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Comments

  • stever said:

    Oh, doh. I meant 15 to 20 panels. 20 would be pushing your 7 number iirc. We don't want to wind up giving excess to the utility since they aren't paying squat for it.

    (A hot tub would be nice however).

    20 kW caught my attention, too. Only certain Colorado entrepreneurs taking advantage of our new cannibas laws would need something that large :)

    We installed 18 panels at 265 watts each.
    Tesla Model 3, 2015 Subaru Outback
  • fezofezo Manahawkin, NJPosts: 10,376
    Did you buy or let them put their panels on your house?
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • We purchased ours.
    Tesla Model 3, 2015 Subaru Outback
  • fezofezo Manahawkin, NJPosts: 10,376
    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    Well, if you stay connected to the grid, that free electricity will likely cost you an infrastructure fee in a few years and it could turn out to be significant.

    Talking to our off grid friends tonight - they splurged on their lead acid batteries and can go 5 cloudy days on stored power. They are going to sell their backup generator since they never use it. The neighbors who cheaped out with marine or car or golf cart batteries are lucky to get a half day of juice. It Elon's lithium home deal is affordable enough, they want to get two of them.
  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    fezo said:

    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...

    FREE electricity! You don't think the government will find a way to tax the wind or sun?

    They'll have to replace that revenue somehow.....if they don't get it one way they will get it another.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • bwiabwia Boston Posts: 2,337
    I've looked into solar electricity but they said they would have to cut down two mature trees to let in more sunlight. Unfortunately, that is not an option since that would take away the ambience of suburban living.

    However, in my Caribbean home I have solar hot water, which works great, but going all the way to produce solar electricity is prohibitively expensive; for that, perhaps a wind turbine might be the way to go, but there is a lot of push back from the utility company with respect to alternative forms of electricity generation.
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,863
    driver100 said:

    fezo said:

    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...

    FREE electricity! You don't think the government will find a way to tax the wind or sun?

    They'll have to replace that revenue somehow.....if they don't get it one way they will get it another.

    Well there are not any taxes on my electric bill so there are not any to replace.

    In my case, the town may get additional real estate tax revenue as solar panels INCREASE the value of the house.
  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    robr2 said:

    driver100 said:

    fezo said:

    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...

    FREE electricity! You don't think the government will find a way to tax the wind or sun?

    They'll have to replace that revenue somehow.....if they don't get it one way they will get it another.

    Well there are not any taxes on my electric bill so there are not any to replace.

    In my case, the town may get additional real estate tax revenue as solar panels INCREASE the value of the house.
    No taxes on your electric bill..............YET!

    When more people turn to solar how will the government make up the shortfall?

    The money has to come from somewhere..................... :'(

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,863
    edited April 2015
    driver100 said:

    robr2 said:

    driver100 said:

    fezo said:

    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...

    FREE electricity! You don't think the government will find a way to tax the wind or sun?

    They'll have to replace that revenue somehow.....if they don't get it one way they will get it another.

    Well there are not any taxes on my electric bill so there are not any to replace.

    In my case, the town may get additional real estate tax revenue as solar panels INCREASE the value of the house.
    No taxes on your electric bill..............YET!

    When more people turn to solar how will the government make up the shortfall?

    The money has to come from somewhere..................... :'(

    If there aren't any taxes on my electric bill today what is the shortfall that has to be made up?

    Heck - my state will PAY me to put in solar panels.
  • jayriderjayrider Posts: 3,602
    driver100 said:

    robr2 said:

    driver100 said:

    fezo said:

    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...

    FREE electricity! You don't think the government will find a way to tax the wind or sun?

    They'll have to replace that revenue somehow.....if they don't get it one way they will get it another.

    Well there are not any taxes on my electric bill so there are not any to replace.

    In my case, the town may get additional real estate tax revenue as solar panels INCREASE the value of the house.
    No taxes on your electric bill..............YET!

    When more people turn to solar how will the government make up the shortfall?

    The money has to come from somewhere..................... :'(

    I propose that anyone who owns 2 Mercedes Benz automobiles pays a special electric shortfall tax. ;)
  • fezofezo Manahawkin, NJPosts: 10,376
    My state will underwrite some of my electric production once things are going and it's a $5,000 federal tax credit for the installation. No tax on the installation as it's a capital improvement.

    Indeed the money for your town, county, state and country have to come from somewhere. If you want government service taxes are part of it. As Oliver Wendell Holmes said, "taxes are the price we pay for civilization."
    2015 Mazda 6 Grand Touring, 2014 Mazda 3 Sport Hatchback, 1999 Mazda Miata 2004 Toyota Camry LE, 1999.
  • mako1amako1a VirginiaPosts: 1,855
    Must be nice getting tax credits with your itemized tax form. I paid cash for my house and receive no such federal tax credit (even if I had a 20 megawatt solar unit and 12 windmills) since I can't itemize.

    2013 Mustang GT, 2001 GMC Yukon Denali

  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,863
    mako1a said:

    Must be nice getting tax credits with your itemized tax form. I paid cash for my house and receive no such federal tax credit (even if I had a 20 megawatt solar unit and 12 windmills) since I can't itemize.

    You don't need to itemize in order to take advantage of the tax credit. It's a tax credit, not a deduction. It goes right on line 53 of form 1040.
  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    edited April 2015
    Here it would be a $7000 state/fed credit. One solar salesman called it a tax break for the rich. That's about the size of it. The utilities must be "uber" nervous.
  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    robr2 said:

    driver100 said:

    robr2 said:

    driver100 said:

    fezo said:

    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...

    FREE electricity! You don't think the government will find a way to tax the wind or sun?

    They'll have to replace that revenue somehow.....if they don't get it one way they will get it another.

    Well there are not any taxes on my electric bill so there are not any to replace.

    In my case, the town may get additional real estate tax revenue as solar panels INCREASE the value of the house.
    No taxes on your electric bill..............YET!

    When more people turn to solar how will the government make up the shortfall?

    The money has to come from somewhere..................... :'(

    If there aren't any taxes on my electric bill today what is the shortfall that has to be made up?

    Heck - my state will PAY me to put in solar panels.
    You're joking right? The government is giving you a tax break for now, but, the day will come when the shortfall from solar energy will be too great, and then they will find a new way to tax you. It may be a Federal Sales Tax, it might be a solar panel luxury tax, but I would guaranty you will pay more tax somewhere along the line.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    jayrider said:

    driver100 said:

    robr2 said:

    driver100 said:

    fezo said:

    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...

    FREE electricity! You don't think the government will find a way to tax the wind or sun?

    They'll have to replace that revenue somehow.....if they don't get it one way they will get it another.

    Well there are not any taxes on my electric bill so there are not any to replace.

    In my case, the town may get additional real estate tax revenue as solar panels INCREASE the value of the house.
    No taxes on your electric bill..............YET!

    When more people turn to solar how will the government make up the shortfall?

    The money has to come from somewhere..................... :'(

    I propose that anyone who owns 2 Mercedes Benz automobiles pays a special electric shortfall tax. ;)
    LOL....but, I shouldn't have to pay additional tax because someone with solar panels is paying less tax. That person still needs roads, police, firemen etc., they can just charge him more State Tax etc. Life goes on, and taxes have to be collected, one way or the other.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    fezo said:



    Indeed the money for your town, county, state and country have to come from somewhere. If you want government service taxes are part of it. As Oliver Wendell Holmes said, "taxes are the price we pay for civilization."

    Taxes are a necessity...the price we pay for civilization....but, they would be less if there wasn't so much waste.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • stickguystickguy Posts: 32,956
    added solar actually helps out the utilities now. they get additional generating capacity (what gets sold back to them) with no investment on their part. Building power plants is expensive!

    I assume though that solar users will just get hit with a bigger access charge for the privilege of being connected to the grid. Now, the people out in sun country with big enough batteries that can be completely disconnected, that sounds great! i do wonder what happens when the batteries are full. where does the excess electricity generated go?

    2019 Acura TLX A-spec 4 cyl. (mine), and 2013 Acura RDX AWD (wife's)

  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    edited April 2015
    My guess is that the inverter just shuts the juice down. Then there's my friend who wants to go solar and skip the inverters and buy all DC lights and appliances. Can just imagine the savings retrofitting an existing house with that wiring. Oh, and our off-grid Taos friends have added a "home brew" composting toilet, yet they still seem pretty normal all in all. :)
  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    stever said:

    My guess is that the inverter just shuts the juice down. Then there's my friend who wants to go solar and skip the inverters and buy all DC lights and appliances. Can just imagine the savings retrofitting an existing house with that wiring. Oh, and our off-grid Taos friends have added a "home brew" composting toilet, yet they still seem pretty normal all in all. :)

    Remind me.............if I am down that way, not to stay at their place.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,863
    edited April 2015
    If one is generating so much energy that they can't store it all - we salute you.

    As for increasing the connection charge, here in Massachusetts the power companies are compelled by regulation to invest in alternative energy. Increasing connection charges on their sources of supply (customer solar installs that generate power) would most likely be looked down upon by the regulators.
  • steverstever Posts: 52,462
    edited April 2015
    @driver100, they have "regular" plumbing inside. All their water comes from a roof catchment system and gets stored in a couple of 1500 gallon cisterns. But the privy will save a bit of water. It's an great place to stay - mountain views and amazing light (he's a pro photog).

    @robr2, there's a big fight going on in Florida right now that features the Tea Party working with the Sierra Club to change the state constitution to basically permit rooftop solar. (link and link). That's the notable example but plenty of other states are under fee pressure by the utilities to try to kill the economics of solar. But talk about strange bedfellows - it's like Chevy and Ford fans getting together.
  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    stever said:

    @driver100, they have "regular" plumbing inside. All their water comes from a roof catchment system and gets stored in a couple of 1500 gallon cisterns. But the privy will save a bit of water. It's an great place to stay - mountain views and amazing light (he's a pro photog).

    That sounds OK...better than our son the conservationist. Tries to use the toilet as little as possible to save....I don't know what exactly, water maybe?

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    Sirius called last week to renew when my trial offer is over May 10th. I declined of course at $175.89 a year!

    Got a special offer in the mail, $79.96. With tax and licence fees it climbed to $121 a year. I did have a cap of $10 a month, but I'll let it go for the extra $1 over budget. It is worth $10 a month, $2.50 a week, 35 cents a day..........................to me................

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    jayrider said:

    driver100 said:

    robr2 said:

    driver100 said:

    fezo said:

    We're purchasing ours. Assuming I live a half a dozen years or more I'll get free electricity in the long run and cheaper in the shorter run. If I don't live that long then I can't complain...

    FREE electricity! You don't think the government will find a way to tax the wind or sun?

    They'll have to replace that revenue somehow.....if they don't get it one way they will get it another.

    Well there are not any taxes on my electric bill so there are not any to replace.

    In my case, the town may get additional real estate tax revenue as solar panels INCREASE the value of the house.
    No taxes on your electric bill..............YET!

    When more people turn to solar how will the government make up the shortfall?

    The money has to come from somewhere..................... :'(

    I propose that anyone who owns 2 Mercedes Benz automobiles pays a special electric shortfall tax. ;)
    lol.........What about a combo like a Mercedes and an Audi for example....would they be exempt?

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,863
    @stever

    I had read about the Tea Party and Sierra Club working together in Florida. I can understand the need for revenue to support the grid. It's unfortunate that utility lobbyists in states like Florida can wield such power over government.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Sonoma, CaliforniaPosts: 64,490
    All this wouldn't be necessary if architects would design smaller and more intelligent homes to begin with. You know, with big garages and tiny bedrooms :D
  • carnaughtcarnaught Desert SWPosts: 2,753
    driver100 said:

    Sirius called last week to renew when my trial offer is over May 10th. I declined of course at $175.89 a year!

    Got a special offer in the mail, $79.96. With tax and licence fees it climbed to $121 a year. I did have a cap of $10 a month, but I'll let it go for the extra $1 over budget. It is worth $10 a month, $2.50 a week, 35 cents a day..........................to me................


    Compare that to the ~$60/yr. I'm paying with the promotional rate. To me, I don't think it is that great and worth over $100 per year.
  • driver100driver100 Burlington, ON 7 mo/Tampa FL 5 moPosts: 24,648
    carnaught said:

    driver100 said:

    Sirius called last week to renew when my trial offer is over May 10th. I declined of course at $175.89 a year!

    Got a special offer in the mail, $79.96. With tax and licence fees it climbed to $121 a year. I did have a cap of $10 a month, but I'll let it go for the extra $1 over budget. It is worth $10 a month, $2.50 a week, 35 cents a day..........................to me................


    Compare that to the ~$60/yr. I'm paying with the promotional rate. To me, I don't think it is that great and worth over $100 per year.
    That plan isn't available in Canada.....but, the way our dollar has gone, $60 US is worth about $120 Cdn.

    Actually our dollar sunk when the price of oil sunk, it went from being worth about 96 cents to the US dollar down to 78 cents, and has worked it's way up to 83 cents. I think our taxes are more 13% and the license fees are probably more too. I don't think I would be allowed to apply for US Sirius, but, if I don't like the deal I get next year I will give it a try.

    2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250

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