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Comments
Quality issues:
1. Annoying rattle in the dash that only I can hear. Wife and dealer service reps are conspiring against me suggesting that I am hearing things. So far, hallucinations are only audible.
2. Rattle from under the car was faulty exhaust shrouds. Replaced under TSB and warranty.
3. Occasional groan/rattle from low in firewall diagnosed as ABS self check. It seems obsessive to me though to self check several times a day (always at a stoplight). Wife thinks its appropriate that hallucinating husband drives obsessive-compulsive car.
The good stuff:
Power to spare. Fully loaded can climb the I-5 grapevive at 80mph with plenty in reserve.
Very stable in crosswinds. Much better than my 4-Runner ever was.
Stable at speed: Perfect wheelbase and width porportions, as well as excellent suspension make this the best freeway cruiser I can imagine. Hit 104 mph once and felt rock solid (and still had several hundred rpm to red-line).
Put a Borla cat-back on it. Best $450 I ever spent.
Exceeding EPA freeway mileage is easy. When driven responsibly (not the way I drive), will get 18 MPG on highway. Average 80 MPH and will still get over 16. In-town mileage averages about 15. Best mileage I ever got was 18.6 MPG (From Evanston Wy to St. George Ut.). Worst was 12.6, mostly off-roading in the Wyoming Range and Wind Rivers.
Heated seats rule.
Stock Michelin LTX's are great highway, and good snow tires (when newish). Suck in mud and deep sand. Sould have made them switch with Perelli Scorpion AT's (in stock size). Will probably switch to 285/75/16's though when the M's get to about 20%.
I've gone on long enough...
Good luck in your search.
HiC
The “shroud” rattle on your 1998 is the same problem that is endemic on all LC’s I believe. My 1991 has been that way since new and this is my second exhaust system. I think it’s a Toyota trademark thing as in Harley Davidson’s exhaust note. Can’t wait for my 2000 to start rattling, then I’ll know it’s properly broken-in.
The sound: Not louder than stock, but at lower frequencies. Like a subwoofer at your tail pipe.
Engine management: Per my Toyota Service Tech, the engine management computer auto-adjusts to the reduced backpressure. It takes several tanks of gas though to "settle in". With the exception of the replaced part (from the cat back), there is no impact on any warranty. The Borla is warrantied for life.
Mileage: Borla may also share some responsibility for my decent gas mileage. I put it on just as the car was getting broken-in though so I can only speculate on that. Borla claims a 1-2 MPG improvement in highway driving though.
I installed it myself in about one hour and did not need to jack the car to do it.
Anyone want a barely used stock cat back for a 100 series? Free for the taking.
HiC
Also, was curious about OME suspensions. Has anybody installed either their shocks or springs on a newer 98+ LC?? If so, what was the outcome. I do some off-roading,towing and hauling with my LC but cannot stand the way the back end sags when loaded. OME says their replacement coils will fix this but will also raise the back end by 40mm. That means I will have to adjust the front torsion bars to even out the ride. Don't know how far I can raise the front end without taking the shafts out of alignment. Was contemplating the installation of Rancho 9000 adjustable shocks all the way around. Any info would be appreciated.
By the way, I too have that heat shield rattle, a crackling noise in the sunroof shade and squeeky rear brakes, but I still would not trade in my LC for any other car.
I have an OME rear spring and shock (the mild version) on my truck now. I hated the rear sag too, as well as the crappy departure angle, but you do not need to adjust the front to match if you don't want to. I wanted mine to sit level when LOADED, so, after I install the rear shocks and springs I put about 800 lbs (in the rear and at the hitch combined) and THEN figured out how much I wanted to adjust the front. It was more like 15 mm, not the 40mm the rear got unladen. Toyota service installed it all but I had to go back for adjustments twice as it worked in. All on my nickle of course: They no longer warranty my shocks and springs.
BTW: with the OME, the car "feels" like stock unladen when loaded, but can be a bit harsh when unladen. I would not recommend it unless off-roading is something you do on a regular basis.
Also, if you garage it, make sure you will still have clearance with the back rides 2" higher (as mine will if I end up with the 285 tires). I got lucky: I'll have about 1/2 inch to spare!
HiC
I've become accustomed to defect free from Toyota and Lexus. Is that too much to ask for a high end truck?
I have a 98 TLC which I have had for about 2.5 years. It was the first new model which my dealer received. I have had virtually no problems to date - a couple of minor rattles which were easily fixed.
My previous vehicle was a 95 TLC which is very similar to the 97 LX450. The 98 is a much better vehicle - V8 engine, better ride, quieter, more leg room in the back, etc.
I typically keep a vehicle three years, however, have pretty much decided to keep my existing TLC for at least another year as there is really no other sport utility I would rather be driving.
I think Lexus has wood, wood steering wheel, the lower body tone matches, the suspension adjustments, and it's really mostly cosmetic.
From my own experience, those who lease tend to not mind paying another $75 or $100 a month or a little more for the Lexus name (L on the back!!) where cash buyers find a $10000 difference hard to swallow, at times. I have heard of smaller gaps in difference depending on the year of the car and exactly what's actually ON it, but they are both very very nice rigs!
We have only put 1800 miles on our new Cruiser and are sold. The build quality is exceptional. Ride and Comfort rule.
Can't wait for summer and Red Rock County.
This is how I made my decision. It may not be the right decision for everyone.
I purchased a 01 DX 470 with NV, etc.
Money Issues.
I bargained for both as I really did not know which I would buy. Both equipped the same the DX was $6,000 more.
Car buying history.
This is how I purchase my vehicles. I pay cash and keep them a long time. 1972 I bought a BOW sold it in 1985. 1985 bought a Mercedes sold it in 2000. 2000 bought the 01 LX470. In all fairness I have always had a sports car as well which I buy and keep a long time. 1982 bought a Porsche sold it in 1999. 1999 I bought another Porsche.
Technical aspects of decision.
I figured if I was paying $6,000 more for the DX what was I getting for my money.
1. The suspension. I found in my test drives and now in ownership that the DX with the suspension on the firm setting handles with a lot less body roll at high speeds on the freeway and on roads with turns. I drive hard some of the time for stress relief. I found the suspension in the DX does a better job. Also the ability to lower the height gives me more clearance to get into tight garage spaces, etc.
2. The Mark Levinson stereo is very, very good. I am a big, big Jazz fan. I paid to upgrade the stereo in both of my previous cars. I find no need to upgrade the stereo in the X.
3. The warranty is longer by a year on the X. Even though I keep my cars for a long time I think the extra year is worth something. Additionally, I get a free loner from nexus when I have my service done. That is also worth something.
4. The comfort features of the DX is also worth something. The way the dash is lit etc.
The decision.
I decided that for the Suspension, Stereo, and Longer Warranty I would pay $6,000. I also keep my cars a long time and so getting what I really like becomes more important. Spread over 15 years, the time I kept the 500SEL Mercedes my last car, I found the $6,000 not to be an issue when juxtaposed against the features above.
Hope this helps. This is how I decided. It may not be right for someone else.
Regards.
Also what I found by researching the Rav4, I mistyped the Url and to my suprise, I ended up at toyota,japan. I'm including the url, it's written in Japaneese, but you can position your mouse over some of the text, look at the bottom of your screen to see where you're going and there are some great vehicles with pictures of all of toyota's vehicles including lexus' there. Interior and exterior. The Url is http://www.toyota.co.jp.
I own both brands. I have owned several Lexus cars and also had a FJZ80 TLC. Loved the TLC. Just a rock. Chevy has NO idea what a rock really is. Toyota does! Great truck and unbelievable reliability.
That said, Lexus offers several upgrades. Better leather, wood wheel/shift, adjustable height control (huge in underground garages and when you have toddlers getting in/out of the truck), adjustable suspension settings (firmness/comfort), nicer colors, Nakamichi stereo system (eons better/nicer than the TLC JBL system), and most importantly the better lexus treatment. Lexus has a longer warranty (4/50) and extended my warranty 5K miles without my asking when I had a MINOR problem with my coupe. Yes, its INITIALLY more expensive but over time becomes worth it.
This may be dealer-specific but the Toyota dealers tend to behave more like mass market dealers and dont seem to put much effort into customer service. From my experience, I think even the Benz dealers are guilty of the same. Once you own a Lexus, you will be coddled in a way that I have not seen elsewhere (except maybe with the Bentley/RR marquee).
If I was looking @ buying a '01 TLC and the Nav system was not important, i would rather buy a '00 model loaded LX470 and pay roughly what you would pay for a new TLC. Its pretty much a wash $ wise and the warranty period is about equal but the Lexus truck will have more features pound for pound and a significantly better ownership experience.
My $0.02.
<<stacy wrote:
Sweety12 [sic] - What made you pick the Lexus over the Toyota? All I can see different is the suspension goes down to make it easier to climb in.Please respond. Thanks, Stacy>>
If you're not interested in offroading, I would consider the Avalon.
Of the four requirements mentioned "luxury, comfort, quiet, space" the LX easily outclasses the competion in three areas. Luxury, comfort, quiet. The Luxury features are the best in any SUV. Comfort is more subjective but I think most people would say the LX is very, very comfortable. Quiet, the LX is the most quiet of any SUV made. The TLC is very, very close in all these areas. The ride of the LX is the most outstanding of any SUV [adjustability, reliability] the TLC is a little less so. In a sentence the LX rides more like your husband's BMW and less like a truck than a TLC.
I live in Socal as well and understand your needs. You have one big advantage if you do buy the TLC. Dianne sells the TLC here in Socal. I did not buy a TLC, but Dianne gave me the straight stuff. She was fair and honest.
Both vehicles are very, very, good. The best in class. I have driven most of the SUVs on the market. Between the LX and TLC we are talking "Shades of Grey." Between these two and others were are talking "Black and White." The others are not in the same class.
I have not driven or even seen the Seq so I cannot help you there. However, ask Dianne she knows both of those vehicles well.
Good Luck with your decision.
I fully understand your dilemma. We have 3 kids, a teenager, a 3 year old and an infant. Hopefully, if I can stay away from work long enough, we'll have 4. :-)
My wife LOVES the LX. She drove our TLC and simply did not want to give it up. She liked the 3 rows of 'adult' seats and the trunk space was decent for two strollers, a diaper bag and other 'gear.' When we got the LX, she was in ecstacy.
We drove the Navigator. She liked the kerb appeal but hated its ride and size. Ditto for the Excursion and Expedition. [Try backing up in those vehicles].
The Sequoia was interesting (being new and all that) but rather blase on the inside and just not as comfortably appointed. Her view was why buy the Sequoia when the LX/TLC was simply a better vehicle fit and finish wise. We both felt that the Sequoia ride was as truck-like as the Expedition (or maybe marginally better).
She thought the LX was the perfect combo of luxury, safety, utility, refinement and quality and most importantly, the 3rd row seats are separately removeable. She liked the adjustable height control too. In fact, there is nothing to dislike in the LX. She thought the dashboard layout in the LX was better [lit] than the TLC. She is absolutely coddled at the dealership, too.
On my part, I like my cars to coddle me. Thats why I buy S class Mercedes cars and Lexus cars. I am less into performance so the BMW has never been an option (although I admit I lusted after the 750iL in my 'first' youth). I do like to step on it on occasion but I have been accused by my spouse of driving like an old man. Go figure!
You will love the LX and you will enjoy the ownership experience.
My $0.02
[insert appropriate disclaimer for bias/self dealing].
The 2nd/3rd row seats do not recline to the best of my knowledge but I'll check when I go out later.
The solution to the 'toddler head flopping' syndrome is a bolster pillow that you can buy at Toys'R'Us. It looks sorta like a 'pillow helmet' and supports the [top half of the] insides of the booster seat so when he falls asleep, his head is supported.
It drives like a dream. We liked the older model TLC and the only thing I hated was the engine which I felt was a little anaemic. This is SO much better. As IXIXVI said, it truly is best of class. I'll go one step further and call it the class valedictorian!
Happy New Year.
Good luck,
HiC
http://reality.sgi.com/80_series/tech/efi_relay.html
I'm researching the three SUV listed on the heading. I'm leaning towards the Toyota C.
Suggestions..thoughts..findings?
I usually keep my cars for a long time.. in this case I have outgrown my wagon.
I think I'll take the Lexus out for a spin today or tomorrow.
Happy New Year
Can any one tell me what to look for when buying this years model.
My quandry is this: am I better off buying an older LC with my $30k, or a newer 4Runner? Or is there more bang for the buck elsewhere? I'm leary of Ford and GM- already burned once.
Any guidance would be much appreciated.
Thank you in advance
thomastu628 & ptown: I would contact dianne4toyota@earthlink.net. She is in SoCal and based on all accounts can offer a very nice deal. She can help you with your 2001 Thomastu628, and maybe your pre-loved TLC ptown. Good luck.
If the email is not quite right. Just cruise through this topic, Sequoia, Highlander and you will find her there along with cliffy1 who is also a great source of info out of the VA area.
Thank you for your input. I will contact Dianne for her help then.
Thomas
I suggested Sequoia to Tom, as well as pointed out that the MSRP for a LC with BG CF C7 is $57600, and the cost of the car with those extras is well over $50,000.
-Dianne
If they continue, any word on redesign? - I hope not - love the looks of the new - although the pre 98's were legendary as well.
Toyota (1-800-GO-TOYOTA) indicates that no decisions have been made to date, but I doubt they would disclose either way.
Finally, any news on a redesign of 4Runner?
-Dianne
Listen to Dianne: Toyota not stupid.
HiC
-Dianne
Thanks.
John G
Eventually, the two driver side tires dug in so deep that the truck high centered. I spent the next 2 hours digging out around and underneath the vehicle. I was then able to rock it out and back on the compact snow and ice. Unfortunately, in the process something broke and the AC was undrivable. It made a loud groaning sound (metal on metal), the vehicle rocked when it moved forward, and eventually stopped completely.
After towing it to the shop, I found out that the front differential was broken. They had to order the parts and it'll be a week before I get the AC back.
I think something must have been wrong with the vehicle even before I got stuck. Why?
*while I was stuck, the rear passenger tire never turned and the front passenger tire seemed to spin only half heatedly.
*activetrac was still engaged while I was in 4L. It was annoying, because I expected 4L to operate all four tires like a tractor. Instead, the braking system kept stopping and starting different tires as the slid. It seemed to make things worse.
*the snow was about 18 inches deep. Four inches of power on top of trusted snow. Seems like easy work for an C.
Any thoughts? It's hard for me to imagine that anything I did could break something as tough as the LC.
As a side note, I drove home a 4x4 Chevy Blazer. It sure made me appreciate the LC!
gonzo4u@earthlink.net
His name's Steve Ganz.