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Mercedes-Benz M-class (ML320, ML350, ML500 and ML55) 2005 and earlier

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Comments

  • markjennmarkjenn Member Posts: 1,142
    What needed to be done for $2.5K?

    - Mark
  • pablo_lpablo_l Member Posts: 491
    My wife's got the bill, but it involved: brakes, CD changer (it skipped), something with the cooling fan wiring, throttle cable, and the whole 45k service.
  • markjennmarkjenn Member Posts: 1,142
    Thanks Pablo. This sounds like the standard stuff the can really drive up ML ownership costs.

    Dealers tend to wildly over-service the brakes (replacing pads only half-worn) and usually replace serviceable rotors, which can double or triple the cost of brake maintenance. My CD changer simply doesn't work if it hasn't been used lately, but I live with it. ML's have a lot of cooling fan problems and the sticky throttle cable problem seems to be something that all of them develop regularly - it is supposedly repairable by some strategically placed grease, rather than replacing the cable all-together). And 15K inspections at MB can be $800 or so, just for the inspection.

    If you want to scrounge and find a good indepedent mechanic, you can reduce these costs by about 2/3rds. But if you're happy and they're doing a good job, then that's more important than penny-pinching.

    Good luck with your truck.

    - Mark
  • babalulubabalulu Member Posts: 8
    We also have an ML 320 (99) that we have been very happy with. It has been trouble free and solid. We tow a boat that is pushing the envelope of 5000 lbs (plus), never without any problems. My concern is that it really needs better brakes and that is why we are considering the ML500. But, since the redesign of the ML 320 into the ML350, have the brakes been improved? Our lease is up and we have a ML 350 in order, here in two weeks. We tried all comparable SUVs out there and we are still going back to the ML . We tried the Volvo SUV, Lexus gx 400, BMW X5 and still, we liked the ML. I was thinking of waiting for the 06 ML, but the 05 is great and it is here. Opinions on the 05 ML 350 brakes? Oh, and where did the ML350 gain 500lbs? I seriously doubt this. I will look at the 99 manual tonight.
  • pablo_lpablo_l Member Posts: 491
    Mark -

    I agree with everything you say. We will most definitely start servicing the car in a place that comes highly recommended. It will not quite save 2/3s, but even 40% saving will add up very quickly! I just want to make sure my wife's car is thoroughly inspected and always safe to drive, but that does not mean it must be serviced at the dealer's service, which -I agree- wildly overcharges.
  • pablo_lpablo_l Member Posts: 491
    bablulu -

    the carpoit comparison confirms 400lbs of additional weight on the recent ML. The dealer also confirmed additional heft - some of it goes for very good stuff, such as additional airbags. The new engine also has some very nice pull. The '04/'05s are very nice, just for our particular situation not quite compelling enough given the fact my wife's car looks very well and got some after-market stuff installed that she really likes.
  • tiger2dolltiger2doll Member Posts: 39
    Well - I am loosing my patience with this vehicle. Last week the Driver side Door Lock started playing havoc - locking and unlocking on its own. The dealer replace the Driver Side Door Lock & the lock control module. Everything worked fine for a week.

    Now the power windows go up and come back an inch or two after doing an auto close. Sometimes the auto close does not work. Also, since I had the Coolant Leak 4 times in 2 years I was just checking under the hood for the coolant level and realized that the radiator is lose - it can be moved back and forth slightly !! Damn another visit.

    Every time I take the car for service I think I should get rid of this and get something else. But, my SA keeps telling me that we have replaced so many parts on your car that its like a new car with all latest and greatest parts. He advises me to keep it since all the known issues are fixed. At times I tend to agree with him but then there's something else which comes up. My dilemma is - what will break next vs I have gotten everything fixed so now it should be more reliable.

    Anyway, was checking out the 2004 Acura MDX for my wife and the sales rep wanted me to trade my ML500. The Trade In value comes to $30k - thats a steep depreciation of 40% form its original price of $50k. The cost of owning this car has been around $1k a month. Thats pretty expensive. Don't know what to do - keep it or sell it. I love the ride and the power but am sick of the dealer visits !! Decisions decisions.

    Sorry for the long post - Happy Motoring !1

    Regards,
    Rahul
  • mark156mark156 Member Posts: 1,915
    Rahul, I too have the '02 ML500 and have not had as many issues that you have had. I have about 29,000 miles on mine. I'm thinking of trading it for an '05 something, not sure yet. That will still leave an additional year of warranty on my Mercedes.

    If I had the issues that you have had, I think I would trade.

    Mark
    2010 Land Rover LR4, 2013 Honda CR-V, 2009 Bentley GTC, 1990 MB 500SL, 2001 MB S500, 2007 Lincoln TC, 1964 RR Silver Cloud III, 1995 MB E320 Cab., 2015 Prevost Liberty Coach
  • markjennmarkjenn Member Posts: 1,142
    The radiator on mine has been somewhat loose since new - the bushings at the top have a lot of play. May be normal as mine has 65K without it being an issue.

    - Mark
  • mgdiazmgdiaz Member Posts: 6
    Rahul,
      I'd sell it. I have an MDX and it has been as reliable as a rock. It holds its value extremely well too. I also have an E-Class that has given me plenty of headaches. I guess MB quality is definitely not what is used to be. Good luck.
  • sirdarbysirdarby Member Posts: 20
    Don't trade at the dealer. Put it in autotrader or the newspaper and sell it yourself. I did and made an additional $4,000.

    Dealers buy your car for cheap and sell it retail for much more. There are a lot of private owners who want a MB, and don't care about maintenance.
    They just want agood deal.

    By the way, the MDX is a good choice, I know 3 people with them (two female relatives) who love the trouble free experience.
  • sirdarbysirdarby Member Posts: 20
    Sold my 98 ML last year for about 15K. It had 95K miles and was about to go out of 100k warranty.

    Anybody who doesn't have 100k extended is bungee jumping without a rope.
  • poppi68poppi68 Member Posts: 3
    55,000 miles. Any problems with the vehicles were fixed in a day. We purchased this vehicle because it was much better than the X5. It's not perfect (nothing is) but we love this vehicle and plan on driving it until it can't take anymore. Extremely safe and a beast when it needs to be. In NYC winters, I can't think of another vehicle I would rather have.

    It seems as though people expect perfection from autos. Why? Everything fails at some point. Everything, even the sun. This is the way of life.
  • losttoothlosttooth Member Posts: 12
    causing damage to oil pan. Repairs $800 - $1000.

    Anybody else have this happen?
  • mark156mark156 Member Posts: 1,915
    Losttooth, what year ML do you have? Mine is still rather new., so no problems yet. How many miles do you have on yours?

    Mark
    2010 Land Rover LR4, 2013 Honda CR-V, 2009 Bentley GTC, 1990 MB 500SL, 2001 MB S500, 2007 Lincoln TC, 1964 RR Silver Cloud III, 1995 MB E320 Cab., 2015 Prevost Liberty Coach
  • markjennmarkjenn Member Posts: 1,142
    Harmonic balancer problems at around 60K-80K seem fairly common. What was your mileage?

    There is a check that can usually warn of the problem well before it actually fails. You shine a flashlight down the front of the engine and onto the lower pulley with the engine idling. If the lower pully appears to wobble, then the balancer is probably going.

    - Mark
  • losttoothlosttooth Member Posts: 12
    I wish I'd known. I have a 2000 ML-320 with 56K on the clock. When it happened, there was a 'clunk', that I thought was something I'd run over on the freeway. Later thought it was pwr steering, but it was the lower pully.

    I guess I should check in here more often. Used to post here as "Sydney6".

    Other than some generally minor problems, (the usual found here) no major issues with reliability.
  • kiiwiikiiwii Member Posts: 318
    You are pretty lucky. Severl members here ended up spending $3-5k to get the damage fixed.
  • tomjavatomjava Member Posts: 136
    Doesn't MBUSA reimburse the repair costs? It's a very well known problem among MB V6 engine.

    IMO, MB should issue a recall on this issue.
  • losttoothlosttooth Member Posts: 12
    If you know of ANYONE who was reimbursed for this failure, PLEASE let me know. Total came to US$925.
  • markjennmarkjenn Member Posts: 1,142
    I haven't heard of any "secret warranty" on the balancer although I suspect there have been some goodwill fixes.

    Failure is somewhat common, but in watching the various ML boards, I don't think it is any worse than the machine-gun door locks or fuel pump issues, none of which have been covered either. All cars have issues like this, so it is a matter of degree. Without hard data, it is difficult to know whether this is a 1%, 5%, or 20% of the fleet problem.

    A lot of V8s seem to have the issue too.

    - Mark
  • losttoothlosttooth Member Posts: 12
    Thanks. I think I'll send MBUSA a letter just the same. I'll let you know what happens.
  • babalulubabalulu Member Posts: 8
    We pulled the trigger on a new 05 ML350 three days ago. What a difference between it and our old ML320 (99). Totally different ride and feel. Very much improved, and way better than what we tried (Volvlo, Lexus, X5, Sequoia). I do have a question, we only got 2 remote keys (no valet key) and our old ML came with 3 (2 remote and 1 valet). Has MBUSA changed how many keys we get for '05? I will also call my dealer, but I wan't to hear from others.
  • pai7pai7 Member Posts: 35
    My daughter's 1998 ML 320 with 99K miles was traded for $10500.She got an 04 RX 330 AWD on which dealer discounted $3200.She enjoys driving the new RX.I also have a 99 ML 430 with almost 75K miles.Plan to sell/trade it before the extended warranty( 100K) runs out.
  • gortizgortiz Member Posts: 9
    I have an 00 ML320 with 61k and I just returned from the dealer after the $430.00 scheduled B service. They also wanted me to replace the spark plugs for nearly $500 and they also suggested the gas filter and gas hoses? Has anyone had this done and is it really necesssary? The service on this vehicle is incredible...
  • joeindenverjoeindenver Member Posts: 31
    Seems to me the spark plugs and perhaps the filter should be covered under the emissions warranty. I'm not 100% sure as I don't have that text in front of me, but I've had things like that repaired on other makes of cars under the emissions warranty. And gas lines going bad? How can they tell??? I've replaced exactly one gas line in all of the cars I've owned - I created a pinhole in the rusted line of my 83 Rabbit GTi when I was replacing the fuel pump(agian). And it has almost 200K miles on it.

    Seems excessive...But I saw this on another related forum:

    2000ml320 "MB M-Class Owners: Problems & Solutions" Sep 3, 2004 12:44pm

    So perhaps this really is a problem. Hope this helps...
  • markjennmarkjenn Member Posts: 1,142
    There are two emissions warranties: 24K and 84K. The 24K warranty covers anything that would cause the vehicle to not pass emissios. But the 84K one only covers the cats and the computer - that's it.

    On the spark plugs and gas filter/hoses, I'd do what the book says - no more, no less.

    - Mark
  • pathdocpathdoc Member Posts: 126
    We have a 2003 ML500 which my wife drives. She noticed squeaking and reduced braking capability. She had the same issue approx. 12000 miles ago(12/03) at which time the dealer replaced pads. Now they say it needs pads and rotors at a tune of $1000. Neither time did the warning light come on.
    Is this normal for the ML?

    Thanks
  • markjennmarkjenn Member Posts: 1,142
    Lots of issues here.

    Well brake squeal comes and goes and generally is an annoyance rather than a problem. I would live with it unless it is pretty loud. If it came after the last brake repair, likely they didn't use the special paste on the back side of the pads that keeps them from vibrating.

    Reduced brake capability probably means a spongy pedal. If you confirm her assessment I'd have the brakes inspected for leaks, bled and if the problem returns, then you've got to figure out where air is getting into the system.

    Brake life is highly variable. 12K is very short, but MLs are hard on brakes and some drivers and environments are pure hell on brakes so it is possible. I get about 25K-35K. Dealers routinely overprescribe new pads because it is a high-profit fix. The sensors are actually pretty conservative, so unless they are broken or were not installed properly after the last brake job, you should have 30%+ of your brake life left even AFTER the sensor starts showing a problem.

    I'd try and look yourself at the brake wear - it is pretty easy to do with a flashlight. If you can see something left of a slot in the middle of the brake pad right in the center where it touches the rotor, then you don't need replacement.

    If you can correlate your issues with the last brake service, I'd find another dealer or cultivate a relationship with an indpendent shop. Often a simple pad change for a $150 or so is all that is required rather than the pads, rotors, etc. changeout that is $600 at the dealer. $1000? That sounds out of line unless something is broken and anything broken should be covered by warranty.

    Good luck.

    - Mark
  • legacylegacy Member Posts: 2
    Your car has 100,000 mile plugs. As long as it is running fine, do not replace the plugs. I replaced my gas filter at around 80,000 and did not replace any hoses.
  • legacylegacy Member Posts: 2
    I replaced my pads about every 15,000 miles. The only rotor replace I did was at 60,000 miles. That's for a 99 ml320.
  • gortizgortiz Member Posts: 9
    Joe,
    The dealer says that MB is switching to new bigger gas filter due to our extreme winters here in the Northeast. Due to this new larger filter some of the hoses need to be replaced at my expense. It sounds fishy to me. I also think the spark plug price is a rip-off.
  • pathdocpathdoc Member Posts: 126
    Thanks for your suggestions. I will evaluate.
  • ghrothe3ghrothe3 Member Posts: 2
    We bought an '05 ML350 about 2 months ago.
    I also inquired about the valet key and was told by both the service advisor and the parts department that the "flat" valet key was NOT available.
    That's too bad since it is so low tech (robust - does not break) and fit ON my key chain instead of ANCHORING it like the electronic key.
    George
  • joeindenverjoeindenver Member Posts: 31
    My words to MB would be: "If you're requiring this change then the change shall be covered under warranty because otherwise it can't be required for me to pay for it." It sounds like they would like for you to pay for a required upgrade that should be covered by their dollars. Assuming you're still under warranty, of course.
  • markjennmarkjenn Member Posts: 1,142
    I doubt MB is "requiring" the change (as in a recall) - they're advising it. (Actually, the dealer is probably advising it, and I'd ignore it - most of the "advice" for additional service coming from dealers is mainly designed to increase their service revenues.)

    Holding a mfg to a standard where they they have to retrofit the entire fleet for free every time they make a change to a car doesn't seem reasonable to me. It would also stifle incremental improvements.

    - Mark
  • gortizgortiz Member Posts: 9
    Gentlemen,

    Thanks for the feedback on the gas filter and plugs. They were both recomendations from the service rep. I am under warranty up to 100K. I will ask about the emissions warranty and see how they handle that. I have to bring the ML back for a loose ball joint and a broken glass faulty sensor. Both are under warranty.
  • joeindenverjoeindenver Member Posts: 31
    re: "Holding a mfg to a standard where they they have to retrofit the entire fleet for free every time they make a change to a car doesn't seem reasonable to me. It would also stifle incremental improvements."

    I'm sorry, that's not what I meant in my previous post. I was under the impression from gortiz's post that the service advisor was saying the updates were "required" and "required" means (to me) they pay, if under warranty, not the user. I didn't mean to imply that I would require MB to update my vehicle if next year's ML350 had something different/better. I would not - that's why one buys new cars, no? : )
  • c_j_gordonc_j_gordon Member Posts: 19
    Well, after my 99 ML320 released about 5 years of hydrocarbons (Mobil-1) into the atmosphere at a rate of 1 quart per week, Benson Mercedes (Metairie, Louisiana) agreed to do the ring job.
  • losttoothlosttooth Member Posts: 12
    Forgot to update this forum on the above. The vehicle is fixed, but the very next week the battery died. 4 or 5 years is normal life, but the Roadside Assist technician said I had the "old style" battery that had a leaking problem.

    There was significant surface corrosion in and around the battery tray area, and I told the technician that I had just had (three weeks before) the Service B, wherein this problem should have been brought to my attention.

    I also mentioned that the week before I had a harmonic balancer failure, and that that was a second opportunity to note the battery problem, AND I mentioned that I had heard (didn't tell him I heard it here) that a visual inspection of the balancer can detect an imminent failure. I told him that I am disappointed that the dealer didn't notice the potential HB failure as WELL as the battery problem. he said that they have had lots of problems with batteries and HB failures.

    As he replaced my dead battery, and as I told him of the HB issue, he looked at the HB (the car was running) and said that it looked 'wobbly' and that he would have it checked ASAP, and not to drive it too much until checked.

    I was flabbergasted that an MB technician would recommend that course of action, given that the HB had JUST been replaced one week before!

    To make a long story a bit shorter, in the end the dealer was very good about it, and replaced the battery tray and cleaned the area at no charge. They had about 4 journeyman technicians check again the HB, and they felt it was in perfect shape. The told me that a visual inspection is a good 'first indicator of potential' failure, but that only a more thorough inspection can truly indicate a problem.

    So, the moral is: if you have a 2002 (?) or older MB, have your battery checked for leadks and corrosion. Also, a visual inspection of the HB (if it's wobbly looking while running) can indicated that further inspection is warranted, but it may not indicate a real problem.

    Good luck
  • chumsaechumsae Member Posts: 61
    Our A/C died at 75,000 miles. Not what one would hope for but not as bad as it seems since we live in the sunbelt where A/C is used for 10 months of the year. Our misfortune led us to have a 2004 ML350 "Sport" as a loaner for a week. Here are my impressions:

    Looks: Improved over the 2000 with nicer bumpers, fog lights, headlights, wheel well bump-outs, and tailgate formation. This one has nicer wheels but these are likely part of the Sport package. The interior strikes me as being much the same with the exception of the center console, which now has some reorganization of window and mirror
    switches.

    Features: Improved over the 2000 with a good A/C
    vent to the rear through the center console, and
    (finally), a decent cup holder/miscellaneous
    compartment where the "old" window switches once were. The old cup holders are still there, they just added a 3rd choice in the front seat area. The storage area in the center console has changed to a 2-compartment/2-latch arrangement which provides 2 layers of storage, one on top for
    shallow and one underneath for deep. The side mirrors have been updated to provide the side marker turn signal lights, which formerly were on the front side fenders between the wheel wells and the front doors - looks better to me. I did miss the slightly larger mirror area provided on
    our 2000 ML.

    What's next: The CD magazine is still in the boot,
    rather than the dash. We all hopped into the ML loaner and our 11-year-old son handed me his Lord of the Rings soundtrack CD, (expecting some progress in this department).

    Performance: Engine noise and general highway noise seemed a couple-to-a-few decibels quieter. The 350 makes a small but noticeable difference in spunk over the 320 in normal driving. The handling and ride seems stiffer and more jittery around town and on the highway compared to our ML320, and here, we prefer our ML... probable difference due to Sport package. The A/C is much better in the ML350... this one has automatic climate control (which our s does not and it is missed) with ice cold air and very, very, nicely lighted control dials. The A/C on our 2000 ML320
    has always been "just adequate" in terms of temperature and airflow and back seat coverage. For comparison, we have a Lexus LS400 that has always put out cold air and lots of it... our ML320 doesn't come very close. Maybe we will get lucky and have super A/C when our ML is returned by the dealer, but I suspect it is a weaker system
    than the LS400 and the ML350.

    The ML350 has 10 airbags versus our ML350 which has six. So, a great safety oriented vehicle gets even greater with the ML350. All of us need to remember that Mercedes is the one car company that has never patented a safety innovation; they make all of their work in this area available to
    all automakers. Given this, I have a bias that helps me forgive Mercedes-Benz for the occasional service blip or quality issue. I just have to respect them for that. Finally, at least ONE of the other manufactures - Ford Explorer - has adopted car-height bumpers to help reduce repair costs and injury to other vehicles and occupants. This is a feature the M-B designed into the ML in 1998.

    In short, a great vehicle gets better.
  • steverstever Guest Posts: 52,454
    Mercedes may license or give away their safety innovations, but they've been patenting safety stuff for over 50 years now.

    Five Decades of Safety Development at Mercedes-Benz (MBLink)

    Steve, Host
  • wmquanwmquan Member Posts: 1,817
    MB safety is 1st-rate, as good as and probably better than Volvo's (or, at least, somewhat different).

    But does the ML350 really have 10 airbags? I thought it's 8 (front driver, front passenger, side driver, side passenger, side left 2nd row, side right 2nd row, left side curtain, right side curtain.

    Unless the side curtains for the 1st and 2nd row are counted for each position.
  • gortizgortiz Member Posts: 9
    Whenever I tow my pop-up for a week-end camping trip I need to put a Quart of oil in. I took it in to the dealer and they told me that since the ML requires 10 quarts and is serviced every 10K that it is customary to add a quart from time to time. How often is too much?
  • chumsaechumsae Member Posts: 61
    There are 10; the usual 6 as found in the 2000 ML320, plus 2 near the two front passenger
    head areas, and another 2 near the rear passenger
    head areas.
  • wmquanwmquan Member Posts: 1,817
    ... plus 2 near the two front passenger
    head areas, and another 2 near the rear passenger
    head areas.

    Technically it's just two airbags, they happen to be multi-chambered. One side curtain deploys on the left, the other on the right. Each side curtain protects both the first and second row occupants' heads on that side. Using this as a measure, competitors like the XC90 have only six airbags compared to the ML's eight.

    If one were to count it as 10 in the ML350, then Volvo and Acura could claim to have 10 airbags. This because their side curtains protect the heads of occupants in the first, second, and third rows (the MB protects the first and second). They do not have thoracic side airbags in their second row like MB's, however (else they'd have 12 using the ML350-has-10-math!).
  • tenet1tenet1 Member Posts: 354
    Hi all
    Whan is the new ML bodystyle expected in the US? Anyone have any links/photos of what it may look like?
    Thanks
  • mercaramercara Member Posts: 291
    I wish they would get some quality control from other manufacturers in exchange for the safetly features they license or give away :)
  • jmclaughlinjmclaughlin Member Posts: 1
    I was wondering if I could get some advice on whether or not to purchase a 2003 ML350. I am an outside sales rep and will be driving a good amount of miles on the car and want something reliable. Is the ML350 reliable? I will be driving about 400-500 a week.

    Also, they are asking 33,900 for the car and it has 22,000 miles, is this a decent price?
  • chumsaechumsae Member Posts: 61
    You're in luck! You have already found edmunds.com
    and on the first page of Edmunds you'll find a TMV
    pricing model; just enter the target car, mileage,
    color, options and your zip code and you'll see
    a fairly reliable valuation.

    Key elements include:
    - knowing the vehicle history.. at least through carfacts, and have a local dealer run a servide history on the VIN.
    - eyeballing the car for negatives.
    - estimating the value of the existing warranty.
    - knowing your options... Our 2000 ML320 had a $42,000 sticker, and our recent loaner 2004 ML350 Sport had a $48,000 sticker with a $37,000 base.
    Hence, in 2003, the ML350 sticker could be anywhere between $37,000 and $50,000; a big window
    of value.
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