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Entry Level Luxury Performance Sedans

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  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181

    Well, entry level is entry level. That definition is pretty clear cut. Sedan is pretty clear cut as well. The only thing that is questionable is the "performance" part. But it appears the A3 will perform just as well if not better than the A4. I think that was the hang up with the TSX being included in that it didn't really fit the "performance" model in a lot of people's minds. I had no problem with it being included because there are a lot of A4 w/ front wheel drive running around out west and down south that are very close on paper to a TSX. I know most people think of the Quattro when they talk Audi ELLPS but that's a choice of their own.

    Doesn't really matter all that much to me. But technically, a lot of the cars that have been traditionally discussed here are no the the performance entry from that particular brand anymore. It's just so complicated isn't it.

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    @dash5 said:
    The new TLX: Definitely on my short list.




    Thanks, Dash. By appearance alone it's at the top of my next car shopping list.

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,118

    @graphicguy said:
    Thanks, Dash. By appearance alone it's at the top of my next car shopping list.

    That is a handsome car - is it just me, or do I detect some semblance to the ILX around the C-pillar and trunk area in the side profile?

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  • carnaughtcarnaught Member Posts: 3,497

    Wish they would have (drastically) changed the grill.

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,439

    Nice

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • dash5dash5 Member Posts: 421

    I like the grill now. Interesting that there is no shifter. Overall though looks great and I'm anxious to see how they price it.

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    @Michaell@Edmunds said:
    That is a handsome car - is it just me, or do I detect some semblance to the ILX around the C-pillar and trunk area in the side profile?

    Michaeall...I see that same tail light treatment in the ILX, the RLX, and how the TLX. At first, I wasn't sure I liked the LED headlights, as Acura is using them as a design cue. They're starting to grow on me, though. Looks like the tailights are the LCD "lite pipe" variety replacing my LED tail lights. That interior is gorgeous.

    Saw some other specs....

    0-60 around 5 secs for the TLX SH AWD (about 1/2 sec quicker than my current TL SH AWD). MPG is 21/31. I get 21 in the city, now. So, not sure that is an upgrade. But, if the numbers are right, I'm getting 28 MPG on the highway. If they can hit 31 MPG with the new trans, that would be great.

    3.5L. 290 HP and about 270 TQ. That HP and displacement is less than my durrent TL (305 HP, 3.7L), but apparently the new 9-speed trans and weight reduction is attributed to the higher performance.

    TLX multi-link suspension replaces my TL's double wishbones. Not sure about that. Will have to drive to see how that affects ride/handling.

    Probably stop by my dealer tonight to see when their roll out is going to be.

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    Having my 320i now since Oct and having over 12K miles on I can say that BMW did it's homework on a entry level Sports sedan. One can get a 320i with the Sports package, (it's really the M sport package) for $1300, a bargin... It can be had with a manual transmission out the door for roughly 5% less then MSRP, if the buyer knows how to haggle with the salesman and over on Bimmerfest, a lot of people know how to haggle. If you add the Premium package to said car, you have a nice ELLPS. Now on power, the 320i only makes 180, but installed the BMS Stage 1 ($395 and installs in 45 minutes) and the power difference between the 320 and 328 disappear. In fact, my 320i is faster then a E90 328i. Overall I'm very happy with this car, as I stated in the past, I don't plan to track the car, so not having a the sport package hasn't been a issue for me. I have been driving it lot between Phoenix and San Diego, Phoenix and Tucson, and I'm simply amazed at the highway MPG best been 36.6 MPG, with cruise set at 80 and A/C on. Is the face of ELLPS changing yes, and I think Acura was the first company to make it change with the TSX.

  • carnaughtcarnaught Member Posts: 3,497

    Regarding the TLX: I like the grill now.

    For me, I still don't dig the shield look, and it's kind of bulbous.....totally subjective, I know.

  • sweendogysweendogy Member Posts: 1,310
    edited April 2014

    tsx Nothing more then a rebaged smaller accord-while a nice car- the new tlx looks great from the side but sorry the grill is still so pronounced it really takes away from the rest of the car like the TL, which by all accounts was a styling nightmare for the brand. & If they are going to make cars without shifters just put a seat in its place, let's make it a 6 seater------ push button drive, reverse, nav button, parking break - seems like they are trying to hard and I guarantee someone will leave this thing in gear at the wrong time.

  • ctlctl Member Posts: 129
    edited April 2014

    I have never owned a TL, but personally, I think the current generation TL (2009 - 2014, especially post 2012) actually looks quite a bit better (exterior wise) than the new TLX in many area (size, stance, and presence). Yes the TLX looks a bit better than TSX, but that's about it...

  • stickguystickguy Member Posts: 50,439

    The TL I like was the 2004-2008 vintage. I was behind one today (in my 2000 TL) and enjoyed the view. Also like the interior much better (plus I fit much better).

    2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.

  • sweendogysweendogy Member Posts: 1,310

    @stickguy‌ - right on best looking was that generation - bmw and mb lovers like to use product codes- so the UA6-UA7

  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,163

    @stickguy said:
    The TL I like was the 2004-2008 vintage.

    Agreed. The shield/beak front felt repulsive, at least at first. It kind of grew on a little bit, but was never in a beauty contest. TSX actually looked just a tad better in this beak thing than TL. I also liked previous TSX.

    BTW, TSX was a perfect size for me. Similar to older BMWs and Audis. I don't really carry passengers, but I like four doors (actually five). To me back seat size is not as essential, as driving experience, which those shorter wheelbase vehicles provided. Unfortunately, all those names grew to sizes reminding their bigger brothers 10 years ago. I think the whole category really shifted. When you get something like optioned-out 335, A4 or soon coming C-class, they aren't really entry level, they are still "sporty", but not really "sports". Same would be with CTS, TLX, or others.

    Unfortunately, their smaller siblings, which some would now argue as ELLPS, come mostly in FWD setups, which is off for traditionalists. It becomes fact of life. It is true that contemporary FWD is not your mother's FWD - current advances in torque handling made those cars much better to drive. Many have or will have AWD option and better engines, which mitigates some of the issue.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481

    So this is a paddle shifter?

  • laurasdadalaurasdada Member Posts: 4,686
    edited April 2014

    @stickguy said:

    I owned an '05 TL for 6.5 years/85k trouble-free, fun and efficient miles. One of Honda/Acuras best designs imo (along with original Legend Coupe). Clean, elegant, sporty. I was so disheartened by the current design, did not consider it for even a moment. The toned down beak/shield is an improvement, but still wouldn't mind seeing it go the way of the Dodos... The TLX, from appearances, welcome back, Acura!

    I"ve not owned nearly as many cars as I'd like (darn family responsibilities and fiscal conservatism!), but my '88 Integra and '05 TL remain two of my faves.

    '21 Dark Blue/Black Audi A7 PHEV (mine); '22 White/Beige BMW X3 (hers); '20 Estoril Blue/Oyster BMW M240xi 'Vert (Ours, read: hers in 'vert weather; mine during Nor'easters...)

  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343

    I like the interior of the new TLX, and I wonder if not having a shift lever will be a plus or a minus in attracting customers. At this point, I don't have any experience with "no shifter" so I'll go with being neutral on the subject.

    I am assuming the interior utilizes the upper and lower screen approach -- I run hot and cold on that, too, but probably more cold: I am more in favor of one screen generally speaking, but the TLX's interior does seem to send out most, if not all, of the queues that suggest it is a Premium car interior (an upgrade from my 2012).

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    Again, no condemnation of your love of Audis. Your experiences have just been different than mine.

    My experiences with Audi have all been positive. Every company can have a bad apple. The real goal should be to buy a vehicle that never gives a company a chance to establish their customer service levels, as you never have to visit them. That's what happened my first 4,100 miles in the perfect 2014 S4, but a day before I'm supposed to pick it up at the body shop, I'm told the dealer is finding the left front side of the vehicle out of alignment spec, enough out of spec that they can't adjust to meet spec.

    The accident was on the right side; this could spell trouble. Not Audi's fault of course, the Lexus driver is at fault. I will say I escaped the ordeal without as little as a bruise; the belt did what it's supposed to do. I'm told the tow truck could have caused the suspension damage.

    All the fluids had to be refilled & recharged (coolant, transmission, transmission coolant, AC system). The driver's seat belt has to be replaced (one-time use with significant impacts). The air box had to be replaced. Might end up being more than 17K when all is said and done; I think they should have totaled it; we'll see.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,118

    @andres3 said:Might end up being more than 17K when all is said and done; I think they should have totaled it; we'll see.

    $17K in damage repairs is still only about 33% of the value of the car; not even close to the threshold used by most insurance carriers to write it off.

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  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @Michaell@Edmunds said:
    $17K in damage repairs is still only about 33% of the value of the car; not even close to the threshold used by most insurance carriers to write it off.

    Yes, but when you add in Diminished value of around 15%, Rental Car expenses of about $1,250, and who knows how much extra could be needed before all said and done. And if the vehicle isn't quite right after all that effort; what then?

    Basically looking at near $30K or 60%. Still, too low to total, but my opinion is generally that cars are unfixable from significant accident damage. Maybe this body shop will change my mind; I'm hoping!

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,118

    @andres3 said:

    Oh, I'm not saying you don't have a case - we've had the diminished value discussion already and I think your car, if any, should qualify for it.

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  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343

    Please keep us posted on the body shop's progress.

  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    @andres3 said:Yes, but when you add in Diminished value of around 15%, Rental Car expenses of about $1,250, and who knows how much extra could be needed before all said and done. And if the vehicle isn't quite right after all that effort; what then?

    Basically looking at near $30K or 60%. Still, too low to total, but my opinion is generally that cars are unfixable from significant accident damage. Maybe this body shop will change my mind; I'm hoping!

    I have been in 5 accidents, 4 in cars (none my fault), one accident, I had to make a panic stop on I-8 west bound from La Mesa to Mission Valley, just picked up our truck from the dealership, truck was 6 months old, had 6K miles on, and a lady slammed into me at 65 mph, lucky for me, the truck was taller then her car, her insurance company was going to fix the truck, it needed a new frame, cost of said frame, $7900, then another $13K to R&R frame. My EX and I fought the insurance company to just total the truck, since the job was going to take roughly 3.5 months to complete.... So after 5 months (it took the dealership 2 months to complete the job) but each time I would take the truck out for a test drive I would find something wrong with the truck, after 5 months, of nit picking her insurance wrote a check for the truck. Andres3 be very picky and DO NOT sign a release unless you are 100% happy with the car, after a while, the adjuster might just say, lets forget this and write you a check... Doesn't your S4 have an aluminum frame?

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481

    The problem isn't so much that the cars can't be fixed---they certainly can be made to look as good as new---, but that the insurance companies don't want to be trapped into, or locked into, supplemental repairs on a complex luxury car, weeks or months after the initial repair. So I think they assess the damage not only as to estimated repairs, but the type of car and the type of damage. You know, floods, fires, etc, give the insurance company pause.

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @flightnurse said:
    ..... So after 5 months (it took the dealership 2 months to complete the job) but each time I would take the truck out for a test drive I would find something wrong with the truck, after 5 months, of nit picking her insurance wrote a check for the truck. Andres3 be very picky and DO NOT sign a release unless you are 100% happy with the car, after a while, the adjuster might just say, lets forget this and write you a check... Doesn't your S4 have an aluminum frame?

    >

    The S4 is a combination of aluminum, ultra high strength steel, and steel components. It appears the aluminum sub-frame of the suspension got knocked out of place affecting the left side though the impact was on the right. They said they were able to adjust it the 2nd day at the dealership to meet specs. I think unlike Toyota (in general), an Audi authorized body shop doesn't try to mess around and do things "half-way." There's only 3 body shops that qualify for "Audi Certified" in all of San Diego County. A good example is that on the first day at the dealership, they didn't try to magically adjust parts out of spec to meet spec. They admitted it didn't meet spec and worked on the car longer to get it right. In a way; this is a good thing; although my rental will now be around $1,400 due to the extended delays. I think they know the typical Audi owner is meticulous with attention to detail. After all, they didn't settle for a VW. :)

    The body shop will get the car back first thing Monday morning, do a test drive by driving the vehicle back to the shop (what happens if they wreck on the way back?) After that, he said they had a good 1.5 days of work finishing up the buffing, polishing, and detailing on the panels that were repainted (a majority of panels by the way due to blending).

    I hope I don't face delays like you did, because the more that is eaten up by rental costs out of the guy's $10K insurance limit, the harder it will be for me to collect decent diminished value.

    When I told Geico to put what they told me over the phone in writing (that they'd defer to me to be made whole first from the 10K, then come in afterwards), they balked. They said let's wait and see what Mercury agrees to pay for DV and other things first, then we'll talk. I sent a demand letter to Mercury for 15% of the total purchase price $55K (including fees/taxes) = $8,250 for DV alone. I added a caveat that this was to settle fast and quickly without me having to pay professional appraisers and incur additional costs. I told them if they force me to go further, I will no longer negotiate the highest of my consultants estimates, whereas right now I might negotiate down a bit to just get it over with.

    If there are ongoing issues with the car, I think now is the time to state for the record I thought the car should of been totaled from the beginning. At least then I can say "I told you so," and your adjuster was off by somewhere near 25% (incompetent or grossly negligent estimate).

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @Michaell@Edmunds said:
    $17K in damage repairs is still only about 33% of the value of the car; not even close to the threshold used by most insurance carriers to write it off.

    Finally got the first supplemental estimate: Just north of $20K!!!!

    Still, well below totaling even with 15% DV and $1,405 rental costs.

    However, I find being off (first estimate was $15.5K) by so much, makes me think someone wasn't being honest with themselves early on. I know supplements are common, but one of nearly 25% extra? 28 day time estimate is way off too. Looks like it'll be 1 month and 4 days if they let me pick up next Tuesday.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373

    @andres3‌

    Thanks for keeping us updated. Sorry you have to go through this whole ordeal.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    So I got in a fight with my insurance company; I believe they've turned on me and they have 3 strikes in my book now. They found out the impacted tire wouldn't balance on the wheel and had to be replaced. They tried to get away with only replacing 1 tire saying the car only had 4,200 miles. I pointed out to Geico that they were deviating from the Owner's manual and Audi specifications that recommend replacing all 4 tires, but under no circumstances should tires be replaced in less than pairs on the front and/or rear axle. They must be within 2 MM to meet spec from front to rear. After sending a semi-nasty letter to Gieco, they realized the error of their ways, and said they'd pay for 80% of 2 tires, but 20% betterment charge to me (they are within the 2 mm spec.

    20% betterment when staggered tires (2/32nd's difference) will result in reduced or at least altered performance? NO THANK YOU. Also, I won't get any betterment because I'm not going to double my maintenance frequency and hassle changing 2 tires at a time, especially when the manual says running different size tires (circumference) will result in reduced handling.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181

    If I were your insurance company I would have the tire shop shave a tire to match up with your present tires and tell you you're good to go. IMO asking for 4 new tires where only one is damaged when the car has only 4200 miles is a reach. Why would you have to double your maint. frequency if the tires are within the 2mm spec. anyway?

  • sweendogysweendogy Member Posts: 1,310

    @andres3‌ we going to see picks of this pig? Would love to see the damage myself ?
    Speed kills people stay safe.:

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @m6user said:
    If I were your insurance company I would have the tire shop shave a tire to match up with your present tires and tell you you're good to go. IMO asking for 4 new tires where only one is damaged when the car has only 4200 miles is a reach. Why would you have to double your maint. frequency if the tires are within the 2mm spec. anyway?

    They are saying I should pay a 20% betterment charge for getting two new tires replacing two tires that had 80% life left.

    My argument is simply that since I want to change all 4 tires at the same time on the same rotation, the extra 2/32nd's on the front tires will provide me no betterment. I'm not going to delay changing the 2 newer tires when the older 2 are due for replacement just so I can eek out a "betterment." I will gain no benefit. If your always changing out your tires 2 at a time you are changing them out twice as frequently (in terms of shop visits and down time) than if you just change out all 4 at once.

    I can assume and project all 4 tires will wear evenly since the car is AWD and all 4 tires measured at the same 20% wear.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    Bigger problems than tires..... Got the car back yesterday afternoon. In a quick 15 minutes close eyeball inspection, I was able to find at least 10 things wrong with the car.

    A small scuff/scratch on the black plastic windshield cowl, multiple black marks/paint blemishes on bumper edges/corners, a small minor white scratch that if not on the prior existing damage sheet, must of been caused during the shop's 38 day ownership of the car, a tiny chip on the roof, some rough slightly bumpy paint around edges such as around the fuel filling cap area, the underside of the hood has a paint blemish, and a general impression that orange peel is more prevalent or noticeable, but not bad, just not great.

    I was expecting all that above and I'm sure most of that can be fixed in a 2nd trip to the body shop under warranty. However, I wasn't expecting the following:

    1. Misaligned right doors (or at least the trim isn't lining up right) Haven't measured but I'd say around 3/16" if I had to guess).
    2. Lower Rocker panel fit and finish issues (increased gap, noticeable double sided sticky tape seeping through the wide uneven gap, paint blemishes at joint) They admitted that even with a brand new rocker panel, 9 new rivets, Audi's instructions, and new double-sided sticky tape, they've never been able to match what they do in Germany. They suggest it must be installed differently in the factory. Looks aftermarket now.
    3. The exhaust was removed and reinstalled, and now both sets of exhaust tips appear to be hanging too low in relation to the back bumper diffuser, with the right two exhaust tips noticeably about 1/2"-3/4" lower than the left pair of exhaust tips. :(

    Number 3 bothers me the most. They say if what you can see is bad and lacks QC, then perhaps what you can't see is even worse. Oh yeah, and there's still about a 4" piece of masking tape on the lower edge of the front right door (detailer should be fired).

    On the other hand, the mechanical work seems solid; that's the bright side. The car drives and runs well (of course the dealership did a large portion of that work). I'd say the only thing I can tell that might be a tad ever so slightly off is the steering wheel might just be like 1 degree off-center; very close. When I eyeball leveling the steering wheel, the car will move slightly right, then again, maybe my eyeballs are off by a degree or two.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    @andres3 said:
    Bigger problems than tires..... Got the car back yesterday afternoon. In a quick 15 minutes close eyeball inspection, I was able to find at least 10 things wrong with the car.

    A small scuff/scratch on the black plastic windshield cowl, multiple black marks/paint blemishes on bumper edges/corners, a small minor white scratch that if not on the prior existing damage sheet, must of been caused during the shop's 38 day ownership of the car, a tiny chip on the roof, some rough slightly bumpy paint around edges such as around the fuel filling cap area, the underside of the hood has a paint blemish, and a general impression that orange peel is more prevalent or noticeable, but not bad, just not great.

    I was expecting all that above and I'm sure most of that can be fixed in a 2nd trip to the body shop under warranty. However, I wasn't expecting the following:

    1. Misaligned right doors (or at least the trim isn't lining up right) Haven't measured but I'd say around 3/16" if I had to guess).
    2. Lower Rocker panel fit and finish issues (increased gap, noticeable double sided sticky tape seeping through the wide uneven gap, paint blemishes at joint) They admitted that even with a brand new rocker panel, 9 new rivets, Audi's instructions, and new double-sided sticky tape, they've never been able to match what they do in Germany. They suggest it must be installed differently in the factory. Looks aftermarket now.
    3. The exhaust was removed and reinstalled, and now both sets of exhaust tips appear to be hanging too low in relation to the back bumper diffuser, with the right two exhaust tips noticeably about 1/2"-3/4" lower than the left pair of exhaust tips. :(

    Number 3 bothers me the most. They say if what you can see is bad and lacks QC, then perhaps what you can't see is even worse. Oh yeah, and there's still about a 4" piece of masking tape on the lower edge of the front right door (detailer should be fired).

    On the other hand, the mechanical work seems solid; that's the bright side. The car drives and runs well (of course the dealership did a large portion of that work). I'd say the only thing I can tell that might be a tad ever so slightly off is the steering wheel might just be like 1 degree off-center; very close. When I eyeball leveling the steering wheel, the car will move slightly right, then again, maybe my eyeballs are off by a degree or two.

    Andres....Just my personal opinion, but I think it's time to go to the insurance company and tell them you need a new car....for all the reasons listed. If they choose to fight (like with the tires, which to me is being rather nit-picky given all 4 tires should have the same tread depth), then you can tell them to give you a new car now, or risk having a car with a salvage title instead after you begin your proceedings.

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    @graphicguy said:
    Andres....Just my personal opinion, but I think it's time to go to the insurance company and tell them you need a new car....for all the reasons listed. If they choose to fight (like with the tires, which to me is being rather nit-picky given all 4 tires should have the same tread depth), then you can tell them to give you a new car now, or risk having a car with a salvage title instead after you begin your proceedings.

    I second it and basically stated that in my posting. When a car has a repair tag of 20K which included frame (sub frame) work you are asking for issues. Since the car is basically new, it would never be the same. Now I don't remember, who was at fault in the accident?

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @sweendogy said:
    andres3‌ we going to see picks of this pig? Would love to see the damage myself ?

    How does one post pictures on this forum, I thought by 2014 it would be as easy as attaching a pic to a text? Tutorial needed.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @flightnurse said:
    I second it and basically stated that in my posting. When a car has a repair tag of 20K which included frame (sub frame) work you are asking for issues. Since the car is basically new, it would never be the same. Now I don't remember, who was at fault in the accident?

    The other driver was at fault of course. I don't cause accidents, and I'm usually able to avoid them. You have to be a really horrible terrible driver to cause a collision with me.

    When I told the adjuster and sent him 5 pictures of the first 5 things I noticed that were wrong (mostly paint scuffs/scratches/chips), he said Geico had paid the body shop, the body shop was my choice, and I'd have to deal with them on paint issues. Basically saying, you are on your own since you didn't choose one of our preferred shops, and our only obligation is to pay for repairs.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @graphicguy said:
    Andres....Just my personal opinion, but I think it's time to go to the insurance company and tell them you need a new car....for all the reasons listed. If they choose to fight (like with the tires, which to me is being rather nit-picky given all 4 tires should have the same tread depth), then you can tell them to give you a new car now, or risk having a car with a salvage title instead after you begin your proceedings.

    I'm liking the idea of having a new car as that's the only way I'll get back to having a German built and assembled S4 which clearly is far superior to one built and assembled in Escondido, CA.

    The insurance company seems to think they are off the hook and I need to sue my chosen body shop. I did point out the windshield cowl was on them since it was never on the estimate, and they said they would pay for stuff if it was missed in the original estimates or supplements. How do I get them to see it as potentially their problem again?

    How would I go about getting a salvage title if they don't cooperate? I am missing a few links in the chain there. I suppose my argument is that Geico and Mercury's adjuster's erred incompetently in saying this vehicle was repairable for 15.5K in 28 days. 38 days of rental for nearly $1,400, and $20.3K in repairs later, and we are where we are now. I do think I'll contact Audi and let them know this shop should certainly be DE-Certified.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Member Posts: 16,373

    @andres3‌

    What you are going through absolutely sucks dude. You are being picky and have every right to demand nothing less than perfection from the body shop and insurance company that is fixing a "dream car" for you with only 4200 miles which before it got hit was still "brand new."

    Did you say they cut you a check for diminished value? It just seems at this point that you aren't going to ever be 100% happy with the car. Have them fix whatever else they can, then take the car to CARMAX, take it to a couple of Audi dealers, sell it or trade it in. Even with a "dirty carfax," it is still a low mileage S4.

    Either way, good luck!

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2022 Highlander XLE AWD, 2022 Wrangler Sahara 4Xe, 2023 Toyota Tacoma SR 4WD

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    Andres...not surprising that the insurance co is being obstinate. I've made a mental note.....never buy Geico insurance.

    They are on the hook to make the car right, regardless of where it was repaired. You didn't sign any release papers did you?

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • flightnurseflightnurse Member Posts: 2,217

    @graphicguy said:
    Andres...not surprising that the insurance co is being obstinate. I've made a mental note.....never buy Geico insurance.

    They are on the hook to make the car right, regardless of where it was repaired. You didn't sign any release papers did you?

    Graphic I don't think he could have taken the car without signing paperwork.... BTW, we have Geico and could not be happier with them, Rick had a fender bender in the Genesis, Geico really took care of him and made sure he was happy with the repairs. We are switching over to USAA not because of the serivce, but rates for the cars and homeowner is less, plus we will get a $1250 discount on our X3 through USAA.

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481

    andres--andres--just click on the "bent over page" icon at the top of the comments box (on the right). Either insert a URL from the web or choose a file from your computer. You may have to size your photo prior to posting, depending.

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665

    @flightnurse said:
    Graphic I don't think he could have taken the car without signing paperwork.... BTW, we have Geico and could not be happier with them, Rick had a fender bender in the Genesis, Geico really took care of him and made sure he was happy with the repairs. We are switching over to USAA not because of the serivce, but rates for the cars and homeowner is less, plus we will get a $1250 discount on our X3 through USAA.

    FN...That works.

    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • andys120andys120 Member Posts: 23,370

    2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    On second thought, the car might not be as bad as I first thought. My list can be contained under 20. The door misalignment might only be 1/8". The rocker panel isn't that bad, its decent work, just not Ingolstad standards. After further review, I wasn't noticing anything else I hadn't already noticed in the first 24 hours (although there was one missed/rough/abrupt shift; not repeatable or duplicatable). If they can get my list right, I think I might just be happy with the car (besides, it'll take 3 to 4 months to get one just like it; as I'd have to re-order it from Germany again). This successful outcome of course depends upon Mercury paying me decent DV, and Caliber Collision/European Autobody paying for a premium rental while they do the RE-work on my list.

    The car drives and rides well, so mechanically it feels strong; then again I was flopping around in a meager 4 cylinder Altima for a while and that seemed to pale in comparison to a new Accord, let alone an S4. Forgot how sturdy and tight fitting the seats were too compared to the rental fodder; reminds me to lose weight, or at least not gain any more weight.

    The main thing that upset me was the low hanging exhaust that isn't symmetrically low hanging. This is a bad rolling on the road advertisement for Audi, hence why I thought the shop should be uncertified.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @flightnurse said:
    Graphic I don't think he could have taken the car without signing paperwork....

    I signed the body shops paperwork noting multiple paint blemishes were noted, to be compiled later. I didn't sign anything from Gieco or Mercury yet.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • roadburnerroadburner Member Posts: 17,312
    edited April 2014

    Sad to say, most people-even those who own premium/luxury/sport cars-aren't all that particular about the quality of bodywork or paint. One of my co-workers was involved in an accident and she asked me to check her car over when it was returned. It was a mess; orange peel, overspray, misaligned trim, and obvious tape lines- but she thought it looked just fine, even after I pointed out the atrocious work.

    That said, I just delivered my Club Sport to my local "BMW Certified Collision Repair Center" to have a couple of dings repaired. Fortunately I know which tech is the most conscientious and meticulous, and I was able to specify that I only wanted him to touch the car. I'll report back when the car is returned...

    Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport; 2020 C43; 2021 Sahara 4xe 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica Wife's: 2015 X1 xDrive28i Son's: 2009 328i; 2018 330i xDrive

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481

    I've seen the best of work and the worst of work done on expensive cars. I recently inspected a 2012 Porsche that had some rather severe damage, and I have to say the bodyshop did an outstanding job on this car. A few weeks later I saw a Lexus SUV and the work was borderline criminal. I could have stuck my finger through the hatch seam.

  • markcincinnatimarkcincinnati Member Posts: 5,343

    My experience with insurance companies is that they will allow the "victim" enough latitude to take the car to a body shop that the victim believes will satisfy their needs to return the car to the status of "like it never even happened."

    Here in Cincinnati, there is ONE body shop that has gone through the Audi A8 (aluminum) certification and actually sent their techs to Germany for training and then to Chicago for follow up training.

    I would use this body shop for any car.

    Oddly, my Audi dealer does NOT have a body shop, but the dealer is part of a billion dollar dealer group that has a body shop at each of their Cadillac and Acura dealerships.

    If I go to the dealer with a body shop need, they used to take the car to the Audi A8 certified shop -- now, unfortunately, they trot it on over to the Cadillac dealership which does a good job.

    Good really is the enemy of great.

    I had a minor hiccup (a scratch really) and ended up "demanding" the car go to the certified body shop. The dealer complied but not before they offered up the Cadillac (or the Acura) body shop.

    I had a trim piece lose its luster on my 2009 A4, and Audi agreed to send me all new chrome trim -- since it was under warranty, I let the Cadillac body shop do the job (and they replaced the trim without incident.) There was no body work or painting involved, however.

    If you have any Audi product, I urge you to at least investigate ONLY taking the car to an A8 certified body shop -- they seem to have been indoctrinated with the "doing it the right way" and good is not good enough philosophy.

    Only great is great, despite the extra cost (which is NOT paid out of your pocket, typically.)

    I assume such a body shop would also be "superior" for any brand since the degree of care required for an aluminum body certified shop certainly seems to be a step or two above and beyond.

  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    UPDATE: Today there was a puddle under my S4 a few hours after arriving at work. Looked under the hood and there was some puddling of liquid at the bottom of the pans. Coolant was well below minimum. Called body shop to tow the car back to them and give me a rental. 38 days at the shop, and I needed a tow truck only 6 days later.

    Germans nearly 4.5 months, 4,100 miles, and no tow trucks.

    Americans assemble and build it and it gets 6 days before a tow truck is needed!

    Geico says my problem is that I'm nowhere close to getting a total because the "repairs" are cheap in comparison to the car's value. That they have to be consistent, fair, and adhere to standards.

    I think I"ll have to fight with them on the definition of "repairs/repaired."

    This is from one of the most reputable well regarded "Audi Certified" body shops in all of San Diego County.

    Yes, I think I was right about the Insurance and body shop industry being a racket. One spoon feeds the other in a vicious cycle of lies. This incident coupled with my list of 20 "issues" has me fed up. The only thing keeping me sane is the body shop is on the hook for the rental I"m in now, and they were receptive to my issue.

    Of course, I realize insurance would be expensive if Every Audi with significant damage had to be totaled the way it should be. Either that, or ship it back to Germany to be fixed correctly.

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
  • andres3andres3 Member Posts: 13,729

    @sweendogy said:
    andres3‌ we going to see picks of this pig? Would love to see the damage myself ?

    '15 Audi Misano Red Pearl S4, '16 Audi TTS Daytona Gray Pearl, Wife's '19 VW Tiguan SEL 4-Motion
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