BMW X5

jammyling · May 2002

I've had my '02 x5 3.0 for about four months now and love it for the most part. I'm still annoyed at some little glitches like the NAV system...which blanks out occaisionally, fogged xenon headlight housings, seat & power mirror memory malfunctions...all of which has been brought back to the dealer two times to have corrected, but been told there are no clear cut remedies. They've acknowledged the problem, but have no solution...not acceptable for a $50K SAV.

To make matters worse, the detailers got wax residue on plastic moldings. Has anyone seen how unsightly that looks?! especially on a black car?! ive demanded my dealership to replace side door moldings after two unsuccessful attempts of removing the residue...in fact, they made it even worse apparently, by sanding parts of the moldings.

ugh...just thought i'd share this with the board

sjbette · May 2002

just test drove them this past weekend. in terms of the ride, i feel the difference with the sport package when going through a few pot holes and speed bumps but that means feeling the road better and i like that. in terms of the look, the star spoke wheel and the clear side mirror appeal to me a lot. i might just get it. thanks for the input.

afields · June 2002

Hello all,
I recently went to a BMW dealership and had the chance to check out an X5 3.0 liter. I liked everything about the car except for the fact that the sound system balance sounded off. It sounded (to me) like it was all coming to strongly out of the right than the left. I twiddled the BALANCE control and I managed to find a relatively comfortable point. However, it still didn't feel right. This has been a problem on two other X5s I have seen. If anyone could shed some light on this, I would greatly appreciate it.

greenlatern · June 2002

I've been skimming thru X5 forums from here to bimmer.org for well over a year and you're the first person to mention any problem with sound balance. If this is wrt the premium (dsp) sound system, many have mentioned that it's just not worth the $, but I've never seen a post about sound imbalance. Till now.

stever · June 2002

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rickrover · June 2002

I've had my 01 X5 3.0 for about 7 months now - I went through the Sport no-Sport issue when I got mine. I liked everything about the sport package except the self leveling suspension.I decided against the sport package because of the self leveling suspension. I plan to keep my X for a long time (it replaced a Range Rover with 170k miles) and didn't want the complexity of the self leveling suspension past 100k miles. I had a 92 M5 that had a similar rear suspension as the X sport - talk about expensive when it got older. I plan to buy some 4.4 sport package wheels/ tires on Ebay to put on my 3.0 - that's all I need and maybe the 4.6is trim pieces.

I've never noticed a balance problem with the sound system, I did add an amp and solobaric subwoofer to it - it's perfect now, nice rich sound.

cgmb16 · June 2002

I was just wondering if the 3.0i's 6 cylinder has enough power or would i need to opt for the 4.4i's 8 cylinder.

greenlatern · June 2002

Drive both, see what you want/need. 90%+ of my miles are city, so the straight 6 easily fit the bill. If you want to tow the 8 pulls another 1000 lbs. If you wanna be a big dawg at the stoplight, well, get a sportscar. 'Cuz even a 4.6 will get its doors blown off by a Z28 costing half as much. Really depends on your driving style -- both engines will allow you to easily exceed every posted speed limit.

timtx01 · June 2002

Hi all -
I was shopping for an X5 at the end of last year and was totally turned off by the "take it or leave it" attitude that I encountered at Houston dealers. I guess the unwillingness to deal is understandable with a hot car. But I was so turned off that I bought a 2002 Passat V6 instead. Drives great, I got a super deal, and I've enjoyed putting my first 8,000 miles on it.

However, I'm now buying my first house and thinking back to the extra carrying room in an X5. Sounds like dealers still are being hard-a**ed about the pricing, which I just don't get. Every dealership I've visited has X5's on the lot, and they can obviously trade to get the one you want. Part of the problem in Houston--and it is a problem from what I can tell--is that 3 of the 4 area dealerships are owned by the same company, Momentum/Advantage. They basically have established a mini-monopoly which I frankly don't appreciate BMWNA allowing in the first place.

What do you guys think about trying to get dealerships in nearby cities--say Austin, San Antonio and Dallas--in on the competition? Maybe fax/call sales managers there too and let the Houston Monolith know it needs to compete? Cuz I sure don't mind a road-trip to bring one home!! My big concern about this is that 1) you get out of town and they try to change the numbers on you and/or 2) the Monolith here refuses to provide free service loaner.

Thanks -
Tim in Houston, TX

stever · June 2002

You may want to try Blast Fax Car Buying. You might get a great deal, and your negotiations will be in writing. Better yet, substitute "email" for "fax."

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nyccarguy · June 2002

I don't know if a blast fax or blast email will work for buying a BMW X5. If you lurk on any board here on TH, you'll realize that Houston is probably one of the worst places in the US to buy a car (along with DFW, Chicago, NoCal, & sometimes SoCal). A few TH members have bought their BMWs outside of Metropolitan areas in TX like Gary Shelton BMW (I think that's nthe name of the dealership) in Tyler, Texas (I don't know how far this is from you). You will run the risk of not getting a loaner car from the Momentum/Advantage dealer if you bring the car in for service there and bought it out of town.

If you're going to buy out of town, then why make a few phone calls and send a few emails to dealerships here in the NY Metro Area (Especially NJ). Many are getting at least $1200 off sticker and maybe more. It is worth a shot!

nyccarguy · June 2002

You might also want to try dealerships in Beaumont, TX & Temple, TX.

timtx01 · June 2002

Nyccarguy - thanks for the reminder that there are also BMW dealerships in smaller towns. Bryan is only 90mins away as is Beaumont. I'll add them to the list of dealers to contact.

I'm curious though - can anyone else who's dealt with the Momentum/Advantage monolith in Houston pls share their experience(s) on this board? I don't understand why BMWNA has allowed the group to get this stranglehold over the local market by controlling 3 of the cities 4 dealers. Momentum/Advantage BMW does not appear to have good customer service either before or after the sale from what I can tell, and since they don't have any competition it's pretty easy to tell why!!! I bought my VW and Volvo from them and they were fine--but that's probably because they have lots of competition in Houston from other dealerships on those brands, unlike with the BMW marque.

Thanks all -
Tim

nyccarguy · June 2002

You might get a better answer on the 3 series board. There's a poster there "seiwvrig" who I believe purchased his 325i (via European Delivery) from one of the Momentum/Advantage dealers in Houston.

As frustrated as you seem to be, you do live in a big city (Houston) where there is an abundance of wealth (oil tycoons, computer geeks, & enron execs;) and the dealership wants to make the most money it can. I don't agree with it, but I understand it.

Obviously you're shopping for a Mid $40-$50K SUV and you're not going to have to take out a second mortgage on your house or get a second job to pay for this (or make payments). If the dealers 90 miles away are going to give you a stellar deal, then go there. Otherwise you might just want to bite your upper lip and take the $500 or $1000 off MSRP that Momentum/Advantage offers you. Just think about your alternatives: Taking your car an hour and a half away for service or not having a loaner car and bumming a ride to the dealership, to work, back to the dealership.

It is frustrating. Try and work a little more with Momentum/Advantage. Talk with the sales manager and see if he'll give you $1000 or $1500 off sticker. There is still plenty of profit in the sale of the X5 at that price. Go in towards the end of the day, near the end of the month.

rickrover · June 2002

You don't have to be in a big city to experience this. I'm in Orando with one BMW dealer - they have the same take it or leave it attitude since they are the only BMW show in town. I did get about $1,500 off my X5 without a whole lot of heartburn. Anything above that I didn't feel was worth the effort, they weren't budging and I like the service loaner program - they really hold you hostage with the service loaner issue.

smarty2 · June 2002

Was 3.0 shopping and finally found very good prices (1900 off sticker) at two local dealerships. As fate would have it I was just about to order a new 3.0 with options(no nav) and I stumbled into a pre-owned 4.4 that had just been traded in that day for the big sedan.It was fully loaded sport,prm.sound ect.(in fact the only option it doesnt have is the nav.)Only 11kmiles ,only 10mths in service and certified for the extra warranty. It was also the exact color and interior I would have ordered on a new one( alpine white, sand with dark wood trim)I bought it after checking it's service record for $48,000.You can get a good deal if you just keep looking.I am thrilled with this car and will share info on my local dealerships with anyone who wants to know.I'm in the N.Va.,D.C&Md. area

westla · June 2002

Any recent data points from the gallery on going rates for a purchase of a new 3.0 with options in the LA area (west LA preferably)?

raybear · June 2002

Any discount is a good one. Try getting to the dealers' fleet or internet managers and offer $1500 off MSRP on the options you are looking for. Someone may bite on that.

greenlatern · June 2002

I bought an X5 back in 01/01 and I bought my wife a T&C Lxi in 12/00 -- car pricing is strictly supply vs. demand. I basically went with a email blast on the T&C, lots of dealers bidding and rebidding...price kept getting lower. Finally got down to 1 dealer with exactly what she wanted at a heckuva price. Buying the X5 was night/day different. There are 3 dealers to choose from in the Denver area and email blasting was near useless. Q: Why didn't they care if I took my business elsewhere? A: The X5 was/is so hot that for every customer who walks away there's 2 more lined up to buy. Most dealers will receive fewer X5s than they can sell, so (from their perspective) why sell it cheap?

Great deals? From what I've seen over the last few years the best deals are concentrated in the northeast. Even then if you really press someone with a "great deal" there's always a catch...loaded up on options (dealer installed), financed thru dealer, low-balled trade-in, 5 spd sitting on lot, etc., etc. I got $500 off (internet price) which is nothing compared to what I spent!

Best time to buy: Christmas. Every drive by a dealership last 2 weeks of December? Salesmen standing around, lots void of customers. And if it were me I'd forget about an '02 and wait for the '03. I understand they're going with Dakota leather (currently Montana leather) and DVD-based Nav. Good luck!

stever · June 2002

Timtx01, I take it all back ;-)

Good luck in your search; sounds like you're really going to need it.

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timtx01 · June 2002

Hi greenlntrn:
Your X5 buying experience is similar to what I encountered when I went shopping for one late last year as well. Which is why I bought a different car instead!

I'm not sure blast-faxing will yield much either, but I'm trying it anyway. One dealership here in Houston has already called 3 times, and Momentum had at least 10-12 unsold when I did a quick drive-by count. The salesperson at Advantage, their sister dealership, admitted to me that the car has cooled a bit (esp now that Enron, Dynegy, Reliant and Williams are all melting down here in Houston!). Interestingly, the Advantage person also freely admitted that the Momentum dealership is arrogant and that the folks there have an attitude like they work in the "Taj Mahal"!

So anyway, I'm convinced that just sticking to my guns and being a harda** right back with these guys will yield something. And if not, hey, I've still got a new Passat that I enjoy driving! I'll keep you all updated!
Tim

legran22 · June 2002

I ran into the same brick wall at the Houston area BMW dealers but finally got a little relief after extended negotiations with Momentum, at closing time the last day of the month. I am told the problem is lack of production on the 4.4 engines. If I wanted a 3.0, it was an easier delivery. How much of that is hot air, I dunno. I ended up ordering one the first part of May and it is supposed to be in this week sometime. I didn't even know there was a dealer in Beaumont.

stoole1 · June 2002

My apologies for this not being about the X5, but I see nowhere else to post this question.
Does anyone know when the X3 will be available? Some of the auto publications suggest that it will be available in 2003. I called the sales manager of my local dealer and he said that it would not be available for 5 yrs.

timtx01 · June 2002

Hi Legran -
Well I already found a dealer in north Texas who sounds motivated on the X5. We'll see if it pans out, it's early days.

But my return to Momentum with this information got me a snippy email from their internet sales manager saying that bidding for business on the phone/email is "not the way I sell BMWs". Not sure what he's there for then as he is the "internet" sales manager. Frankly I've been shocked at the arrogance from these guys. In contrast, the dealer from north Tex was very courteous, perfectly willing to discuss numbers.

My understanding was that the 4.4 is easy to come by as people are reluctant to spend so much extra $$ on it when the 3.0 is plenty peppy. That's awesome that yours will be in soon!

Best -
Tim

timtx01 · June 2002

Hey Legran -
I forgot to ask - what price did Momentum finally do on your vehicle - was your trade fair and how was your X5 equipped? IE, how motivated were they on the last day of the month?
Thx -
Tim

stever · June 2002

The BMW X3 board got archived due to a lack of posts. I'll try to unfreeze it tomorrow (my tools aren't working in there tonight) and maybe you can "reseed" the discussion. Meanwhile there were a few links posted in there that may help.

The Buzz says "sometime next year."

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nicktamberrino · June 2002

Looking at a 4.4 x5 purchase but want to see if I should wait until the '03. Has anyone heard of any changes? I was hoping the 745i engine might become standard. Anyone have thoughts on sport vs. non-sport pkg? I test drove a used v8 sport pkg car and it felt a little harsh compared to my 540 sport, but I loved those 19" wheels.

nyccarguy · June 2002

You drive a 540 Sport and want to get an X5? What is this world coming to?

The Valvetronic 4.5L V8 from the 745 will not make its way into the X5 next year (at least not with 325 HP). The 540i & X5 4.4 I believe have been updated and now pump out 290hp as opposed to 282hp in years past.

jrobinson5 · June 2002

Smarty2--I am in DC area and am considering a new X5 3.0 or used 4.4. What dealers do you recommend?

stever · June 2002

The X3 board is up and running again.

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needwheelsbad · June 2002

We are looking at both of these SAV/AAV's and are having a tough time choosing.. The BMW rides better but the 2002 M-Class is better than previous years. Are there any X5 Sport owners out there who have gone through this decision? I would appreciate any comments from X5 Sport owners.

Thanks.

suavechavo · June 2002

Don't forget Fred Brown in College Station/Bryan. They always make the list for customer satisfaction thru the BMW network. Hope this helps.

Good Luck!

greenlatern · June 2002

Both sport packages feature a number of cosmetic changes, but the X5 sport also features a beefed up suspension. Depending on the road conditions where you live the X5 sport may be too harsh for your back seat passengers (it's hard to impress potential clients after beating them senseless). Price-wise a reasonably optioned X5 Sport is more comparable to an ML500, not the 320. Reallly a judgement call based entirely on your driving habits, needs (X5 is pretty small inside), and styling preferences. Both excellent vehicles so it's hard to go wrong.

arh4 · June 2002

My X5, 3.0 is not up to the same German build quality as my 530. Mechanically it's great but fit and finish leaves much to be desired, lots of squeaks still around after 4 visits to Momentum's service dept. in Houston.

Anyone with squeaking/creaking noises around the hatch area? If so please let me know what the fix was.

rickrover · June 2002

I don't have any squeaks/ rattles in my X5 at 10k miles - it's solid as a rock. Try another dealer, I doubt they are even trying to fix it.

smarty2 · June 2002

Go to BMW of Fairfax and deal directly with John Hayes or Richard Burton of BMW of Arlington.In June I was looking at 1900 off sticker for new car and a wait of 5 wks.to special order. They had a pretty good selection on the lot in Fairfax. Call first, avoid salesmen if you can.The above mentioned are sales managers. Know what you want before you go, and if they have a good pre-owned that you like check Edmunds and aim for the price by a forsale by owner from the dealer with certifcation and 6yr./100,000 My preowned had a sticker of about 61,000 new.A year later and only 11,500miles and I payed 48k.

Sylvia · July 2002

A journalist is looking to interview CEOs/CFOs/CIOs or other c-level business-types who drive the BMW X5 or the Volkswagen Beetle. Please direct all responses, including daytime contact information, to me at jfallon@edmunds.com no later than Monday, July 15th 5:00 p.m. Eastern.

Jeannine Fallon
PR Director
Edmunds.com

sirwin · July 2002

Ok, so I have gone out and test driven both the X5 and RX300. Although the RX300 had a few extra standard accessories, I fell in love with the X5. My only concern is that I keep reading about the below average reliability of the X5 which deters some from truly recommending this SUV. Does anyone have specific experiences with the 2002? Help!!

sirwin · July 2002

I'm gearing up to buy a 3.0i X5 between now and the end of the year. Does anyone have a recommendation as to when is the best time of the year to buy? And, should I be waiting for the 2003 model - if so, why? In other words, what's the difference between the 2002 and 2003? Finally, when do the 2003s appear on the lots. Thanks!

greenlatern · July 2002

The most common complaints I read about these days are a) key memory b) peeling door handles and c) break dust. The X5 began as a new vehicle on a new line in a relatively new plant so it went through some growing pains. If you search google for 'bmw forums' I think you'll find a group where you can ask all the '02 questions you want -- my experience there indicates the X5 has gotten much better.

Personally I think you should wait for the '03 rather than take the immediate depreciation hit. IIRC the '03 should be out in October with some subtle improvements (like an indash CD player available with Nav).

IMO the best time to buy is when supply is high and demand is low...of course this is hard to gauge. A few posters suggested they were going in to buy last month but they never came back -- so who knows how it went. End of the month is rarely effective on an in-demand vehicle. In some states dealers have to pay taxes on vehicles on the lot at the end of the year so the last week in December and the week leading up to xmas are pretty good if you can "buy off the rack".

jammyling · July 2002

So i just received my 02 X5 3.0 from Open Road BMW service center for the 3rd time for the same navigation problem...screen blanks out for no reason and resets itself. Once again, the problem hasn't been fixed even though they told me they installed a new navi system. in fact, its blanked out more times in the past four days since i've had it back than ever before!
Needless to say, its getting pathetic.
To make matters worse...i picked up my X5 at the service center with 20 more miles on it than when i dropped it off. Does it take 20 miles to test a navi system!?!? And lets not forget to mention a self tapping screw stuck in my brand new 22" rims/tires!!!!

toska1 · July 2002

Look out for this site,euracar.com, the 2003 X5 facelift, check it out.

marysam · July 2002

sorry if this question has been addressed before.
i just got my X5 a couple of weeks ago and have an issue with my xenon headlights. at nights when there are no street lights, the lamps on the passenger side seems to extend "much farther" than the driver side. i understand that this helps to protect on-coming traffic from that glare. not sure. are the rest of the X5 owners with xenon lights see this much difference? the difference is annoying since i am much more into symmetry (even discharge levels from both sides). thanks for any advice.

greenlatern · July 2002

If you visit the bmwusa.com website and drill down to "X technology" under the "X" series, and the end of the page you'll find a link to "Xenon Technology". That'll take you to a shockwave model comparing the Xenon lighting pattern to that of halogen bulbs. What you are experiencing sounds normal and matches my experience as well.

txdriver · July 2002

What broke to make the dust? Or did you mean brake dust...? This seems to be a common problem with German cars. Just check out all the BMW's and Mercs with clean rear wheels and ugly, black front ones... Our Audi A4 used to do this until we had the brake pads replaced at the corner Just Brakes shop. I cant detect any difference in brake effectiveness and no more dust.

thor8 · July 2002

"This seems to be a problem with German cars". Is only a problem of aesthetics, one has to always keep in mind that Germany is the only country that has an Autobahn, as such they have to satisfy domestic demands, and that is for a vehicle to be able to handle very high speeds AND BE ABLE TO STOP at those high speeds, therefore they use a high content of carbon filler in the pads, hence the black dust, another plus is that those pads are softer (very little metallic fillers) and they prolong the life of the rotors.

slocko · July 2002

The X5 is the first bmw I have ever test driven. I had this image of bmws being very quiet, so I was kind of surprised at how noisy the engine was.

Are all bmws this noisy or is it just the X5 because it's an suv?

lzmlz · July 2002

I have 3.0 X5 for 4 month now. I enjoy every minute of driving it. X5 actually is quieter than Lexus RX300 in both max acceleration and cruise at 70 MPH, according to Car & Driver magzine. My wife has RX300 and it is true. X5 does have engine noise, but it's kind like music to my ears, because of the in-line 6-cylinder designe (better than V6 engines, as agreed by experts). The engine and transmission response is much better in X5 than RX300, just like a sports car with a high seating position. It is also very smooth. I always had Japenese and American cars in the past. The X5 experience totally change my impression about German cars. By the way, my X5 has been rock solid, it's perfect in terms of reliability with near 4000 miles now. Go with the X5, you will not regret. Driving X5 to and from work is certainly the high point of my day.

smarty2 · July 2002

I had to have my bumper replaced because I was rear-ended by someone while waiting in a parking lot for a light. My car was a brand new purchase but these things happen.I decided not to return to the dealership I purchased the car from due to location and the fact the buying experience was not great(Sterling BMW in Va.)So I went to VOB which also was the closest BMW dealership with their own body shop. Here is what I have been through. 1 Estimated repair 4 days to fix bumper, park distance sensor and exhaust..2 weeks later still no car because of wait on a part..Insurance Co. becoming hostile.2 Get car back..wrong muffler is on my sport package X5 it should be black,but it's silver like the non-sport. VOB trys to convince me this is the only replacement part BMW has for the X5. Call BMW several times before finally getting someone to admit the wrong part was put on. 3 The new bumper was a mess with overspray on the black part of the bumper(my car is white)and the worst paint job imaginable.Car must be redone.Everyone agrees on this.4 While waiting for the muffler to be replaced I come back from getting coffee and see my car parked in the service road due to lack of parking at dealership and there is a nice scratch on it. The dealership says they will take care of it but I am livid.5) Car goes back to body shop 2 days later to have bumper redone....4 days later pick the car up to find that while it is a much better looking job,there still is over spray on the black trim (when the back hatch is opened, you see it)and worst yet...they have cured the problem of overspraying and messing up a brand new bumper by painting the black textured part that is not supposed to be painted. They are telling me that it will be just fine and that they do this all the time..This car was $61,000 new...2 other dealerships say this bumper needs to be replaced but I cannot stomach dealing with VOB again(Also my car had a full tank of gas but was only3/4ths full and at least 15 miles higher upon picking it up) I have had it..I told the insurance co. that I refuse to take it back there they have been so dishonest to deal with. Can anyone tell me if there is anything I can do?I think the insurance company may tell me I can have it redone but with no further liability on their part.What about all my time ect.? I never had Mercedes dealership problems in the 20yrs.I owned various cars.I thought a change would be nice,what a mistake! No matter how much fun the X5 is to drive so far my BMW experience has been horrible!

nyccarguy · July 2002

While I understand your pain, you're having a bad experience with that particular dealer's body shop. I suggest you try and speak to the manager of the body shop or even the manager of the dealership. Your bumper will get fixed right, you just have to talk to the right people.

Next time something like this happens, I suggest you find a body shop that specializes in European Marquees.

Another suggestion I can say is to take it to another body shop and have it fixed right on your own dime. You're driving a $61,000 BMW and I assume you're not strapped making payments on it. I know there is a principle involved, but somethimes you just have to cut your losses.

BMW X5

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