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Also, I didn't notice that TireRack's page on All Seasons tires mentions that all of them have the M+S designation (all the ones on their page, not necessarily all All Seasons).
So I am good. Thanks again.
Luigi
Long story short, both sets of tires for my Mazda3 have M+S on the sidewall. The Michelins are highly stylized and even though indicator is fairly large, it was easy to miss. The Yokohamas were easy to overlook as well due to the "M+S" indicator being maybe only an eighth of an inch high.
So, time for me to shut-up and crawl back into my hole.
But this created a problem for the California Highway Patrol who regulated what vehicles were allowed to go into the mountains in winter. Their regulations required SNOW tires - amd while they understood that All Season tires had better snow traction than bias ply tires did, they needed something concrete to work against. So the Rubber Manufacturers Association (RMA) created a verbal description of what an all season tire looked like and Cailfornia wrote a regulation around that definition with the letters "M" and "S" as indicators. Put specifically - those two letters could only be used if, and only if, the tires met the definition - and the term "All Season could only be used if, and only if, the tire had an "M" and "S" on the sidewall. Other tires could have those letters - all terrain, winter tires - but the intent was to delineate street passenger car tires that had snow capability.
The letters "M" and "S" could be separated by a "+", or a "-", or a "/", or nothing at all, but when the letters appear, those mean "all season" and vice versa.
So you may ask: "Why didn't they mandate a test rather than a description of how they looked!" Because snow traction testing was in its infancy and there was lots of variability. In other words - it wasn't reliable enough.
Fast forward a couple of decades: The Canadians wanted to create a regulation for winter tires. They knew that some all season tires weren't vey good in the snow (although clearly superior to the old bias ply tires), but they wanted something that clearly delineated a superior winter traction tire. Again, the RMA stepped in and came up with a test and a symbol (Commonly called the "SnowFlake Symbol"). Needless to say, that snow traction test had become much more repeatable and reliable by then so the test had vaildity to the real world.
That is where things are at the moment.
But there is a problem: Many all terrain tires will pass this test - as will some agressive all season tires. That makes it difficult to enforce a "Winter Tire Only" regulation. So the Canadians have proposed a more agressive test and an approriate symbol to match - and they have run into technical difficulties. The Canadians would like to add ice traction to the testing protocol - BUT - tires that are really good in snow aren't necessarily really good on ice and vice versa. So they are have some difficulties writing a regulation to deal with this. They need to work out the bugs before a new symbol can be created.
When the Canadians proposed the new regulation, they assumed that a tire that would have - relatively - excellent ice traction, would also have - relatively - excellent snow traction. It would have been nice if that was true, but, alas, that is not the case.
Clearly ice traction is going to be low compared to dry traction - but that wasn't the issue. It had to do with rating tires - and the assumption was that the average motorist would assume a highly rated winter tire would be highly rated for both snow and ice traction - and because they are not, there's a dilemma.
But the TIRERACK video definitely shows that at slow speeds (10 mph) some tires perform quite well on ice (they used an ice rink). So I could see why picking the right tire makes a difference under those conditions.
That said, chains are still better.
Suburban does just fine on Toyo Open Country AT's with added siping.
I gave up studs years ago, and haven't missed them.
Did them ourselves, for the first time.. I have a friend with a floor jack, a torque wrench and a pickup truck (to haul two sets down to his house).. That's all we needed...
Good practice for the teenager!
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I am really confused because m+s is kind of an all season rating and the snowflake logo means that it has winter tire specification.
The question I have is could I consider this cooper tire an all weather tire and keep it all year round? I remember the nokian AW previously mentioned bearing the snowflake logo too? Thanks!
Second, Cooper Discoverer M+S is indeed a winter tire and what Cooper says about it on their web site doesn't mention year round use. But to be sure, You should call Cooper and ask.
I have a set of Nokian Hakkapeliita LT's on my Toyota Rav 4. I would highly recommend them to anyone. They are my first set of winter tires so I don't have much to compare them to but paired with the Rav's traction control system I'll say that this is a totally different driving experience than with the all seasons that came with the vehicle. I posted a review on them here. There are a few other winter tire reviews as well.
them to be installed. My daughter that winter was the only one of her friends that could keep rolling on the ice and snow. When it came to time for me to replace my 20K old on my TDI
I called Tyresbyweb and had four Entyres shipped via FEDEX to me hear in Newport Beach.
I noticed that my TDI Jetta VW that gets 50 MPG on the highway now gets 63 MPG on the highway WOW. I also do not pick up nails like my wife's Hankooks . Recently we got a big
rain storm all the roads get very slick with the oil on them the Entyres worked great with this
what more can you ask for.