords · January 2004

I don't know if you could find any dealer that will give you unlimited alignments during the warranty period. Alignments are typically a wear type item subject to how the driver dirves and the vehicle is treated. Coming off the truck out of alignment and expecting unlimited alignments are two different things. I have had 5 Fords from new and never been disappointed with the service I've gotten, but that is all relevant to t dealer that is doing the service, not the manufacturer. You can get bad service from any dealer regardless of who the manufacturer is.

davant · January 2004

It's the best attention getting header I could drum up regarding Ford service. I haven't needed but one alignment in the first year of Expie ownership. Our dealer treated me right by taking me to the mall and picking me up. They said it was fixed and it told me to bring it back if it wasn't. No one mentioned that being me picky and making the vehicle perform as designed wasn't covered under warranty no matter how many attempts that took, in fact quite the opposite. I'm not sure if another auto maker put out the hogwash you're referring to, but Ford is no better or worse than any of the mainstream car companies, probably smack in the middle. My ownership experiences with Cadillac, Chevrolet, Dodge, Honda, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, Nissan, Pontiac, Porsche, Toyota, and Volvo dealers aren't any better or worse. Dealer service as a whole is like other consumer goods, there's good and bad; no corporate direction to treat customers poorly or cut corners on perceived repeat problems.

Keep in mind that few happy, satisfied customers take the time to laud on internet forums. Therefore, the ranters represent a very small percentage of vehicle owners as a whole. If you go to a BMW or Mercedes site you'll find the same is true. I'm just as concerned as you and my warranty period hasn't been trouble free. To this point it has all been free trouble though...

blockislandguy · February 2004

I've got a question that's bugging me. Everone "knows" that the Expy/Nav product is better than the GMs and the Toyota Sequoia. Better means more engine technology, fold flat third seat, rack and pinion steering, independent rear suspension, and a nicer interior. Clearly the Expy/Navs SUVs are a generation ahead of the General's.

Not only are they a generation ahead, they cost less to buy (Expys are 2-3K less than a Tahoe/Yukon; Navs at 10K off list before you walk into the front door==Denali list).

Moreover, the Exp/Nav product hasn't been bedeviled by CSK issues, the reputation of poor GM service, etc. etc.

YET, when you just look at the number of posts, the Yukon/Denali/Sequoia crowd post far more frequenty, seem to do more with their vehicles, and identify more with them. Why??

Take a look at the number of posts per brand:

Expy 1254
Nav 919
Tahoe/Yukon 4379
Denali 2360
Sequo. 7695

clpurnell · February 2004

It is all about demographics. On average the avg import buyer is more internet savy than the avg domestic buyer. So therefore they are more likely to use the internet for research and to discuss they're vehicles.

The Chevy vs Ford thing is tougher to call. My best guess would be that chevy owners are more enthusiastic and relate more to there vehicle purchase than would the ford buyer. Also I see the Tahoe/Yukons driven more by men while the Expy's are driven more by women which may or may not make a difference.

I too think the expy/nav is a great SUV but was scared away by Ford resale and reliability. They need to get the 300 hp v8 in the expy quickly as the Hemi Durango and Armada are going to steal a lot of it sales.

davant · February 2004

Maybe the reason could be that GM gives a year of free Internet Service and Toyota gives you a laptop?

Even if they did I'd still choose the Expedition.

For the record, the GM's are driven INTO more Fords by women. Surely you've seen the pro-GM ad campaigns that say, "Have you driven into a Ford lately?" I said pro-GM because they total so easy it sells more units, 2:1 over Ford that tends to survive with the stiffer frame. Toyota's total easily too, not because they're fragile but they cost so much to repair.

On second thought, maybe I read the ad wrong. ;0]

corpus · February 2004

I drove a 4wd Suburban for ten years/122,000 mi., and loved it. I towed extensively, and used the 4wd (low) for at least 2,000 miles in sand. It only recently began to have rattle issues, and it fouled a cylinder, so I bought a 2003 Expedition Fx4.

From day one, the driver door did not fit well--let air in hitting small bumps at highway speeds. The body cladding rattled. I took it in, and they fixed the rattle. The door is tighter, but still rattles on its latch. I had to replace the tires because they wouldn't balance, and they made the steering wheel vibrate on the highway.

You can feel the road a lot more in the Expedition, which some may like, but it also means that the driving experience is less comfortable. I get back in the Suburban and it feels like a marshmallow compared to the Expedition, but even though I like a rougher ride, the Suburban seems like a higher quality vehicle. The Expedition is tight, yet it is tight in a way that makes it feel cheaper. It already feels like it's been beaten up worse than my Suburban.

That's my perspective, for what it's worth.

bewhite25 · February 2004

Any idea when we can expect to see the 3V 5.4 in the Expeditions? Also, even though the Expedition has a nice interior, I'd love to see Ford dress it up with the new F-150 interior...

slandy · February 2004

How in the world can you say the exp is better than the Seqouia? It is less efficient, less dependable, resale is worse, not as strong off the road-there is a reason for the solid rear axle. Drive both vehicles for 5 years and see which one is holding up better, squeaks, rattles, loose suspension etc....

jrc346 · February 2004

Done. If that means you will count in the last generation of Expeditions. My 1999 Expedition EB is at 96,000 miles and has been the most reliable vehicle I have ever owned. I have not driven a Sequoia before, but I think your assuming that Expeditions wont hold up as well as Sequoia's and that is why you want people to drive both. Repairs to date have been:

New alternator due to shorted bat. (@~65,000K)
New brakes (@~90,000K)

I live on a bad, dirt, Michigan road, so it gets it fair share of abuse, and it remains to be extremely quiet.

I have seen the reliability ratings in CR for the new Expy, but they, like many other manufacturers new vehicles, have first year problems. I will be anxious to see if they do any better in CR's up coming Annual Auto Issue.

jekcartalk · February 2004

Expedition has been a great SUV so far:
75K miles. So far only had front end work done @ ~$350.00. Had some minor things done during the warranty period. The worst seems to be the breaks that need to be replaced every 40,000 miles. Maybe the weight of the vehicle. Other than that it's been a solid ride. In Fact I've been tempted to "down size" to 2004 Mercury Mountaineer or Explorer but my kids would not be happy! Lots of room. Ride quality the same as when the day I bought it (Very Good).

bendotorg · February 2004

Hello,

I recently created a Web site dedicated to the 2003 Ford Expedition. There is no commercial slant, just took some time to share various reviews, photos, etc. that I have compiled and thought others may be interested in.

http://www.ben.org/cars/expedition

Ben

tourguide · February 2004

Ben,

WOW! GREAT job on that site!! I'm going to have fun looking through all that you have there. I can see LOTS of time invested and I know that others will appreciate your efforts too.

Are you taking contributions too? I'm going to be ordering either a late build 04 or an early 05 and I'd add my thoughts too if you're taking submissions. I'm holding out for this particular time frame because the 3 valve 5.4 is supposed to be coming for some of the late build 04s and will be offered in the 05s for sure (if the guys at the local dealership are to be believed).

Thanks!

-TG

tourguide · February 2004

The link below will take you to a pic of a 2004 EB Premium Edition in red. I know there have been a few people here asking about this option and this is what it looks like in red.

http://auto.consumerguide.com/auto/new/reviews/full/index.cfm/id/- 37555

After seeing this pic (it's only one view I know) I've decided there are better ways for me to spend $895. I just don't care for this option. The marketing slicks from Ford show the black monochrome and after looking at this I can see why they chose to do that.

dollirae · March 2004

Our 2001 Expedition is nearing the end of it's warranty. We don't have tons of extra money to purchase this extended warrenty, but are wondering what everyone out there thinks about it. I'm tempted to just 'play it out' and not buy it. And if I need a repair, then fix it. I do have 4 children, and one of my concerns is the electric windows. What has your experience been?

tourguide · March 2004

Ford Warranty Central lists the following things that people should consider when thinking about the purchase of an ESP:

You should consider an ESP if you are.....

-Buyers of well equipped vehicles, with extensive high-tech components.

-High mileage drivers.

-Customers who keep their vehicle beyond the original factory limited warranty period.

-Customers who like and can afford premium programs.

-Customers who can't afford or don't want to deal with unexpected repair bills.

In addition to those I would say ESP plans make sense if you KNOW that you're going to be keeping your Expy for a longer period of time. If you plan to trade out of it then it makes little sense.

When we buy our 05 I am planning to make that part of the package. 7yr/100,000 $0 deductable. That plan can be had for about $2650 on Fordwarrantycentral.com. Oh and BTW, I wouldn't consider ANY other plan than a Ford ESP. Third party warranties cost about the same and are often difficult to get payment on. Most people who purchase these plans have found that they have used them and gotten a good value for the money. (this is of the people that I've asked who've responded)

blockislandguy · March 2004

I like the features of the Expy/Nav vs. the GM alternatives, but I'm concerned about the third seat. I wish it didn't have one. Unfortunately, it is not removable. I occasionally need to carry a pallet load of heavy equipment. Would 500-700 pounds of cast iron crush the flat folded third seat? Do they make custom heavy duty rubber cargo mats (e.g., Weatherbeaters) for this yet?

Or, do I just put up with the solid rear axle, recirculating ball steering with mandatory service every six months on the steering assembly, cold start knocking engine, plastic pickup truck interior of the GM to get a good space for a heavy pallet?

jrc346 · March 2004

Heck no you don't have to step back in time to be able to transport your heavy loads. I am sure that the seat would be fine, but for extra assurance, cut a piece of ply wood to fit in there for those times that you need to carry those heavy loads. That way your seat and carpet will be protected and weight across the same area will be better dispersed.

ims · March 2004

I currently drive a Landcruiser '95 with AWD; my other cars have been AWD Audi and currently an AWD Subaru WRX. Since Expedition 4WD has capability of 2WD, the 4WD system cannot be like an AWD. What are the differences and which type of system will actually give better traction? I am not a car whiz, so try to keep the explanation simple. Thanks

stever · March 2004

Check out the 4WD & AWD systems explained discussion too.

Steve, Host

davant · March 2004

IMS,

Regardless of whether you have 2WD, 4WD, AWD, manual or automatic transmission, the traction will always be the same in NWD (no wheel drive) as all axles will be unlocked and turn freely. This position is also known as neutral on your gearshift or PRNDL. Just trying to help. =]

wilson2 · April 2004

I bought a 2003 Ford Expedition last October. At the time it had 14,000 miles on it. Since then I have noticed a few things that concern me just a little. 1.) Brakes squeal when pressed lightly. No other symptoms with the brakes just the squeak -very annoying. 2.) A rumbling sound, like I have "pipes" on the truck when I start it and until it gets warm. I have read that this might be the rear differential but it happens when the truck is standing still(yikes!). 3.) The transmission seems to hunt for gears when I accelerate from a very low speed, say 10 MPH - then it sort of slams into the next gear. It does this quite a bit in stop and go commuter traffic. All of the issues seem minor but I would like to get them addressed while I'm still under warranty. I mentioned the brakes to the dealer and they said they couldn't find anything (go figure). Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated.

Thanks,

tourguide · April 2004

I would have a set of Raybestos Quiet Stop pads installed if I were you. You could go round and round with your stealership and if they aren't feeling REAL cooperative you're SOL. The pads I recommended are ceramic pads and dust up VERY little. WELL worth the money.

#2 sounds like piston slap to me. If this is what it is, then there is no fix forthcoming from Ford. You could switch to a full synthetic motor oil and this will help with the sypmtoms. Keep in mind though this is much like taking sudafed for a cold.

#3 sounds like somthing Ford should be able to help with.

Is your 03 an early build?

edistobeach · May 2004

Trying to build a 2004 Exp. I do not understand what the Advance Trac and Four Corner Load Leveling are. Also, the air sup.??? Can anyone explain what these are , why you'd want them??
Thanks,
Babs

califjohn · May 2004

Has anyone seen any info on the 2005 Expy? I have read very little about what may change. The small diesel seems dead for sure at least until 2007 or later, but the F-150's 3v 5.4 and 5 speed auto are possible. Either or both should help fuel economy. For tourguide: Do the Raybestos ceramic pads improve stopping distances as well as reduce black dust? Does this result in increased wearing of the rotors with these harder pads? For edistobeach: You may want to search in some of the previous posts going back some time as I believe these topics were discussed. Perhaps our host will help point you in the right direction too.

dwgutwir · May 2004

Advance Trac is Ford's stability control system for the Expedition.

The four corner load leveling suspension is the air suspension. You'd want this if you planned to tow a fair amount, but that's really all. It might provide a better ride in some situations and also lowers the vehicle slightly when parking for easier egress. I've heard of reliability issues with this system, and its not cheap to repair post warranty.

If I wasn't planning on towing an awful lot I'd pass on this and take the Advance Trac for the improved safety in ever day driving circumstances.

Note, on the Expedition these two options are NOT available together. It is one or the other.

tourguide · May 2004

I don't know if the Quietstops reduce stopping distances or not. Most people who have them claim that they are at least as good, some say better at stopping power. In my view, if they are as good at stopping and eliminate (or severely cut back) the brake dust they are a win.

Regarding the rotor wear. I think this is a myth. This was the thing everyone was saying about semi-metalic pads when they first came out. Oh, they'll tear up your rotors. I think this is a rumor started by techs who want a few more hours on the clock.

You should (IF you don't neglect them) get about 100,000 miles on a set of rotors provided your driving style isn't too agressive. The worst thing you can do to the longevity of your rotors is allow the pads to go metal on metal. Then you're screwed and it is going to cost you big $.

califjohn · May 2004

the Raybestos info. I agree totally with your advice to not let the pads wear to metal.

nvbanker · May 2004

1) Squeaking sucks, and it shouldn't. I'm surprised the dealer won't help with this. "They should.

2) Rumble on start up - if it's right as the engine catches, so does mine.

3) Transmission - this isn't right and is the only problem of yours I'd be really concerned about. It needs service. Probably a reflash.

Good luck!

tloftus · May 2004

Hi guys- I have asked this before, and am still wrestling with it. Have a 2004 Expedition and love it (except for the recent problem with the in-dash CD). My dealer says to change the oil every 3,500 miles. My local mechanic says every 4,000. The freaking owners manual from the manufacturer, FORD, says that for my kind of driving (no towing, no off-roading, normal conditions)every 5,000...what do I do?

alwaysfords2 · May 2004

I've always been a 3,000 miler (dino oil) even though my driving doesn't call for it. On my 2003 I've been able to hold out to 4,000, allowing a little extra mileage for the synthetic blend

gheimur · May 2004

I've recently had a 1995 Plymouth Voyager 160k that I repaced with a 2004 Expy 2 weeks ago, 2001 Ford Escape 51k, 03 Saturn 9500 miles and 96 Ford Taurus 131k. Bought all the cars new and have changed the oil myself. Before they turn 100k I changed the oil and filter every 4k. After 100k every 5k. Plymouth Voyager,Taurus Engine, and Escape engines all run like new. No Smoke, burning etc.. Consumers Reports did a test a few years ago and noticed no differnece in engine wear between 3k or 5k oil changes , so I decided to do 4k

nvbanker · May 2004

And I follow the manufacturer recommendations, of 5,000 miles. Never lost an engine yet.

stever · May 2004

I follow the manufacturer's recommendation too, but my manual says 7,500 miles.

Engine Oil - A slippery subject Part 2

Steve, Host

gasguzzler007 · May 2004

LOL I think the last time I posted was like 2 years ago.

I dont know if any of you guys remember me but I have been on the forums for a while. So whats new you ask. Well My 97 Expedition is still in my possesion and has 130k miles on it now. Last time I posted it has like 95k. It still runs like new and still hasnt given me any problems. My f150 is still in my possession. It has 65k miles on it now also with 0 problems. I no longer have a 96 Mustang GT, I dont remember if I did the last time I posted. I have a 00 Mustang 3.8 now that Im in the process of selling. I bought it to drive daily and now it needs to go so I can get my hands on another GT. Life has been really busy lately but hopefully I can stick around again and continue answering questions. If theres any Ford chats going on you know Ill be there! I see a few familiar posters on here but it seems a lot has happened.

gasguzzler007 · May 2004

I always do my oil changes every 5-6k miles. It also depends on your driving style and where you live. My cars always get 93 octane fuel even with the rising fuel prices. I always used Mobil 1 oil. While it may be expensive, I feel that it is well worth it to have a 10 year old car that is like new.

nvbanker · May 2004

your input is welcomed.

jeff88 · May 2004

Am planning to change the oil every 5,000 miles and also replace the air filter every 15k. Our new expedition has about 1300 miles on it and I plan to change the oil & filter in a few days. Have always been of the opinion that the 1st change occur fairly early. Will change again at 5k then every 5k after. Also rotate the tires every 5k with the oil change. The manual calls for 5k intervals and that seems fine to me since it is a v8 with low revving engine speeds. (When I've had 4 cyl engines, the interval was always 3,750.)

As for gas, have always thought that using the prescribed octane was best for the engine. if it calls for 87, use 87. Wouldn't 93 run hotter than ideal? To me, unless the engine knocks or pings, going higher in octane may not be the best thing for the engine.

Ford Expedition

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