Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles

isellhondas · October 2005

And that is EXACTLY the way to buy a fast depreciating car like that Buick!

You did good.

bridonohue · November 2005

Just starting the search and besides the Edmunds TVP what is a good way to determine whether the offered price is fair? How much negotiating is done on used certified cars? Is there a formula based on year, make, and miles that helps me figure out the dealers cost vs. what i should pay?

Thanks in advance.

bridonohue

qbrozen · November 2005

good question.
well, i usually pop on over to Real-World Trade-In Values and ask Terry what similar cars are going for at auction. Then I tack on about $2k-$2500 as my offer to a dealer. Has worked very well for me over the past few years.

verboten · January 2006

I just purchased used mercedes from non-MB Used Car Dealer. The car was CPO'd 1 year ago with previous owner up to 5YRS/100K Miles.

Dealer said MB does not allow anyone other than owner to transfer. Therefore, there is no warranty. Is this correct?

Could I contact he previous owner to see if he was willing to transfer? How would MB tell I purchased from someone else?

Thanks

british_rover · February 2006

The CPO warranty went away as soon as the previous owner traded in the car since the CPO warranty is not transferable to a dealer.

If you had bought it privately from the second owner yourself you would have been ok though.

carter7 · March 2006

WHERE CAN YOU GET THE BLUE BOOK LISTING PRICE FOR A USE VEHICLE WITHOUT BUYING A BLUE BOOK?

bdr127 · March 2006

KBB

rroyce10 · March 2006

.... Don't you mean a "Black Book" ....?

Terry.

isellhondas · March 2006

I've never seen a "black" book.

Guess that's a back east thing?

rroyce10 · March 2006

... Black Books are nationwide ... almost worldwide with the auctions in Puerto Rico and Hawaii ...... what do you guys use, cook books .........?

Terry :P

bdr127 · March 2006

Black Books are nationwide ... almost worldwide with the auctions in Puerto Rico and Hawaii

http://www.blackbookusa.com

rroyce10 · March 2006

..... Bud, it ain't like I don't have everyone from the year 1999 ..l.o.l...

Terry

jefk · March 2006

Would you say that the black book is more accurate than the blue book??? I ran my car yesterday and the black book was $500 more than KBB and Edmunds on a trade-in.

Thanks!!!
Jef

isellhondas · March 2006

We use mostly NADA or look at the auction numbers.

I had never even heard of a black book before I came to these forums. Never heard of them when I lived in california either so I don't think they are totally nationwide. I've have yet to see one.

isellhondas · March 2006

You can be like my customers who are trading in cars...just find the one that has the numbers you like the most!

qbrozen · March 2006

Given that I can go to 4 different stores and find each one using a different book, I'm not surprised there is one that escaped your radar for so long. Sometimes I marvel that the whole used car biz doesn't just crumble and die due to such differing numbers provided by these books.

In all honesty, although Galves is definitely the prevalent source here in NJ, I have never been on a shopping trip where every dealer I visited used the same book. Mind boggling.

qbrozen · March 2006

Its not unheard of for dealers to do this, so don't give him any ideas.

I know one Volvo dealer in particular where I had quite an interesting conversation about this very thing. He wanted to use black book for my trade-in (a mazda at the time), but insisted "blackbook doesn't apply to used volvos," and, therefore, the car he was selling cost him the Galves higher price.

rroyce10 · March 2006

... **although Galves is definitely the prevalent source here in NJ..**

The funny part is, you never see a Galves book at any of the NY/NJ/PA auctions ......... I take that back, after they get 20 paper cut's they throw em' in the circular file ..l.o.l....

Terry.

rroyce10 · March 2006

... **Would you say that the black book is more accurate than the blue book??? I ran my car yesterday and the black book was $500 more than KBB and Edmunds on a trade-in.**

It's not that any book is gospel .. but Black Book will be the closest --IF-- you know how to read one ..... you have to know how miles effect each and every vehicle, you have to know how options effect vehicles, color, area of the country ... drop a Diesel in a high mileage Ford Excursion and they're still worth some serious $$ .. drop a manual tranny in a low mileage Volvo S60 and you got didley squat ....

Terry.

isellhondas · March 2006

Something to look at and for banks to use.

Cars are worth what the market dictates. A lot of cars are way "back of book" and other cars will bring more than the books say.

I've never seen a Galves book either.

isellhondas · March 2006

Exactly. Or the "wrong" color can make an impact.

On that Volvo, the books may call for a 500.00 deduction for the manual tranny but in the real world, the car is saleproof so nobody is going to pay "book".

rroyce10 · March 2006

...... I know you don't like anything that doesn't say "Honda" .... but Volvo's do big money, even in your area ....(unless they got a handshaker) ... $500 nothin', try $1,500 and lets hope it's not that almost greenish bluish color with the baby poop interior ... Yawza.!

Terry :sick:

british_rover · March 2006

Galves is all over New England and New Jersey but like Terry said no where in PA or NY i think.

rroyce10 · March 2006

... Galves is indigenous to the upper NE area .... but when you guys come down to the real world, you drop them like bad habits ..l.o.l... I know dealers in NJ/PA/NY and they keep both ... they show the Galves to the customer and then they look at the Black Book to get the real price ..l.o.l....

Terry.

british_rover · March 2006

Yeah I have heard the same thing. Galves is notriously low on just about every car. The values we give for vehicles are normaly above galves unless the market on the car is crazy soft.

qbrozen · March 2006

I wouldn't toss it aside so quick. On the last 4 or 5 cars I've run past Terry over the years, Galves has been dead on his price, and, consequently, dead on what most dealers offer around here.

Granted, its not like my sampling is all that large, but considering I've never owned 2 cars from the same manufacturer, its at least a varied sampling.

isellhondas · March 2006

Terry, I like a lot of cars besides Hondas.

What I DON'T like are cars that constantly cause trouble.

Check engine lights, SRS lights, won't start, etc...

Do Audi's and Volvos come to mind here?

qbrozen · March 2006

My Volvo always starts. ;b

well, ok, i've gone through 2 batteries ... but that's not the car's fault.

That said, I'm seriously considering getting rid of her. there's nothing technically wrong with it at this point, but it just doesn't "feel" right anymore and I'm tired of throwing money at it trying to make it feel new again. This is more a fault of mine than the car's, though.

Anyway, the problem is I have yet to find a car for about what the Volvo is currently worth that is nearly as nice. I mean, is it really a good move to trade a '98 Volvo for a '96 Civic for even money?? I just can't see it. About the only car that I've found and considered is a Grand Marquis / TownCar ... but then I'll have 2 RWD V8s in my stable and winter will be a scary thought.

bdr127 · March 2006

My Volvo always starts. ;b

well, ok, i've gone through 2 batteries ... but that's not the car's fault.

I don't know about your particular car.... but draining batteries are usually the car's fault. They'll often have something draining them when the car's off, like a fan or something.

qbrozen · March 2006

well, no, in this case the batteries were just old. The original one went for 4 years and its replacement for 3. Typical lifespan is 3-4 years. They didn't drain, they got to the point they would no longer recharge.

bigdveedubgirl · March 2006

Hey NOW!!! HA HA! You know I was running errands in an S4 today and the drivers side window started going up and down for no reason. THANK GOD for certification!

pupaupair · March 2006

Hi!
I test drove a 2003 Toyota Highlander and returned a few days later and bought it. The salesman proundly pointed out that it was a "Certified" vehicle. I had read the Edmunds info and felt this was a deciding factor in my purchase.

When I got it home I realized that 1. the manual had disappeared from the glovebox 2. there was no "Vehicle History Report" in my paperwork and 3. the windshield wipers are completly shot (I had not examined them on the test drive). I would like to know when to schedule an oil change, Etc.(I need to prove that I'm maintaining the vehicle to keep the warranty good) but the saleman has not returned my phone calls.

So exactly what did they do for the "160-point Quality Assurance Inspection" and the $600 'Dealer Prep"?

Its not like I bought this thing from a guy in a raincoat in an alley. What information/action should I reasonably expect from my dealership?
Regards, Dee

bdr127 · March 2006

Rather than call, pull into the service department and talk to a service advisor. They'll be able to pull up the service history (at least what they did for service). The saleperson would need to go through service to get the info you want, so try going right to the source.

badboymust · March 2006

i,ve just purchased a 98 mustang, after driving it a few times went to started up the battery light start blinking and the steering wheel stiffing making it almost impossible to steer and the brakes wont stop the car immediately. what might be the reason for that? is it because the battery is dying or dead?

Kirstie_H · March 2006

Hi badboymust,
This discussion is about shopping for certified used vehicles. You are much more likely to get help on our Maintenance & Repair board, and you can get there by clicking on my link. Good luck with your car problems!

qbrozen · March 2006

definitely not a battery problem if happening while car running and driving. if you tell me where you repost, we can discuss it further.

sdempsey · March 2006

I bought a certified used car. The salesperson emailed the features and they included intermittent wipers and alloy wheels. I asked if the wheels were alloy when I first arrived and they said yes. They looked steel but I believed them. They also said it had intermittent wipers. I specifically asked these questions. The window sticker and the emails sent also stated the features of alloy wheels and intermittent wipers. The wheels are steel and no intermittent wipers.
I was told the window sticker disclaimer lets them off the hook on these 2 non-existent features. I plan to take them to small claims court. Anyone have any experience with this type of problem?

Sammie

rroyce10 · March 2006

... What is the year, make and model.....?

Terry.

sdempsey · March 2006

2004 Nissan Xterra

sdempsey · March 2006

Still wondering if anyone has any suggestions or comments?

pupaupair · March 2006

Hi!
Thanks for the advice! Actually, as I was leaving for a 6 hour drive, I did a "pre-flight check" (something my father taught me) and the oil was dirty. Hmmm, strange for a vehicle fresh from a 160 Point Quality Assurance Program. :confuse: So I dropped into the dealer's service department on my way out of town. According to his computer records NOTHING :surprise: was done to my Toyota Highlander but a wash and carpet vacumn and a 20 day shuffle around the parking lot. I had him recheck the fluids and told the salesman, the sales manager and the service manager what happened and that I would schedule my car for the proper servicing when I came back to Miami the following week. I'll post the results of my experiences.

bdr127 · March 2006

Hmmm, strange for a vehicle fresh from a 160 Point Quality Assurance Program. So I dropped into the dealer's service department on my way out of town. According to his computer records NOTHING was done to my Toyota Highlander but a wash and carpet vacumn and a 20 day shuffle around the parking lot.

I would definitely let corporate Honda know about this.... If this dealer is putting "Certified" cars out there that they're not properly servicing in order to maximize profit, then Honda will be mighty pissed. You could chalk it up to a simple mistake on this car, but if the R.O. was only written up for a car wash, then it seems like their whole process for certifying a car is waaaaay off.

pupaupair · March 2006

Hi!
Could have been a mistake and the salesman did seem startled. He whipped up a 2004 manual (said it was the same as my 2003 model) for me before I drove away and he had been putting me off before this happened. I printed out the 160 point inspection list from the Toyota site and checked off the stuff I noticed was questionable on my car. I'll take it with me when I go for my service. I'll also take 2 boxes of fresh donuts for the service crew. My moto is "Carry a big stick and a couple of jelly donuts!!

isellhondas · March 2006

Comments?

That window sticker shouldn't have listed items that the car didn't have but this can happen sometimes. I think they input the VIN number and they think that's enough to tell them what model the car is. That part is true but there can be equipment differences.

But, seriously, if those options were that important to you, you should have checked for yourself.

9bj · March 2006

Hi! I just need an experts' opinion about my car problem. I bought 1998 Chrysler Intrepid 2 months ago from the mechanic store. It was e-tested and certified. (I'm in Canada) A couple of days ago I noticed that car made ticking sounds when I was waiting for the next signal on the road. I got back home as soon as possible and I found there was smoke coming out of the front hood, and the anti-freeze liquid was spilling right under the engine. I even refilled some anti-freeze liquid and it came down right a way. I went to the mechanic and they recommended to replace the whole engine. Because the car was certified, I would like to know if the seller would've known this will happen soon and just hid the fact from me. And is there any other solutions other than replace a new engine... I really need help...

rolexrob · April 2006

Agreed, I bought my 2001 Sentra XE last April and Carmax did not change the oil either. It was really dirty and they said they changed it before I bought it!!
Pleasen NEVER buy a vehicle fdrom CAR :mad: MAX!!!

aspesisteve · April 2006

what certified means to me?
in a word it means 'Rip off'

Especially if the car is still under the manufacturers warranty. It also means you are buying from a dealer which always means you pay a big mark up.

Certified in my opionion is worth about $100 - cause it's about a hour and a half of a mechanics time going over stuff that is fairly basic.

As for those who say you could buy a lemon from a private party - well it can happen on a certified vehicle too.

jwilliams2 · April 2006

As one who has bought several certified cars, I would have to disagree with you. Many certified warranties extend the number of years as well as the mileage. Last car I bought had a 4yr/50k factory warranty, and the certified program took me to 6yr/100k. So at 80k or so, if you have a problem, its covered. I really think that is worth more than $100.

bdr127 · April 2006

what certified means to me?
in a word it means 'Rip off'

Yeah, I also disagree.... Perhaps you're looking at different CPO programs than I am, or perhaps you aren't particular well-versed in what they include.

First of all, the inspection criteria on certified checklists are typically fairly extensive. Every manufacturer uses a different # "points", but they are all more than just a standard state inspection-type-of-thing. Also, if you buy a car from a private party or from a mom-n-pop lot, have they done any of that inspection work? If it's a dealer that doesn't sell/service that make of car, did they really know what they were doing with that "stranger" car?.... Hard to know.

Next.... Say you buy a 3 year old BMW with 40k miles on it. It'll have 1 year and 10k miles warranty left on it.... If you plan to keep the car for at least another 3 years or 60k, when paying maybe $1000-$1500 in a certified car versus non-certified would be totally worth it, IMO. You get an extra 2 years and 50k miles of warranty. Perhaps you'll never need the warranty... Who knows? But what are the chances you'll pay more than $1000 in repairs on that used car after next year? Pretty high, would you say?

The other thing, which perhaps you are not aware of, is that many manufacturers have incentive interest rates on particular years and models. On some cars you can get low rates like 0%, 1.9%, 2.9%, etc... That's something that no bank or credit union can match, especially on 3/4/5 year old used cars. There's other things, too, like how right now if you buy a Certified 2003 BMW 3-series, BMW Financial Services will pay your first 2 months payment.... That's something you won't be able to get anywhere else.

pupaupair · May 2006

Ok,Guys, here's what happened.
I scheduled an appointment to do the certification routine on a Wednesday. I asked for a rental car because it looked like they would have to do alot of stuff (and its part of the warranty contract anyway...A point I had to bring up because the salesman was hesitating about providing one).
Service kept it until Saturday because they had trouble locating matching tires. The service manager called Sat. morning and said to come get it, they closed the rental office and the service bays at 1 PM. I just made it and like Cinderella at midnight, the rental was whisked away, the service manager smiled as he chained off the bays, told me to get the keys from the desk and waved a hand toward the south side of the dealership. I wandered around until I found the car. It was dirty and dusty from sitting in the shop(I had washed it before I took it to them) and it still didn't have any floormats but it did have a new cigarette lighter, new wiperblades, a working dome light, 2 new tires, clean fluids and a "certified car" sticker on the windshield. Several days later I found the "Certified Check-off list" in the glovebox with all the list's boxes neatly checked off--including the ones noting that the car was washed/polished/carpets cleaned and the floormats in place. Probably wouldn't have been so sad if the carpet in the back didn't still have the little indentations where there HAD been floormats when I had taken my test drive.
So I'm pretty neutral about the experience. The vehicle is OK. I can wash and vacume my own car. I'll buy my own floormats and buff out the scratches the service manager said didn't come under the program. But the lack of pride in follow-through (when this was a major dealer's screw-up) shows how my future problems will be handled at this dealership. I will always wonder what else was cheerily checked off the list without really being done. Would I recommend buying a "Certified" Toyota to a friend? No. Buy from this dealer? Nah.

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