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Documentation Fees

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Comments

  • graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,665
    fees?

    -window etch....about 10 minutes of a lot boy's time
    -credit processing....don't know. Get pre-approved at your bank or S&L. Dealer has no credit to process.
    -online registration.....have them show you this fee in your locale
    -tire tax....are they buying new tires? Tires should already be on the car. You pay tax on the ENTIRE car, not just the tires separately.
    -Electronic signing fee....bring your own pen and sign the contract with your own ink.
    -Doc fee....look at any of the above posts.
    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
  • jwilliams2jwilliams2 Member Posts: 910
    edited April 2010
    Fees....
    Window etch...If you want it, make sure it includes the $3-5k insurance policy as many do, helps recover your down payment if the car is stolen...or just say no.
    Credit processing...Shouldn't pay if you get your own financing.
    Online registration...Could be a local thing.
    Tire Tax...This is legit...charged on all new cars by the State of New Jersey at $1.50 per tire.
    Registration....Sounds about right for NJ
    Electronic signing fee......Doubtful..
    Doc Fee....Negotiate...tell them to reduce the price of the car by a similar amount.
  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    They all sound like a bunch of horse hockey to me here in NJ.
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • jwilliams2jwilliams2 Member Posts: 910
    You have horse hockey in NJ? We have (horse) polo here in CT, but no hockey.
  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    :D
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • michaellnomichaellno Member Posts: 4,120
    ...and paid $0 in doc (or dealer handling) fees.

    lrguy might know what dealership group this is, since he and I are both in Colorado.
  • lrguy44lrguy44 Member Posts: 2,197
    I missed the question but if you are looking for a $0 doc fee I don't think Ralph Schomp BMW Honda charges one.
  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    Wow. Michaelll bought his daughter a BMW? :P
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • michaellnomichaellno Member Posts: 4,120
    Wow. Michaelll bought his daughter a BMW?

    Uh, no.

    But, thanks for playing!
  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    :P
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • nrwaynenrwayne Member Posts: 45
    I am a CT resident. Just leased a car from a NY dealer. The lease agreement stated that the document fee was $75 and estimated the registration fees at $187.50. When I picked up the car, I was told that if the registration cost less I would receive a refund. When I got the registration papers, they showed the total cost as $90. So I called the dealer and requested my refund. They told me that there were additional charges which they decided not to pass along. I requested the papers showing those charges and it turns out that they slapped on a $135 CT processing fee, which was not in the lease agreement and was not something I had agreed to. It appears that they have attempted to increase the document fee beyond the NY limit by calling it something else. I believe this is in violation of NY law and that I am entitled to a refund. Am I correct?
  • fordfoolfordfool Member Posts: 240
    The first page of your lease agreement should have a statement to the effect that "the amount paid for state DMV registration and title fees is an estimate and that any overpayment must be refunded to you within sixty days."

    I had to nag my dealer for the refund, but I got it. It's the law in New York.
  • nrwaynenrwayne Member Posts: 45
    After calling the DMV and the state AG's office, I called the dealer and explained that I would consider the additional processing fee they slapped on after the agreement an honest mistake once they refund the excess of payments made for registration and title fees. Having leased three Ms from this dealer over the past four years, I believe I should be considered a customer worth keeping. Although there was a minimal attempt to respond by the person at the dealership, I made it clear that their choice was either a refund to me or the potential problems they will face if I need to turn the matter over the AG's office. This kind of situation, unfortunately, is far too common and one in which the dealers often prevail after the customer gets tired of fighting. Don't think that will happen here.
  • time2drive2time2drive2 Member Posts: 1
    I have found a used car that I like. We have agreed on a price for the car. Then I asked about all the 'extra' fees and this is what I was given. I was expecting TTL. Should I pay these or say no deal??? I'm in Texas.

    State Tax $971.75

    Veh. Data Dots $248.00

    Deputy Fee $5.00

    License/TransferFee $110.30

    Documentary Fee $249.00

    Dealer Vehicle Investory

    Property Tax $28.87
  • alamocityalamocity Member Posts: 680
    I would not pay the dealer vehicle inventory fee on a used vehicle and the Doc fee is way out of line, especially for a used vehicle. Was the Doc fee posted at the dealership, state law changed last year and that fee has to be posted at the dealership for everyone to see, otherwise it can and should be contested.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Member Posts: 27,132
    What is the Veh. Data Dots for $248?

    2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,

  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    What extra funds would you pay if you bought a car from a private party? Then pay no more than that which would be involved if buying from a PP.
  • bocacoderbocacoder Member Posts: 3
    Hello All - this is my first post - needed to vent for a bit. I just bought a new Mazda6 iTouring 4 cylinder to replace my dieing Ford Focus. I had done a few test drives of other vehicles, but I really liked the Mazda6 over the Accord, Camry, and Sonata. After doing my homework on Edmunds, I took my information to my local (South Florida) dealer, and test drove the 6 cylinder and the 4. After I decided the 4 was enough for me (it took them a while to locate the 4 as it was on a test drive), we started talking price. I had my Edmunds info with me, and negotiated what I thought was a great price. I had told the salesperson the price I wanted to pay including fees. Well, we came to an agreement, and then it was off to the paperwork. By now I had been at the dealer for about 4 hours and I was a little beat. I signed all the paperwork and took my new car home. Well, low and behold, they slipped the Dealer Fee past me (I re-read the contract when I got home). Ugh, what a stupid mistake on my part. At this point I think I just have to suck it up - any ideas on if I can go back to the dealer get something back from them?
  • nortsr1nortsr1 Member Posts: 1,060
    You, yourself, have stated that "negotiated what I thought was a fair price" and now you complain about the dealer fee. If you got the fair price, then the dealer fee of (Probably $599.00)(the usual Florida dealer rip-off fee) was probably figured into your negotiated great price.
    Am I missing something here????????? A negotiated "fair price" is usually the "bottomline" that you were willing to pay???????
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,145
    It sounds to me like the OP negotiated an out-the-door price to include all fees, then later found an additional fee added to the contract.

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  • fezofezo Member Posts: 10,384
    What? A dealer sneaking on an extra fee on top of an agreed upon price? Say it ain't so..... :surprise:
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • jipsterjipster Member Posts: 6,244
    Well, low and behold, they slipped the Dealer Fee past me

    Unless they were using invisible reappearing ink, not possible. Enjoy your Mazda 6 and don't worry abou [non-permissible content removed]..
    2020 Honda Accord EX-L, 2011 Hyundai Veracruz, 2010 Mercury Milan Premiere, 2007 Kia Optima
  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    In the finality of the deal, how does sneaking in the fee contribute to referrals, repeat business, & positive feedback to the manufacturer? :mad:
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Member Posts: 2,882
    Sounds like you didn't read your contract before signing it to verify the agreed on price was actually the true bottom line price before state tax & title fees were added. Trust but verify. I'd kill em on the survey.
  • bocacoderbocacoder Member Posts: 3
    mikefm58 - you're right, I didn't read it carefully enough. I guess I'll learn from the experience and go in with a checklist over to the finance department next time so that I don't forget to double check all fees.
  • ken117ken117 Member Posts: 249
    I too have a problem with the Doc fee. Interestingly, some dealers in Virginia have a price list for the Doc fees. For people living in Virginia the fee is $399, for people coming from Delaware the fee is $299 and for people in Maryland the fee is $100. I wonder if people really pay $399! No way would I buy a car and pay that amount.

    When I negotiate, I negotiate a bottom line price. Usually the dealer will simply adjust the pricing structure to get to the bottom line price to include whatever Doc fee they choose. Since it does not impact the bottom line, makes no difference to me, other than the tax would be a bit less. It has to do with legal issues, appears the dealers must charge everyone the Doc fee or they could face legal troubles.

    For me, a Doc fee of $50 would be OK as they do provide a service in that I do not have to go to MVR. Too me that is worth a few bucks, but not $399.
  • jhs70jhs70 Member Posts: 213
    VA resident here. The car business must be booming here in NOVA. Based on my recent new car inquiries, dealers stop talking to me when I mention that i will drive to MD to buy a new car in order to escape the ridiculous, and I mean ridiculous, doc fees that some of them charge. I've even tried to keep my dollars in VA by going for an OTD price that reduces the doc fee, but they all balk. I guess there are more than enough people in the area willing to spend spend spend that they are disinterested in working with me. What other conclusion can I draw? I've purchased my last 3 or 4 vehicles in MD because of this. (I still think that MD charges too much, but 100 is a lot less than 399, 499, you get the drift.)
  • nortsr1nortsr1 Member Posts: 1,060
    Don't feel bad. I live in Florida and the dealers charge anywhere from 499.00 to $599.00 dealer fees. What I usually do (in fact always do) is wait to the final $$$ amount is given to me for my trade-in (and that is after MUCH back and forth negotiation) and than tell them I want either $500.00 or $600.00 more for my trade-in.
    It really all boils down to what you are willing to pay "BOTTOM LINE"!!!!
  • bocacoderbocacoder Member Posts: 3
    edited August 2010
    Thanks nortsr1, that's a great way to handle it. I'll keep that in mind next time.
  • nortsr1nortsr1 Member Posts: 1,060
    You are most welcome. It always has worked for me....and believe you me....they always come out ahead on your trade-in. I have walked out several times from dealerships) only to be called back (more than once)....and they will agree to what I have asked. Always remember...if you can't get the price you want...you can ALWAYS walk out. Yes, maybe you have asked too much...but it is your money that they want.
    If they let you walk out, then perhaps you have demanded too much...but...there is always another dealership somewhere.
    And remeber this...if you are satisfied with the deal you get...be HAPPY... not two days later kicking yourself in the [non-permissible content removed] thinking you could have done better.
    Since I purchase a new car (suv) every three years, beieve me, I have done a lot of purchasing and "negotiating" over the past years. I am 79 years old...so you know I have bought and negotiated a loy of new vehicles.
  • cadillacmikecadillacmike Member Posts: 543
    The situation in northern virginia is likely the result of it being a border area with several states, and the dealers responding to the dealer doc fee laws in those states.

    We don't have that 'problem' here in FL, because the appears to be no law or regulation and the doc fees have hit the stratosphere! $600 - probably more when i actually get to the dealership. Absolutely ludicrous. As northstar1 has stated, find out what it is, and account for that in your final price either on the car you're buying or trading.
  • euphoniumeuphonium Member Posts: 3,425
    DOC fee translates into "Additional Dealer Profit". An attempt to legitimize a rippoff. After we settled on the cash price, the paperwork listed a DOC fee. We walked out without saying a word. :surprise:
  • mikefm58mikefm58 Member Posts: 2,882
    They always do that, then act surprised like "Gee how'd that get there" or make it sound like everybody does it that way. Most will adjust the trade-in or price to account for it when you point it out to them, but it is slimy the way they try to slide it in there, hoping you won't notice.
  • cadillacmikecadillacmike Member Posts: 543
    When its $699 it hard not to notice it! :mad:
  • cadillacmikecadillacmike Member Posts: 543
    edited July 2013
    Its been quiet here on Doc fees.

    That's strange because here in FL they have broken the stratosphere and are halfway to Jupiter. The Cadillac dealers are at $600-700.

    But the absolute worst offenders are the kia dealers, they are at $700-800. I mean you have got to be kidding me, but they're not. I guess it's part of their plan the make the screamer ads touting "$3,000 minimum trade in" and still have a buyer walking out paying more than MSRP... WTF ???

    I actually went to several kia dealers last spring (looking for my nephew) and yup, they add on way more than $3,000 in Doc fees, advert, and etc., so that the $13,000 MSRP kia rio (or whatever)r costs $14,000 AFTER the $3,000 trade in.

    And this is on kias. :sick:
  • ken117ken117 Member Posts: 249
    Kia dealers do seem a bit behind the times when it comes to selling. Any dealer which uses screamer ads are best avoided.

    Regarding doc fees, the best way to handle these fees would be for all buyers to walk out. If this were to happen, I doubt it would take the dealers very long to eliminate this charade. Sadly this will not happen, there are simply too many unsophisticated buyers.

    The most effective method a single buyer can use is to factor the amount into the purchase price, reduce the price to compensate for the doc fee. I recently bought a vehicle in Virginia. Dealer had a $499 doc fee. After we negotiated the bottom line, I told the sales person I would not pay the doc fee. The dealer quickly lowered the price by $250 and increased the trade value by $250. There was a guy at the next table who I heard take the same approach with similar success.

    Anyone interested in an insider's perspective on doc fees should google Earl Stewart on Cars. He has some very insightful comments on the Florida doc fee fiasco.
  • nortdnortd Member Posts: 13
    Cadillacmike....go to Hollywood Kia.com No dealer fees
  • cadillacmikecadillacmike Member Posts: 543
    Thanks. I looked Earl up. Jeez, it's even worse on the gold coast than on the sun coast. I think my next war will have to be another 1996 Fleetwood, the new car market is just too screwed up.

    For those of you who do not know, Florida's "Gold coast" is the southern half of its Atlantic coast from approx West Palm on down, while the "Sun coast" is the gulf coast from approx Clearwater on down.
  • cadillacmikecadillacmike Member Posts: 543
    Nort, I'm currently in the desert, and can't go to any dealer. My nephew ended up buying a Mitsubishi (I have another word for it that Kirstie will censor on me! :P ).

    Of course he was too stubborn to ask me or my wife for any assistance so he got taken to the cleaners..... :sick:

    As for cars for me & the misses, just look at my userid for what I buy.
  • raybearraybear Member Posts: 1,795
    Looking back to when I started this thread...doc fees haven't gone away, in fact they've increased everywhere. The first dealership I ever worked in charged $65 and that was normal...this is in Connecticut. Now I'm seeing upwards of $750! The place I work in now charges $379, but that's often included in the price quote if you're an online customer and I do recommend anyone find out what fees are during the negotiation, as with Ken's post above.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 235,175
    Yeah.. if you are in Florida or Georgia, it can go as high as $899.. Borderline criminal.

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  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,057
    kyfdx said:

    Yeah.. if you are in Florida or Georgia, it can go as high as $899.. Borderline criminal.

    Was $499 when we bought our Outback in February .. and that's about average here in Colorado. Have seen them as high as $699 at a Kia (!) dealer.

    There is one dealership group that doesn't charge any sort of dealer / documentation fee - BMW / MINI / Honda. However, they are a one price store, so it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other.

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  • raybearraybear Member Posts: 1,795
    Michaell said:

    kyfdx said:



    There is one dealership group that doesn't charge any sort of dealer / documentation fee - BMW / MINI / Honda. However, they are a one price store, so it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other.

    Which dealer group is that, Michaell? They deserve a mention. I know not all BMW, MINI and Honda dealers are in that class.

  • MichaellMichaell Moderator Posts: 240,057
    raybear said:

    Michaell said:

    kyfdx said:



    There is one dealership group that doesn't charge any sort of dealer / documentation fee - BMW / MINI / Honda. However, they are a one price store, so it's 6 of one, half dozen of the other.

    Which dealer group is that, Michaell? They deserve a mention. I know not all BMW, MINI and Honda dealers are in that class.

    Ralph Schomp in Denver. They only have the three stores - daughter has bought both her MINIs from them. Consistently get excellent customer service ratings.

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  • sdasda Member Posts: 6,934
    Since most, actually I think all dealers in our area charge the Admin/Doc fee, before I even start negotiations I ask what fees they charge upfront. Often there is some him and hawing, but I persist. Gives a good starting point and reduces any confusion and unpleasant surprises.

    2018 VW Passat SE w/tech, 2016 Audi Q5 Premium Plus w/tech, 2006 Acura TL w/nav

  • dino001dino001 Member Posts: 6,162
    edited April 2015
    nortsr1 said:

    Don't feel bad. I live in Florida and the dealers charge anywhere from 499.00 to $599.00 dealer fees. What I usually do (in fact always do) is wait to the final $$$ amount is given to me for my trade-in (and that is after MUCH back and forth negotiation) and than tell them I want either $500.00 or $600.00 more for my trade-in.
    It really all boils down to what you are willing to pay "BOTTOM LINE"!!!!

    Try $699, $799, or even $895 some friendly Toyota outfits charge here in Tampa Bay. OTD is af course the way to go, but the whole approach by these guys is completely outrageous.
    It allows them to prey on uninformed and avertise fake prices. I'm big on free market, but it seems it's getting out completely if control to the point that perhaps the government needs to step in. 900 bucks is no longer a fee, it's basically a deception scheme. They clearly can't police themselves and have no internal brakes.

    2018 430i Gran Coupe

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